EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 2883
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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets. Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source. If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread | ||
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LegalLord
United Kingdom13775 Posts
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Sermokala
United States13754 Posts
Coops are something that doesn't get enough attention and my dairy cousins do pretty well with them. | ||
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Wegandi
United States2455 Posts
Are people really this self-deluded? PS: Its difficult to find only personal income data for the UK. I'm not sure how they classify this data but they use household numbers. Not sure if in the UK household = personal or its actually household or not. If it is truly household than the US dwarfs them by even more where US household income is somewhere 72-75k median. | ||
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Wegandi
United States2455 Posts
On December 09 2020 18:17 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: In regular times it's better to avoid debt spending but with the way the world has handled the COVID issue via just locking down entire economies direct payments are the best way. Sad to say with the lockdowns they've hurt small businesses and regular working class people the most whilst helped billionaires and big business greatly.Amazon saw sales increase 37% to 96B in 3Q while many small businesses were forced to stay closed https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/oct/29/amazon-profits-latest-earnings-report-third-quarter-pandemic Democrats may talk tough on helping the poor and getting tougher on big business but their COVID lockdown policies do exactly the opposite. Progressive policies always help the biggest firms. Small firms and local franchises need as low overhead as possible. All policies from progressives intend to make companies overhead as high as possible whether it be ridiculous zoning laws, myriad of regulatory burdens, long and expensive permitting processes, funding environmental commissions, increased labor costs with minimum wage laws, and even policies to prevent competition (like the CON statutes for hospitals permitting processes which thankfully were temporarily dismissed during COVID). https://reason.org/commentary/covid-19-prompts-states-to-suspend-regulations-that-have-limited-expansion-of-health-care-facilities/ | ||
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Salazarz
Korea (South)2590 Posts
But hey, talk about being self-deluded. The fact that you actually seriously consider that 30k per year could be the median household income in the UK just shows how utterly ignorant you are of the world outside of your own little bubble. | ||
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iamthedave
England2814 Posts
On December 09 2020 19:52 Salazarz wrote: @ Wegandi, you're right, I didn't bother doing the math of weekly earnings and just looked at the total figure which includes part timers to get the $35k for the US. But it's not as if the $865 weekly vs UK's weekly median of £586 (as per https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-8456/ and no, it's not household it's individual income) is significantly better. It's nowhere near the 50% difference you're claiming. 586 British Pounds works out to just under 800 US dollars; round it up to a 10% difference if you like, it's still basically the same. Except in UK the median wage worker also gets a minimum of 28 days of paid leave, 52 weeks maternity leave, and other commie benefits, whereas in US you've got what... right, whatever your boss decides to give you. Which on average, according to google, is around 10 days per year. But hey, talk about being self-deluded. The fact that you actually seriously consider that 30k per year could be the median household income in the UK just shows how utterly ignorant you are of the world outside of your own little bubble. I'll fill in a bit of detes here. The minimum paid leave allowed by jobs is 28 days. However in a lot of jobs that goes higher, as we also get bank holidays and the Queen's birthday off in most cases, and if we don't pretty much all jobs pay a higher hourly wage for working those days (even most retail; stingier companies pay 1.2x, some go as high as 1.5, and New Years Day, Christmas Eve/Boxing Day are usually 2x, and the jobs that need a Christmas Day shift usually pay 3x). Bottom end of the pay scale is 14k PA, so its conceivable for household income to fall in at 30k but very rare. The majority of civil service jobs are around 20k PA, so I'd expect median household income to fall in closer to 40k, since if two people have a job one of them's likely going to be higher than the low end. Wegandi might have mistaken overall household income with household disposable income, which indeed falls in at around 30k. That's the end result after mandatory national insurance contributions, NHS contributions and taxes. Though nobody in the UK gets to chest pound as we're one of the worst in Europe in almost every way and have a large spike in people living at or under the poverty line compared to most other EU countries. Still lower than the US. To compare to the US, Germany's median household income converted into dollars is 47k. | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7813 Posts
On December 09 2020 18:47 Sermokala wrote: Eh there are good unions and bad unions but the smaller ones are a lot better then the massive monolith national organizations. They provide a lot better jobs and benefits for the workers than jobs that don't have unions for them. Investigating them so they don't go corrupt is one thing but being anti-union in general is just pretty disgusting at the end of the day. Coops are something that doesn't get enough attention and my dairy cousins do pretty well with them. The collapse of unions is the number one reason blue collar jobs are proportionally underpaid. Workers have no bargaining power without unions, and it's no surprise that blue collar wages started to plateau when unions essentially disappeared. Unions are an absolutely crucial part in a functional capitalist economy. | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On December 09 2020 18:17 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: In regular times it's better to avoid debt spending but with the way the world has handled the COVID issue via just locking down entire economies direct payments are the best way. Sad to say with the lockdowns they've hurt small businesses and regular working class people the most whilst helped billionaires and big business greatly.Amazon saw sales increase 37% to 96B in 3Q while many small businesses were forced to stay closed https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/oct/29/amazon-profits-latest-earnings-report-third-quarter-pandemic Democrats may talk tough on helping the poor and getting tougher on big business but their COVID lockdown policies do exactly the opposite. problem with this is it's not like you have any other choice when if you do not shutdown many more people will die. What would you do differently because you have too many fucking dumb asses trying to preach freeeeeedom or this going against my human rights when it's just going to kill more people. I'm sorry but that's a big fucking cop out and cop outs can suck my dick. | ||
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Sadist
United States7189 Posts
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Simberto
Germany11342 Posts
On December 09 2020 22:46 Sadist wrote: The thing is weve tried not having lockdowns after the initial lockdown. We got to where we are now with that exact approach. Im just curious what those who oppose lockdowns would be? Let the hospitals be overrun and have the death rate skyrocket due to rationed care? That is always what confuses me. Yes, wearing a mask is slightly annoying. Yes, lockdowns are annoying and also bad for the economy. Yes, social distancing sucks, not being able to meet your friends and family sucks. I don't think anyone disputes these. But it is not like those are actually things anyone wants. I just don't see any alternative that isn't absolutely horrific, and the people who are protesting against corona restrictions never seem to have any plan on how to deal with the virus, either. I am not sure if they just assume that covering your eyes like a toddler and assuming that nothing bad is happens will work, or if they just don't care about the consequences of a runaway pandemic. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Sadist
United States7189 Posts
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States43827 Posts
On December 09 2020 22:46 Sadist wrote: The thing is weve tried not having lockdowns after the initial lockdown. We got to where we are now with that exact approach. Im just curious what those who oppose lockdowns would be? Let the hospitals be overrun and have the death rate skyrocket due to rationed care? Literally yes, and the justification for permitting that is "because of my personal freedom". That's a full-stop argument for some people, which is extremely selfish and short-sighted. And also, sadly, our initial lockdown was half-assed and not heavily enforced, let alone universally enforced, within the United States. | ||
KwarK
United States42016 Posts
On December 09 2020 18:17 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: In regular times it's better to avoid debt spending but with the way the world has handled the COVID issue via just locking down entire economies direct payments are the best way. Sad to say with the lockdowns they've hurt small businesses and regular working class people the most whilst helped billionaires and big business greatly.Amazon saw sales increase 37% to 96B in 3Q while many small businesses were forced to stay closed https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/oct/29/amazon-profits-latest-earnings-report-third-quarter-pandemic Democrats may talk tough on helping the poor and getting tougher on big business but their COVID lockdown policies do exactly the opposite. The Democrats don’t like COVID lockdowns, they think they’re necessary even though they don’t like them. What a ridiculous argument. Everybody would prefer that there wasn’t a pandemic but unfortunately there is one and so we can’t all have what we’d prefer. | ||
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Dan HH
Romania9024 Posts
On December 09 2020 18:17 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: In regular times it's better to avoid debt spending but with the way the world has handled the COVID issue via just locking down entire economies direct payments are the best way. Sad to say with the lockdowns they've hurt small businesses and regular working class people the most whilst helped billionaires and big business greatly.Amazon saw sales increase 37% to 96B in 3Q while many small businesses were forced to stay closed https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/oct/29/amazon-profits-latest-earnings-report-third-quarter-pandemic Democrats may talk tough on helping the poor and getting tougher on big business but their COVID lockdown policies do exactly the opposite. The entire ecommerce sector saw a boom this year for obvious reasons. Within that context, Amazon's growth is inline withe the growth of your average 500 visitors a day online shop. If you're having trouble with the above, imagine the opposite. Let's say there's an infectious disease that spreads only by internet use and the government shuts down the internet temporarily. Then you show the inevitable sales growth of Walmart as proof that shutting down the internet only helped big business, while ignoring that all in-person purchases grew at the same rate. | ||
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Biff The Understudy
France7813 Posts
On December 09 2020 18:17 iPlaY.NettleS wrote: In regular times it's better to avoid debt spending but with the way the world has handled the COVID issue via just locking down entire economies direct payments are the best way. Sad to say with the lockdowns they've hurt small businesses and regular working class people the most whilst helped billionaires and big business greatly.Amazon saw sales increase 37% to 96B in 3Q while many small businesses were forced to stay closed https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/oct/29/amazon-profits-latest-earnings-report-third-quarter-pandemic Democrats may talk tough on helping the poor and getting tougher on big business but their COVID lockdown policies do exactly the opposite. Were you under a rock when the senate was the stage of an epic battle between the GOP that promoted a relief bill almost exclusively in favour of big businesses and the Dems, which pushed for a bill helping modest household and small businesses? | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Netherlands30548 Posts
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States43827 Posts
On December 10 2020 01:43 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote: What does a president mean when he says he'll 'intervene' in court cases? https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1336668083822473221 It means he has no idea what he's talking about... or trying to commit election fraud... or both. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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