Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!
NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.
I mean, look some of this is always going to suck regardless depending on one’s principles, but there is something to be said for the manner in which it is done
Not just ICE, but American law enforcement in general. Very intimidating, very dismissive, often very aggressive.
Unlike some I do concede the necessity of having those in one’s locker if required, but there’s just so many clips I’ve see where it’s the first resort
And yes it’s a big country, and Twitter or Reddit will naturally amplify the bad, on the flip side I just don’t really see much of anything comparable. Be it Northern Ireland, or the wider UK
There’s a segment of our population who will basically never trust our police force no matter what reforms are made, for quite understandable reasons but reforms have been made to address those issues.
We don’t have too many world leaders in anything over here, but our riot squads are absolutely the gold standard in containment and preventing escalation.
In the States, even with various controversies and protest movements, how law enforcement chooses to operate doesn’t seem to have changed all that much at a base cultural level.
Most people only see a few cherry-picked handful of the millions of encounters police have with people and make their judgements off that. It's an apples to oranges comparison of the job between USA officers and UK officers when it's a night and day difference of someone potentially having a gun that could end your life in a second. UK officers having a more chill attitude is not surprising.
I was in a bar that had a hoax called in about a dual firearm/bomb threat and the firearms squad bombed in from every entrance in the place. I happened to go out for a smoke right before this happened and was politely but firmly told not to attempt to re-enter. Mate who worked the bar on the inside told me the rest, which sounded to me as exemplary policing and they swept the place and were in and out in like 10 minutes.
Didn’t behave anything like some of the videos I see
Yes the fact we have a dedicated firearms squad(s), who are the only peelers armed and thus held in reserve for such potential incidents is illustrative of a difference in potential threats faced and their frequency, which I’ve conceded many times is absolutely a pertinent factor.
The problem I frequently see is a total lack of ability in some to de-escalate, indeed some inflame various scenarios. If you can’t do that, it’s problematic for you to be in that position.
Or, put another way, given the (relatively) atypical likelihood of firearms being held by anyone you stop versus other locales, you need to be better equipped to deal, not worse.
And I think there’s a general cultural problem with policing in the US that sees many being worse at this.
Frankly I think there are too many petty tyrants in US law enforcement, it’s really apparent in most of these kind of incidents. And it’s almost always that mentality which features in the stuff that makes it to Reddit or Twitter or whatever, it’s super fucking obvious that some of these people are on a power trip and that’s the problem.
Not to besmirch the many who are not like this by any means, but that culture is a huge part of the problem and I’m still not seeing some real shift to eradicate it
On May 10 2025 06:41 decafchicken wrote: Because they're weaponizing ICE against students exercising free speech, violating due process, deporting citizens, leveraging wartime and national emergency powers when neither are occurring, etc.
This.
Yes, deportations happend before.. but now they specificly target people "dear leader" doesn't like. Students, researchers, protestors.
And they bend the rules or forget them completely. If you are on a student visa, you should be able to part take in protest. Should you be accused of a crime, than only after a conviction ICE should challgenge your visa - now they do it on the basis of an accusation - or video - alone.
So while academics being targeted.. ICE contractors specificly spare farmers in red states from paying american-americans $60/hr to help with their fieldwork.. but allow illegals to continue for whatever pay they receive.
I wonder if the same judges dealing with ICE cases will also get some cases where people protest ICE, prevent arrest, etc. One could image that protesters would have reasonably good case when judge is already pissed at ICE and their behaviour in the same court could be used as evidence why protesters fear arrest being unlawful.
The levels of incompetence of this administration is criminal.
Apparently, Wiktoff has been relying upon a Kremlin interpreter for his negotiations. Besides the obvious conflict of interest in the initial exchange, this also means Wiktoff cannot use the interpreter in the retrospective debrief when making the memorandam of conversation which the rest of the Trump's (may he live for ever) administration will be relying upon.
My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
I'm baffled that the opposition in the US still uses the word 'tariff' instead of always replacing it with 'Trump tax'. It would be so easy to exploit this to get the point across.
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
I'm baffled that the opposition in the US still uses the word 'tariff' instead of always replacing it with 'Trump tax'. It would be so easy to exploit this to get the point across.
The best is all the cnbc interviews and whatnot. They're usually right leaning but factual so Scott bessent will be taking about how inflation is going down and they'll either passive aggressively cut to a graphic of all the price increases or very directly say "No, that is not how the economy works" and it's hilarious.
On May 10 2025 07:18 WombaT wrote: I mean, look some of this is always going to suck regardless depending on one’s principles, but there is something to be said for the manner in which it is done
Not just ICE, but American law enforcement in general. Very intimidating, very dismissive, often very aggressive.
Unlike some I do concede the necessity of having those in one’s locker if required, but there’s just so many clips I’ve see where it’s the first resort
And yes it’s a big country, and Twitter or Reddit will naturally amplify the bad, on the flip side I just don’t really see much of anything comparable. Be it Northern Ireland, or the wider UK
There’s a segment of our population who will basically never trust our police force no matter what reforms are made, for quite understandable reasons but reforms have been made to address those issues.
We don’t have too many world leaders in anything over here, but our riot squads are absolutely the gold standard in containment and preventing escalation.
In the States, even with various controversies and protest movements, how law enforcement chooses to operate doesn’t seem to have changed all that much at a base cultural level.
Meanwhile people in UK get arrested for posts on social medias...
On May 09 2025 23:07 GreenHorizons wrote: I suspect the tension between ICE/Police and society is going to reach a high during the summer with confrontations like this only escalating.
You see the problem here is, this is emotional argument, and you lost it at the moment first illegal immigrant committed a crime. It kind of looks like this: "Trump keeps kids in cages" - oh no thats horrible. "This illegal committed this crime" - WTF? this need to be stopped.
That I must say was rather brilliant of his campaign. I doubt he came up with this, but whoever did, needs a rise. The moment you hear this, it doesnt matter anymore that immigrants basically dont commit crimes compared to actual citizens (well, they do, but at lower rate). I must say that it is rather amusing that Trump beat Democrats at their own game. Democrats: Oh no x, y, z are poor, we need to help them. Trump: Oh no you are all poor, I'll help all of you.
But he doesn't. He lies about helping poor and then asks them to donate to his campaign. Brilliant, what a guy. There was a report of a German green card holder who was stopped at the airport, detained for 2 months in a high security prison without representation and then when he saw a judge about the violation he was in prison for, a 10 year old minor drug offence he was found not guilty for at the time, he got released by the judge. Is that the kind of way you want this country to operate? Shall Germany arrest us tourists as a tit for that?
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
Leopards ate my face will never stop being funny. It would be all okay if it was just the people who voted for this who were suffering, but sadly they got to pull everyone down into the leopard pit with them.
On May 10 2025 07:18 WombaT wrote: I mean, look some of this is always going to suck regardless depending on one’s principles, but there is something to be said for the manner in which it is done
Not just ICE, but American law enforcement in general. Very intimidating, very dismissive, often very aggressive.
Unlike some I do concede the necessity of having those in one’s locker if required, but there’s just so many clips I’ve see where it’s the first resort
And yes it’s a big country, and Twitter or Reddit will naturally amplify the bad, on the flip side I just don’t really see much of anything comparable. Be it Northern Ireland, or the wider UK
There’s a segment of our population who will basically never trust our police force no matter what reforms are made, for quite understandable reasons but reforms have been made to address those issues.
We don’t have too many world leaders in anything over here, but our riot squads are absolutely the gold standard in containment and preventing escalation.
In the States, even with various controversies and protest movements, how law enforcement chooses to operate doesn’t seem to have changed all that much at a base cultural level.
Meanwhile people in UK get arrested for posts on social medias...
On May 09 2025 23:07 GreenHorizons wrote: I suspect the tension between ICE/Police and society is going to reach a high during the summer with confrontations like this only escalating.
You see the problem here is, this is emotional argument, and you lost it at the moment first illegal immigrant committed a crime. It kind of looks like this: "Trump keeps kids in cages" - oh no thats horrible. "This illegal committed this crime" - WTF? this need to be stopped.
That I must say was rather brilliant of his campaign. I doubt he came up with this, but whoever did, needs a rise. The moment you hear this, it doesnt matter anymore that immigrants basically dont commit crimes compared to actual citizens (well, they do, but at lower rate). I must say that it is rather amusing that Trump beat Democrats at their own game. Democrats: Oh no x, y, z are poor, we need to help them. Trump: Oh no you are all poor, I'll help all of you.
Some people should be arrested for what they say online, some should not I’m sure.
Regardless it’s not really the crux of my point, one is a matter of what laws are being enforced, my point was around how that is done and the institutional culture.
I mean most of us don’t want or expect to be a suspect in a crime, but if one was would you rather it by US law enforcement or law enforcement from basically any other Western nation?
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
I'm baffled that the opposition in the US still uses the word 'tariff' instead of always replacing it with 'Trump tax'. It would be so easy to exploit this to get the point across.
It does seem like low hanging fruit. I do think the let them figure it out themselves might end up working out better long term because they have nothing to rally against other then...
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
Leopards ate my face will never stop being funny. It would be all okay if it was just the people who voted for this who were suffering, but sadly they got to pull everyone down into the leopard pit with them.
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
I'm baffled that the opposition in the US still uses the word 'tariff' instead of always replacing it with 'Trump tax'. It would be so easy to exploit this to get the point across.
The best is all the cnbc interviews and whatnot. They're usually right leaning but factual so Scott bessent will be taking about how inflation is going down and they'll either passive aggressively cut to a graphic of all the price increases or very directly say "No, that is not how the economy works" and it's hilarious.
Much like how even in MAGA ville everyone was posting pictures of there no where close to 1.98 gas Trump was claiming.
It is pretty funny in general how they think a guy famous of opulence is going to be great for lowering prices. I mean they need the massive tax increase just to pay for Donald's weekly golf vacations.
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
I'm baffled that the opposition in the US still uses the word 'tariff' instead of always replacing it with 'Trump tax'. It would be so easy to exploit this to get the point across.
It does seem like low hanging fruit. I do think the let them figure it out themselves might end up working out better long term because they have nothing to rally against other then...
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
Leopards ate my face will never stop being funny. It would be all okay if it was just the people who voted for this who were suffering, but sadly they got to pull everyone down into the leopard pit with them.
On May 11 2025 07:42 Billyboy wrote: My new guilty pleasure is reading tweets of MAGA people freaking out as they figure out that big Don was not in fact truthful on Tariffs being a foreign tax, but rather a tax paid by Americans.
I'm baffled that the opposition in the US still uses the word 'tariff' instead of always replacing it with 'Trump tax'. It would be so easy to exploit this to get the point across.
The best is all the cnbc interviews and whatnot. They're usually right leaning but factual so Scott bessent will be taking about how inflation is going down and they'll either passive aggressively cut to a graphic of all the price increases or very directly say "No, that is not how the economy works" and it's hilarious.
Much like how even in MAGA ville everyone was posting pictures of there no where close to 1.98 gas Trump was claiming.
It is pretty funny in general how they think a guy famous of opulence is going to be great for lowering prices. I mean they need the massive tax increase just to pay for Donald's weekly golf vacations.
I dunno if there’s much hope for the ‘let them figure it out’ crowd
Camp A may be benign enough folks, but if they haven’t figured it out yet, will they ever?
Camp B is more driven by antagonism, or other factors so even if they understand this tariff program is idiotic, they’re alright with it as long it’s punishing other folks they don’t like.
I’m getting a metric fuckton of Brexit (today’s quota) flashbacks in how the dynamics are working.
On the plus side, it does seem a sufficient portion of the country, including plenty of Trump voters do at least seem to understand quite how idiotic this is, which unlike in our example is proving a barrier to actualising these policies in the way initially proposed
Donald Trump has indicated he is ready to accept a luxury plane being offered to the US president as a gift from Qatar’s royal family, almost immediately igniting accusations of bribery and corruption as well as commensurate criticism.
Trump’s three-day tour of the Middle East that includes Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates and Qatar, ABC reported.
Donald Trump has indicated he is ready to accept a luxury plane being offered to the US president as a gift from Qatar’s royal family, almost immediately igniting accusations of bribery and corruption as well as commensurate criticism.
"A Gulf diplomatic source, who declined to be named or disclose his position, told The Media Line, "President Donald Trump will issue a declaration regarding the State of Palestine and American recognition of it, and that there will be the establishment of a Palestinian state without the presence of Hamas."
Now I am highly sceptical (anonymous source, somewhat brutal change of direction, and so on). It however made me wonder - If it turned out true, would some people here change their opinion on Trump presidency?
EPT
