Penn & Teller call bullshit on video game violence

On July 17 2009 07:42 Frits wrote:
Who says that knowing the difference between fantasy and reality is the big problem with video games? There's a lot of bad arguments in that video and none of them really stand up to the countless research programs that state otherwise, then again I suppose it's for the all sake of comedy. As it is right now, in the field of psychology violent video games (or movies) are considered a bad influence on children by most people, though I do think most people are exaggerating the effects.

On July 17 2009 09:17 UmmTheHobo wrote:
The last part with the kid firing the gun was counteractive to their argument. Most crazed school shooters I know cry after firing a gun.

On July 17 2009 08:10 ToT)OjKa( wrote:
yo my dad play tekken is he gona bet me/

On July 17 2009 09:18 Caller wrote:

you know a lot of em don't you

Learn how to properly educate your children and you won't need to feed them BS in order to make sure they are not serial killers.

On July 17 2009 09:48 pLaTypu5 wrote:
Awesome video.

After a few beers I'll start flying around and harassing workers due to video games. And I micro myself very, very poorly.

On July 17 2009 10:09 CharlieMurphy wrote:
Why the hell was that kid crying, what a pussy.

He's 9 and guns are fucking scary.

On July 17 2009 11:11 Kwark wrote:

He's 9 and guns are fucking scary.

On July 17 2009 12:38 CharlieMurphy wrote:

I'm pretty sure I fired a gun at that age and I didn't cry, we even killed some rabbits.
+ Show Spoiler +

On July 17 2009 07:25 Kentor wrote:
But man did you see that Asian chick with all the white guys? shit...

On July 17 2009 13:20 Exia wrote:
And she wasn't hiding her face...

On July 17 2009 12:38 CharlieMurphy wrote:

I'm pretty sure I fired a gun at that age and I didn't cry, we even killed some rabbits.

On July 17 2009 10:09 CharlieMurphy wrote:
Why the hell was that kid crying, what a pussy.

On July 17 2009 22:05 Timangi99 wrote:
I am a bit ambivalent about bullshit. Sure its funny and all, but they way they use humour is to disguise the fact that they are often using the same methods of faulty reasoning as the bullshitters they attempt to expose. At least I know from reading and watching other videos that Penn (that is the tall guy rite?) isn't keen on chasing religion as a whole, but rather bullshitters within their ranks.

On July 18 2009 00:43 fanatacist wrote:

Probably hurt too, he is way too small for that gun and the recoil was not dampened by proper shoulder positioning; probably left bruising, hit his face. And yea, scary as fuck.

The first time I shot a real gun I was 13, and I didn't cry or get scared really, but the recoil was brutal and it was difficult as hell and I basically would do it again but wouldn't go out and look for the opportunity. It was okay.

On July 18 2009 00:52 Stratos.FEAR wrote:


the point was also to prove that his hours of all those fps games could not have taught him how to kill using weapons such as this.

On July 17 2009 23:07 Kgosi wrote:


I'm fairly certain that they have freedom of speech up to a certain point. I mean the show is a big hit and all but if they were to go with guns blazing saying Religion all together is a bunch of b.s. they would probably get sued.

They go as far as they can. Just my 2 cents.

On July 17 2009 22:05 Timangi99 wrote:
I am a bit ambivalent about bullshit. Sure its funny and all, but they way they use humour is to disguise the fact that they are often using the same methods of faulty reasoning as the bullshitters they attempt to expose.

On July 18 2009 01:58 Djabanete wrote:

I tend to feel the same way. Showing one kid fire a gun proves absolutely nothing, no matter what his reaction is. Deliberately choosing out nutjobs and picking on them is also a good way to discredit your own argument.

P&T are entertainers, and should be taken with a grain of salt just like anything else. I have not personally done any research into this subject, and therefore I don't know anything about it, and therefore I don't have an opinion either way. But I'm guessing that most people posting in this thread haven't done any research either, and yet everyone seems to agree with P&T automatically because this is a gaming forum and everyone here likes video games. P&T did not themselves present any evidence either way, they just made fun of people and said "fuck" a lot. That doesn't make them right.

On July 17 2009 22:55 Rev0lution wrote:
And CharlieMurphy whatever gun you used to kill rabbits does not compare to that big ass rifle the Marine brought in for the kid.

BB gun =/= Semi automatic

On July 18 2009 03:18 Stratos.FEAR wrote:
There wouldn't be an issue if the parents would stop letting their kids play GTA or other stuff if they knew their kids were troubled. this just goes to show that some parents dont give a shit about what their kids do and believe that their 'little angels' have been corrupted by some video game which they paid no attention to the M rating on the game.

isn't this why they changed the cookie monster to the veggie monster? because the irresponsible parents fed their kids to the point of obesity and then proceed to blame a figure of children's television for encouraging the eating of cookies....

and while there was loads of stuff done in the vids for entertainment the ending part on football is totally true.

On July 18 2009 03:30 Chef wrote:

You could argue that trouble kids being able to lose themselves in a fantasy world allows them to act normally in reality. I don't think there's been to much evidence specifically for video games regarding the matter (it's a bit difficult to test). There has been research of catharsis methods such as hitting punching bags and kicking things that does show worsened moods and higher aggression (as apposed to not using such methods). They say that if you're hitting something that isn't the object of your pain, it doesn't help (but if it is, it does). But I think tho, that unless you are very unusual, you are not imagining the people you hate on the faces of the characters you shoot up, you're imagining yourself being a superhero (which would make it different and perhaps therapeutic).

But yeah... Blame the parents, blame the video games, blame blame blame, just so long as we avoid finding the core of the problem (which in my opinion, is WHAT is making the child sad/troubled, not how he or she deals with it).

On July 17 2009 22:55 Rev0lution wrote:
And CharlieMurphy whatever gun you used to kill rabbits does not compare to that big ass rifle the Marine brought in for the kid.

BB gun =/= Semi automatic

On July 18 2009 03:38 Judicator wrote:


Well as nice as that is, shit happens, I mean we all have shitty days or stretches of time, but the vast majority of us deal with it without extreme violence. So how someone deals with sadness or stress is very important and relevant.

On July 18 2009 00:43 fanatacist wrote:

Probably hurt too, he is way too small for that gun and the recoil was not dampened by proper shoulder positioning; probably left bruising, hit his face. And yea, scary as fuck.

On July 18 2009 05:03 Chef wrote:

No, it's treating the symptoms and not the cause. Everyone 'has shitty days' but for a lot of us the cause goes away on it's own. The people who commit these acts aren't just having a bad week, they usually have a long history of sadness.

I really hate this attitude of just saying "well these people are inferior. Most people just deal with that stuff." Frankly, I can imagine myself in their position, and I don't usually think I'd be so different. I also don't think something trivial like taking away video games, or taking away music or movies is going to make a person any less dangerous. They're dangerous BECAUSE of their history, not because of media. One is the cause, and one is the symptom. I listen to sad songs because I'm sad. I'm not sad because I listen to sad songs. Right?

On July 18 2009 06:08 Judicator wrote:


I am not saying that, but for you to disregard how someone deal with these problems is just as problematic as disregarding the cause. Read what I posted, because you are misunderstanding.

On July 18 2009 06:23 Chef wrote:

Man, I did read what you posted. That's why I replied to it. Either reiterate what you said so it is clear, or stop pretending you're mysterious and wise and that I'm just not smart enough to know what you meant. Yeah, most people deal with their stress in non-extremely violent ways. Most people are also not experiencing the same stress/sadness that people who commit suicide or commit murder are experiencing. That's why something different happens. People need options to deal with their stress and problems, and when they don't have options, that's when it's more important to eliminate the cause.

IE: Anti-bullying campaigns and anti-poverty efforts help to eliminate the causes of criminal activity. They're good. Telling kids how to accept being bullied and not to take it to heart, or putting low-income people who steal in jail is bad, because it's treating a symptom.

On July 18 2009 07:32 Zoler wrote:
This is stupid, there is nothing to argue about. People that are against video games should never be listened to.

In a few years the old will be dead and we won't have to care about this debate anymore.

I mean, why do we want to do that?

On July 18 2009 07:42 Foucault wrote:


Thanks for the input but you don't seem to be even have considered the option that video games affect people in both good and bad ways.

"Should never be listened to"? Nice one.

On July 17 2009 08:05 prOxi.swAMi wrote:
I can't even believe this is an issue. Parents hold themselves accountable for nothing these days, always looking for something or someone else to blame. They're YOUR shitty kids! You stop them playing FPS if that's what you really want. Don't fucking force it on everyone else's perfectly normal kids. God, it makes me sick.

On July 18 2009 09:39 Stratos_speAr wrote:


Are there not these laws in other places? I said this before and no one responded to it - whenever anyone I know goes to buy a video game that's M, they're ID'd just like you would be at a bar.

On July 18 2009 09:39 Stratos_speAr wrote:


Are there not these laws in other places? I said this before and no one responded to it - whenever anyone I know goes to buy a video game that's M, they're ID'd just like you would be at a bar.

On July 18 2009 02:22 Stratos_speAr wrote:



What the fuck is goin' on here? I wanted to smack that lawyer in the face and say, "They do, dumbass!" Do they not in some states? In Minnesota, whenever I try to by an M rated game, I get ID'd on the spot. You have to be 17 to buy an M rated game anywhere around here.

On July 19 2009 08:50 Sneaky wrote:
That kid needs to whipe the sand out of his mangina. Someone said that comparing a bb gun at 9 and an assult rifle wasnt compareble. I shot shotguns when i was that young, and would of jumped out of my shoes to shoot an AAR-15. Who knows tho, he may of shot the kid instead of ron jeremey =P, or just flat out missed completly... like a nub

On July 19 2009 08:50 Sneaky wrote:
That kid needs to whipe the sand out of his mangina. Someone said that comparing a bb gun at 9 and an assult rifle wasnt compareble. I shot shotguns when i was that young, and would of jumped out of my shoes to shoot an AAR-15. Who knows tho, he may of shot the kid instead of ron jeremey =P, or just flat out missed completly... like a nub

On July 18 2009 09:31 Drowsy wrote:
I definitely wouldn't mind seeing laws passed to prevent M rated games from being sold to people under 17. I don't play anything more violent than starcraft on a regular basis, but I definitely don't think a 12 year old should be exposed to something like GTA4.

On July 19 2009 08:50 Sneaky wrote:
That kid needs to whipe the sand out of his mangina. Someone said that comparing a bb gun at 9 and an assult rifle wasnt compareble. I shot shotguns when i was that young, and would of jumped out of my shoes to shoot an AAR-15. Who knows tho, he may of shot the kid instead of ron jeremey =P, or just flat out missed completly... like a nub