I mean I think the only thing we disagree on is whether the system disadvantages Republicans specifically or just sucks in general. One of the bigger problems I have with the primary system is that it puts too many important decisions in a weird small election earlier in the year that nobody turns out for, and the only reason I liked the idea of this one is it let important intraparty decisions happen in the general instead. But the “lock out candidates” part still happens in the primary, which is maybe even worse. So yeah, let’s trash it, right? Ranked choice has its own problems but it’s gotta be better than this!
US Politics Mega-thread - Page 3831
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ChristianS
United States3304 Posts
I mean I think the only thing we disagree on is whether the system disadvantages Republicans specifically or just sucks in general. One of the bigger problems I have with the primary system is that it puts too many important decisions in a weird small election earlier in the year that nobody turns out for, and the only reason I liked the idea of this one is it let important intraparty decisions happen in the general instead. But the “lock out candidates” part still happens in the primary, which is maybe even worse. So yeah, let’s trash it, right? Ranked choice has its own problems but it’s gotta be better than this! | ||
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gobbledydook
Australia2605 Posts
On December 11 2022 09:01 Simberto wrote: But FPTP leads to and enables all of the problems. In a proportional system, gerrymandering is simply not a problem. That's like saying that car accidents can't happen without cars so the best way to reduce car accidents is to ban cars. Yeah, that solves the problem, but you didn't really solve it, you just made it irrelevant. | ||
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Simberto
Germany11912 Posts
On December 11 2022 20:22 gobbledydook wrote: That's like saying that car accidents can't happen without cars so the best way to reduce car accidents is to ban cars. Yeah, that solves the problem, but you didn't really solve it, you just made it irrelevant. Sure. But if you can make the problem irrelevant without any ill effects, you don't need to solve it. I am sure that with todays population numbers, dealing with the shit of all of the horses on the horse carts people need to move around would be a massive problem and hard to solve. But we don't need to solve that problem, because people don't use horse carts anymore. | ||
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Slydie
1971 Posts
On December 11 2022 20:45 Simberto wrote: Sure. But if you can make the problem irrelevant without any ill effects, you don't need to solve it. I am sure that with todays population numbers, dealing with the shit of all of the horses on the horse carts people need to move around would be a massive problem and hard to solve. But we don't need to solve that problem, because people don't use horse carts anymore. Right on. But I was talking to an US conservative, and he wasn't the slightest worried that the system is undemocratic. He didn't even consider the US a democracy, but rather a "republic", whatever that means. If someone consider it problematic that a majority gets its will, how do you even argue? Many conservatives feel entitled to a dispropotionate share of power. Minority rule is preferred, as long as THEY are that minority. That the Democrats still some times wins within this system is more than enough to keep the status quo, and if they can implement a better system for the conservatives, that is good. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35173 Posts
On December 11 2022 10:01 Djabanete wrote: A proportional system is certainly one solution. I also remember reading, I forget where, a list of 8 or so geometrical/mathematical/geographical rules for drawing districts. I think it was a set of rules actually in force in a Scandinavian country. The point is that, with sensible and meaningful constraints on how districts are drawn, it may not be possible to game the system very much even if your aim is to make districts that favor yourself. I’m all for independent districting commissions, but the independent or partisan nature of the districting commission could be less important than the constraints under which they operate. Ideally the rules for districting would be such that even the most self-interested party couldn’t get much mileage out of drawing the maps themselves. Not much of a track record for sensible and meaningful rules from Scandinavian countries going on here though. | ||
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Mikau313
Netherlands230 Posts
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Velr
Switzerland10910 Posts
"Not much of a track record for sensible and meaningful rules from Scandinavian countries going on here though." | ||
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28848 Posts
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Mikau313
Netherlands230 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35173 Posts
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Razyda
1036 Posts
DeSantis seeks grand jury investigation of Covid-19 vaccines "Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis said Tuesday that he plans to petition the state’s Supreme Court to convene a grand jury to investigate “any and all wrongdoing” with respect to the Covid-19 vaccines." Is it only me, or is he basically launching his presidential campaign without committing, or saying so? | ||
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gobbledydook
Australia2605 Posts
On December 11 2022 21:42 Slydie wrote: Right on. But I was talking to an US conservative, and he wasn't the slightest worried that the system is undemocratic. He didn't even consider the US a democracy, but rather a "republic", whatever that means. If someone consider it problematic that a majority gets its will, how do you even argue? Many conservatives feel entitled to a dispropotionate share of power. Minority rule is preferred, as long as THEY are that minority. That the Democrats still some times wins within this system is more than enough to keep the status quo, and if they can implement a better system for the conservatives, that is good. On the other side we have our resident communist GreenHorizon who believes in revolution and overthrow of the US government. There are extremists on both sides. | ||
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micronesia
United States24780 Posts
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Zambrah
United States7393 Posts
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Slydie
1971 Posts
On December 14 2022 10:21 gobbledydook wrote: On the other side we have our resident communist GreenHorizon who believes in revolution and overthrow of the US government. There are extremists on both sides. There have been times in the west when violent left-wing extremism was a relevant and dangerous force. The last 30 years have not been such a time, but whataboutism is great to resort to. | ||
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Simberto
Germany11912 Posts
On December 14 2022 16:47 Slydie wrote: There have been times in the west when violent left-wing extremism was a relevant and dangerous force. The last 30 years have not been such a time, but whataboutism is great to resort to. There is a kind of well-known quote by a famous german comedian about this: "left- or rightwing terrorism, i don't see any difference." "No, no. One sets foreigners on fire, the other cars. And cars are worse, because it could be my car. I don't own any foreigners." | ||
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Deleted User 173346
16169 Posts
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Simberto
Germany11912 Posts
And it is all so stupid. That is the weird thing. This whole conflict is pointless. Literally all they would need to do is leave people alone, and it would have no negative consequences for anyone. Yet they have to do this, for no discernable reason. This, once again, is one of those cases where i have a hard time viewing republicans as anything but simply evil. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On December 15 2022 01:12 plasmidghost wrote: Texas AG Ken Paxton is requesting names and numbers of all trans people in the state that have changed their gender on state records in the past two years, which includes me. That he's asking for this is freaking me the fuck out. The data wasn't able to be provided yet, but I do not doubt for a second that Paxton will make it happen. Jesus I really can't ever return to Texas. https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/12/14/texas-transgender-data-paxton/ Texas objectively sucks, don't worry about not going back. | ||
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gobbledydook
Australia2605 Posts
On December 14 2022 10:49 Zambrah wrote: GH is also not in a position of real authority within the US government basically at all, lol Neither is this "US conservative". I think the comparison is fair. | ||
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