• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 02:41
CEST 08:41
KST 15:41
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 1 - Final Week0[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall10HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0
Community News
Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation14$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced6Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles6[BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China9Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL66
StarCraft 2
General
Firefly given lifetime ban by ESIC following match-fixing investigation RSL Season 1 - Final Week The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation TL Team Map Contest #4: Winners Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles
Tourneys
$25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series WardiTV Mondays
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [G] Progamer Settings ASL20 Preliminary Maps [ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China [BSL20] Grand Finals - Sunday 20:00 CET CSL Xiamen International Invitational
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Positive Thoughts on Setting Up a Dual-Caliber FX
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Summer Games Done Quick 2025! US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
Culture Clash in Video Games…
TrAiDoS
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 587 users

Customer Discrimination: Okay or Not? - Page 2

Forum Index > General Forum
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Next All
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-18 17:40:22
January 18 2013 17:37 GMT
#21

You misspelled "immigrants," by the way. I honestly cannot tell if that was intentional however, lol.


Intentional, quoting Moe from the Simpsons.

Episode 3f20 'Much Apu About Nothing' fyi.

"Immigants! I knew it was them! Even when it was the bears, I knew it was them."
TheWorldToCome
Profile Joined January 2012
United States452 Posts
January 18 2013 17:43 GMT
#22
If your business is a private business and on your private property you can allow or disallow anyone you want based on whatever you want. Just like you can allow or disallow anyone you want into your private home.

It's a private property issue.
Starcraft 2 was designed to have a best race. You play the worst one.
heroyi
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States1064 Posts
January 18 2013 17:47 GMT
#23
Sucks but it is a right for the owner of the business.

"We have the right to refuse business to anyone."

wat wat in my pants
NEOtheONE
Profile Joined September 2010
United States2233 Posts
January 18 2013 17:47 GMT
#24
I agree with the general principle that if there are alternative options to the business that is refusing services then the business can go ahead and refuse services.

If the business discriminates based on race, gender, or disability then there is the possibility that the business could be taken to court over the matter. (Though could you imagine someone trying to sue over Ladies Night? They would get laughed right of the court room)
Abstracts, the too long didn't read of the educated world.
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-18 17:50:40
January 18 2013 17:49 GMT
#25
On January 19 2013 02:43 TheWorldToCome wrote:
If your business is a private business and on your private property you can allow or disallow anyone you want based on whatever you want. Just like you can allow or disallow anyone you want into your private home.
It's a private property issue.


So you are okay with this? You can't see why there would be any reason for a civilised responsible society to prevent this sort of thing?:

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]
bonifaceviii
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada2890 Posts
January 18 2013 17:51 GMT
#26
It's up to the government to determine which forms of discrimination are permissible or not. Simply saying "businesses should not be able to discriminate any of their practices based on any factor at all, under any circumstances" is not A) possible or B) ideal.

Example: in 2010 the CBC started kicking up a fuss because home insurance companies were using their customers' credit ratings to determine their rates:
The Co-operators said in written correspondence that credit scores are "one of the most predictive indicators of future claims for property and casualty insurance. As such, it is a logical rating factor for home insurance."

The funny thing about it was that it was already illegal for car insurance companies to discriminate based on credit rating in certain provinces. Why the disconnect? If a car insurance company can't make the (actuarially reasonable) assumption that you're going to make claims because you're a deadbeat, why can a home insurance company?

Also, you might remember we all laughed at the guy who wrote a nasty letter to his car insurance company for giving him a higher quote because he was male but the European Court agrees with him.

TLDR: it's complicated
Stay a while and listen || http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=354018
VayneAuthority
Profile Joined October 2012
United States8983 Posts
January 18 2013 17:54 GMT
#27
On January 19 2013 02:49 sc4k wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 19 2013 02:43 TheWorldToCome wrote:
If your business is a private business and on your private property you can allow or disallow anyone you want based on whatever you want. Just like you can allow or disallow anyone you want into your private home.
It's a private property issue.


So you are okay with this? You can't see why there would be any reason for a civilised responsible society to prevent this sort of thing?:

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]


If there is a black guy in your house and you don't want him there, believe it or not you have the right to get him removed from your property. It is no different here. Please try strolling into people's homes and claiming you have a right to be there and see what happens. If the guy owns the land the bakery is on, he can have anyone removed from there that he wants.

Thats why our laws are pretty terrible, since there is so much overlap and gray area in things like this
I come in for the scraps
MooseyFate
Profile Joined February 2011
United States237 Posts
January 18 2013 17:59 GMT
#28
On January 19 2013 02:49 sc4k wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 19 2013 02:43 TheWorldToCome wrote:
If your business is a private business and on your private property you can allow or disallow anyone you want based on whatever you want. Just like you can allow or disallow anyone you want into your private home.
It's a private property issue.


So you are okay with this? You can't see why there would be any reason for a civilised responsible society to prevent this sort of thing?:

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]




If the owner of a private business is dumb enough to put up that sign, then he can deal with the consequences. Anyone who isn't an ignorant racist would boycott the business and they would no longer be a business. It's that simple. Society as a whole isn't that stupid.
We don't need the government to bubble wrap everything in the world so that no one ever gets offended by anything ever again. If someone wants to discriminate against people who don't tie their shoes in a certain fashion, they can. But everyone has just as much right to call them out on their ignorant bullshit and not give them their money. Let the people speak for themselves (democracy) instead of forcing people to hold to a government prescribed morality.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18825 Posts
January 18 2013 18:02 GMT
#29
On January 19 2013 02:54 VayneAuthority wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 19 2013 02:49 sc4k wrote:
On January 19 2013 02:43 TheWorldToCome wrote:
If your business is a private business and on your private property you can allow or disallow anyone you want based on whatever you want. Just like you can allow or disallow anyone you want into your private home.
It's a private property issue.


So you are okay with this? You can't see why there would be any reason for a civilised responsible society to prevent this sort of thing?:

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]


If there is a black guy in your house and you don't want him there, believe it or not you have the right to get him removed from your property. It is no different here. Please try strolling into people's homes and claiming you have a right to be there and see what happens. If the guy owns the land the bakery is on, he can have anyone removed from there that he wants.

Thats why our laws are pretty terrible, since there is so much overlap and gray area in things like this

Actually, the ambiguity of our laws and the necessity for contextual interpretation is one of their greatest strengths, but that is neither here nor there. A public storefront and a private home are different entities; a store might be private property but if it is open to the general public for business different rules apply, i.e. the civil rights act of 1964. If the bakery owner wishes to change his business to an entirely private affair without an open storefront and accordingly deny gays wedding cakes, that is his right. But the matter becomes more complicated if his business is to remain open to the public.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-18 18:08:28
January 18 2013 18:03 GMT
#30
On January 19 2013 02:54 VayneAuthority wrote:
If there is a black guy in your house and you don't want him there, believe it or not you have the right to get him removed from your property. It is no different here. Please try strolling into people's homes and claiming you have a right to be there and see what happens. If the guy owns the land the bakery is on, he can have anyone removed from there that he wants.


You are trying to make out like there are no other social issues at play here, but there are. Have you studied anything about the history of racism in your country? It's not about the simple legal right to prevent access to your property.

On January 19 2013 02:59 MooseyFate wrote:
We don't need the government to bubble wrap everything in the world so that no one ever gets offended by anything ever again.


You can't seriously think that outlawing 'no coloureds allowed' signs is bubble wrapping 'everything in the world'.

This isn't just about offence. It speaks to the history of your country, the goals of a civilised country, the desire for everyone to suppress racist provocation. Your approach is extremely insensitive and unsophisticated, in my opinion.
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-18 18:07:37
January 18 2013 18:07 GMT
#31
-oops
FiWiFaKi
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada9858 Posts
January 18 2013 18:08 GMT
#32
On January 19 2013 02:54 VayneAuthority wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 19 2013 02:49 sc4k wrote:
On January 19 2013 02:43 TheWorldToCome wrote:
If your business is a private business and on your private property you can allow or disallow anyone you want based on whatever you want. Just like you can allow or disallow anyone you want into your private home.
It's a private property issue.


So you are okay with this? You can't see why there would be any reason for a civilised responsible society to prevent this sort of thing?:

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]


If there is a black guy in your house and you don't want him there, believe it or not you have the right to get him removed from your property. It is no different here. Please try strolling into people's homes and claiming you have a right to be there and see what happens. If the guy owns the land the bakery is on, he can have anyone removed from there that he wants.

Thats why our laws are pretty terrible, since there is so much overlap and gray area in things like this


What kind of comparison is that lmao. That's not discrimination, you have the right to remove EVERYONE from your property. If it was only black people, then yeah, shit would hit the fan.

If it holds for everyone, we meet a mutual acceptance, and people are happy with it because "I wont go in peoples' houses, and they wont go into mine, sounds good". If it was "white people can come into my house, and I can't come into theirs". That's when it gets bad. A balance of fairness and equality must be there.
In life, the journey is more satisfying than the destination. || .::Entrepreneurship::. Living a few years of your life like most people won't, so that you can spend the rest of your life like most people can't || Mechanical Engineering & Economics Major
cLAN.Anax
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
United States2847 Posts
January 18 2013 18:09 GMT
#33
To those who support: Are there certain aspects that some would prejudice against (namely gender or race) that you believe would prove more harmful to society than the freedom to discriminate is worth?

To those who oppose: What is your opinion on discounts, like those offered to senior citizens, students, and members of the armed forces? It is necessarily discrimination (albeit more positive discrimination), but is that a form of discrimination you would accept?
┬─┬___(ツ)_/¯ 彡┻━┻ I am the 4%. "I cant believe i saw ANAL backwards before i saw the word LAN." - Capped
heliusx
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
United States2306 Posts
January 18 2013 18:12 GMT
#34
On January 19 2013 02:47 heroyi wrote:
Sucks but it is a right for the owner of the business.

"We have the right to refuse business to anyone."



That doesn't mean what you think it does. It is illegal to refuse service based on race, color, religion, sex or disability. In some states it goes even further including sexual orientation.
dude bro.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18825 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-01-18 18:18:47
January 18 2013 18:16 GMT
#35
On January 19 2013 03:09 cLAN.Anax wrote:
To those who oppose: What is your opinion on discounts, like those offered to senior citizens, students, and members of the armed forces? It is necessarily discrimination (albeit more positive discrimination), but is that a form of discrimination you would accept?

As far as I'm concerned, the "discount" nature of those mild forms of discrimination changes the manner in which they are legally regarded; if the general public is still offered a normal, unchanged price for goods and services, than preferential discounts are probably ok. In the case of the smoothie shop, the fact that political inclination possibly entails a fee or a higher than baseline price if one belongs to a particular group seems like obvious evidence of an illegally discriminatory business practice. And outright refusal of business in the case of the bakery owner seems utterly inexcusable, at least if the business is to be open to the public. Ultimately, it is the legal recognition of a private business entity's being "open to the public" that is most important here.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
FiWiFaKi
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada9858 Posts
January 18 2013 18:17 GMT
#36
On January 19 2013 03:09 cLAN.Anax wrote:
To those who support: Are there certain aspects that some would prejudice against (namely gender or race) that you believe would prove more harmful to society than the freedom to discriminate is worth?

To those who oppose: What is your opinion on discounts, like those offered to senior citizens, students, and members of the armed forces? It is necessarily discrimination (albeit more positive discrimination), but is that a form of discrimination you would accept?


There is certain "discrimination" we tolerate, because our beliefs and values give us respect for certain people and we feel they deserve to be rewarded. This like you said includes senior citizen, and retired military. If you look a couple hundred years back, a portion of the people in the US believed they were better than black people, and deserved more, just as Hitler believed his "Aryan Race" was better and deserved more.

Don't really understand why people are trying to make this complicated when it isn't. Severe inequality leads to Racism, Religious Intolerence, and Political View Intolerence. This eventually leads to extreme nationalism and violence.

Nothing else can really be added to this situation, logically looking at it, there's no real other outcomes.
In life, the journey is more satisfying than the destination. || .::Entrepreneurship::. Living a few years of your life like most people won't, so that you can spend the rest of your life like most people can't || Mechanical Engineering & Economics Major
Silvanel
Profile Blog Joined March 2003
Poland4725 Posts
January 18 2013 18:19 GMT
#37
It is my belive that private buisness should be able to discimanate any way it wants. Be it skin color, faith, height, weight, color of pants, or ability to integrate. It should however lose this right, if its owned by governemnt (even in 0,001%), is benefiting from governemnt grants, or grants by governemnt sponsored organization, or benefiting from any tax reduction or exemption which purpose might be in contradiction with such discrimantion.
Pathetic Greta hater.
PassionFruit
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
294 Posts
January 18 2013 18:26 GMT
#38
On January 19 2013 02:54 VayneAuthority wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 19 2013 02:49 sc4k wrote:
On January 19 2013 02:43 TheWorldToCome wrote:
If your business is a private business and on your private property you can allow or disallow anyone you want based on whatever you want. Just like you can allow or disallow anyone you want into your private home.
It's a private property issue.


So you are okay with this? You can't see why there would be any reason for a civilised responsible society to prevent this sort of thing?:

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]


If there is a black guy in your house and you don't want him there, believe it or not you have the right to get him removed from your property. It is no different here. Please try strolling into people's homes and claiming you have a right to be there and see what happens. If the guy owns the land the bakery is on, he can have anyone removed from there that he wants.

Thats why our laws are pretty terrible, since there is so much overlap and gray area in things like this


lol that's not a gray area. Private business "open to the public" =/= private homeowner living in the privacy of his home. The only gray area is how to define "open to the public," not whether the two situations should be treated the same way.
FiWiFaKi
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada9858 Posts
January 18 2013 18:27 GMT
#39
On January 19 2013 03:19 Silvanel wrote:
It is my belive that private buisness should be able to discimanate any way it wants. Be it skin color, faith, height, weight, color of pants, or ability to integrate. It should however lose this right, if its owned by governemnt (even in 0,001%), is benefiting from governemnt grants, or grants by governemnt sponsored organization, or benefiting from any tax reduction or exemption which purpose might be in contradiction with such discrimantion.


In a situation where many believe that big multi-national companies have enough money to "buy" spots in government, I'm sure it happens to an extent, to how much, I don't know. This seems like an awful idea.

Crazy people running the show can do lots of harm, only way against this would be people constantly campaigning against companies with such policy, which just defeats the purpose.
In life, the journey is more satisfying than the destination. || .::Entrepreneurship::. Living a few years of your life like most people won't, so that you can spend the rest of your life like most people can't || Mechanical Engineering & Economics Major
GnarlyArbitrage
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
575 Posts
January 18 2013 18:30 GMT
#40
If an entire sector or something all asked what your political affiliation was and wanted proof, and this service was a "basic necessity", would that be considered an invasion of privacy? What if I don't want people to know my political standing, but I must use their services or someone else's in the industries? I mean, sure, I can not buy a car, have insurance and inspection, but I live in a city where I need a car to get around.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 3h 19m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 216
StarCraft: Brood War
Leta 322
Noble 110
Bale 23
JulyZerg 19
Dota 2
ODPixel198
NeuroSwarm107
League of Legends
JimRising 699
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor94
Other Games
summit1g9349
shahzam790
Stewie2K762
monkeys_forever399
SortOf73
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick37706
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH361
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• tankgirl 2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota291
League of Legends
• Lourlo1103
• Stunt553
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
3h 19m
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs Reynor
OSC
6h 19m
Replay Cast
17h 19m
RSL Revival
1d 3h
Classic vs Cure
FEL
1d 9h
OSC
1d 13h
RSL Revival
2 days
FEL
2 days
FEL
2 days
CSO Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
2 days
Bonyth vs QiaoGege
Dewalt vs Fengzi
Hawk vs Zhanhun
Sziky vs Mihu
Mihu vs QiaoGege
Zhanhun vs Sziky
Fengzi vs Hawk
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
FEL
3 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
3 days
Bonyth vs Dewalt
QiaoGege vs Dewalt
Hawk vs Bonyth
Sziky vs Fengzi
Mihu vs Zhanhun
QiaoGege vs Zhanhun
Fengzi vs Mihu
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-07-07
HSC XXVII
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025

Upcoming

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSL Xiamen Invitational
CSL Xiamen Invitational: ShowMatche
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
Underdog Cup #2
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.