you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
On July 14 2013 02:39 boredrex wrote: you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
Actually, if you look at the 7-11 video, you can see how his pants are worn. I noticed that I think it was yesterday. They were down, thug-like.
On July 14 2013 02:24 Esk23 wrote: This video is what the media and idiots would like you to believe:
that video... my sides....
This is so ridiculous. The best part is the party part of the shooting at like 3-4 minutes is more accurate to the knowledge of evetns. The actual shooting they show at around 5 minutes is insane lolol
On July 14 2013 02:39 boredrex wrote: you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
Actually, if you look at the 7-11 video, you can see how his pants are worn. I noticed that I think it was yesterday. They were down, thug-like.
The prosecution should have played this for their closing argument. Hell, they probably funded its production then had to not use it because they lost the battle of who was on top.
On July 14 2013 02:39 boredrex wrote: you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
Actually, if you look at the 7-11 video, you can see how his pants are worn. I noticed that I think it was yesterday. They were down, thug-like.
not mom jeans = "thug-like"
?
Is he wearing a "I just voted", or a "I just gave blood to the redcross Sticker"? I guess it could be the Obama logo?
On July 14 2013 02:39 boredrex wrote: you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
Actually, if you look at the 7-11 video, you can see how his pants are worn. I noticed that I think it was yesterday. They were down, thug-like.
not mom jeans = "thug-like"
?
Is he wearing a "I just voted", or a "I just gave blood to the redcross Sticker"? I guess it could be the Obama logo?
he was 17 so i dont think it was i just voted maybe blood
Who threw the first punch is up for debate...by initiating I mean Zimmerman's stalking/harrassment which is the only thing thats 100% fact. The facts dont favor him in my opinion. Zimmerman's also a known liar and his version of the story's the only one we heard
Everyone who has ever lived beyond the age of 10 years old has told a lie at one point or another, so I suppose we are all "known liar(s)".
Interesting point. You would think that the prosecution would have provided an alternative story, as they usually do in criminal cases... it is quite telling that they were both incapable of providing one and unwilling to.
In the same way people say Trayvon was asking for it because he smoked weed and got into a little trouble (even tho he was a teenager) Im not supposed to consider Zimmerman's poor character when it comes to his story? By lying Im referring to Zimmerman lying to the court about his finances, thats a bit more serious than a random 10 year old's lie wouldnt u agree?
He wasn't asking for it because he smoked weed. He was asking for it when he pummeled Zimmerman into concrete for 40 seconds while Zimmerman yelled for help.
Says Zimmerman
Stop being a dumbo. Zimmerman has the injuries to prove he was attacked and beaten up. Trayvon didn't even have a scratch on him to suggest he was attacked and beaten other than a cut on his knuckle that is consistent with punching someone.
Injuries prove he was not winning the confrontation, who attacked is uncertain. The facts are GZ has some minor injuries and at some point near the end Trayvon was on top.
According to GZ, despite being pummeled, grounded and pounded, having his head smacked into the concrete, being smothered on mouth and nose, and being generally overpowered he is somehow quicker to the gun than Trayvon, after Trayvon spotting it and grabbing for it with his 6th hand, who is mysteriously unable to do anything about the weak and powerless GZ shooting him.....
You understand that Zimmerman didn't even need to have ANY injuries in order to shoot and kill TM in self defense right? They had two doctors testify that Zimmerman's injuries were not minor and that he should have been sent to a hospital for x-rays. Zimmerman was attacked for 40-45 seconds before he killed TM in self defense. Trayvon had no injuries consistent with being attacked.
It is obvious who attacked who first. TM had plenty of time to go back home but he decided not to. This tells me he confronted George Zimmerman.
If GZ really wanted to execute or murder TM why would he call the police beforehand and do all what he did.
His injuries only show he was losing the fight which is irrelevant...they were minor and not life threatening by any means. What makes it obvious that TM attacked first besides Zimmerman's word? To me it seems more likely Zimmerman was the instigator due to his proven actions during that night. Thats really the crux of the argument and what will decide his fate...I guess what remains is to see who's side the Jury believes
What you are not getting is that the extent of Zimmerman's injuries do not matter. How many more punches, head slams or head injuries should Zimmerman have waited to receieve before he shot in self defense? This incident lasted about 45 seconds of one man continuously beating on another. One has injuries and the other doesn't. One eye witness who was right in front of where this happened identified Trayvon as the one on top throwing a beatdown on the guy on the bottom. He also identified Zimmerman was the one calling for help.
There is 0 evidence that GZ started the confrontation let alone the fight or struggle itself. As I said again, the fact that Trayvon had 4 minutes to go or run home and didn't says to me he waited and confronted GZ. There is 0 evidence that GZ continued to follow TM after the operator said he didn't need to follow him and there is 0 evidence that counters what GZ said about going through the T to get an address.
Evidence nor common sense is on your side.
This is whats funny to me...u guys make it seem like its so cut and dry and the prosecution has no case at all...then why hasnt a not guilty verdict come back yet? If it was so obvious they wouldve came back with a non guilty verdict in the first few hours. Apparently some in the jury agree with me that facts and common sense are not both against me.
On July 14 2013 02:39 boredrex wrote: you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
Actually, if you look at the 7-11 video, you can see how his pants are worn. I noticed that I think it was yesterday. They were down, thug-like.
not mom jeans = "thug-like"
?
Is he wearing a "I just voted", or a "I just gave blood to the redcross Sticker"? I guess it could be the Obama logo?
On July 14 2013 00:41 sc2superfan101 wrote: [quote] Everyone who has ever lived beyond the age of 10 years old has told a lie at one point or another, so I suppose we are all "known liar(s)".
Interesting point. You would think that the prosecution would have provided an alternative story, as they usually do in criminal cases... it is quite telling that they were both incapable of providing one and unwilling to.
In the same way people say Trayvon was asking for it because he smoked weed and got into a little trouble (even tho he was a teenager) Im not supposed to consider Zimmerman's poor character when it comes to his story? By lying Im referring to Zimmerman lying to the court about his finances, thats a bit more serious than a random 10 year old's lie wouldnt u agree?
He wasn't asking for it because he smoked weed. He was asking for it when he pummeled Zimmerman into concrete for 40 seconds while Zimmerman yelled for help.
Says Zimmerman
Stop being a dumbo. Zimmerman has the injuries to prove he was attacked and beaten up. Trayvon didn't even have a scratch on him to suggest he was attacked and beaten other than a cut on his knuckle that is consistent with punching someone.
Injuries prove he was not winning the confrontation, who attacked is uncertain. The facts are GZ has some minor injuries and at some point near the end Trayvon was on top.
According to GZ, despite being pummeled, grounded and pounded, having his head smacked into the concrete, being smothered on mouth and nose, and being generally overpowered he is somehow quicker to the gun than Trayvon, after Trayvon spotting it and grabbing for it with his 6th hand, who is mysteriously unable to do anything about the weak and powerless GZ shooting him.....
You understand that Zimmerman didn't even need to have ANY injuries in order to shoot and kill TM in self defense right? They had two doctors testify that Zimmerman's injuries were not minor and that he should have been sent to a hospital for x-rays. Zimmerman was attacked for 40-45 seconds before he killed TM in self defense. Trayvon had no injuries consistent with being attacked.
It is obvious who attacked who first. TM had plenty of time to go back home but he decided not to. This tells me he confronted George Zimmerman.
If GZ really wanted to execute or murder TM why would he call the police beforehand and do all what he did.
His injuries only show he was losing the fight which is irrelevant...they were minor and not life threatening by any means. What makes it obvious that TM attacked first besides Zimmerman's word? To me it seems more likely Zimmerman was the instigator due to his proven actions during that night. Thats really the crux of the argument and what will decide his fate...I guess what remains is to see who's side the Jury believes
What you are not getting is that the extent of Zimmerman's injuries do not matter. How many more punches, head slams or head injuries should Zimmerman have waited to receieve before he shot in self defense? This incident lasted about 45 seconds of one man continuously beating on another. One has injuries and the other doesn't. One eye witness who was right in front of where this happened identified Trayvon as the one on top throwing a beatdown on the guy on the bottom. He also identified Zimmerman was the one calling for help.
There is 0 evidence that GZ started the confrontation let alone the fight or struggle itself. As I said again, the fact that Trayvon had 4 minutes to go or run home and didn't says to me he waited and confronted GZ. There is 0 evidence that GZ continued to follow TM after the operator said he didn't need to follow him and there is 0 evidence that counters what GZ said about going through the T to get an address.
Evidence nor common sense is on your side.
This is whats funny to me...u guys make it seem like its so cut and dry and the prosecution has no case at all...then why hasnt a not guilty verdict come back yet? If it was so obvious they wouldve came back with a non guilty verdict in the first few hours. Apparently some in the jury agree with me that facts and common sense are not both against me.
Because they would be remiss not to go through all possible scenarios again and again and make sure the decision they make is the correct one.
On July 14 2013 00:41 sc2superfan101 wrote: [quote] Everyone who has ever lived beyond the age of 10 years old has told a lie at one point or another, so I suppose we are all "known liar(s)".
Interesting point. You would think that the prosecution would have provided an alternative story, as they usually do in criminal cases... it is quite telling that they were both incapable of providing one and unwilling to.
In the same way people say Trayvon was asking for it because he smoked weed and got into a little trouble (even tho he was a teenager) Im not supposed to consider Zimmerman's poor character when it comes to his story? By lying Im referring to Zimmerman lying to the court about his finances, thats a bit more serious than a random 10 year old's lie wouldnt u agree?
He wasn't asking for it because he smoked weed. He was asking for it when he pummeled Zimmerman into concrete for 40 seconds while Zimmerman yelled for help.
Says Zimmerman
Stop being a dumbo. Zimmerman has the injuries to prove he was attacked and beaten up. Trayvon didn't even have a scratch on him to suggest he was attacked and beaten other than a cut on his knuckle that is consistent with punching someone.
Injuries prove he was not winning the confrontation, who attacked is uncertain. The facts are GZ has some minor injuries and at some point near the end Trayvon was on top.
According to GZ, despite being pummeled, grounded and pounded, having his head smacked into the concrete, being smothered on mouth and nose, and being generally overpowered he is somehow quicker to the gun than Trayvon, after Trayvon spotting it and grabbing for it with his 6th hand, who is mysteriously unable to do anything about the weak and powerless GZ shooting him.....
You understand that Zimmerman didn't even need to have ANY injuries in order to shoot and kill TM in self defense right? They had two doctors testify that Zimmerman's injuries were not minor and that he should have been sent to a hospital for x-rays. Zimmerman was attacked for 40-45 seconds before he killed TM in self defense. Trayvon had no injuries consistent with being attacked.
It is obvious who attacked who first. TM had plenty of time to go back home but he decided not to. This tells me he confronted George Zimmerman.
If GZ really wanted to execute or murder TM why would he call the police beforehand and do all what he did.
His injuries only show he was losing the fight which is irrelevant...they were minor and not life threatening by any means. What makes it obvious that TM attacked first besides Zimmerman's word? To me it seems more likely Zimmerman was the instigator due to his proven actions during that night. Thats really the crux of the argument and what will decide his fate...I guess what remains is to see who's side the Jury believes
What you are not getting is that the extent of Zimmerman's injuries do not matter. How many more punches, head slams or head injuries should Zimmerman have waited to receieve before he shot in self defense? This incident lasted about 45 seconds of one man continuously beating on another. One has injuries and the other doesn't. One eye witness who was right in front of where this happened identified Trayvon as the one on top throwing a beatdown on the guy on the bottom. He also identified Zimmerman was the one calling for help.
There is 0 evidence that GZ started the confrontation let alone the fight or struggle itself. As I said again, the fact that Trayvon had 4 minutes to go or run home and didn't says to me he waited and confronted GZ. There is 0 evidence that GZ continued to follow TM after the operator said he didn't need to follow him and there is 0 evidence that counters what GZ said about going through the T to get an address.
Evidence nor common sense is on your side.
This is whats funny to me...u guys make it seem like its so cut and dry and the prosecution has no case at all...then why hasnt a not guilty verdict come back yet? If it was so obvious they wouldve came back with a non guilty verdict in the first few hours. Apparently some in the jury agree with me that facts and common sense are not both against me.
Go look at the presecutions case. go look at there closing statement. Find a fact. a single undisputed fact that supports there theory. Oh wait at this point they dont even have a theory of events anymore that hasnt been debunked by the defense.
The reason people here assume its cut and dry is because there is utterly no evidence that supports zimmerman as being guilty of anything.
Once again, what proof do you have that Zimmerman started the confrontation.
Who threw the first punch is up for debate...by initiating I mean Zimmerman's stalking/harrassment which is the only thing thats 100% fact. The facts dont favor him in my opinion. Zimmerman's also a known liar and his version of the story's the only one we heard
Everyone who has ever lived beyond the age of 10 years old has told a lie at one point or another, so I suppose we are all "known liar(s)".
Interesting point. You would think that the prosecution would have provided an alternative story, as they usually do in criminal cases... it is quite telling that they were both incapable of providing one and unwilling to.
In the same way people say Trayvon was asking for it because he smoked weed and got into a little trouble (even tho he was a teenager) Im not supposed to consider Zimmerman's poor character when it comes to his story? By lying Im referring to Zimmerman lying to the court about his finances, thats a bit more serious than a random 10 year old's lie wouldnt u agree?
He wasn't asking for it because he smoked weed. He was asking for it when he pummeled Zimmerman into concrete for 40 seconds while Zimmerman yelled for help.
Says Zimmerman
Stop being a dumbo. Zimmerman has the injuries to prove he was attacked and beaten up. Trayvon didn't even have a scratch on him to suggest he was attacked and beaten other than a cut on his knuckle that is consistent with punching someone.
Injuries prove he was not winning the confrontation, who attacked is uncertain. The facts are GZ has some minor injuries and at some point near the end Trayvon was on top.
According to GZ, despite being pummeled, grounded and pounded, having his head smacked into the concrete, being smothered on mouth and nose, and being generally overpowered he is somehow quicker to the gun than Trayvon, after Trayvon spotting it and grabbing for it with his 6th hand, who is mysteriously unable to do anything about the weak and powerless GZ shooting him.....
You understand that Zimmerman didn't even need to have ANY injuries in order to shoot and kill TM in self defense right? They had two doctors testify that Zimmerman's injuries were not minor and that he should have been sent to a hospital for x-rays. Zimmerman was attacked for 40-45 seconds before he killed TM in self defense. Trayvon had no injuries consistent with being attacked.
It is obvious who attacked who first. TM had plenty of time to go back home but he decided not to. This tells me he confronted George Zimmerman.
If GZ really wanted to execute or murder TM why would he call the police beforehand and do all what he did.
His injuries only show he was losing the fight which is irrelevant...they were minor and not life threatening by any means. What makes it obvious that TM attacked first besides Zimmerman's word? To me it seems more likely Zimmerman was the instigator due to his proven actions during that night. Thats really the crux of the argument and what will decide his fate...I guess what remains is to see who's side the Jury believes
Are you illiterate, or just choose to ignore the dozens of times the *Actual Lawyers* here on the forum have explained what self-defense is? The fact that he was losing the fight is perhaps the MOST relevant aspect of the case. You can only use self-defense as your defense if you're being attacked to the point of (reasonably) fearing for your life. The instigation of the altercation is one of the least important aspects of this case. The question is: Was Trayvon assaulting GZ to the point where it was reasonable to think that he was in mortal danger when he fired the gun? If the answer is yes, GZ was well within his legal rights to shoot Martin. End of story.
In the same way people say Trayvon was asking for it because he smoked weed and got into a little trouble (even tho he was a teenager) Im not supposed to consider Zimmerman's poor character when it comes to his story? By lying Im referring to Zimmerman lying to the court about his finances, thats a bit more serious than a random 10 year old's lie wouldnt u agree?
He wasn't asking for it because he smoked weed. He was asking for it when he pummeled Zimmerman into concrete for 40 seconds while Zimmerman yelled for help.
Says Zimmerman
Stop being a dumbo. Zimmerman has the injuries to prove he was attacked and beaten up. Trayvon didn't even have a scratch on him to suggest he was attacked and beaten other than a cut on his knuckle that is consistent with punching someone.
Injuries prove he was not winning the confrontation, who attacked is uncertain. The facts are GZ has some minor injuries and at some point near the end Trayvon was on top.
According to GZ, despite being pummeled, grounded and pounded, having his head smacked into the concrete, being smothered on mouth and nose, and being generally overpowered he is somehow quicker to the gun than Trayvon, after Trayvon spotting it and grabbing for it with his 6th hand, who is mysteriously unable to do anything about the weak and powerless GZ shooting him.....
You understand that Zimmerman didn't even need to have ANY injuries in order to shoot and kill TM in self defense right? They had two doctors testify that Zimmerman's injuries were not minor and that he should have been sent to a hospital for x-rays. Zimmerman was attacked for 40-45 seconds before he killed TM in self defense. Trayvon had no injuries consistent with being attacked.
It is obvious who attacked who first. TM had plenty of time to go back home but he decided not to. This tells me he confronted George Zimmerman.
If GZ really wanted to execute or murder TM why would he call the police beforehand and do all what he did.
His injuries only show he was losing the fight which is irrelevant...they were minor and not life threatening by any means. What makes it obvious that TM attacked first besides Zimmerman's word? To me it seems more likely Zimmerman was the instigator due to his proven actions during that night. Thats really the crux of the argument and what will decide his fate...I guess what remains is to see who's side the Jury believes
What you are not getting is that the extent of Zimmerman's injuries do not matter. How many more punches, head slams or head injuries should Zimmerman have waited to receieve before he shot in self defense? This incident lasted about 45 seconds of one man continuously beating on another. One has injuries and the other doesn't. One eye witness who was right in front of where this happened identified Trayvon as the one on top throwing a beatdown on the guy on the bottom. He also identified Zimmerman was the one calling for help.
There is 0 evidence that GZ started the confrontation let alone the fight or struggle itself. As I said again, the fact that Trayvon had 4 minutes to go or run home and didn't says to me he waited and confronted GZ. There is 0 evidence that GZ continued to follow TM after the operator said he didn't need to follow him and there is 0 evidence that counters what GZ said about going through the T to get an address.
Evidence nor common sense is on your side.
This is whats funny to me...u guys make it seem like its so cut and dry and the prosecution has no case at all...then why hasnt a not guilty verdict come back yet? If it was so obvious they wouldve came back with a non guilty verdict in the first few hours. Apparently some in the jury agree with me that facts and common sense are not both against me.
Because they would be remiss not to go through all possible scenarios again and again and make sure the decision they make is the correct one.
Also, the fact that a lesser charge now exists may very well give the jury (especially those jurors who are still on the fence) a more ideal option- a false compromise to fall back on. ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation )
On July 14 2013 02:39 boredrex wrote: you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
Actually, if you look at the 7-11 video, you can see how his pants are worn. I noticed that I think it was yesterday. They were down, thug-like.
not mom jeans = "thug-like"
?
Is he wearing a "I just voted", or a "I just gave blood to the redcross Sticker"? I guess it could be the Obama logo?
he was 17 so i dont think it was i just voted maybe blood
i miss the part in which gz slams his head on concrete, breaks his own nose and runs from one house to another to establish fake-witnesses within a minute before the cops arrive.
On July 14 2013 02:39 boredrex wrote: you know, I've been reading people saying Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun from that position. Then I realized that if Trayvon Martin dressed like a thug and had his pants around his knees, Zimmerman wouldn't have been able to pull his gun. How would have thought that having your pants around your knees could save you!
Actually, if you look at the 7-11 video, you can see how his pants are worn. I noticed that I think it was yesterday. They were down, thug-like.
not mom jeans = "thug-like"
?
Is he wearing a "I just voted", or a "I just gave blood to the redcross Sticker"? I guess it could be the Obama logo?
That button is a "memorial" picture of a relative, like a 2nd cousin or something who was involved in a situation, ironically enough where the Stand Your Ground law applied. There is information on it out there.
Can anybody point to what the prosecution has so much as suggested that George Zimmerman could have done something else to stop the ongoing attack by Trayvon Martin. I could see arguing that he shouldn't have shot him because he had other less lethal alternatives, but they have yet to suggest, let alone prove beyond a reasonable doubt, that he had any alternative to stop the attack.
EPT![[image loading]](http://theconservativetreehouse.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/trayvon-with-button.jpg?w=370)
