NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.
Will someone think of the poor Ukrainian draftees (but not of the tortured, raped and murdered Ukrainians). Priorities, everyone. It's important to not mobilize another soul (but not important to save more citizens from genocide).
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
I’m unsure why there needs to be a lot of soul searching as to who to blame, it can scarcely be more obvious. Then sure there are a multitude of other factors that can be looked at.
As one can’t be said to master a jigsaw puzzle if their method involves jamming whatever pieces together and saying the resulting image is the correct one, so too do analyses of foreign affairs not hold up if the same methodology is used.
Nationalism, especially if it’s bolted on to ethnic tensions, long-standing animosity or cultural/religious clashes gets to be extremely ugly.
This is what you get. You seem to grant the legitimacy of one side’s capacity to bring their rabid nationalism to bear as an aggressor, but Ukrainians should, in the position of the wronged party, shelve their own nationalism because it’s destructive?
Which strikes me as utterly ludicrous. ‘Arse backwards’ as we like to say over here.
On August 14 2023 14:40 captainwaffles wrote: So, us people on the internet can say things, we have our own points of view about stuff, but what are the guys, 40 thousand of whom have died since the "counter offensive" have to say about the current state of things, ie, charging into defensive lines across the Donbas, territories and peoples that *voted* to join the Russian Federation, because they didn't want anything to do with the US backed Maiden coup in 2014?
> "NATO is sending us here to DIE" Ukrainian commanders admit they are cannon fodder for NATO
You could compare the situation now to WWI in 1918. Everything was fine / a stalemate until it wasnt. The Entente had just lost their powerful ally to the east and the lines hadnt moved in a long time, things were looking grim yet it was the German and Austro-Hungarian societies that collapsed first under pressure.
There is only so much Ukrainian society can take even with rabid nationalism and harsh suppression of dissent, the wheels come off the cart eventually. This cannot last forever, something has to give.
Why do the wheels have to fall off?
There’s little indication that anything is liable to shift in the near thru medium term to pull this out of a long, long protracted stalemate.
To be fair, not all political collapses are easy to see in advance. Few people saw wagner mutiny coming and that could have turned very badly. I'm just not sure why would Ukrainian downfall be more likely than Russia's.
Well yeah this is true, which is generally why I’m not in the business of making big bold predictions
Unlike the cottage industry of YouTube experts and conspiracists who are seemingly in constant competition to make the most incorrect big calls on the conflict possible.
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror of their own governemnt. If its vile to think that this is wrong then stick whatever label you want on me.
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror. If its vile to think tht this is wrong then stick whatever label you want.
You never wonder why Russia does not take conscripts from Moscow and Saint-Petersbourg don't you? :D
If we would love to see those tweets from your twitter feed, we would simply follow them as well. We don't because we find them to be the lowest form of anecdotal material and there is nothing to discuss.
We are more interested in your background, what makes you who you are. Sharing only tweets from others make us think that others are making you who you are. You lose your personna and get easily attacked on your (non-existant) personna.
On August 14 2023 18:29 0x64 wrote: It's really funny, because pro-russians can post videos and share infinite amount of sources.
But they can't form their own opinion.
Like which would be a better leader for Russia, putin or prigozhin?
Should there be political opposition in Russia?
For how long would you put Navalny to Prison?
All those questions are supposed to be answered from your heart, not based on some youtube rant.
We got hundreds of question that have value for us to understand better the cultural difference.
There is clearly a discussion to be had, but not the one where we go "your propaganda is stronger than ours"
I think I have already explained here the famous Eastern Propaganda Paradox which dictates that
"Western propaganda is so strong that only us are able to see through it, those poor westerner are brainwashed" -> "Our propaganda is weaker, we are able to know what is propaganda because we suck at propaganda"
It is simple, but it makes you feel so smart for not falling for Western propaganda.
No, I have very clear opinion on all these matters.
>>Like which would be a better leader for Russia, putin or prigozhin? -I think that Prigozhin has no agency in internal policts, so the answer is certainly Putin. I just cannot publicly explain this point in more details, because this will soon lead to a thing which I believe is a sensitive information, and for which I've once been scolded by FSB. Overall, I find the Russian political system unstable and prone to corruption, to the degree that it looks miraculous to me, that it currently is in a good shape.
>>Should there be political opposition in Russia? -yes it should. In my opinion, the lack of a geniune political opposition in Russia mainly is due to the lack of manpower in the governing authorities, so most decent candidates are easily taken in.
>>For how long would you put Navalny to Prison? -untill its safe to let him out - i.e. untill Russia either decisively wins or loses the war
>>There is clearly a discussion to be had, but not the one where we go "your propaganda is stronger than ours" -I'm extremely pleased to share what I know (or I think I know) with anyone, who's genuinely interested in my opinion.
>>"Western propaganda is so strong that only us are able to see through it, those poor westerner are brainwashed" -> "Our propaganda is weaker, we are able to know what is propaganda because we suck at propaganda"
-let me answer very bluntly. 1. I tend to agree with this statement, although there are numerous exceptions to it (this is close to my "the US has the largest terror organization on planet, and we have the 2nd"). 2. I've been brainwashed by western propaganda myself, and I don't feel any moral superiority of my current position. I think its normal to be brainwashed, while the opposite requires a lot of effort, and can be damaging. I've been lucky to learn some key methods of information warfare very early, in quite a comic circumstances, so it may helped me a bit to understand these things easier. 3. The first principle of any propaganda - is to make you think that the opposing propaganda lies. I can do nothing about it, just disclose my daily sources of info, if anyone interested.
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror. If its vile to think tht this is wrong then stick whatever label you want.
You never wonder why Russia does not take conscripts from Moscow and Saint-Petersbourg don't you? :D
If we would love to see those tweets from your twitter feed, we would simply follow them as well. We don't because we find them to be the lowest form of anecdotal material and there is nothing to discuss.
We are more interested in your background, what makes you who you are. Sharing only tweets from others make us think that others are making you who you are. You lose your personna and get easily attacked on your (non-existant) personna.
I found the video about Kyiv interesting. There's been dozens if not hundreds of posts mentioning how conscription works in Russia, and how they're avoiding conscripting from their central cities, so there's really not much to add to that. I was under the impression that Kyiv is regularly hit with missiles and generally 'unsafe' -- based on the posts I see here and elsewhere; but apparently, that's not really the case at all.
Now I wonder how true the part about 'people being terrified' in other cities are, but well, half of a picture is better than none at all... or something.
I've rarely heard a more ridiculous take than "there are parties in Ukraine while there's war, this is immoral". Please, even the troops are trying to have fun whenever they're not actively fighting. They're human, they have a right to enjoy themselves. Should they be depressed for the remaining duration of the war? This is completely absurd.
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror of their own governemnt. If its vile to think that this is wrong then stick whatever label you want on me.
Could you not just swap out a few place names and you’re having a testament from some young Russian bloke?
Who’s claiming that it’s vile to think that these things are wrong? Conscription sucks, war sucks, some of these people will die.
Unless there’s some crippling material necessity, what is to be gained by shutting down all regular life in Kiev, or anywhere else?
On August 14 2023 15:18 KwarK wrote: Ruble over 100 and showing no signs of slowing. Lost about 1% of its purchasing power on each trading day in the last week. 20% in the last 90 days. A third in the last 180 days.
The idea that Kyiv is somehow away from the war on an ivory tower where they’re blind to the struggles of the conflict is very difficult to reconcile with the reality of months of missile attacks. It’s almost as if it’s complete nonsense. The population of Kyiv aren’t excluded from the realities of the Russian invasion.
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror of their own governemnt. If its vile to think that this is wrong then stick whatever label you want on me.
Could you not just swap out a few place names and you’re having a testament from some young Russian bloke?
Not really, no. There was no general mobilization called for single cities in Russia where the entire male population was forbidden from leaving the city without a permit. Again if I'm wrong and there are whole populations in Russia afraid of leaving their homes and being caught by enlistment officers like animals please by all means post the testimonies/evidence. If you can't find anything regarding mobilization younger than a year old hell even posts article from a year ago about whole cities being on defacto lockdown. If the same thing is happening in Russia right now I would love to know
Who’s claiming that it’s vile to think that these things are wrong? Conscription sucks, war sucks, some of these people will die.
It was claimed in the post I was quoting
Unless there’s some crippling material necessity, what is to be gained by shutting down all regular life in Kiev, or anywhere else?
Aren't they all being genocided, raped and murdered at the same time according to some people? The streets being full of people partying and relaxing doesn't seem to add up. Or maybe they can have a good time because people unfortunate enough not to own property inside Kiev are terrified of leaving their homes, because they'll be forced at gunpoint to defend the good times being had by those people.
It's almost as if they know there is no threat of Russian missiles hitting them while they are out having a good time
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror of their own governemnt. If its vile to think that this is wrong then stick whatever label you want on me.
Could you not just swap out a few place names and you’re having a testament from some young Russian bloke?
Not really, no. There was no general mobilization called for single cities in Russia where the entire male population was forbidden from leaving the city without a permit. Again if I'm wrong and there are whole populations in Russia afraid of leaving their homes and being caught by enlistment officers like animals please by all means post the testimonies/evidence. If you can't find anything regarding mobilization younger than a year old hell even posts article from a year ago about whole cities being on defacto lockdown. If the same thing is happening in Russia right now I would love to know
Unless there’s some crippling material necessity, what is to be gained by shutting down all regular life in Kiev, or anywhere else?
Aren't they all being genocided, raped and murdered at the same time according to some people? The streets being full of people partying and relaxing doesn't seem to add up. Or maybe they can have a good time because people unfortunate enough not to own property inside Kiev are terrified of leaving their homes, because they'll be forced at gunpoint to defend the good times being had by those people.
It's almost as if they know there is no threat of Russian missiles hitting them while they are out having a good time
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror of their own governemnt. If its vile to think that this is wrong then stick whatever label you want on me.
Could you not just swap out a few place names and you’re having a testament from some young Russian bloke?
Not really, no. There was no general mobilization called for single cities in Russia where the entire male population was forbidden from leaving the city without a permit. Again if I'm wrong and there are whole populations in Russia afraid of leaving their homes and being caught by enlistment officers like animals please by all means post the testimonies/evidence. If you can't find anything regarding mobilization younger than a year old hell even posts article from a year ago about whole cities being on defacto lockdown. If the same thing is happening in Russia right now I would love to know
Unless there’s some crippling material necessity, what is to be gained by shutting down all regular life in Kiev, or anywhere else?
Aren't they all being genocided, raped and murdered at the same time according to some people? The streets being full of people partying and relaxing doesn't seem to add up. Or maybe they can have a good time because people unfortunate enough not to own property inside Kiev are terrified of leaving their homes, because they'll be forced at gunpoint to defend the good times being had by those people.
It's almost as if they know there is no threat of Russian missiles hitting them while they are out having a good time
EDIT: my 6000th post ^^
How about the hundred of thousand of men who left the country?
So for you, at the same time, they are close to collapse and lose the war, and partying because the war does not impact them.
Just because the Bucha massacre happened in the past, does not mean it doesn't count anymore.
You have a very selective argumentation that does not hold up, it is almost like you are being stupid on purpose. Not because you are pro-russia, but because you chose deliberately to not care about the integrity and logic of your arguments.
When you get upset and run out of arguments, you cry "Straw man, Straw man", or something else magical that you need to find because how could you admit to yourself that you are defending war crimes?
On August 14 2023 18:36 zeo wrote: It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
Yeah, guess what - the people to blame are the ones killing them. Or ordering that. This is not rocket science but you are still unable to grasp this. How you are able to string together sentences but fail to see the painfully obvious is really fascinating. Makes me hope for your sake that you are just a troll.
Apparently the Ruble is now worth less than a US penny. The Central Bank will apparently have an emergency meeting tomorrow to discuss it's continued slide. It's clear that Elvira Nabiullina is going to be the potential scapegoat even though she tried to resign at the start of the year.
Vladimir Putin’s luck may be running out now that the ruble plunged below one cent, the lowest level against the U.S. dollar since the early days of his war in Ukraine.
The Russian president, who briefly faced down a coup attempt in June, could long point to the resilience of his currency in the face of sanctions as a propaganda victory that proved just how impotent Western economic reprisals were.
More than 500 days since his army invaded Ukraine, it looks as if Moscow’s highly respected central bank governor can no longer perform miracles for her boss.
The ruble that Elvira Nabiullina manages crashed through the psychological support of 100 to the U.S. dollar and on Monday is now worth less than a penny, the first time since March 23 of last year.
“They’re laughing at us,” scathed Vladimir Solovyov, Russia’s most well-known state TV personality and a chief Putin ally, already last week.
The war hawk demanded Nabiullina explain herself to the population now that currency has lost roughly a quarter of its value against the dollar since the start of this year.
On Sunday, images were shared online of a small symbolic protest mounted in western Siberia: A building’s chyron kept repeating the message that “Putin is a dickhead and a thief,” calling the ruble’s exchange rate “crazy.”
Her institution, meanwhile, has countered by arguing a softer ruble does not present risks to the country’s financial stability. Nonetheless, Russia’s central bank decided to freeze purchases of foreign currency on the domestic market through the remainder of this year to restore faith in the sliding ruble.
Russia’s currency strength handed Putin a PR victory
Following a brief collapse in the initial aftermath of last year’s Feb. 24 invasion, which saw Russia’s fiat tender plunge to a record low of 120 to the dollar, the ruble rebounded to trade at one point at highs not seen since 2015, around 50 to the dollar.
This gave the Kremlin an important PR victory by suggesting Russia’s economy was strong enough to withstand anything the West threw at it.
This in turn prompted soul-searching among Ukraine’s Western backers while bolstering critics alarmed more at the cost of soaring food and energy prices than at Russia’s empire-building.
“It’s slightly more valuable than it was on the day that Russia invaded Ukraine. The economic situation in the United States by contrast is deteriorating fast,” then Fox News host Tucker Carlson, a chief critic of U.S. aid to Kyiv, said last April.
Nabiullina was celebrated for cleverly steering her financial system through the worst of the turmoil by placing a range of capital controls that quickly stabilized the currency and prevented mass outflows.
“They were a quick fix for the ruble in 2022, but are counterproductive in the long run,” wrote Janis Kluge, senior associate at the German Institute for International and Security Affairs, last week.
The fresh signs of economic weakness come at an important juncture in the war. The Russian army is attempting to defend large swaths of territory seized in the early months of the invasion against a Kyiv counteroffensive boasting modern Western military equipment.
Any material losses on the battlefield could further undermine Putin’s authority, already weakened following the challenge made by Wagner mercenary boss Yevgeny Prigozhin in June.
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror of their own governemnt. If its vile to think that this is wrong then stick whatever label you want on me.
Could you not just swap out a few place names and you’re having a testament from some young Russian bloke?
Not really, no. There was no general mobilization called for single cities in Russia where the entire male population was forbidden from leaving the city without a permit. Again if I'm wrong and there are whole populations in Russia afraid of leaving their homes and being caught by enlistment officers like animals please by all means post the testimonies/evidence. If you can't find anything regarding mobilization younger than a year old hell even posts article from a year ago about whole cities being on defacto lockdown. If the same thing is happening in Russia right now I would love to know
Who’s claiming that it’s vile to think that these things are wrong? Conscription sucks, war sucks, some of these people will die.
It was claimed in the post I was quoting
Unless there’s some crippling material necessity, what is to be gained by shutting down all regular life in Kiev, or anywhere else?
Aren't they all being genocided, raped and murdered at the same time according to some people? The streets being full of people partying and relaxing doesn't seem to add up. Or maybe they can have a good time because people unfortunate enough not to own property inside Kiev are terrified of leaving their homes, because they'll be forced at gunpoint to defend the good times being had by those people.
It's almost as if they know there is no threat of Russian missiles hitting them while they are out having a good time
EDIT: my 6000th post ^^
How about the hundred of thousand of men who left the country?
So for you, at the same time, they are close to collapse and lose the war, and partying because the war does not impact them.
Just because the Bucha massacre happened in the past, does not mean it doesn't count anymore.
You have a very selective argumentation that does not hold up, it is almost like you are being stupid on purpose. Not because you are pro-russia, but because you chose deliberately to not care about the integrity and logic of your arguments.
When you get upset and run out of arguments, you cry "Straw man, Straw man", or something else magical that you need to find because how could you admit to yourself that you are defending war crimes?
What are you even talking about? You are all over the place in every reply, Hail Mary ad hominems and misrepresenting (poorly) every single statement while going on wild tangents just to change the subject. Take a deep breath, count to 10, then start typing. You and that guy that turned off his Hitler scripts act like you're having breakdowns.
You need to learn how to build arguments or how to engage with other people instead of pelting the first soundbite from Reddit that comes to your head. I can say something is a strawman when something is a strawman, you and your little friends don't get to decide what is right and what is wrong. The higher the horse you are sitting on, the more its going to hurt when you fall flat on your face.
At least try to have a normal conversation without hostility and prejudices and you just might learn something new. You have the right to say the complete opposite of what I am and you have the right to prove me wrong. Hell, whats the point of having an opinion if no one can challenge it, I want my convictions to be tested. Thats how I know if they hold up. But throwing tantrums and acting like a spoiled little brat when the narrative isn't going your way... well you make the argument against yourself very very easy.
On August 14 2023 16:38 KwarK wrote: He uses the example of WW1 in which the Russian Empire fell apart under the stresses of attritional warfare and the western industrial complex proved able to to outlast its enemies as an example of why the western backed forces will surely succumb to Russian attrition.
Ukraine will surely fold, just as Russia did in WW1. Russia will surely endure, just as it previously didn’t in WW1. It all makes sense once you realize that Russia has nothing in common with Russia.
One country is fine on its own. The other died as a sovriegn country that can function on its own more than a year ago. Its corpse has been reanimated with injections of aid totaling more than the entire Marshal plan after WW2 in todays money. 5 million people left the country after Feb 2022 (with 1.5million Ukrainians going to Russia) and the unemployment rate is still at 20%.
The take here being that a society can suffer as long as you can keep injecting aid to prolong the suffering. How do you imagine life is like in the European Utopia? When all is said and done something tells me the population left in Ukraine will point its finger at you.
Europe isn’t causing the suffering. As always your nonsensical attempts to play the champion of the Ukrainians ring hollow as you’re advocating for their suffering. Europe isn’t prolonging it, Russia is. They can stop at any time.
You should just drop this angle. You’ve tried it a few times but it’s just entirely unconvincing given everything we know about you. You’re not going to persuade anyone that you’re really motivated out of a concern for the safety of the Ukrainian people. Not after all your gloating at their suffering. Not after all your cheerleading of the invasion forces.
My concern is not for the Maidanists that made their bed and are now sleeping in it. Rather for the normal people not allowed to live normal lives because of them. Should they have stood up against them before it got to this? Yes. But the inheritors of Ukraine won't be the rich draft dogers and criminals happy to send other people to die instead of themselves. It will be the people sent to die instead of them, and there will be a lot of soul searching about who is to blame. And not a lot of undestanding for those that are to blame.
I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens.
You are such a vile person.
Here's a guy from Ivano-Frankovsk, he seems perplexed at the fun and carefreeness to be had on the streets of Kiev while in his home town people are terrified of being snatched on the streets and sent to the front lines.
Weird isn't it? The elites and politicians living it up like its Weimar era Berlin while the rest live in terror of their own governemnt. If its vile to think that this is wrong then stick whatever label you want on me.
Could you not just swap out a few place names and you’re having a testament from some young Russian bloke?
Not really, no. There was no general mobilization called for single cities in Russia where the entire male population was forbidden from leaving the city without a permit. Again if I'm wrong and there are whole populations in Russia afraid of leaving their homes and being caught by enlistment officers like animals please by all means post the testimonies/evidence. If you can't find anything regarding mobilization younger than a year old hell even posts article from a year ago about whole cities being on defacto lockdown. If the same thing is happening in Russia right now I would love to know
Who’s claiming that it’s vile to think that these things are wrong? Conscription sucks, war sucks, some of these people will die.
It was claimed in the post I was quoting
Unless there’s some crippling material necessity, what is to be gained by shutting down all regular life in Kiev, or anywhere else?
Aren't they all being genocided, raped and murdered at the same time according to some people? The streets being full of people partying and relaxing doesn't seem to add up. Or maybe they can have a good time because people unfortunate enough not to own property inside Kiev are terrified of leaving their homes, because they'll be forced at gunpoint to defend the good times being had by those people.
It's almost as if they know there is no threat of Russian missiles hitting them while they are out having a good time
EDIT: my 6000th post ^^
How about the hundred of thousand of men who left the country?
So for you, at the same time, they are close to collapse and lose the war, and partying because the war does not impact them.
Just because the Bucha massacre happened in the past, does not mean it doesn't count anymore.
You have a very selective argumentation that does not hold up, it is almost like you are being stupid on purpose. Not because you are pro-russia, but because you chose deliberately to not care about the integrity and logic of your arguments.
When you get upset and run out of arguments, you cry "Straw man, Straw man", or something else magical that you need to find because how could you admit to yourself that you are defending war crimes?
What are you even talking about? You are all over the place in every reply, Hail Mary ad hominems and misrepresenting (poorly) every single statement while going on wild tangents just to change the subject. Take a deep breath, count to 10, then start typing. You and that guy that turned off his Hitler scripts act like you're having breakdowns.
You need to learn how to build arguments or how to engage with other people instead of pelting the first soundbite from Reddit that comes to your head. I can say something is a strawman when something is a strawman, you and your little friends don't get to decide what is right and what is wrong. The higher the horse you are sitting on, the more its going to hurt when you fall flat on your face.
At least try to have a normal conversation without hostility and prejudices and you just might learn something new. You have the right to say the complete opposite of what I am and you have the right to prove me wrong. Hell, whats the point of having an opinion if no one can challenge it, I want my convictions to be tested. Thats how I know if they hold up. But throwing tantrums and acting like a spoiled little brat when the narrative isn't going your way... well you make the argument against yourself very very easy.
I'm talking about you having no value to the discussion and should be banned as the thread is not progressing in anyway.
(the why is simply that you are never answering the posts, you wrote three paragraphs without bringing up any of your point of view challenged)
And yes I called you for how you chose to communicate, which you can't grasp why it does not work.
EPT
