EPTPerhaps Religion is the main problem for the underlying tension in the area, and the world... just a thought.
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine - Page 122
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
Perhaps Religion is the main problem for the underlying tension in the area, and the world... just a thought. | ||
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Cricketer12
United States14000 Posts
On November 25 2023 10:23 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: So Hamas just executed two Palestinians who were claimed to have helped of Israeli intelligence services... hanging them from electricity poles. Perhaps Religion is the main problem for the underlying tension in the area, and the world... just a thought. What on earth does religion have to do with what you just said? | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17673 Posts
Related slurs include claims that Jews are wealthy, greedy and stingy, obsessed with material goods and profit, and that they exploit their economic advantages to help their own people, to the detriment of the public good. https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/usury-and-moneylending-in-judaism/ Jews themselves joke about it. Seinfeld covers the tax evading jew. the stingy jew and the superficial jewish american princess all in one scene. Comedic Genius. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27066 Posts
On November 25 2023 05:38 Cricketer12 wrote: Ah shit, they're using slings, time to mow the lawn. I'll make my point quite clear because it's likely not to be caught, I remain concerned by the seriously lack of concern or respect for the lives of Palestinian civilian lives. All atrocities committed upon civilians (Pal or Israeli) is fucked up and to be avoided at all costs. The lengths by which the IDF's actions are justified is problematic. Indeed. It doesn’t sound like all of these prisoners to be released are exactly hardened terrorists. There’s probably a more thorough breakdown elsewhere but bit busy at work to track down a better link who-were-the-palestinian-prisoners-israel-released-on-friday | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
1: That hospital actually was destroyed and 500 people were killed (taking Nebuchad’s word that it was mistranslated, but it would have spread as 500 dead is my point) Due to modern technology and information availability: we have extreme confirmation the hospital’s parking lot was hit, some cars lit on fire, but the hospital straight up was not destroyed 2: Hospital bombings were cruelty rather than valid military targets Due to modern technology and information availability: We’ve all seen the security camera footage from within Al-Shifa conclusively proven hostages were taken there and they were killed after sustaining injuries they did not have prior to arrival at the hospital. Tons of evidence of all the tunnels and whatnot in various places, including Al-Shifa 3: Palestinians are living under a dictatorship they don’t support and they are some kinda victims of circumstance Due to modern technology and information availability: Folks in West Bank gathering to celebrate a dude getting publicly hanged. And hanged by Hamas. More and more evidence of the whole “West Bank are moderates and totally not hateful” being a complete sham 4: The attack itself was exaggerated or something along those lines Due to modern technology and information availability: We have all the videos of the incredibly cruel and grotesque things Hamas did…because they themselves posted it. They glorified it, celebrated it, and documented it all themselves I really have no idea how much of this has always been a giant disinformation thing, or if it’s just that the situation is getting a lot more extreme as time has gone on. As you all know, October 7 has essentially been the beginning of me learning about all this. I’m sure I’ve been here long enough for folks to find posts from me when I was much younger where I wanted Israel to be entirely cut off from all American funding and left to fend for itself. I always said that 100% aware it would mean they’d all be killed within a few years. I totally and completely hated Israel and wanted it to be wiped out. I still deeply dislike Israel in an absolute sense. If I woke up as god tomorrow, I’d forcibly remove all Israelis from Israel because I fundamentally hate the justifications from both Israel and Palestinians as to why the land is theirs. But after I learned about how the muslim nations around the world responded to 1948, and having seen how much disinformation is being unmasked recently, I’m realizing a ton of stuff I thought was bullshit is clearly true. Israel is still deeply unethical in my eyes, but holy smokes, Hamas and all the folks who cheer for Hamas in these twitter videos of the public execution make it really easy to see the situation as just 2 shit head factions where 1 of them is like 999x more of a shit head. | ||
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RvB
Netherlands6288 Posts
On November 25 2023 11:59 WombaT wrote: Indeed. It doesn’t sound like all of these prisoners to be released are exactly hardened terrorists. There’s probably a more thorough breakdown elsewhere but bit busy at work to track down a better link who-were-the-palestinian-prisoners-israel-released-on-friday Al Jazeera isn't a good source on this conflict. They're fine if Qatar has no stake but change into a propaganda outlet if they do. Couple of weeks ago someone linked this article from the Arabic website of Al Jazeera on Reddit. Put it into google translate and you'll see. Here is the list from Israels government and here some info from Sky. It contains quite a few alledged Hamas members and like I already said they also use slings when 'throwing rocks'. Slings are no joke. They're weapons and have already killed people. The problem is the use of administrative detention. | ||
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Magic Powers
Austria4478 Posts
Sorry to say this but I'm not impressed by your comment. In one go you explain how your views changed from anti-Israel to something more nuanced (which is great) and your rant ends with "but as a God I'd wipe Israel off the map". It doesn't work like that, Mohdoo island doesn't exist and it never will. This is reality. The State of Israel, regardless of its bloody foundation, has a right to exist no matter what. The people of Israel aren't the ones with blood on their hands. Oh and you also mention how people in the West bank celebrate the deaths of people by the hands of Hamas. Newsflash: people do that all over the globe. There are idiots and radicals everywhere, and they don't represent the entire local population. | ||
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Nebuchad
Switzerland12472 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On November 25 2023 18:36 Magic Powers wrote: @Mohdoo Sorry to say this but I'm not impressed by your comment. In one go you explain how your views changed from anti-Israel to something more nuanced (which is great) and your rant ends with "but as a God I'd wipe Israel off the map". It doesn't work like that, Mohdoo island doesn't exist and it never will. This is reality. The State of Israel, regardless of its bloody foundation, has a right to exist no matter what. The people of Israel aren't the ones with blood on their hands. Oh and you also mention how people in the West bank celebrate the deaths of people by the hands of Hamas. Newsflash: people do that all over the globe. There are idiots and radicals everywhere, and they don't represent the entire local population. Pardon my humor, because you are of course right. I’m just taking the opportunity to be snide about how easy it is to view the whole conflict as 2 drunks at a bar yelling at each other and killing the vibe for everyone else. I think the conflict is macroscopically distasteful and cringe. We shouldn’t be having conflicts of this nature with the information and philosophies we have accumulated since inventing fire. I consider the whole rivalry yucky. And when I say remove them, I mean my good ole North Dakota idea lolol. They’d be given a vastly superior place to live and would be wealthy by all measures, but they and Palestinians would receive that at the cost of letting go of this stupid nursery rhyme about why the land is important My snide disdain for their entire concept of reality is real. But my little fantasy is just me being silly. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
A senior Hamas official has told the BBC that the delay to the handover of the hostages this evening is due to Israeli violations of the humanitarian truce agreement by preventing agreed-upon aid trucks from entering northern Gaza. He said that Israel allowed only three trucks out of 100 to reach northern Gaza. He also said that Israel violated the ceasefire agreement by flying drones over southern Gaza. Israel has denied it has violated the truce agreement. Source | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24059 Posts
I have to admit the ability to start a paragraph like that without it ending in getting banned is thoroughly impressive. But I also remember Mohdoo's posting on the subject a bit differently. On July 31 2014 04:55 Mohdoo wrote: I'm a long time supporter of a 2 state solution, but that ship looks like it sailed. Israel is gonna take the whole thing and that's really all there is to it. Whether it is fast or slow, the result will be the same. I hope Israel cleans house sooner than later so that the world can move on. User was warned for this post On December 06 2017 12:51 Mohdoo wrote: Good way to put it. I deeply support Israel in this rare instance simply because Palestinians are being ridiculous by not gg'ing out. They are just floating CC's and hoping Israel disconnects. We need to move on at some point. I think the ethical thing would be for Palestinians to have the land, but I think the correct decision is to give it all to Israel. I mean technically he does say the ethical thing would be for Palestinians to have the land before dismissing it as the incorrect decision. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
Edit: Agreement is believed to be still on. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On November 26 2023 02:33 GreenHorizons wrote: "I still deeply dislike Israel in an absolute sense. If I woke up as god tomorrow, I’d forcibly remove all Israelis from Israel because I fundamentally hate..." I have to admit the ability to start a paragraph like that without it ending in getting banned is thoroughly impressive. But I also remember Mohdoo's posting on the subject a bit differently. I mean technically he does say the ethical thing would be for Palestinians to have the land before dismissing it as the incorrect decision. Yes, the situation is another example of why ivory tower ethical considerations are often besides the point when it comes to preventing and reducing suffering. The major thing is that Palestinians deserve to be able to rest and live a happy life. All of the countries that encourage Palestinians to dehumanize themselves and become human sacrifices are prolonging human suffering. The reason you usually see wars create a lot of refugees is that it’s unsafe and a really bad situation for raising a family. Gaza’s government, which has a very high approval rating, has a strong preference for using Palestinians as non-human tools to further their efforts to kill as many Jews as they can. Similar to how a cult leader often has very high approval along his many wives and children, Hamas enjoys widespread support because of the average age of inhabitants. They were born into this cult compound, they think it’s all true, and the ones who don’t think it’s all true are dehumanized and labeled as martyrs by their government. They need an off-ramp. From river to sea doesn’t mean “2 state solution”. It means zero Israel. Those 2 carrier groups were a reminder that’s a fantasy at best. So when even a 2 state solution would change nothing, it’s time to call it. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On November 26 2023 04:56 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Red Cross is at the Egyptian border now waiting on Hamas. https://twitter.com/ariel_oseran/status/1728500890909159751 Do we have any indication from anyone how many hostages Hamas currently has? How many Israeli vs non-Israeli? It is such a bizarre situation to be reminded Hamas is still keeping hostages and some of them aren’t even Israeli. If their whole shpeal is “wahhh I wanna kill all Jews wahhh”, why in the world would they hold on to the other folks for so long? What is the win there? I honestly would have expected they’d try to eject all the non-Israelis ASAP so that they could frame the situation as only being directed as Israelis. I understand there is only so much logic and reason I can expect from these zealots, but is it really just cash? Thailand gave Hamas money in exchange for their folks right? Is that the case with the other countries as well? Hamas gotta buy more fuel to keep from hospitals, so may as well use the hostages for cash? And not necessarily expecting you specifically to know all this. More so talking out loud and wondering if others know the answers or have theories. | ||
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
Also the hostage exchange resumed when Egypt pressed Qatar. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
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CuddlyCuteKitten
Sweden2826 Posts
On November 25 2023 12:29 Mohdoo wrote: It’s interesting what a mask-off situation this all has been. 10 years ago I would have wrongly assumed: 1: That hospital actually was destroyed and 500 people were killed (taking Nebuchad’s word that it was mistranslated, but it would have spread as 500 dead is my point) Due to modern technology and information availability: we have extreme confirmation the hospital’s parking lot was hit, some cars lit on fire, but the hospital straight up was not destroyed 2: Hospital bombings were cruelty rather than valid military targets Due to modern technology and information availability: We’ve all seen the security camera footage from within Al-Shifa conclusively proven hostages were taken there and they were killed after sustaining injuries they did not have prior to arrival at the hospital. Tons of evidence of all the tunnels and whatnot in various places, including Al-Shifa 3: Palestinians are living under a dictatorship they don’t support and they are some kinda victims of circumstance Due to modern technology and information availability: Folks in West Bank gathering to celebrate a dude getting publicly hanged. And hanged by Hamas. More and more evidence of the whole “West Bank are moderates and totally not hateful” being a complete sham 4: The attack itself was exaggerated or something along those lines Due to modern technology and information availability: We have all the videos of the incredibly cruel and grotesque things Hamas did…because they themselves posted it. They glorified it, celebrated it, and documented it all themselves I really have no idea how much of this has always been a giant disinformation thing, or if it’s just that the situation is getting a lot more extreme as time has gone on. As you all know, October 7 has essentially been the beginning of me learning about all this. I’m sure I’ve been here long enough for folks to find posts from me when I was much younger where I wanted Israel to be entirely cut off from all American funding and left to fend for itself. I always said that 100% aware it would mean they’d all be killed within a few years. I totally and completely hated Israel and wanted it to be wiped out. I still deeply dislike Israel in an absolute sense. If I woke up as god tomorrow, I’d forcibly remove all Israelis from Israel because I fundamentally hate the justifications from both Israel and Palestinians as to why the land is theirs. But after I learned about how the muslim nations around the world responded to 1948, and having seen how much disinformation is being unmasked recently, I’m realizing a ton of stuff I thought was bullshit is clearly true. Israel is still deeply unethical in my eyes, but holy smokes, Hamas and all the folks who cheer for Hamas in these twitter videos of the public execution make it really easy to see the situation as just 2 shit head factions where 1 of them is like 999x more of a shit head. Technology also let us see the dead and wounded kids in Gaza. Both sides are horrible. I just hope Hamas can release the hostages and Israel will stop their bombing soon. 😞 | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27066 Posts
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Cerebrate1
265 Posts
On November 26 2023 03:38 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Well... this will prove interesting. No idea how they would be able to communicate with Senior Hamas members without being exposed to Egyptian and Israeli intel... unless it just an optics message. https://twitter.com/sentdefender/status/1728482668138881334 Edit: Agreement is believed to be still on. https://twitter.com/michaelh992/status/1728485790240424109 Sounds like Israel was in fact keeping everything on their side of the bargain, but Hamas was still holding back their agreed upon hostages, potentially causing the whole ceasefire to fall apart. Egypt and Qatar got pissed at Hamas for making all their hard work putting that deal together into the trash for nothing (and making them look like bad guarantors), so they both started pressuring Hamas to live up to their end of the bargain. | ||
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