EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 4962
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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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Uldridge
Belgium4765 Posts
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EnDeR_
Spain2688 Posts
On May 12 2025 18:54 Razyda wrote: I was just about to post this: https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-853387#853387 "A Gulf diplomatic source, who declined to be named or disclose his position, told The Media Line, "President Donald Trump will issue a declaration regarding the State of Palestine and American recognition of it, and that there will be the establishment of a Palestinian state without the presence of Hamas." Now I am highly sceptical (anonymous source, somewhat brutal change of direction, and so on). It however made me wonder - If it turned out true, would some people here change their opinion on Trump presidency? Change their opinion that Trump can easily be bought with a shiny new jet? | ||
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Acrofales
Spain17983 Posts
On May 12 2025 18:54 Razyda wrote: I was just about to post this: https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-853387#853387 "A Gulf diplomatic source, who declined to be named or disclose his position, told The Media Line, "President Donald Trump will issue a declaration regarding the State of Palestine and American recognition of it, and that there will be the establishment of a Palestinian state without the presence of Hamas." Now I am highly sceptical (anonymous source, somewhat brutal change of direction, and so on). It however made me wonder - If it turned out true, would some people here change their opinion on Trump presidency? Why would this change anybody's opinion of Trump. The main idea here is that the White House is for sale. And any time it is sold it is for sale again a day later. So if Qatar buys Trump's recognition of a Palestine state with a fancy plane, it doesn't even mean that tomorrow Netanyahu won't buy Trump's permission to invade that newly recognized state with a concession for the development of 5 new golf clubs in Gaza and the West Bank... Basically, (1) no, the means don't justify the end, and (2) especially not because the dude making assurances is a fickle piece of shit whose word is worth less than the paper it's written on. | ||
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KT_Elwood
Germany942 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25243 Posts
On May 12 2025 18:54 Razyda wrote: I was just about to post this: https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-853387#853387 "A Gulf diplomatic source, who declined to be named or disclose his position, told The Media Line, "President Donald Trump will issue a declaration regarding the State of Palestine and American recognition of it, and that there will be the establishment of a Palestinian state without the presence of Hamas." Now I am highly sceptical (anonymous source, somewhat brutal change of direction, and so on). It however made me wonder - If it turned out true, would some people here change their opinion on Trump presidency? I probably would not change my opinion no, in truth I struggle to think of what would at this point. I would consider it a positive development, sure, and if such a move occurred I suppose one could say he doesn’t entirely dance to Israel’s tune. But on the flipside, why? What’s changed? How do we go from removing restrictions on certain armaments being sold to Israel, and ‘let’s turn Gaza into a piece of international real estate’ to this? For me Trump as a political phenomenon has always been a problem of 2 parts. The first is quite explicable, it’s just stock standard populist stuff. Often shitty to my sensibilities but hey. The second is how incoherent it can be, how chaotic and unpredictable certain things are. And that’s basically all Trump, or sometimes people trying to predict how to curry his favour. The chaos is a problem in and of itself, to a degree you just don’t see elsewhere even with broadly similar strongmen populist types. I think we both concede what this leak is claiming is rather quite unlikely, but I figured I’d indulge anyway. I’d approve, but for there to be a U-turn this big, Trump has either been flattered/bribed, or alternatively the ‘Trump will just do whatever the last convincing person he was in a room with said’ framing is coming into play. These propensities are awful, awful attributes for a leader to possess, much less still one in such a lofty position. Add his narcissism and the demand for loyalty and subservience to it and it gets even worse as a cocktail. | ||
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Razyda
712 Posts
On May 12 2025 20:25 WombaT wrote: I probably would not change my opinion no, in truth I struggle to think of what would at this point. I would consider it a positive development, sure, and if such a move occurred I suppose one could say he doesn’t entirely dance to Israel’s tune. But on the flipside, why? What’s changed? How do we go from removing restrictions on certain armaments being sold to Israel, and ‘let’s turn Gaza into a piece of international real estate’ to this? For me Trump as a political phenomenon has always been a problem of 2 parts. The first is quite explicable, it’s just stock standard populist stuff. Often shitty to my sensibilities but hey. The second is how incoherent it can be, how chaotic and unpredictable certain things are. And that’s basically all Trump, or sometimes people trying to predict how to curry his favour. The chaos is a problem in and of itself, to a degree you just don’t see elsewhere even with broadly similar strongmen populist types. I think we both concede what this leak is claiming is rather quite unlikely, but I figured I’d indulge anyway. I’d approve, but for there to be a U-turn this big, Trump has either been flattered/bribed, or alternatively the ‘Trump will just do whatever the last convincing person he was in a room with said’ framing is coming into play. These propensities are awful, awful attributes for a leader to possess, much less still one in such a lofty position. Add his narcissism and the demand for loyalty and subservience to it and it gets even worse as a cocktail. I think thats fair. Thank you for actually answering the question. | ||
JimmyJRaynor
Canada16699 Posts
 I have a trade deficit with the grocery store. They keep stealing my money! I'm sick of this... I'm only going to be buying locally grown, in upstate New York, Avocados, Oranges, and Bananas! These evil grocery stores are probably sneaking in fentanyl with the bananas! TL;DR On The Presser: sitting underneath trees helped China and the USA settle their differences. The next time I'm making an important deal I'm gonna say: "hey, let's go over to the park and talk about this underneath some trees... we'll figure it all out there!" OK, more seriously: it is nice to see scott bessent heading up these negotiations. Howard Lutnick is scarey. I wonder if Lutnick believes the stuff he says. | ||
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Byo
Canada207 Posts
If it was a personal gift then why would the POTUS use his personal jet... Isn't that not really a "benefit" like using your own car for business. Even if trump sees this as perpetual gig, and there's no distinction between POTUS or himself then the POTUS should have no trouble commissioning a jet of his liking, he doesn't need to buy it per say. And what's a one time payment of a billion bucks truely mean in terms of the USA as a whole... Then there is the security concerns... Just doesn't feel right to me. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland25243 Posts
On May 12 2025 21:04 Razyda wrote: I think thats fair. Thank you for actually answering the question. No worries. I’m open to changing my mind on some things, I just don’t see Trump’s entire psyche fundamentally changing in his 70s, it is what it is. | ||
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KT_Elwood
Germany942 Posts
On May 12 2025 22:16 Byo wrote: Am I the only one that thinks this jet gift thing is a bit weird. If it was a personal gift then why would the POTUS use his personal jet... Isn't that not really a "benefit" like using your own car for business. Even if trump sees this as perpetual gig, and there's no distinction between POTUS or himself then the POTUS should have no trouble commissioning a jet of his liking, he doesn't need to buy it per say. And what's a one time payment of a billion bucks truely mean in terms of the USA as a whole... Then there is the security concerns... Just doesn't feel right to me. POTUS used to be the servant of the people, whose office probably had to ask some budget comissions if a new jet would be feasable.. Now POTUS is king and can just be gifted a jet from the country he also sells his "Trump brand" to, to build a 5,5 billion dollar golf course .. in the desert. "I have no intention of slowing down my business during the 2nd presidency" - Trump I like it. Just bribe him. Ask Trump what it would cost to nuke moscow on wednesday. A Trillion Dollars in Gold? | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16699 Posts
interesting times... | ||
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oBlade
United States5583 Posts
The current two planes are about 35 years old, from when the Berlin Wall fell. Boeing doesn't make 747s anymore, but Trump had negotiated (proudly) a $3.9 billion contract for them to deliver two replacements. This contract doesn't involve them building planes that aren't on their assembly line anymore, but modifying two 747s that were built but not delivered to anyone else. That was supposed to be $3.9 billion and done by this year. Now, it is, briefly, more than $3.9 billion and not going to be done until after Trump's term. Which is bullshit. Boeing by the way is the leading alternative to Mars-Man-Bad's company when it comes to space. The Qatar jet is also a 747 that had been parked in Florida. Either nobody is/was using it, or not often. The goal is to have a different company retrofit that aircraft to serve as an interim plane. https://nypost.com/2025/05/03/us-news/see-inside-trumps-lavish-new-air-force-one-complete-with-gold-walls-and-opulent-furnishings/ To me the interesting questions aren't being asked. Like you have to screen the whole plane, and retrofit it. The communications are one thing. But the current planes have nuclear bomb proofing and serious countermeasures for missiles and stuff. I don't know how much of that is from Boeing vs. from other people. And so it's interesting to see what the capabilities of the new plane would or wouldn't be, and who that's ultimately up to. Because the USSS doesn't even let the president drive. So what's the process for screening and retrofitting a plane that wasn't purpose-built, or at least wasn't in the custody of a defense contractor the whole time (like the unsold 747s being modified in the current $3.9 billion contract). Are the capabilities going to be the same? Better? Is that one just for domestic flights or something? And why is it better to pay for a plane than get it for free? | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23221 Posts
The order Trump is promising will direct the Department of Health and Human Services to tie what Medicare pays for medications administered in a doctor’s office to the lowest price paid by other countries. “I will be instituting a MOST FAVORED NATION’S POLICY whereby the United States will pay the same price as the Nation that pays the lowest price anywhere in the World,” the president posted Sunday on his social media site, pledging to sign the order on Monday morning at the White House. “Our Country will finally be treated fairly, and our citizens Healthcare Costs will be reduced by numbers never even thought of before,” Trump added. His proposal would likely only impact certain drugs covered by Medicare and given in an office — think infusions that treat cancer, and other injectables. But it could potentially bring significant savings to the government, although the “TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS” Trump boasted about in his post may be an exaggeration. He came into his first term accusing pharmaceutical companies of “getting away with murder” and complaining that other countries whose governments set drug prices were taking advantage of Americans. On Sunday, Trump took aim at the industry again, writing that the “Pharmaceutical/Drug Companies would say, for years, that it was Research and Development Costs, and that all of these costs were, and would be, for no reason whatsoever, borne by the ‘suckers’ of America, ALONE.” Referring to drug companies’ powerful lobbying efforts, he said that campaign contributions “can do wonders, but not with me, and not with the Republican Party.” apnews.com | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States44312 Posts
On May 12 2025 23:40 GreenHorizons wrote: Trump announced he's signing an EO to lower drug prices. apnews.com Didn't he just allow a rise in drug prices? And now he's going to lower them back? It sounds a lot like when businesses raise prices right before Black Friday / the holiday season, so that the "50% off" sale is really on goods that had just secretly doubled in price, meaning that it averages out to no savings at all. | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21667 Posts
On May 12 2025 23:40 GreenHorizons wrote: So this is just Trump reinstating the Biden drug lowering EO that he pulled when he came into office?Trump announced he's signing an EO to lower drug prices. apnews.com | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21667 Posts
On May 12 2025 22:16 Byo wrote: This is Qatar buying Trump his own Airforce One with all the bells and whistles and making the US government pay for it.Am I the only one that thinks this jet gift thing is a bit weird. If it was a personal gift then why would the POTUS use his personal jet... Isn't that not really a "benefit" like using your own car for business. Even if trump sees this as perpetual gig, and there's no distinction between POTUS or himself then the POTUS should have no trouble commissioning a jet of his liking, he doesn't need to buy it per say. And what's a one time payment of a billion bucks truely mean in terms of the USA as a whole... Then there is the security concerns... Just doesn't feel right to me. Could Trump just have bought one for himself as President and make the US pay for it? technically yes but I imagine he might get more pushback against it compared to Qatar 'gifting' the plane. And yes this plane would be a security nightmare. Basically 100% guaranteed to be full of the most advanced listening devices on the planet. If its retrofit were to finish before Trumps term ends then it would be an insane security breach to actually use it, but we have defense secretaries talking over uncontrolled chats while the world is listening in so... /shrug. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States44312 Posts
On May 12 2025 23:53 Gorsameth wrote: So this is just Trump reinstating the Biden drug lowering EO that he pulled when he came into office? It's like how Trump is surely going to brag about lowering taxes after repealing his own policy that raised taxes (tariffs). Eventually healing his own voluntary, damaging, self-inflicted wounds shouldn't be earning him any points. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States23221 Posts
On May 12 2025 23:45 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: Didn't he just allow a rise in drug prices? And now he's going to lower them back? It sounds a lot like when businesses raise prices right before Black Friday / the holiday season, so that the "50% off" sale is really on goods that had just secretly doubled in price, meaning that it averages out to no savings at all. Sorta. Probably different drugs (my cursory research indicates as much, you might have a better source to describe what you're talking about?), but it's still just something Trump said, not something he's signed that we can read (let alone interpret), so we can't know for sure. Even if it was the "sale" thing (which separately, is something that should be legislated against), it's going to get interpreted by MAGA/Repubs/ilk similarly to how libs/Dems/ilk interpreted Democrats not making the expanded child tax credit (that lifted "millions of kids out of poverty") permanent in hopes they could instead exploit its expiration as a campaigning strategy later. On May 12 2025 23:53 Gorsameth wrote: So this is just Trump reinstating the Biden drug lowering EO that he pulled when he came into office? Not as far as I can tell. EDIT: He signed it, I don't see the text myself, but maybe someone else will find it or a reliable interpretation of it. | ||
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oBlade
United States5583 Posts
On May 12 2025 23:53 Gorsameth wrote: So this is just Trump reinstating the Biden drug lowering EO that he pulled when he came into office? You're correct except the signs are flipped. The MFN rule for drug pricing was a Trump EO. The most he can possibly do is affect medicare prices because the government healthcare is under the executive branch. Price controls affecting the whole market, is a serious departure from the norm and would need to get past Congress. Democrats never supported it. Despite being an obvious socialist win, the majority of Democrats in Congress are controlled by big pharma. Even Trump's limited rule for medicare was challenged, and withdrawn under Biden. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15686 Posts
Other countries still have significant bargaining capability. The whole reason the US pays way more is we have extremely poor bargaining ability. Our whole political system is designed to prevent consumers from effectively bargaining and we pay way more for pharmaceuticals because of it. The countries that plain and simply can't afford to pay more will not pay more because pharma companies have already determined they still benefit from selling there. Pharma companies will probably just find shitty little ways to inch out a little higher costs for various other countries to offset the decrease in the US. | ||
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