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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 665

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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!

NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.


If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
August 31 2018 20:41 GMT
#13281
I doubt it will gain any traction beyond his base. The general public has seen this dance before and understands the basic concept that talking shit about your business partner kills deals.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
August 31 2018 20:44 GMT
#13282
--- Nuked ---
thePunGun
Profile Blog Joined January 2016
598 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-08-31 21:01:01
August 31 2018 20:59 GMT
#13283
On September 01 2018 05:41 Plansix wrote:
I doubt it will gain any traction beyond his base. The general public has seen this dance before and understands the basic concept that talking shit about your business partner kills deals.


I think you're giving the "general public" too much credit here. They generally think they have a basic understanding of all sorts of things/concepts...
But I'm almost always amazed by the collective delusion and neglect of logic and common sense, when it comes to the so called "general public."
"You cannot teach a man anything, you can only help him find it within himself."
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-08-31 21:28:50
August 31 2018 21:28 GMT
#13284
On September 01 2018 05:59 thePunGun wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2018 05:41 Plansix wrote:
I doubt it will gain any traction beyond his base. The general public has seen this dance before and understands the basic concept that talking shit about your business partner kills deals.


I think you're giving the "general public" too much credit here. They generally think they have a basic understanding of all sorts of things/concepts...
But I'm almost always amazed by the collective delusion and neglect of logic and common sense, when it comes to the so called "general public."

Being cynical about humanity is easy and requires nothing A section of the county might be taken in by Trump's con, but slowly the rest of the country seems to be losing patience with the endless false claims and crying wolf.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
mikedebo
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada4341 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-08-31 21:42:32
August 31 2018 21:30 GMT
#13285
On September 01 2018 03:48 Lmui wrote:
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/08/31/bombshell-leak-to-toronto-star-upends-nafta-talks-in-secret-so-insulting-remarks-trump-says-he-isnt-compromising-at-all-with-canada.html

Show nested quote +
In remarks Trump wanted to be “off the record,” Trump told Bloomberg News reporters on Thursday, according to a source, that he is not making any compromises at all in the talks with Canada — but that he cannot say this publicly because “it’s going to be so insulting they’re not going to be able to make a deal.”


Essentially, the gist of this is that in an "off the record" interview with bloomberg, Trump admitted he's trying to torpedo the negotiations with Canada as far as NAFTA goes by refusing to compromise, and negotiating in bad faith.

Really, NAFTA needed some updates, but it was working fairly well for most industries. Hopefully Canada just walks away. I doubt we'll get any semblance of a win-win, it's more likely that Canada receives an ultimatum from the states going by this report. I think the Canadian consensus is to say fuck Trump, walk away if it's not mutually beneficial.

It depends on if the negotiators are on the same page as Trump, but it's fairly likely that there's no intention to make this be something which can work before the midterms in the states.


Really don't think we are going to walk away. Trudeau is going to get nailed for this pipeline debacle, and if we end up in a long situation with no trade agreement the PCs will scream about it nonstop until they know it's doing damage going into the 2019 election.

I am pretty confident that we will end up in a similar agreement as before. I personally wish we could end up in a situation where we only tariff US dairy instead of global, because their product is trash. Who the heck wants American dairy? That's like wishing for American beer. I'd love to be able to buy cheese imported from Europe, though.
I NEED A PHOTOSYNTHESIS! ||| 'airtoss' is an anagram of 'artosis' ||| SANGHOOOOOO ||| "No Korea? No problem. I have internet." -- Stardust
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-08-31 21:52:03
August 31 2018 21:36 GMT
#13286
Talks resume next week, per both sides. Trump is the one claiming that he is sending the Mexico only agreement to Congress. And then it will die, because Congress isn’t going to pass a NAFTA 2.0 without Canada and Mexico wouldn’t agree either. NAFTA only workers because Mexico and Canada want to trade with each other too and the US is in the way, like physically.

Edit: Slaughter, I just heard that as well. Trump is full of shit and he knows it. NAFTA can't be changed without congress.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
On_Slaught
Profile Joined August 2008
United States12190 Posts
August 31 2018 21:47 GMT
#13287
NPR was just saying that the Mexico agreement doesn't even work in a vacuum because much of the language presumes and requires Canadian involvement on certain issues.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-08-31 22:00:52
August 31 2018 22:00 GMT
#13288


There has been another plea deal in the Russia investigation related to another lobbyist and one time business partner to Manafort. He testified that he helped steer foreign money to Trumps inaugural committee and lied to the senate. All of that is illegal. One of the people he was funneling money on behalf of is a Russian national.

Also, this thread is good and details how wide the criminal malfeasance surrounding Trump has been.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-08-31 22:40:40
August 31 2018 22:33 GMT
#13289
On September 01 2018 07:00 Plansix wrote:
https://twitter.com/DavidKris/status/1035633291955720193

There has been another plea deal in the Russia investigation related to another lobbyist and one time business partner to Manafort. He testified that he helped steer foreign money to Trumps inaugural committee and lied to the senate. All of that is illegal. One of the people he was funneling money on behalf of is a Russian national.

Also, this thread is good and details how wide the criminal malfeasance surrounding Trump has been.


And that criminal malfeasance surrounding him has long preceded his presidency. By some coincidence his hotel deals are often financed by literal mob bosses or international grifters. Many Russians have parked their laundered money in his condos. Hopefully he gets caught by one or more of these investigations.
WolfintheSheep
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada14127 Posts
August 31 2018 23:19 GMT
#13290
On September 01 2018 06:30 mikedebo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2018 03:48 Lmui wrote:
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/08/31/bombshell-leak-to-toronto-star-upends-nafta-talks-in-secret-so-insulting-remarks-trump-says-he-isnt-compromising-at-all-with-canada.html

In remarks Trump wanted to be “off the record,” Trump told Bloomberg News reporters on Thursday, according to a source, that he is not making any compromises at all in the talks with Canada — but that he cannot say this publicly because “it’s going to be so insulting they’re not going to be able to make a deal.”


Essentially, the gist of this is that in an "off the record" interview with bloomberg, Trump admitted he's trying to torpedo the negotiations with Canada as far as NAFTA goes by refusing to compromise, and negotiating in bad faith.

Really, NAFTA needed some updates, but it was working fairly well for most industries. Hopefully Canada just walks away. I doubt we'll get any semblance of a win-win, it's more likely that Canada receives an ultimatum from the states going by this report. I think the Canadian consensus is to say fuck Trump, walk away if it's not mutually beneficial.

It depends on if the negotiators are on the same page as Trump, but it's fairly likely that there's no intention to make this be something which can work before the midterms in the states.


Really don't think we are going to walk away. Trudeau is going to get nailed for this pipeline debacle, and if we end up in a long situation with no trade agreement the PCs will scream about it nonstop until they know it's doing damage going into the 2019 election.

I am pretty confident that we will end up in a similar agreement as before. I personally wish we could end up in a situation where we only tariff US dairy instead of global, because their product is trash. Who the heck wants American dairy? That's like wishing for American beer. I'd love to be able to buy cheese imported from Europe, though.

Trudeau's approval ratings and popularity always shoots up every time he takes a hard-line with Trump. If the PCs want to make it an election issue, I think they'll be on the losing side of it.
Average means I'm better than half of you.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15687 Posts
August 31 2018 23:58 GMT
#13291
On September 01 2018 08:19 WolfintheSheep wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2018 06:30 mikedebo wrote:
On September 01 2018 03:48 Lmui wrote:
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/08/31/bombshell-leak-to-toronto-star-upends-nafta-talks-in-secret-so-insulting-remarks-trump-says-he-isnt-compromising-at-all-with-canada.html

In remarks Trump wanted to be “off the record,” Trump told Bloomberg News reporters on Thursday, according to a source, that he is not making any compromises at all in the talks with Canada — but that he cannot say this publicly because “it’s going to be so insulting they’re not going to be able to make a deal.”


Essentially, the gist of this is that in an "off the record" interview with bloomberg, Trump admitted he's trying to torpedo the negotiations with Canada as far as NAFTA goes by refusing to compromise, and negotiating in bad faith.

Really, NAFTA needed some updates, but it was working fairly well for most industries. Hopefully Canada just walks away. I doubt we'll get any semblance of a win-win, it's more likely that Canada receives an ultimatum from the states going by this report. I think the Canadian consensus is to say fuck Trump, walk away if it's not mutually beneficial.

It depends on if the negotiators are on the same page as Trump, but it's fairly likely that there's no intention to make this be something which can work before the midterms in the states.


Really don't think we are going to walk away. Trudeau is going to get nailed for this pipeline debacle, and if we end up in a long situation with no trade agreement the PCs will scream about it nonstop until they know it's doing damage going into the 2019 election.

I am pretty confident that we will end up in a similar agreement as before. I personally wish we could end up in a situation where we only tariff US dairy instead of global, because their product is trash. Who the heck wants American dairy? That's like wishing for American beer. I'd love to be able to buy cheese imported from Europe, though.

Trudeau's approval ratings and popularity always shoots up every time he takes a hard-line with Trump. If the PCs want to make it an election issue, I think they'll be on the losing side of it.



Yeah, Trudeau is one of many politicians riding the anti-Trump wave to high approval ratings.
CorsairHero
Profile Joined December 2008
Canada9491 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-09-01 02:54:26
September 01 2018 02:54 GMT
#13292
On September 01 2018 08:58 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2018 08:19 WolfintheSheep wrote:
On September 01 2018 06:30 mikedebo wrote:
On September 01 2018 03:48 Lmui wrote:
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/2018/08/31/bombshell-leak-to-toronto-star-upends-nafta-talks-in-secret-so-insulting-remarks-trump-says-he-isnt-compromising-at-all-with-canada.html

In remarks Trump wanted to be “off the record,” Trump told Bloomberg News reporters on Thursday, according to a source, that he is not making any compromises at all in the talks with Canada — but that he cannot say this publicly because “it’s going to be so insulting they’re not going to be able to make a deal.”


Essentially, the gist of this is that in an "off the record" interview with bloomberg, Trump admitted he's trying to torpedo the negotiations with Canada as far as NAFTA goes by refusing to compromise, and negotiating in bad faith.

Really, NAFTA needed some updates, but it was working fairly well for most industries. Hopefully Canada just walks away. I doubt we'll get any semblance of a win-win, it's more likely that Canada receives an ultimatum from the states going by this report. I think the Canadian consensus is to say fuck Trump, walk away if it's not mutually beneficial.

It depends on if the negotiators are on the same page as Trump, but it's fairly likely that there's no intention to make this be something which can work before the midterms in the states.


Really don't think we are going to walk away. Trudeau is going to get nailed for this pipeline debacle, and if we end up in a long situation with no trade agreement the PCs will scream about it nonstop until they know it's doing damage going into the 2019 election.

I am pretty confident that we will end up in a similar agreement as before. I personally wish we could end up in a situation where we only tariff US dairy instead of global, because their product is trash. Who the heck wants American dairy? That's like wishing for American beer. I'd love to be able to buy cheese imported from Europe, though.

Trudeau's approval ratings and popularity always shoots up every time he takes a hard-line with Trump. If the PCs want to make it an election issue, I think they'll be on the losing side of it.



Yeah, Trudeau is one of many politicians riding the anti-Trump wave to high approval ratings.

Doesn't really matter because the conservative have +4 % support over the liberals last month according to ipsos. Although this changes with the recent addition of another conservative party.
© Current year.
Ayaz2810
Profile Joined September 2011
United States2763 Posts
September 01 2018 14:00 GMT
#13293
"While some in the room rebuffed George's offer [to meet with the Russians], Mr. Trump nodded with approval and deferred to Mr. Sessions who appeared to like the idea and stated that the campaign should look into it. George's giddiness over Mr. Trump's recognition was prominent during the days that followed."

This is a legal document that says Trump knew about the conspiracy in his campaign and Sessions committed perjury. When are we going to stop playing games and giving reasonable doubt? That's for the legal system. We as citizens already know that the Trump campaign worked with Russia and middle eastern states to get himself elected illegally. LIke.... we KNOW it. There's enough public information to make that connection very clear. At what point do we stand up and say enough is enough with the lying and gaslighting? Just fess up already and resign for fuck's sake.

https://www.newsweek.com/papadopulos-trump-approved-when-meeting-putin-was-proposed-ahead-2016-1100898
Vrtra Vanquisher/Tiamat Trouncer/World Serpent Slayer
iamthedave
Profile Joined February 2011
England2814 Posts
September 01 2018 14:17 GMT
#13294
On September 01 2018 23:00 Ayaz2810 wrote:
"While some in the room rebuffed George's offer [to meet with the Russians], Mr. Trump nodded with approval and deferred to Mr. Sessions who appeared to like the idea and stated that the campaign should look into it. George's giddiness over Mr. Trump's recognition was prominent during the days that followed."

This is a legal document that says Trump knew about the conspiracy in his campaign and Sessions committed perjury. When are we going to stop playing games and giving reasonable doubt? That's for the legal system. We as citizens already know that the Trump campaign worked with Russia and middle eastern states to get himself elected illegally. LIke.... we KNOW it. There's enough public information to make that connection very clear. At what point do we stand up and say enough is enough with the lying and gaslighting? Just fess up already and resign for fuck's sake.

https://www.newsweek.com/papadopulos-trump-approved-when-meeting-putin-was-proposed-ahead-2016-1100898


The hardcores will never, ever, ever, ever, ever admit it. To them it's a media hack job. If Trump himself admitted it they'd just say 'they got to him too'.

I think everybody else already knows and either wants him gone or knows and doesn't care enough to want him gone over it. I honestly don't know why so many mainstream republicans are dug in over this; surely President Pence is closer to their moral view of the world?
I'm not bad at Starcraft; I just think winning's rude.
Ayaz2810
Profile Joined September 2011
United States2763 Posts
September 01 2018 14:31 GMT
#13295
On September 01 2018 23:17 iamthedave wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2018 23:00 Ayaz2810 wrote:
"While some in the room rebuffed George's offer [to meet with the Russians], Mr. Trump nodded with approval and deferred to Mr. Sessions who appeared to like the idea and stated that the campaign should look into it. George's giddiness over Mr. Trump's recognition was prominent during the days that followed."

This is a legal document that says Trump knew about the conspiracy in his campaign and Sessions committed perjury. When are we going to stop playing games and giving reasonable doubt? That's for the legal system. We as citizens already know that the Trump campaign worked with Russia and middle eastern states to get himself elected illegally. LIke.... we KNOW it. There's enough public information to make that connection very clear. At what point do we stand up and say enough is enough with the lying and gaslighting? Just fess up already and resign for fuck's sake.

https://www.newsweek.com/papadopulos-trump-approved-when-meeting-putin-was-proposed-ahead-2016-1100898


The hardcores will never, ever, ever, ever, ever admit it. To them it's a media hack job. If Trump himself admitted it they'd just say 'they got to him too'.

I think everybody else already knows and either wants him gone or knows and doesn't care enough to want him gone over it. I honestly don't know why so many mainstream republicans are dug in over this; surely President Pence is closer to their moral view of the world?


Seeing as Manafort picked Pence, there is little doubt in my mind that he is up to his fundamentalist neck in all of the same shit. When you look at the line of Presidential succession, you might end up with a janitor as President by the time it's all rooted out.

1 Vice President Mike Pence (R) -DIRTY
2 Speaker of the House of Representatives Paul Ryan (R) -DIRTY
3 President Pro Tempore of the Senate Orrin Hatch (R) -WILL BE DEAD IN A WEEK
4 Secretary of State Mike Pompeo (R) - DIRTY
5 Secretary of the Treasury Steven Mnuchin (R) -DIRTY
6 Secretary of Defense James Mattis (I) - DING DING DING!

President Mattis?
Vrtra Vanquisher/Tiamat Trouncer/World Serpent Slayer
Ayaz2810
Profile Joined September 2011
United States2763 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-09-01 15:27:46
September 01 2018 14:58 GMT
#13296
https://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/craig-bannister/warrants-spy-carter-page-obtained-without-fisa-court-hearings-doj

That is because they are warrants, not indictments or verdicts. The blatant lying to the uninformed masses is what got us here, and is the only thing keeping this ship afloat. It's saddening.

I wonder if judicial watch is aware that in every state a prosecutor or officer can call a judge on the phone and get a warrant?

Rule 17. Hearings.

(a) Scheduling. The Judge to whom a matter is presented or assigned must determine whether a hearing is necessary and, if so, set the time and place of the hearing.

It's almost like..... they followed procedure. *clutches pearls* OH MY.


User was temp banned for this post: Post history plus thread specific violation
Vrtra Vanquisher/Tiamat Trouncer/World Serpent Slayer
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
September 01 2018 18:03 GMT
#13297
has anyone followed the issue of the US decrease in funding for the UN run palestinian refugee org enough to say whether it's definitely a stupid decision, or if there's a decent underlying basis for it? (short answer is fine)
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
mahrgell
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Germany3943 Posts
September 01 2018 20:33 GMT
#13298
On September 02 2018 03:03 zlefin wrote:
has anyone followed the issue of the US decrease in funding for the UN run palestinian refugee org enough to say whether it's definitely a stupid decision, or if there's a decent underlying basis for it? (short answer is fine)

If you simply want to pick Israel as winner, it is a logical step.
If you want to somehow find a solution involving both sides, it is a stupid decision.

Until now the US at least pretended to be interested in a mutual solution to the conflict. That changed.
iamthedave
Profile Joined February 2011
England2814 Posts
September 01 2018 23:27 GMT
#13299
On September 02 2018 03:03 zlefin wrote:
has anyone followed the issue of the US decrease in funding for the UN run palestinian refugee org enough to say whether it's definitely a stupid decision, or if there's a decent underlying basis for it? (short answer is fine)


The US has finally begun behaving honestly over there .Can't really complain. I think we all know your government doesn't give a damn about the Palestinians save to do some vague hand wringing that won't in any way assist them in the long run.

It's monstrous, of course, but that's current US foreign policy for you.
I'm not bad at Starcraft; I just think winning's rude.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States42668 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-09-02 00:34:40
September 02 2018 00:29 GMT
#13300
On September 01 2018 04:17 Excludos wrote:
Why would a president (or anyone, really) admit to anything to a journalist that he doesn't leaked out, "off the record" or not? Does he get a hardon by sharing his secrets with random people? What did he think he would gain from doing this? Admiration from a single journalist..?

This. Don't say things to a journalist that you don't want them to repeat. Hell, don't say things to anyone if you don't want them to repeat them. But especially not journalists. It's baffling that Trump doesn't know how to have thoughts and not say them. Honestly it'd probably be worth it to get him a deaf friend to talk to, just to help protect national security.

Also I really don't get how the "dishonest media quoted me verbatim" line works. He's agreeing that he said it, whether or not a gentlemen's agreement existed between him and the journalist doesn't somehow make the Bloomberg reporting dishonest.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
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