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On March 20 2020 04:40 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2020 04:39 stilt wrote:
What a mess but everything is China's fault ofc, they must pay for this. (they just gave us 1m masks btw) To be clear, they gave 1m masks for the pandemic they tried to cover up, which drastically increased the total # of infected people world-wide.
Even if the worst rumors about China were true I don't think it would have changed much in most western countries. SK and the US had their first known case basically the same time. The massive amounts of infections the west are experiencing are on our own governments imo.
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On March 20 2020 05:11 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2020 04:40 Mohdoo wrote:On March 20 2020 04:39 stilt wrote:
What a mess but everything is China's fault ofc, they must pay for this. (they just gave us 1m masks btw) To be clear, they gave 1m masks for the pandemic they tried to cover up, which drastically increased the total # of infected people world-wide. Even if the worst rumors about China were true I don't think it would have changed much in most western countries. SK and the US had their first known case basically the same time. The massive amounts of infections the west are experiencing are on our own governments imo.
It is possible for china to do something awful which then allows the us to also be awful. When the us is awful, it does not invalidate previous Chinese awfulness. China remains extremely guilty regardless of subsequent failures.
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On March 20 2020 04:40 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2020 04:39 stilt wrote:
What a mess but everything is China's fault ofc, they must pay for this. (they just gave us 1m masks btw) To be clear, they gave 1m masks for the pandemic they tried to cover up, which drastically increased the total # of infected people world-wide.
China is also to blame for not dealing with the wet markets that have caused other outbreaks before. That, alongside the cover-up, they definitely have blood on their hands. That sits comfortably side-by-side with the colossal failure of the governments worldwide to pro-actively deal with this public health disaster. The fuck-up of the US is especially astounding. All in all, this virus has exposed all the nasty shit (governments, companies, culture, individuals) that people have to deal with everyday. It's darkly comedic.
I think this thing also has the potential to bring people together (worldwide) and add some impetus and resolve in tackling the climate issue in the future.
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On March 20 2020 05:15 anon3297534 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2020 04:40 Mohdoo wrote:On March 20 2020 04:39 stilt wrote:
What a mess but everything is China's fault ofc, they must pay for this. (they just gave us 1m masks btw) To be clear, they gave 1m masks for the pandemic they tried to cover up, which drastically increased the total # of infected people world-wide. China is also to blame for not dealing with the wet markets that have caused other outbreaks before. That, alongside the cover-up, they definitely have blood on their hands. That sits comfortably side-by-side with the colossal failure of the governments worldwide to pro-actively deal with this public health disaster. The fuck-up of the US is especially astounding. All in all, this virus has exposed all the nasty shit (governments, companies, culture, individuals) that people have to deal with everyday. It's darkly comedic. I think this thing also has the potential to bring people together (worldwide) and add some impetus and resolve in tackling the climate issue in the future.
Yeah, basically my thoughts as well. Your use of "side-by-side" is very good IMO. There is a great deal of shared guilt and we need to be mindful of the fact that China is cleaning up a mess they made.
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On March 20 2020 04:12 Mohdoo wrote:Also, now that we have a lot more data out of Italy, can we finally say with 100% certainty that China has been fabricating their data? At the very least, their death rates? Why? From what I understand China's system wasn't overwhelmed to the degree Italy was, in part because China is HUGE and they had a lot of resources in less effected regions that they could pull from and they reacted much more aggressive to quarantining people.
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Northern Ireland25507 Posts
Getting increasingly pissed off, all this ‘we’re in this together’ rhetoric, except if you’re in retail (or health services obviously)
Simultaneously having entire extended families out for a shop around me while getting berated by other customers for being there if I cough.
By all means we’re needed and being able to continue working is a privilege others aren’t afforded, but there are so many sensible social norms and overt policies that could mitigate both the risk of me getting infected or subsequently infecting others.
We’re closing from 10 to 6am now, to replenish stock which is bizarre because custom is really low at that period anyway. We could do with having periods during the day where we close to ram out goods as we’re totally overloaded. Plus that would have the side benefit of separating our staff and the public for periods.
How is retail affected in some of your countries? We’re rather hamstrung in this country because the government loves advisory measures rather than taking charge.
A fair few bars and restaurants are staying open here for example, solely because their insurance doesn’t pay out if they voluntarily close.
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Found this nice site summarising data.
https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus
I especially liked how easy to understand the two Growth: Country by country view sections are. The Trajectories since the 100th confirmed case graphs also show how different reactions are panning out quite well, though you would have to get those separately.
Good resource to get a lot of information for the interested.
Will be interesting to see if we only shut down for 2 weeks, still working from home and nobody fired yet.
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Germany shutting down singular towns in the south --> Curfew in place in a couple of places (German).
Everything cloes until after easter holidays (20.04.2020) according to a regional leader (Armin Laschet).
Food banks are closing and trying to evaluate how they can support the "regulars".
I'm wainting for the nationwide curfew.
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Canada8989 Posts
On March 20 2020 03:50 anon3297534 wrote:
Guys, I'm in Canada and our situation isn't as dire but we've got nowhere to go but up. Kinda depressing with the US blowing up. Anyways, can someone answer me this question that's driving me CRAZY?
We have strict COVID-19 testing criteria: 1) Travel overseas (started off with at-risk countries but it might be anywhere now) 2) COVID-19 symptoms 3) Contact with someone with COVID-19 (these may differ slightly based on province)
When a journalist asks one of our public health reps about the testing criteria, they list the above and the reason why we're not testing more broadly? Because we have no evidence of community spread. How can you obtain evidence of community spread when your testing criteria ensures you will never directly get evidence of community spread?!!?!?!?
Not one journalist that I've heard has asked the obvious question of how you can prevent community spread effectively if you don't test for community spread. Yes, we are starting to see community spread so they are catching them somehow but it's definitely not through direct testing [of walk-ins] and so we are not pro-active in trying to nip this in the bud (like in Nova Scotia where there hasn't been that many cases so far but rising). Why are these questions not being asked or addressed?
You wait until they have symptom or show up at the hospital basicly, community spread is gonna happen anyway.
With that said it might not be a bad idea to do more extensive testing in more remote places.
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
On March 20 2020 05:11 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2020 04:40 Mohdoo wrote:On March 20 2020 04:39 stilt wrote:
What a mess but everything is China's fault ofc, they must pay for this. (they just gave us 1m masks btw) To be clear, they gave 1m masks for the pandemic they tried to cover up, which drastically increased the total # of infected people world-wide. Even if the worst rumors about China were true I don't think it would have changed much in most western countries. SK and the US had their first known case basically the same time. The massive amounts of infections the west are experiencing are on our own governments imo.
If, at the time of those first infections, the response of the US government was to lock down the borders completely and to mass produce test kits, that would have significantly reduced the impact of this whole thing. But the corporations - and the opposing political parties, for that matter - would have cried bloody murder, and it would be a political disaster (rather than the economic, humanitarian, AND political disaster we have now). While you're not wrong, that sounds so truly out of scope of how the US deals with its problems as to be unthinkable.
Nations that have actually dealt with potentially crippling pandemics, like Korea and Japan, seem to have known exactly how to react, and managed to spare themselves from the brunt of the infections. Maybe next time, we will have learned that lesson as a nation.
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On March 20 2020 06:48 LegalLord wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2020 05:11 GreenHorizons wrote:On March 20 2020 04:40 Mohdoo wrote:On March 20 2020 04:39 stilt wrote:
What a mess but everything is China's fault ofc, they must pay for this. (they just gave us 1m masks btw) To be clear, they gave 1m masks for the pandemic they tried to cover up, which drastically increased the total # of infected people world-wide. Even if the worst rumors about China were true I don't think it would have changed much in most western countries. SK and the US had their first known case basically the same time. The massive amounts of infections the west are experiencing are on our own governments imo. If, at the time of those first infections, the response of the US government was to lock down the borders completely and to mass produce test kits, that would have significantly reduced the impact of this whole thing. But the corporations - and the opposing political parties, for that matter - would have cried bloody murder, and it would be a political disaster (rather than the economic, humanitarian, AND political disaster we have now). While you're not wrong, that sounds so truly out of scope of how the US deals with its problems as to be unthinkable. Nations that have actually dealt with potentially crippling pandemics, like Korea and Japan, seem to have known exactly how to react, and managed to spare themselves from the brunt of the infections. Maybe next time, we will have learned that lesson as a nation.
Unfortunately we'll gradually forget the lesson, maybe over 10, 20 or 50 years.
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On March 20 2020 04:12 Mohdoo wrote:
Question: Does anyone here use a camera while WFH? It seems insane. A friend of mine was asking about getting a webcam and I can't imagine people asking for me to be on camera while on a work call. That sounds like some straight trash work culture IMO. I would be like "uh, mine isn't working, ain't happening" and disable it in device manager or something.
Also, now that we have a lot more data out of Italy, can we finally say with 100% certainty that China has been fabricating their data? At the very least, their death rates?
We mostly have the camera on during meetings. Adds a bit of a social dimension to it if you can see peoples' faces. But yeah, no rule. One colleague leaves it off, and nobody cares.
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On March 20 2020 07:51 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2020 04:12 Mohdoo wrote:
Question: Does anyone here use a camera while WFH? It seems insane. A friend of mine was asking about getting a webcam and I can't imagine people asking for me to be on camera while on a work call. That sounds like some straight trash work culture IMO. I would be like "uh, mine isn't working, ain't happening" and disable it in device manager or something.
Also, now that we have a lot more data out of Italy, can we finally say with 100% certainty that China has been fabricating their data? At the very least, their death rates? We mostly have the camera on during meetings. Adds a bit of a social dimension to it if you can see peoples' faces. But yeah, no rule. One colleague leaves it off, and nobody cares.
Insane. I'd never consider it.
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On March 20 2020 04:39 stilt wrote:
Wow, that's the first time our mainstream public media (france 2) is showing so much critical reactions against the gov. For almost 10 min, we saw nurses, doctors who are desperately asking for masks, basically every medical staff is asking for it. Every answers to each interview were extremely harshs, they're considering the lack of masks and overall means and disaster and are accusing the governement for it.
However, a partial selection of patients has already began in the East when the military hospital which have been announced will only be operational the 27 march (with only 30 beds, China in the same timelapse built a structure with 1000 beds, weird, according to some posters, our plutocraties were so much better)
Construction workers want to exercise their right to withdraw because they can't respect the one meter separation and the minister calls them uncivil.
The former health minister (or secretary, whatever), Agnes Buzyn who left the governement the 17 february in order to participe to the municipale elections of Paris called the non annulation of the municipal elections of the 15 march a masquerade, she looked quite devasted.
Finally, the governement is praising all the medical staff while during their 20 last years, they reduced both their numbers and salaries.
What a mess but everything is China's fault ofc, they must pay for this. (they just gave us 1m masks btw)
OF COURSE it's China's fault. If they didn't eat f*cking bats in some wet market in Wuhan, we'd have never been in this coronavirus mess. I might sound angry but that's because I'm angry during this lockdown regime in my country. I just want to live my life peacefully and normally. I want to go for a walk, I want to go to work instead of staying home, etc. I want to go to shop after 8 pm, but hey, shop closes at 8 pm during quarantine period. Again, it's because of some guys who thought bats are delicious. Wtf?
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Please tone down the aggression.
There is no need to be so derogatory.
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On March 20 2020 08:28 Artisreal wrote:
Please tone down the aggression.
There is no need to be so derogatory.
This isn't aggression mate. If you want to see aggression, go read about some guys abusing Asians in the streets for the current situation. I'm merely complaining about mess which puts me and my relatives at risk. Also, all inconveniences caused by lockdown which could very well be extended because I doubt we can finish off coronavirus in 2-3 weeks. And this isn't all, economic recession is coming. People could lose lives, jobs, relatives, etc. Are you happy with that? I'm not.
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Canada, Ontario:
Well, still the same symptoms here personally. They gave us this number
If you think you have COVID-19, before you come to hospital, please be screened by Telehealth by calling 1-866-797-0000
However I called the number. I was on hold for 5 hours and 47 minutes. The call was dropped. Apparently the average wait time is 3 hours and 30 minutes.
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China did ban these types of markets. It was a month or two ago but I'm sure I saw the news story about how they were banning the sale of wild animals.
Yes they should have known this was a thing to do after the last couple scares before but at least they've learned how this will blowback on them and they're doing a lot to help Italy in order to regain any face they can.
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EPT
