President Obama Re-Elected - Page 54

On April 25 2012 01:03 taldarimAltar wrote:
From what I've heard the american politics and government is such a partisan monstrosity that it doesn't really matter who wins

On April 25 2012 01:08 MethodSC wrote:


This is a fact that most americans don't want to accept, but will eventually have to when shit turns from bad to worse. Let's just hope it's not too late when people wake up.

On April 25 2012 01:18 Mephiztopheles1 wrote:

I agree with this but as a latino, I feel morally compelled to support the candidate that despises us the least, Obama.

On April 25 2012 01:26 MethodSC wrote:


as a fellow latino I feel morally compelled to support neither candidate because both would continue to strip away every citizen's rights, not just our own. Unless you were born in another country, you're an american. This isn't about race. When people say lesser of two evils, they're still voting for evil. Never forget that.

On April 25 2012 01:34 TheFish7 wrote:


Amen, Wegandi. Does anyone take the ratings agencies seriously anymore? If you do, I have a bridge in Alaska to sell you.

Anyway, the reason Obama has been "utterly helpless" is mostly because the republican congress has been doing everything in its power to derail any of Obama's ideas to help fix the economy and/or healthcare. Remember the huge infrastructure bill that was going to create a ton of jobs? the republicans voted that down. But no, we are going to get rid of Obamacare and create a Keystone pipeline that will send our oil to asia and create a dangerous situation for the environment at home, all so insurance and oil companies can keep their income statements looking good.

And now that the republicans have successfully prevented Obama from doing anything at all, they are going to blame him for the economy not recovering. I just hope that average Americans wake up to whats really happening and who is on their side, instead of just blindly listening to Fox news or wherever they get these nonsense ideas about "socialism" - government spending and taxes (which are at historically low rates)



I would like to counter some of these points

Healthcare - The Obama plan is a boom to the health insurance industry? Not sure where you get this idea, The Obama plan will force the industry to give more people coverage and help to keep costs down for consumers. The plan is similar to the Romney plan, which was a good one imo.

Foreign Policy - We are finally out of Iraq - thanks to Obama.
Yes, we are still in Afghanistan, but this is I believe to prevent the Taliban from taking it back over or starting a very bad civil war.
"illegal campaign in Libya" - I believe the Libya campaign was a huge success for democracy. Who cares if it was "illegal"?
Aggression with China - The Obama administration has been doing a lot to bridge the gaps with china. Keep in mind that this is a country that routinely commits cyber attacks against American intelligence and corporate secrets.
Aggression with Iran - Last time I checked, the republicans were the only ones advocating attacking Iran. Obama can't come outright and condemn Isreal, or he would lose all his jewish voters.

Civil Rights - As far as I know, America is no longer torturing prisoners. As far as illegal spying and rights being infringed upon, I will agree that I am disappointed in the US government in that they seem to wish to erode the rights of their own citizens.

Economy - BUSH bailed out the banks, and Obama bailed out Detroit. big difference - Obama was acting to save the auto industry, while Bushy boy was saving his Yale buddies from losing their cushy jobs. Congress is at fault for refusing to cut spending or create universal healthcare, not Obama, so it is fair to make the comparison.

On April 25 2012 02:15 RDaneelOlivaw wrote:
Ron Paul. I honestly feel no motivation to vote for either of these players. It won't make a difference in the outcome but my vote of symbolic protest against the is all I feel I have left in the current American system.

On April 25 2012 02:09 TheFish7 wrote:


The republicans will do anything to keep the wealthy in power and make it look like Obama is the one at fault for the poor economy. So many senators are in the pocket of Big _______ (Oil, Insurance, whatever). and with superPACs they want to make it so you can not only buy policies, but also buy elections.

"That was an unfortunate vote," he said of Thursday's Senate action. Obama "won't stop calling for this, it makes zero sense to have the American taxpayer subsidize oil and gas companies who are enjoying record profits."

Poor Americans are subsidizing CEOs. its like Robin Hood, but the other way around. Here is Exxon Mobil's abridged income statement from last year (in $1,000's)

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=XOM Income Statement&annual
Net Income Applicable To Common Shares 41,060,000

They saved a billion dollars in subsidies. thats a billion dollars that will not go to American schools or roads or healthcare.

On April 25 2012 02:36 TheFish7 wrote:


You're right, my post comes across as pretty biased against republicans. I am not trying to place the blame solely on them, as the democrats have been as you said and for lack of a better term, picking their noses. In fact, 4 Democrats voted for the oil co. subsidies that were mentioned. The way I see it, both parties have their heads pretty far up their ass, just the republicans are a little bit farther up there. It does have alot to do with the legislature and less to do with the president than most people realize.

As someone who teaches college level economics, I wholeheartedly agree that tax cuts are not the best idea in the midst of one of the worst recessions ever. Ideally, we would first "fix" the economy, then afterwards raise taxes on those with the highest incomes to start paying down the debt. The argument against this is "but if you raise taxes people won't bother earning money" argument has been shown to be false until you get to like ~75% tax rates.

Tax rates are the lowest they've been since the great depression;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MarginalIncomeTax.svg

On April 25 2012 02:44 aksfjh wrote:

Seeing that you're interested in tax rates, you should take a look at the rates as a percentage of GDP.

http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxfacts/displayafact.cfm?Docid=205

On April 25 2012 01:34 TheFish7 wrote:


I would like to counter some of these points

Healthcare - The Obama plan is a boom to the health insurance industry? Not sure where you get this idea, The Obama plan will force the industry to give more people coverage and help to keep costs down for consumers. The plan is similar to the Romney plan, which was a good one imo.

Foreign Policy - We are finally out of Iraq - thanks to Obama.
Yes, we are still in Afghanistan, but this is I believe to prevent the Taliban from taking it back over or starting a very bad civil war.
"illegal campaign in Libya" - I believe the Libya campaign was a huge success for democracy. Who cares if it was "illegal"?
Aggression with China - The Obama administration has been doing a lot to bridge the gaps with china. Keep in mind that this is a country that routinely commits cyber attacks against American intelligence and corporate secrets.
Aggression with Iran - Last time I checked, the republicans were the only ones advocating attacking Iran. Obama can't come outright and condemn Isreal, or he would lose all his jewish voters.

Civil Rights - As far as I know, America is no longer torturing prisoners. As far as illegal spying and rights being infringed upon, I will agree that I am disappointed in the US government in that they seem to wish to erode the rights of their own citizens.

Economy - BUSH bailed out the banks, and Obama bailed out Detroit. big difference - Obama was acting to save the auto industry, while Bushy boy was saving his Yale buddies from losing their cushy jobs. Congress is at fault for refusing to cut spending or create universal healthcare, not Obama, so it is fair to make the comparison.

On April 25 2012 03:33 mmp wrote:

The healthcare "plan" doesn't address either of the crises: cost and under/un-insured. It has a medley of good ideas designed to relieve some of the stresses people are feeling (recent college graduates, elderly, people with preexisting conditions), but these ideas work under the framework of the bloated for-profit health insurance companies. It's a "feel-good" piece of legislation the way "No Child Left Behind" was a fix for education. It's a bunch of hot air. Don't blame congress for failing to enact universal healthcare, the Dems flat out rejected the idea in planning because it's bad for the insurance industry (who help fund election cycles).

We're not "out of Iraq." We're as much out of it now by declaring an end to "Combat Missions" as when Bush declared "Mission Accomplished." Most of our troops have come home or gone elsewhere (Afghanistan), but we're still running the show in Iraq. We're not going anywhere anytime soon.

Regarding Afghanistan, the Taliban is in control of the country. It is known.

Libya had nothing to do with democracy, nor was it legal under US Constitutional law. Check yo' facts.

Iran: our sanction regime is unwarranted and provocative, and hypocrisy any way you look at it. More countries regard USA as a threat to stability than Iran. Check yo' bias.

You're correct that TARP was on Bush's watch.

Civil rights: As far as you know? That's not far enough, I'm afraid. We don't just torture our citizens, we assassinate them too. We also record and analyze the citizenry's email & phone conversations. Habeas corpus is dead. Obama's accelerated the Bush legacy of expanded executive military power, becoming judge jury and executioner at his whim. Scahill, Greenwald, and others have written extensively on the subject. It is not safe to be a political dissident in America (which is why a handful of people are trying to get NDAA knocked down before it gets out of control).

I don't know where you get your rosy picture of this administration's record, but the facts are damning.

On April 25 2012 03:43 aksfjh wrote:

The Libya stuff wasn't part of Constitutional law. It was a violation of the War Powers Resolution, which has been violated by all the past 3 Presidents at least once.

On April 25 2012 03:45 mmp wrote:

The Constitution gives Congress the power to declare war. Obama went to Congress. Congress said, "We'll give you the money to do what you want to do, but we don't give approval."

On April 25 2012 02:09 TheFish7 wrote:


The republicans will do anything to keep the wealthy in power and make it look like Obama is the one at fault for the poor economy. So many senators are in the pocket of Big _______ (Oil, Insurance, whatever). and with superPACs they want to make it so you can not only buy policies, but also buy elections.

"That was an unfortunate vote," he said of Thursday's Senate action. Obama "won't stop calling for this, it makes zero sense to have the American taxpayer subsidize oil and gas companies who are enjoying record profits."

Poor Americans are subsidizing CEOs. its like Robin Hood, but the other way around. Here is Exxon Mobil's abridged income statement from last year (in $1,000's)

http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=XOM Income Statement&annual
Net Income Applicable To Common Shares 41,060,000

They saved a billion dollars in subsidies. thats a billion dollars that will not go to American schools or roads or healthcare.