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President Obama Re-Elected - Page 679

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Hey guys! We'll be closing this thread shortly, but we will make an American politics megathread where we can continue the discussions in here.

The new thread can be found here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=383301
kwizach
Profile Joined June 2011
3658 Posts
October 05 2012 02:06 GMT
#13561
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.


The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes.

Jesus Christ, how many times does it have to be repeated in this thread that the bills created by Republicans WERE NOT Obama's budget?!
"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions." -- Stephen Colbert
TotalBalanceSC2
Profile Joined February 2011
Canada475 Posts
October 05 2012 02:08 GMT
#13562
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.


Wealth is no measure of intelligence at all.
Souma
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
October 05 2012 02:08 GMT
#13563
On October 05 2012 11:06 kwizach wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes.

Jesus Christ, how many times does it have to be repeated in this thread that the bills created by Republicans WERE NOT Obama's budget?!


Don't take him too seriously. He's either a troll or just plain doesn't know what he's talking about. :p

In any case, can't wait for the next episode of The Daily Show! Bill Maher should be interesting as well. I'm sure he'll blast the hell out of Obama.
Writer
th3j35t3r
Profile Joined September 2012
Australia15 Posts
October 05 2012 02:12 GMT
#13564
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.

In terms of intelligence the two candidates are similar that being said, Romney's skill set and background is what makes him better. This is a guy that fixed broken companies for a living, then if that was not enough proceeded to fix the salt lake city Olympics. Some have complained that doesn't translate to political success, then again he was the governor of the most liberal state in the nation.
Go ahead, make my day
xDaunt
Profile Joined March 2010
United States17988 Posts
October 05 2012 02:16 GMT
#13565
On October 05 2012 11:06 kwizach wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes.

Jesus Christ, how many times does it have to be repeated in this thread that the bills created by Republicans WERE NOT Obama's budget?!

It doesn't really matter. The democrats didn't bother to advance his budget because it was such a piece of shit.
Defacer
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada5052 Posts
October 05 2012 02:25 GMT
#13566
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.


There both exceptionally intelligent and successful, compared to most people. Romney was born with everything but to his credit made the most of it, amassing a remarkable fortune. Obama was born with a single flakey mother and an absent, drunk father and paved his own way to become the first Black President of the United States.


Tula
Profile Joined December 2010
Austria1544 Posts
October 05 2012 02:25 GMT
#13567
On October 05 2012 11:12 th3j35t3r wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.

In terms of intelligence the two candidates are similar that being said, Romney's skill set and background is what makes him better. This is a guy that fixed broken companies for a living, then if that was not enough proceeded to fix the salt lake city Olympics. Some have complained that doesn't translate to political success, then again he was the governor of the most liberal state in the nation.


fixed broken companies for a living? I'm sorry but are we talking about the same firm? Bain investment did a lot of stuff but that is not how many people would describe him.

What bothers me the most about this discussion is not wether Romney is a good buisnessman, he obviously was or he wouldn't have made any money, but what exactly does that have to do with being a good politician? Frankly Obama tried his best but the way Republicans blocked him had nothing to do with his bills or their inherent quality. I have no idea how good Romney would be in Comparison, but what I do know is that the way the USA are split into two camps makes sensible compromise almost impossible.

Frankly I don't think either of them will manage to get much done, no matter who is elected the deadlock in Senate/House will remain.
SayGen
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1209 Posts
October 05 2012 02:26 GMT
#13568
Obama really screwed up the debate- he had the election secured and he screwed it up.
Maybe he shoulda practiced his dogma instead of hanging out with Dave Letterman or The View ladies.
We Live to Die
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland25332 Posts
October 05 2012 02:29 GMT
#13569
On October 05 2012 11:12 th3j35t3r wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.

In terms of intelligence the two candidates are similar that being said, Romney's skill set and background is what makes him better. This is a guy that fixed broken companies for a living, then if that was not enough proceeded to fix the salt lake city Olympics. Some have complained that doesn't translate to political success, then again he was the governor of the most liberal state in the nation.

He made plenty of cash for himself and other investors, he doesn't exactly have a good record in actually saving the companies he bought, on many occasions he just asset-stripped them. While in itself this is pretty good business savvy, not really particularly politically useful, he can't trumpet his success in this regard for this campaign because many of the electorate find it unedifying.

Obama's politically useless in his own way, in that he never shows any balls. People like to claim they want more cooperation in politics and that probably explains his conciliatory approach towards the Republicans. However, this is really harming his perception among his own political base.
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
October 05 2012 02:29 GMT
#13570
On October 05 2012 11:12 th3j35t3r wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.

In terms of intelligence the two candidates are similar that being said, Romney's skill set and background is what makes him better. This is a guy that fixed broken companies for a living, then if that was not enough proceeded to fix the salt lake city Olympics. Some have complained that doesn't translate to political success, then again he was the governor of the most liberal state in the nation.


Working for Bain Capital does not involve "fixing broken companies," no matter what soundbytes Romney has said on the campaign trail. The number one goal of his company was leveraging the assets of the company they were consulting, not fixing them or saving jobs. Others who worked with him have even said as much.
TheRabidDeer
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
United States3806 Posts
October 05 2012 02:33 GMT
#13571
On October 05 2012 11:25 Tula wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 11:12 th3j35t3r wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.

In terms of intelligence the two candidates are similar that being said, Romney's skill set and background is what makes him better. This is a guy that fixed broken companies for a living, then if that was not enough proceeded to fix the salt lake city Olympics. Some have complained that doesn't translate to political success, then again he was the governor of the most liberal state in the nation.


fixed broken companies for a living? I'm sorry but are we talking about the same firm? Bain investment did a lot of stuff but that is not how many people would describe him.

What bothers me the most about this discussion is not wether Romney is a good buisnessman, he obviously was or he wouldn't have made any money, but what exactly does that have to do with being a good politician? Frankly Obama tried his best but the way Republicans blocked him had nothing to do with his bills or their inherent quality. I have no idea how good Romney would be in Comparison, but what I do know is that the way the USA are split into two camps makes sensible compromise almost impossible.

Frankly I don't think either of them will manage to get much done, no matter who is elected the deadlock in Senate/House will remain.

The same question about translation of skills happened with Obama too. He had no political experience, and was mostly a lawyer. A huge amount of his administration has shown off his abilities as a lawyer. Perhaps getting a successful businessman to the front COULD help?
RCMDVA
Profile Joined July 2011
United States708 Posts
October 05 2012 02:41 GMT
#13572
I took a look at Obama's speech in Madison Wisconsin this afternoon.

http://www.c-span.org/Campaign2012/Events/Pres-Obama-Campaign-Rally-in-Denver/10737434626/

No real mention of jobs, other that what he said in the debate.

If I had to make a bet the NFP payroll number will be under 100k tomorrow. Obama gets the NFP number a day in advance.


Internationally...the biggest issue I'm seeing out there that could come into the Presidental race is that Iran's currency in a freefall. Currency collapse mixed with nukes. Fun stuff.

TheFrankOne
Profile Joined December 2010
United States667 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-05 02:44:41
October 05 2012 02:42 GMT
#13573
On October 05 2012 09:55 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 09:16 sam!zdat wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:13 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On October 05 2012 08:04 HunterX11 wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:01 Zaqwert wrote:
On October 05 2012 06:50 HunterX11 wrote:
On October 05 2012 06:46 Zaqwert wrote:
Every politician always promises to do everything in vague terms

"I'll cut the deficit by X over Y years!"

"I'll reduce/increase A over B years!"

and none of them ever do it and both of these dudes are no different.

You say what you need to to get elected.


All things said and done, I'm voting Romney. Unbridled capitalism is definitely the way to go. Everyone is better off long term when the markets are free.

People look at billionaries and millionaries and get all pissed off and jealous, but who super rich a few get is unimportant if it improves the quality of life of everyone.

The poorest people in America have a higher standard of living than the King of England did 500 years ago.

Poor people have high def tvs, iphones, cars, all the food they could ever want, etc.

Capitalism creates a few super wealthy, but not at the expense of society, it's for its greater benefit. When the government gets into the business of "fairness" and redistributing wealth it's always bad long term. A few people at the very bottom get a temporary benefit to the detriment of most everyone else.

People need to get over looking at people at the top and thinking they got all that money by screwing you over. They got it by creating things, inventing things, providing goods and services to everyone's benefit, etc.

Both candidates kinda suck, but I believe Romney will provide a less regulated economy long term which will lead to greater prosperity of everyone long term.


It's unimportant that a small select few control the vast majority of the wealth? I'm pretty sure that is important to everyone, rich and poor alike.


It's unimportant what % of total wealth in the world you control, what's important is that the total value of that wealth is growing.

To put it in simple terms, would you rather have $1 worth of value in a world where there was a total of $10 (you own 10% of all the wealth in the entire world)

Or would you rather have $5 worth of value in a world where there was a total of $100 (you now own 5% of the wealth in the entire world)

Poor is a make believe RELATIVE term.

A guy making 20K in the US is considered poor. He has a higher standard of living than 99.99% of people in human history ever has. THAT is what is important.

He has more utility wealth at his disposable than most emperors and kings in history did.

To use a classic analogy, stop worrying about how the pie is divided and start worrying about making a bigger pie. What's important is not the ratio of your pie slice to everyone else's, what's important is that if things run properly EVERYONE GETS MORE PIE.


Why not use any contemporary analogies? Is the existence social democracy some massive conspiracy and actually Europe doesn't exist at all or something? Besides, median real wages in the U.S. have remained stagnant for decades, while the richer have got richer. Productivity has increased, as have profits, but wages have not. There IS more pie, and ALL of the excess is going to the rich. The rich are taking the whole pie.

Has the increase in non-wage compensation made up for that? If you are just looking at wages you are ignoring the greater role benefits like health insurance have taken in worker compensation. I don't know what data you are going off of so I don't know if that has been taken into account with your statement or not.


Do you have any thoughts on or analysis of this phenomenon? I would be interested to hear.


I'm more or less speaking from my own general knowledge, but I found this NBER working paper on the interwebs.

Link

Show nested quote +
Two principal measurement mistakes have led some analysts to conclude that the rise in labor income has not kept up with the growth in productivity. The first of these is a focus on wages rather than total compensation. Because of the
rise in fringe benefits and other noncash payments, wages have not risen as rapidly as total compensation. It is important therefore to compare the productivity rise with the increase of total compensation rather than with the increase of the
narrower measure of just wages and salaries.


To clarify, that is a paper on the relationship between wages and productivity in the nonfarm business sector.

Fascinating paper, but if you read the whole thing you will find that while "wage" (including noncash benefits) has increased at about the same rate as productivity using constant dollars derived from non-cpi inflation, if you use appropriate deflationary models to look at standard of living (cpi), the difference is over a 1/3 gap between increase in productivity and wage increases.

"If one uses the CPI data to calculate real compensation, its growth is reduced to 1.2 percent a year and therefore substantially less than the 1.9 percent annual rise in productivity.... There are of course other questions for which using compensation deflated by the CPI or some other consumer price index is appropriate, including measuring changes in the standard of living of wage earners"

So workers wages have mostly kept pace with their productivity increases based off of inflation in their industry, but each year they increase in productivity more than their wages and all the while cpi products climb in price faster than what the "non-farm business sector" produces.

Even that paper says that the standard of living has been eaten away. I'm not really willing to concede that having health insurance one day, then having the same health insurance but it costing more the next feels like much of a wage increase, and it definitely is not a step towards higher standard of living.

Sanctimonius
Profile Joined October 2010
United Kingdom861 Posts
October 05 2012 02:43 GMT
#13574
People keep talking about how good Romney was as a businessman, and maybe that's what the US needs. Personally I'll be interested to see how firing, asset-stripping and shipping jobs abroad will do for the average American.
You live the life you choose.
Defacer
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada5052 Posts
October 05 2012 02:46 GMT
#13575
On October 05 2012 11:41 RCMDVA wrote:
I took a look at Obama's speech in Madison Wisconsin this afternoon.

http://www.c-span.org/Campaign2012/Events/Pres-Obama-Campaign-Rally-in-Denver/10737434626/

No real mention of jobs, other that what he said in the debate.

If I had to make a bet the NFP payroll number will be under 100k tomorrow. Obama gets the NFP number a day in advance.


Internationally...the biggest issue I'm seeing out there that could come into the Presidental race is that Iran's currency in a freefall. Currency collapse mixed with nukes. Fun stuff.



Yeah, and Iranians are starting to protest their government again. Who said the sanctions didn't work?
Jumbled
Profile Joined September 2010
1543 Posts
October 05 2012 02:47 GMT
#13576
On October 05 2012 11:26 SayGen wrote:
Obama really screwed up the debate- he had the election secured and he screwed it up.
Maybe he shoulda practiced his dogma instead of hanging out with Dave Letterman or The View ladies.

Yes and no - Obama performed poorly in the debate, but Romney took a lot of risks to win it that may come back to haunt him. He changed his position on quite a few issues and lied about others, which provides a lot of material for attack ads as well as giving Obama potential ammo for the remaining debates.
Defacer
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada5052 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-05 02:53:28
October 05 2012 02:52 GMT
#13577
On October 05 2012 11:29 TheTenthDoc wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 11:12 th3j35t3r wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.

In terms of intelligence the two candidates are similar that being said, Romney's skill set and background is what makes him better. This is a guy that fixed broken companies for a living, then if that was not enough proceeded to fix the salt lake city Olympics. Some have complained that doesn't translate to political success, then again he was the governor of the most liberal state in the nation.


Working for Bain Capital does not involve "fixing broken companies," no matter what soundbytes Romney has said on the campaign trail. The number one goal of his company was leveraging the assets of the company they were consulting, not fixing them or saving jobs. Others who worked with him have even said as much.


The debate I really want to see is the debate about 'principles' -- or a philosophical argument about the role of government, and how it should be run.

I want to hear Romney explain why government should be run as a business, or how his business experience is relevant to the country's problems.

I want to hear why Obama explain the merits of systems and programs designed to support social welfare, and explain why certain socialist ideals aid freedom and democracies, versus impede it.

I know that's never going to happen, but if they're not going to discuss policy anyway than fuck it, why not? We know Romney has no specifics, and we already know all the mistakes of the Obama administration.


biology]major
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2253 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-10-05 02:56:05
October 05 2012 02:55 GMT
#13578
wrong thread
Question.?
RCMDVA
Profile Joined July 2011
United States708 Posts
October 05 2012 02:55 GMT
#13579
On October 05 2012 11:33 TheRabidDeer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 11:25 Tula wrote:
On October 05 2012 11:12 th3j35t3r wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:55 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked. Especially if Obama keeps being timid, he's intellectually superior and holds a better plan, he just needs to drive it home : D I feel like the next debate you'll see a bit more vigor and fire.


Your defiantly about to get fucked when all the new taxes come into law at the beginning of the year. Jackson's point was one made in ignorance and he knows it. Obama is NOT intellectually superior and his plan is crap there is a reason his budgets have gotten 0 votes. Please your saying the community organizer who needs a teleprompter to speak properly is smarter than the multimillionaire multi successful business owner. I'll give Obama he is smart but to compare the two I don't think its close.

In terms of intelligence the two candidates are similar that being said, Romney's skill set and background is what makes him better. This is a guy that fixed broken companies for a living, then if that was not enough proceeded to fix the salt lake city Olympics. Some have complained that doesn't translate to political success, then again he was the governor of the most liberal state in the nation.


fixed broken companies for a living? I'm sorry but are we talking about the same firm? Bain investment did a lot of stuff but that is not how many people would describe him.

What bothers me the most about this discussion is not wether Romney is a good buisnessman, he obviously was or he wouldn't have made any money, but what exactly does that have to do with being a good politician? Frankly Obama tried his best but the way Republicans blocked him had nothing to do with his bills or their inherent quality. I have no idea how good Romney would be in Comparison, but what I do know is that the way the USA are split into two camps makes sensible compromise almost impossible.

Frankly I don't think either of them will manage to get much done, no matter who is elected the deadlock in Senate/House will remain.

The same question about translation of skills happened with Obama too. He had no political experience, and was mostly a lawyer. A huge amount of his administration has shown off his abilities as a lawyer. Perhaps getting a successful businessman to the front COULD help?


Both Obama and Romney passed the bar. Romney did next to nothing with his law degree. It was part of the JD/MBA program he was in. Obama as well... he never really was a practicing lawer. He did some research and taught some classes. But that's about it.

So what you had last night were two lawyers who were arguing in front of each other...who have never argued in front of a judge or a jury.
kmillz
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1548 Posts
October 05 2012 03:01 GMT
#13580
On October 05 2012 10:18 rogzardo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 05 2012 10:07 kmillz wrote:
On October 05 2012 10:03 NeMeSiS3 wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:58 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 09:00 Silidons wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:30 CajunMan wrote:
On October 05 2012 07:13 Silidons wrote:
Did anyone see this from ReasonTV? Just saw it on TheYoungTurks, as a rebuttal to the video from Samuel L Jackson. Brilliant video... (Warning: NSFW - Language)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhV9aZOqmz8


I think blacks are starting to wake up check out this new ad for Romney not everyone is fooled by Samuel L Jackson and blind celebrities.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GTc5vBgJsM

The one I linked wasn't for Romney though.


I know this one was against yours because not everyone is tarded and listens to Samuel L Jackson

nope not everyone is tarded but if you're going to use a derogatory term to insult someone at least add the extra 2 letters in front.

Samuel L. Jackson's video had a pretty concrete point, if you're broke or middle class you're about to get fucked.


I'm broke, I'm still not voting for fiscal irresponsibility.


Voting for the candidate with no fiscal plan is the definition of fiscal irresponsibility.


Obama's plan is projected to put us at 22 trillion in debt in 4 years, Romney's is not.
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