EPTUS Politics Mega-thread - Page 2853
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Zambrah
United States7297 Posts
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On November 25 2020 12:13 Shingi11 wrote: So the fight to hold onto the Trump supporters begins for Republicans. They are going to boycott the Georgia specials because they are not supporting Trump with his coup. Loffer looks to be behind Warnock already and Prudue just barely edged out Ossloff. 2018 was pretty good without Trump on the ticket so I would think things are looking up. God it would be so nice to punish Republicans by getting 50. And we can throw there same excuse back at them. Just change it from "Dem would of done it if they had chance" to "Republicans did do it when they had chance". And on the flip side, Warnock oppo just started: He supports Reverent Jeremiah Wright's "God damn America" epithets --same on Wright's “very fine” sermon calling AIDS an invention of the US government as a tool of genocide against black people. Gave a sermon saying you can't serve God and be in the military He's critical of Israel, comparing it to apartheid South Africa (It's like Democrats didn't even vet this guy before running him) Dems should push everything behind Ossloff, to be honest. Warnock's gonna get buried by all the oppo. Republicans are favored to hold one seat, but I'd say it's a tossup for the second seat. | ||
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Shingi11
290 Posts
On November 25 2020 12:31 Danglars wrote: And on the flip side, Warnock oppo just started: He supports Reverent Jeremiah Wright's "God damn America" epithets --same on Wright's “very fine” sermon calling AIDS an invention of the US government as a tool of genocide against black people. Gave a sermon saying you can't serve God and be in the military He's critical of Israel, comparing it to apartheid South Africa (It's like Democrats didn't even vet this guy before running him) Dems should push everything behind Ossloff, to be honest. Warnock's gonna get buried by all the oppo. Republicans are favored to hold one seat, but I'd say it's a tossup for the second seat. I not following the race too closely but it was my understanding that Warnock was the favorite with Ossloff being the underdog. I am sure both races are going to get a boat load of support and cash but would it not make sense to push Warnock if they had too. | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On November 25 2020 12:42 Shingi11 wrote: I not following the race too closely but it was my understanding that Warnock was the favorite with Ossloff being the underdog. I am sure both races are going to get a boat load of support and cash but would it not make sense to push Warnock if they had too. They're stuck with Warnock, but I disagree with "loeffer looks to be behind Warnock already" since the release of his past sermons & statements occurred too recently to feature in ads and permeate the electorate. I don't see Republicans losing both races, but Democrats need that to happen to get much done in the next two years. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35146 Posts
On November 25 2020 12:48 Danglars wrote: They're stuck with Warnock, but I disagree with "loeffer looks to be behind Warnock already" since the release of his past sermons & statements occurred too recently to feature in ads and permeate the electorate. I don't see Republicans losing both races, but Democrats need that to happen to get much done in the next two years. Read: Republicans will refuse to do their job for another 2 years. | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On November 25 2020 12:53 Gahlo wrote: Read: Republicans will refuse to do their job for another 2 years. In divided government, that’s doing their job. Compare with : Presidents elected with a mandate. Next time, try winning state elections? Or running on a platform attractive to a majority of states? This time hundreds of millions of dollars were spent opposing senate seats that Republicans won by 15+ points  | ||
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Gahlo
United States35146 Posts
On November 25 2020 13:36 Danglars wrote: In divided government, that’s doing their job. Compare with : Presidents elected with a mandate. Next time, try winning state elections? Or running on a platform attractive to a majority of states? This time hundreds of millions of dollars were spent opposing senate seats that Republicans won by 15+ points I'm sure that's going to make the sick and dying feel better. | ||
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NewSunshine
United States5938 Posts
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Zambrah
United States7297 Posts
On November 25 2020 13:57 Gahlo wrote: I'm sure that's going to make the sick and dying feel better. You should know better than to think the Republicans give a flying fuck about the sick and dying, the only stage of human life they give a crap about is the one where its arguable whether or not its classifiable as human life. Such an angle for the Democrats to work, I pray they learn something, bully Biden into yes manning some real legislation for the working class and lap up the disenfranchised Trump voters. | ||
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StasisField
United States1086 Posts
On November 25 2020 14:37 Zambrah wrote: You should know better than to think the Republicans give a flying fuck about the sick and dying, the only stage of human life they give a crap about is the one where its arguable whether or not its classifiable as human life. Such an angle for the Democrats to work, I pray they learn something, bully Biden into yes manning some real legislation for the working class and lap up the disenfranchised Trump voters. Hell, Biden and the Democrats should adopt Sanders' plan of attack to get necessary votes he proposed while running for President: Propose legislation that benefits the working class, find out which Congresspersons who oppose the legislation are up for re-election, and then hold rallies in those Congresspersons' states to pressure them into switching their votes. "Oh, you don't want to see people's standard of living go up? I'll make sure your entire state knows that." | ||
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Simberto
Germany11507 Posts
On November 25 2020 12:31 Danglars wrote: And on the flip side, Warnock oppo just started: He supports Reverent Jeremiah Wright's "God damn America" epithets --same on Wright's “very fine” sermon calling AIDS an invention of the US government as a tool of genocide against black people. Gave a sermon saying you can't serve God and be in the military He's critical of Israel, comparing it to apartheid South Africa (It's like Democrats didn't even vet this guy before running him) Dems should push everything behind Ossloff, to be honest. Warnock's gonna get buried by all the oppo. Republicans are favored to hold one seat, but I'd say it's a tossup for the second seat. You make all of those sound ridiculous, but some of them do make a lot of sense. I think you risk a lot of mental strain trying to square "Thou should not kill" and being in the military. And Israel is problematic in a lot of ways. Sadly the whole area is a major clusterfuck at this point, but i would say that supporting Israel no matter what they do is not the solution. | ||
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Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
On November 25 2020 14:11 NewSunshine wrote: I see we're back to the "President doesn't matter, it's only when the President and Senate match for some unspecified reason that you can get away with anything" line of reasoning. Nonsense. Own the fact that your guys are making the deliberate choice to do fuck all to represent their constituents. It's a choice they make, nobody's forcing Republicans to be the "Party of No". What do you think tea party Republicans represent besides "party of no." Their constituents are on board with them saying no to anything democrats propose. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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Uldridge
Belgium4768 Posts
It's entirely logical it ends up this way. However, in other countries it's getting quite bad as well. I have the eerie feeling Western democracy is eating itself. | ||
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DarkPlasmaBall
United States44324 Posts
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Gorsameth
Netherlands21679 Posts
On November 26 2020 00:46 JimmiC wrote: Don't you think it makes sense for a conservative to think nothing should change without an overwhelming majority?It is beyond messed up that someone would think that government is well functioning if their only goal is to "own the other side" (block anything and everything). The point is to fight all election then work together while in government. It is not like reps and dems voters are so wildly different they disagree on everything it more the framing of things. There are tons of things they agree on. That policy has become were the opposite of those guys is moronic and self defeating. Kinda seems like it encapsulates the political physiology nicely no? | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
That’s a repudiation of Trump and not one of the GOP agenda. Whining more about how dumb Americans are to vote for this, and lying about what Republicans ran on, is a quick ticket to giving us more seats in 2022. See that combative Pelosi call with her caucus where Democrats blamed DNC messaging on a a diverse range of topics for losing their comfortable House margin. | ||
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brian
United States9619 Posts
On November 26 2020 01:27 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: Given that Trump and Giuliani have been trying to sabotage the presidential election for 3 weeks now without any precedent or evidence, is what they're doing officially treasonous? I'm curious what the official legal term is for the crime they're undoubtedly committing, which seems to be attempting to preemptively undermine our country's next executive branch and replace president-elect Biden with their own party's leader (Trump) who legitimately lost the election. This seems to be pretty consistent with a conspiracy to commit treason, as treason includes attempts at overthrowing the government. I'm sure they won't be imprisoned because of their level of influence, but I think we're way past the point where these are just honest mistakes on their part and/or the idea that we shouldn't take Trump and Giuliani seriously because they're bumbling morons. This isn't just fearmongering or gaslighting anymore; when does it become a crime to say and do the things they're doing, which includes destroying our democracy? Or is it not yet a crime, but will become a crime once the electors vote? Or perhaps after Inauguration Day? this has been happening for MUCH longer than three weeks. Trump has been priming his followers (may as well say believers at this point for those remaining in his camp) for this since before July, with all the claims of how bad mail in voting is. | ||
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Nevuk
United States16280 Posts
On November 26 2020 01:27 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: Given that Trump and Giuliani have been trying to sabotage the presidential election for 3 weeks now without any precedent or evidence, is what they're doing officially treasonous? I'm curious what the official legal term is for the crime they're undoubtedly committing, which seems to be attempting to preemptively undermine our country's next executive branch and replace president-elect Biden with their own party's leader (Trump) who legitimately lost the election. This seems to be pretty consistent with a conspiracy to commit treason, as treason includes attempts at overthrowing the government. I'm sure they won't be imprisoned because of their level of influence, but I think we're way past the point where these are just honest mistakes on their part and/or the idea that we shouldn't take Trump and Giuliani seriously because they're bumbling morons. This isn't just fearmongering or gaslighting anymore; when does it become a crime to say and do the things they're doing, which includes destroying our democracy? Or is it not yet a crime, but will become a crime once the electors vote? Or perhaps after Inauguration Day? No. Treason has an extremely specific legal definition in the US. It only applies to a country we have declared war with. Now, there is a good question as to whether it applies to those who have declared war on the US which is slightly applicable - apparently Putin said something to this effect in 2015 or 2016 in one of the redacted parts of the Mueller report. The answer is likely to be no, however. Treason has a crazy limited definition because it was wildly misused in contemporary England when the constitution was written. Sedition is closer to what you're looking for, with one exception - it probably requires intent to "delay execution" "by force". It is a little unclear. Here's the statute (emphasis mine). If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both. 18-usc-sect-2384 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2384 It's a very high burden to prove that Trump is trying to incite violence to prevent Biden from becoming president. If there were smoking gun proof (ie, a leaked recording stating that he is doing that, with all of his lawyers contributing to the strategy in a way that makes it clear that it's not a joke), this is the statue he'd get charged with. Trump's legal strategies are all perfectly fine (though moronic) within the law. It's only his speech that could get him in trouble. | ||
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Sermokala
United States13927 Posts
On November 26 2020 01:32 Danglars wrote: It’s when Democrats can’t get everything they want that they whine about obstructionism. Americans, and nobody else, returned a Democratic president together with an *almost* Republican Senate and the smallest majority in a Democrat House for a new president in around a half century. That’s a repudiation of Trump and not one of the GOP agenda. Whining more about how dumb Americans are to vote for this, and lying about what Republicans ran on, is a quick ticket to giving us more seats in 2022. See that combative Pelosi call with her caucus where Democrats blamed DNC messaging on a a diverse range of topics for losing their comfortable House margin. Its pretty crazy when the Dems that were conservative in their messaging were the ones that got defeated. People don't have an appetite for the left-leaning party to lean right. Really unhappy that peterson lost his seat in Minnesota. Dems couldn't hold onto a seat that chaired the agriculture committee in a massively agricultural district. If you needed any more evidence that the dems have stopped given a shit about the farm and labor vote they should be going after its that. Now the farm bill will be benefiting the coasties and the midwest will get even worse for dems. | ||
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