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Hey guys! We'll be closing this thread shortly, but we will make an American politics megathread where we can continue the discussions in here. The new thread can be found here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=383301 | ||
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Gorsameth
Netherlands22695 Posts
No, they're laughing at Obama for being weak and folding on the missile defense issue and more or less hanging our Eastern European allies out to dry. Yeah... im sure a missile defense that Russia hates in your backyard while there in walking distance really makes you feel very secure... | ||
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jdseemoreglass
United States3773 Posts
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/21/romney-to-release-2011-tax-returns/ He paid a tax rate of about 14.1%, largely due to capital gains rate. In 2011 his income was $13.7 million, and he and his wife donated about $4 million to charity. On average over 20 years he donated 13.45% of income to charity. | ||
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Derez
Netherlands6068 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:18 jdseemoreglass wrote: Romney to release his 2011 tax returns today and a summary of his last 20 years of taxes paid. http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/21/romney-to-release-2011-tax-returns/ He paid a tax rate of about 14.1%, largely due to capital gains rate. In 2011 his income was $13.7 million, and he and his wife donated about $4 million to charity. On average over 20 years he donated 13.45% of income to charity. Thats a rather desperate way to try and change the story. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:16 Gorsameth wrote: Yeah... im sure a missile defense that Russia hates in your backyard while there in walking distance really makes you feel very secure... It absolutely makes you secure because it brings your country under the protection of the US military by treaty. You can't get better protection than that, particularly when you have a bad Russian neighbor that has a long history of invading you. | ||
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:18 jdseemoreglass wrote: Romney to release his 2011 tax returns today and a summary of his last 20 years of taxes paid. http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/21/romney-to-release-2011-tax-returns/ He paid a tax rate of about 14.1%, largely due to capital gains rate. In 2011 his income was $13.7 million, and he and his wife donated about $4 million to charity. On average over 20 years he donated 13.45% of income to charity. WE WANT FULL TAX FORMS NOT A SUMMARY! Good to see Romney doing this. If this works I'm going to be really happy. I mean, just thinking about it from a strategic perspective, slowroll the tax forms so Dems trip over themselves trying to discredit you (looking at you Reid) and then POW, right in the kisser. Respect. | ||
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jdseemoreglass
United States3773 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:19 Derez wrote: Thats a rather desperate way to try and change the story. What? I don't know what you are talking about. Just summarized the first couple paragraphs. | ||
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Derez
Netherlands6068 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:19 xDaunt wrote: It absolutely makes you secure because it brings your country under the protection of the US military by treaty. You can't get better protection than that, particularly when you have a bad Russian neighbor that has a long history of invading you. Ah right. That's why missile defense is incredibly unpopular everywhere in Europe. Not even the countries you're placing the installations in want them without massive compensation. Fact is that Europe (especially the east) knows its pretty dependant on Russia for energy and we don't want to piss them off too much as long as they behave somewhat. Missile defense in Europe is largely associated with American unilateralism and the 'bush years', not with actual protection. Especially seeing how the missile shield wouldn't even protect the countries it is in, due to the fact that the kill vehicle is lauched much further away. On September 22 2012 03:20 jdseemoreglass wrote: What? I don't know what you are talking about. Just summarized the first couple paragraphs. Sorry, I was unclear. I ment the Romney campaign trying to change the story by releasing it now. Not you trying to do anything. | ||
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farvacola
United States18874 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:20 jdseemoreglass wrote: What? I don't know what you are talking about. Just summarized the first couple paragraphs. “The Romneys thus limited their deduction of charitable contributions to conform to the governor’s statement in August, based upon the January estimate of income, that he paid at least 13 percent in income taxes in each of the last 10 years,” said R. Bradford Malt, Mr. Romney’s trustee. This can read as "Look, Romney is willing to forgo some deductions, what a champ!" or "Look, Romney is clearly able and willing to change his tax forms based on a number of factors, this time being his previous statements. Wouldn't want any inconsistency, now would we?" Oh yeah, the fact that he is still unwilling to release the actual returns still speaks volumes. | ||
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Focuspants
Canada780 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:20 Risen wrote: WE WANT FULL TAX FORMS NOT A SUMMARY! Good to see Romney doing this. If this works I'm going to be really happy. I mean, just thinking about it from a strategic perspective, slowroll the tax forms so Dems trip over themselves trying to discredit you (looking at you Reid) and then POW, right in the kisser. Respect. How is paying less than 15% tax something to be proud of? That is disgustingly low for a multi millionaire, regardless of how they earned that money. Romey pays the same % of income tax as someone who makes $30k a year here in Canada and less than someone making $8,700 – $35,350 in the US. That my friend is not something to be proud of. | ||
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HunterX11
United States1048 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:19 xDaunt wrote: It absolutely makes you secure because it brings your country under the protection of the US military by treaty. You can't get better protection than that, particularly when you have a bad Russian neighbor that has a long history of invading you. It would make sense for a country like Georgia or Moldova but I really don't think that the Soviets are going to invade Poland or the Czech Republic any time soon. | ||
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jdseemoreglass
United States3773 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:34 Focuspants wrote: How is paying less than 15% tax something to be proud of? That is disgustingly low for a multi millionaire, regardless of how they earned that money. Romey pays the same % of income tax as someone who makes $30k a year here in Canada and less than someone making $8,700 – $35,350 in the US. That my friend is not something to be proud of. If 47% of the country doesn't pay federal income taxes, then how can someone earning $10,000 a year be charged 15% tax rate? Something doesn't make sense here. | ||
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CajunMan
United States823 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:34 Focuspants wrote: How is paying less than 15% tax something to be proud of? That is disgustingly low for a multi millionaire, regardless of how they earned that money. Romey pays the same % of income tax as someone who makes $30k a year here in Canada and less than someone making $8,700 – $35,350 in the US. That my friend is not something to be proud of. He invested smart and is a smart man who worked hard his whole life to get where he is AND donates more money every year than you'll probably make in your entire life time. Get more jelly. | ||
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madsweepslol
161 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:07 xDaunt wrote: Like I said, I don't give two shits whether the rest of the world likes the US. All that matters is whether other countries respect us and do what we want them to do. This should be the foreign policy aim of any country. If you aren't getting the other countries to do things that are in your interest, then your foreign policy has failed. Period. You're basically a school yard bully. Go on and play CoD, leave foreign policy and diplomacy to the grown ups. User was warned for this post | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:38 HunterX11 wrote: It would make sense for a country like Georgia or Moldova but I really don't think that the Soviets are going to invade Poland or the Czech Republic any time soon. In the immediate future, there's not much risk. However, if Russia ever did turn aggressive again (and I would bet money that they will once they sort out some of their domestic problems), it wouldn't take much for Russia to run over the nations bordering it allowing for Russia to move into Poland or the Czech Republic. | ||
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Focuspants
Canada780 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:40 CajunMan wrote: He invested smart and is a smart man who worked hard his whole life to get where he is AND donates more money every year than you'll probably make in your entire life time. Get more jelly. I am not jealous. I dont mind people being rich. I just think they should shoulder more of a burden for society than someone who makes under $30k a year. You do realize it is impossible for everyone to make that much money right? Again, people making average incomes arent all lazy, dumb, poor investors, etc... as you assert. Also, most of his "donations" (as in over 80%) are to the mormon church. That is not a charitable donation in my eyes. | ||
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NovaTheFeared
United States7232 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:40 jdseemoreglass wrote: If 47% of the country doesn't pay federal income taxes, then how can someone earning $10,000 a year be charged 15% tax rate? Something doesn't make sense here. He probably forgot that the brackets are for taxable income and that deductions, like the standard deduction/various child tax credits, lower your taxable income/tax liability. These credits and deductions result in the 47% figure. The point he's making still stands though, it's the old Buffet quip that he pays a lower tax rate than his secretary. It's an argument of fairness. If you have a normal salaried or wage job with an approximately average income you could easily pay a higher tax rate than Romney who is making millions per year. | ||
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farvacola
United States18874 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:42 xDaunt wrote: In the immediate future, there's not much risk. However, if Russia ever did turn aggressive again (and I would bet money that they will once they sort out some of their domestic problems), it wouldn't take much for Russia to run over the nations bordering it allowing for Russia to move into Poland or the Czech Republic. Except that that scenario woud require almost total acquiescence on the part of China when it comes to a land grab, and "sort out some of their domestic problems" is a far more substantial undertaking than you are suggesting. | ||
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JonnyBNoHo
United States6277 Posts
On September 22 2012 02:52 farvacola wrote: You mean "Change the tax code and the richest 1% of America will greedily chide you for assaulting their wealth via threats of offshoring and commercial emmigration, both of which already happen." No, I mean that changing the tax code has consequences. Read the article - no one is threatening offshoring or emigration. Businesses are restructuring their financial policy. Because of that the tax increase isn't going to collect all the revenue it intends to and markets will be a little less efficient during the transition. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:53 farvacola wrote: Except that that scenario woud require almost total acquiescence on the part of China when it comes to a land grab, and "sort out some of their domestic problems" is a far more substantial undertaking than you are suggesting. Well, right. I don't expect Russia to right the ship any time soon (like within five years), and it may be that Russia doesn't fix its domestic problems for many years beyond that. | ||
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DarK[A]
United States217 Posts
On September 22 2012 03:40 madsweepslol wrote: You're basically a school yard bully. Go on and play CoD, leave foreign policy and diplomacy to the grown ups. Sounds like someone has never played Diplomacy. | ||
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