EPTNow, it is disgusting in the first place - the way he's doing it. (I know that there's more nuance to it trophy hunting than that as it incentivizes the area to keep it's rare game alive and breeding, but persobally I don't like it). However, the bigger deal is probably going to be that a year after sandy hook and bragging about the necessity of good guys with guns, he failed to hit an unmoving target three times. I don't think that will play well with the pro gun crowd.
US Politics Mega-thread - Page 3197
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
Now, it is disgusting in the first place - the way he's doing it. (I know that there's more nuance to it trophy hunting than that as it incentivizes the area to keep it's rare game alive and breeding, but persobally I don't like it). However, the bigger deal is probably going to be that a year after sandy hook and bragging about the necessity of good guys with guns, he failed to hit an unmoving target three times. I don't think that will play well with the pro gun crowd. | ||
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farvacola
United States18869 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
On April 28 2021 07:57 JimmiC wrote: Not only unmoving, but the largest land animal! Probably as big as the broad side of some barns!  Well, he technically still hit it... just missed it being lethal. Which is honestly my biggest complaint here : the president of the NRA went sports hunting and tortured an animal because he was such a shitty shot, within a year of saying a good guy with a gun was the solution to toddlers being murdered. It's like the darkest kind of satire. In fact, his tour guide had to make the shot for him (and apparently his wife was a much better shot). I don't like sports hunting but it's one thing to do it painlessly... via new yorker btw, actually, not NYT. https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/the-secret-footage-of-nra-chief-wayne-lapierres-botched-elephant-hunt + Show Spoiler + The heat, at times, causes LaPierre to sweat. As he walks, his wire-framed glasses slide down his nose. After a guide spots an elephant standing behind a tree, LaPierre takes aim with a rifle. As LaPierre peers through the weapon’s scope, the guide repeatedly tells him to wait before firing. LaPierre is wearing earplugs, doesn’t hear the instructions, and pulls the trigger. The elephant drops. “Did we get him?” LaPierre asks. The guide at first says yes, but then, as he approaches the elephant, it appears that the animal is still breathing. The guide brings LaPierre within a few strides of the elephant, which lays motionless on the ground. He tells LaPierre that another bullet is needed. “I’m going to show you where to shoot,” the guide says. “Listen, hold your rifle—I’m going to tell you when. Just hold it up.” The guide pushes the rifle’s barrel skyward as other men involved in the expedition move around in the distance. “I’m going to point for you where to shoot. Just waiting for these guys.” The guide walks over to the elephant, crouches down, and points near the animal’s ear, telling LaPierre to shoot the elephant there. Makris directs LaPierre to shoot low, accounting for the rifle scope. LaPierre fires and a confused expression comes over his face. Once again, he shoots the elephant in the wrong place. It’s still alive. The guide tells LaPierre to sit down and reminds him to reload, as he physically moves LaPierre into place. Now on one knee, the N.R.A. leader asks, “Same spot?” and then shoots again. The bullet misses the mark. “I don’t think it’s quite done yet,” the guide says to Makris. “Do you want to do it for him?” The guide then says to LaPierre, “I’m not sure where you’re shooting.” “Where are you telling me to shoot?” LaPierre responds, sounding frustrated. The guide again walks over to the elephant and points toward the ear. “Oh, O.K.,” LaPierre says. “Alright, I can shoot there.” He takes a third shot at point-blank range. “Uh-uh,” the guide says, indicating that LaPierre has missed his mark again. “No?” LaPierre asks. As the guide chuckles, Makris asks, “Do you want me to do it?” “Go ahead, finish him,” the guide says. Makris cocks his rifle and shoots. “That’s it,” the guide declares, before turning to the N.R.A. chief to congratulate him. | ||
micronesia
United States24803 Posts
On April 28 2021 08:01 Mohdoo wrote: I can't imagine the mountain of insecurity someone needs to feel comfortable shooting an animal for sport. If you eat the animal, I can accept it, but hunting for sport is truly an abomination. I can't respect someone who hunts for sport. Not even the tiniest amount. What about if the hunting is part of an animal population control program? I personally have no desire to hunt but I can understand the value of using hunters to keep deer populations to within an acceptable band. An alternative would be to release a bunch of angry lions into the habitat... that would also control the deer population although it might be a bit more painful for the deer. | ||
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StasisField
United States1086 Posts
On April 28 2021 07:16 plasmidghost wrote: Meanwhile here, the Texas Senate has passed a bill that would do many things like revoke the medical licenses of any doctor that treats trans kids and forcefully take trans children from their homes if their families supports them and place them in our horrendous foster system. It may not clear the House, but we have until the end of May to wait and see since that's when the legislature ends until 2023. I cannot emphasize enough that these kids are going to be traumatized and die. www.texastribune.org/2021/04/27/texas-senate-transgender-child-abuse/ I seriously hate politics in this fucking state. I hope the House vote fails or that they run out of time to pass it. The latter seems unlikely though. Several years back in high school, I participated in something over the summer that allowed me to meet many people involved in the Texas Senate, House, etc and one of the "open secrets" one of the representatives shared with us is that the time-keeping they do for the House floor is falsified. For example, he claimed that on, say, the last night the House would be in session they'd stay later than they were allowed to be in session and simply record each vote on a bill as taking place at 11:59 PM. If they want to force a vote on this and ruin people's lives, they'll find a way. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Sermokala
United States14211 Posts
On April 28 2021 09:25 JimmiC wrote: I would hope all those deers are eaten if not it is a massive waste, and then Mohdoo would be fine with it. I eat all the deer I kill and I pay a fee for every one I tag. The hides can be donated in exchange for a pretty kickass pair of deer hide gloves. I support sport hunting that supports directly the species being hunted. Organizations like pheasants orever do a ton of good for habitats by buying the land for the pheasants and setting them up into public trusts for all animals. My local chapter of rual Minnesota has raised more than a million dollars in 10 years. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On April 28 2021 08:44 micronesia wrote: What about if the hunting is part of an animal population control program? I personally have no desire to hunt but I can understand the value of using hunters to keep deer populations to within an acceptable band. An alternative would be to release a bunch of angry lions into the habitat... that would also control the deer population although it might be a bit more painful for the deer. So long as there is a benefit to the environment, it’s no different than a lion hunting an animal. Humans do not need the ego trip of “Ooga booga me am strong man me kill animal”, so hunting for sport is a moral failing, whereas population control is not | ||
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Archeon
3273 Posts
On April 28 2021 08:57 StasisField wrote: I seriously hate politics in this fucking state. I hope the House vote fails or that they run out of time to pass it. The latter seems unlikely though. Several years back in high school, I participated in something over the summer that allowed me to meet many people involved in the Texas Senate, House, etc and one of the "open secrets" one of the representatives shared with us is that the time-keeping they do for the House floor is falsified. For example, he claimed that on, say, the last night the House would be in session they'd stay later than they were allowed to be in session and simply record each vote on a bill as taking place at 11:59 PM. If they want to force a vote on this and ruin people's lives, they'll find a way. Honestly laws stopping trans operations on children is one of the few points where I agree with the right. Trans operations are basically irreversible and this decision is far too large for an easily influenced kid to make. And no I don't trust parents to make the right call for their children, they are too often influenced by their own political agenda or wishes in this issue (on both sides). Let the person make their own call once they aren't a child anymore. On a side note apparently trans people who undergo the operations still have astronomical suicide rates, so no the operation doesn't magically make them feel at home in their own body and saves their life. It might help, but it might just as well lead to a situation during or past puberty where they wish they didn't get treated. | ||
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micronesia
United States24803 Posts
On April 28 2021 10:00 Mohdoo wrote: So long as there is a benefit to the environment, it’s no different than a lion hunting an animal. Humans do not need the ego trip of “Ooga booga me am strong man me kill animal”, so hunting for sport is a moral failing, whereas population control is not This gets a bit murky because a lot of the hunters in these areas are hunting for sport, but they are allowed to do so because of the population control goals of the local government. Some of the hunters cook and eat the meat, some do not. If eating the meat was somehow a requirement there may not be enough hunters to keep the deer populations in check in these areas. Perhaps you would view this as a necessary evil but not something to be proud of. | ||
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On April 28 2021 10:17 micronesia wrote: This gets a bit murky because a lot of the hunters in these areas are hunting for sport, but they are allowed to do so because of the population control goals of the local government. Some of the hunters cook and eat the meat, some do not. If eating the meat was somehow a requirement there may not be enough hunters to keep the deer populations in check in these areas. Perhaps you would view this as a necessary evil but not something to be proud of. If someone feels an internal desire to hunt for sport, they are a bad person and they have some stuff to work out in therapy. If it turns out this perversion ends up being a net positive to the environment, I'm all for it. I wouldn't invite the guy doing the hunting to thanksgiving, but I would view his contribution as a good thing. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24377 Posts
Conservationist hunting doesn't always mean it's for meat either. Varmint animals aren't usually eaten but depending on one's ecological view (and the particular species) they are considered nuisance animals that have adverse impacts on other wildlife (but usually humans). | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24377 Posts
On April 28 2021 10:32 GreenHorizons wrote: Where do people that kill and slaughter meat animals for others consumption like at chicken, beef, pig farms fit into this? Like someone who kills cows all day for work but never eats beef? | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Mohdoo
United States15743 Posts
On April 28 2021 10:32 GreenHorizons wrote: Where do people that kill and slaughter meat animals for others consumption like at chicken, beef, pig farms fit into this? Like someone who kills cows all day for work but never eats beef? Anyone doing this work is in a social class where they pretty much get a pass in terms of what they do for money. In the case you described, it is similar to hunting and eating it. You can kind of go down a rabbit hole, similar to the military. The general gist of it being "if no one agreed to do this work, it would cease to exist", but that would never happen so long as we live in a capitalist society. So long as a lower class worker is being held under the thumb of capitalists, doing what they gotta do to feed their kids makes sense to me. In the case of the sport hunter, I am assuming it is not needed for basic survival and that they are otherwise employed. They aren't dependent on hunting, they do it for pleasure. On April 28 2021 09:55 Sermokala wrote: I eat all the deer I kill and I pay a fee for every one I tag. The hides can be donated in exchange for a pretty kickass pair of deer hide gloves. I support sport hunting that supports directly the species being hunted. Organizations like pheasants orever do a ton of good for habitats by buying the land for the pheasants and setting them up into public trusts for all animals. My local chapter of rual Minnesota has raised more than a million dollars in 10 years. In my eyes, all of this money should have been raised/donated without someone demanding they kill an animal for fun first. Nothing stops people from donating to wildlife conservatories and whatnot. Its not like they won't let you donate unless you agree to also kill something. | ||
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Fleetfeet
Canada2836 Posts
The picture you're painting of sport hunters being fundamentally broken people isn't something I can get behind. I've met a few hunters, and a consistent thread through most of them is a respect for nature and consideration of the craft. Sure, it's a craft centered around killing, but that doesn't mean it is inherently evil or disrespectful. You could make an argument that the respect for nature is perverse, and I'd happily hear that argument, but I haven't seen signs that hunters are automatically bad people. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Sermokala
United States14211 Posts
The Black Rhinos that are auctioned off to kill need to be killed for the betterment of the herd and would be killed regardless of them monetizing it or not. I'm genuinely surprised that they haven't offered rich Americans a chance to go on a patrol for paochers, I know a number of people who have specifically asked for that on facebook. | ||
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