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This topic is not about the American Invasion of Iraq. Stop. - Page 23 | ||
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HellRoxYa
Sweden1614 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:41 xavra41 wrote: ^ you mean quoted for spam... If you think economic inequality is so bad then why don't you share your wealth with 3rd world countries? Did you actually read his post? I'm going to place my bet on no. | ||
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Doublemint
Austria8760 Posts
On March 23 2012 16:30 Kuja wrote: Thanks for quoting such a reliable source as /b/, with its highly esoteric standards, i guess i have no choice but to fall infront of your infallible reasoning. Way to dismiss perfectly fine reasoning... you seem to hate the messenger even more than the message I guess. | ||
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manloveman
424 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:41 xavra41 wrote: ^ you mean quoted for spam... If you think economic inequality is so bad then why don't you share your wealth with 3rd world countries? Wow, so you think economic inequality is good? or just trolling? | ||
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xavra41
United States220 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:42 HellRoxYa wrote: Did you actually read his post? I'm going to place my bet on no. I did and it is pro-socialism. Like most socialists he completely disregards reality. 'If you just had public education on prevention everything would be perfect'. This is simply not true. Let's take weight loss, for example, as most people know that being obese causes health problems and having a healthy diet will prevent disease. Everybody knows this but obesity is on the rise. Secondly corruption and government are inseparable which is why capitalism is awesome, so if the government advertises it can fix everything. When we had the swine flu the government advertised everyone to get a vaccine. Not only did nthey not have enough flu shots they were also wrong about the dangers. And, as it turns out, the vaccine has some nasty side effects. | ||
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Satire
Canada295 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:41 xavra41 wrote: ^ you mean quoted for spam... If you think economic inequality is so bad then why don't you share your wealth with 3rd world countries? Straw-mans argument - this is somewhat irrelevant to what we're talking about, as my post was primarily about equity within the context of populations within countries rather than between countries. Although unintentional, you are correct though in the assumption that globalization has a large spread effect on health, but systemic change is generated from the local level to the global level. Despite your obvious attempt of trolling, I'll bite anyways: I already do share my wealth (like I have much, I'm still in University at this time...) and intend on sharing my knowledge. I have participated in various fund raisers that go towards helping those countries such as the 30 Hour Famine, despite knowing that most charities are designed to solve problems rather than prevent them. Baby steps though right? I also intend on providing my services to Doctor's Without Border's upon graduation and am lined up to participate in assisting with free orthopedic surgeries in Ecuador through a volunteer program through Covenant Health. Make no mistake I do this for my own benefit and knowledge just as much as I do it for other people. I have no misguided notions that I'm going to change the world by participating in things like this, but I might be able to help a few select individuals. Perhaps in understanding others I can better advocate for chances in policies that can make a difference. Unfortunately the point you bring up is more related to globalization and global health, as opposed to what I was referring to, and is thus an infinitely more complex issue that involves subjects like historical imperialism, banking systems, globalization, and the social stratification of production and access to goods and services in the context of ethical vs non-ethical capitalism. I'd be happy to discuss it with you through PMs though if you're actually interested... | ||
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xavra41
United States220 Posts
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manloveman
424 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:54 xavra41 wrote: I did and it is pro-socialism. Like most socialists he completely disregards reality. 'If you just had public education on prevention everything would be perfect'. This is simply not true. Let's take weight loss, for example, as most people know that being obese causes health problems and having a healthy diet will prevent disease. Everybody knows this but obesity is on the rise. Secondly corruption and government are inseparable which is why capitalism is awesome, so if the government advertises it can fix everything. When we had the swine flu the government advertised everyone to get a vaccine. Not only did nthey not have enough flu shots they were also wrong about the dangers. And, as it turns out, the vaccine has some nasty side effects. Oh you mean the reality where your country is the most incarcerating in world, and on steep upwards curb? Or the reality where public debt is skyrocketing like never before. Or maybe its the reality where there is an actual wiki page of notable tent cities in your country. Tent cities. What I dont get, is how the fuck is the ordinary american able to close his eyes to these problems... I mean when is it time to react. When a fifth of the adult population is incarcerated? Half? | ||
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xavra41
United States220 Posts
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manloveman
424 Posts
On March 23 2012 19:06 xavra41 wrote: You straight up don't know what you are talking about why don't you focus on your own countries problems. I won't fall for the red herring so how about you stay on topic. So why dont you educate me? I dont really think there is too much to misunderstand about incarceration statistics. The tent cities could be one large holiday camp though, you might be right there. | ||
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xavra41
United States220 Posts
On March 23 2012 19:15 manloveman wrote: So why dont you educate me? I dont really think there is too much to misunderstand about incarceration statistics. The tent cities could be one large holiday camp though, you might be right there. This topic is about obamacare not incarceration in USA. | ||
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Mr_Kzimir
France268 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/dqKPP.png) | ||
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karpo
Sweden1998 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:54 xavra41 wrote: I did and it is pro-socialism. Like most socialists he completely disregards reality. 'If you just had public education on prevention everything would be perfect'. This is simply not true. Let's take weight loss, for example, as most people know that being obese causes health problems and having a healthy diet will prevent disease. Everybody knows this but obesity is on the rise. Secondly corruption and government are inseparable which is why capitalism is awesome, so if the government advertises it can fix everything. When we had the swine flu the government advertised everyone to get a vaccine. Not only did nthey not have enough flu shots they were also wrong about the dangers. And, as it turns out, the vaccine has some nasty side effects. How can someone mention obesity, vaccines, and the awesomeness of capitalism in the same sentence? You do know that food that cause obesity and vaccines are heavily lobbied for by large coorporations that defend themselves with the argument that they should not have to care about the economy or health of their customers. The big winners from the swine flu vaccine were the capitalist big corporations. Government doesn't manufacture this stuff based on a socialist "no profit", coorporations do and they do it for profit. | ||
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xavra41
United States220 Posts
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Djabanete
United States2786 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:54 xavra41 wrote: I did and it is pro-socialism. Like most socialists he completely disregards reality. 'If you just had public education on prevention everything would be perfect'. This is simply not true. Way to ignore the points that were actually made, invent your own, and disagree with them because you already disagreed with the post in question before you even read it. If I were to summarize Satire's post, it would not be the way you just did. It would be, "Within real-world countries and states, lower economic inequality correlates strongly with better overall health, including for the wealthy." I think Satire backed up this argument quite well, but if you disagree, you should try quoting specific statements and forming arguments based on Satire actually wrote --- let alone asking to see those 30+ studies that supposedly support his point. Unless you're a troll. | ||
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xavra41
United States220 Posts
1. Government endorsed education "The second way to address this issue, is to provide public education to the masses on the effects of hot stoves and create policies which allow easier access to said education. By doing this, the trips to both the hospital and the store are prevented, and the incidence of this particular health disparity causes actively goes down" Swine flu is the perfect example of the failure of government. karpo said it well that corporations had special interest which impacted the advice. If i want quality advice on my health i definitely do not go to government. Secondly because there is awareness/education it doesn't solve the problem (see obesity). 2. Capitalism is anti-prevention thus socialism is better "This is why capitalism and healthcare should not mix as there is far more potential for profit in treating problems than there is in preventing them." First and foremost, you have a choice to take prescription or treatments. Preventive options are still an option. The problem is the people, not the markets, because people don't value prevention very much. Secondly the profit and capital from these industries has driven innovation in the health industry. Profit isn't a force of evil, it is an incentive. A lot of people become doctors because of how much money they make that doesn't make them evil. I am a fan of capitalism because it gives decision making power to the individual not the politician. | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
On March 23 2012 18:58 xavra41 wrote: I was actually after a deeper point. Why should we be forced to help others? Who decides who or what to help and how much is taken from us. I am in the camp of if you want to help people then help them and if you don't then dont. I respect personal liberty and freedom of choice, so government mandates take away much of your ability to be yourself. Yes, very deep. But the "personal liberty" you do have is already a benefit given to you by your society. You get it by birthright, for free. You have done nothing to earn it, in fact you haven't earned it. Where exactly do you think freedom comes from in the first place? It certainly doesn't fall from the sky. You have it because the society you live in allows you to have it. In fact you're incredibly fortunate that it does - historically if you were of a wrong race or gender, you wouldn't get nearly as much. If you were born elsewhere, you might not get it even today. Society doesn't "take away" anything from you, it quite literally enables you to have everything you do have in life. You think you actually accomplished anything entirely on your own? That's not even theoretically possible. It takes an incredible amount of misguided arrogance to be given so much, and then demand the "freedom" to decide whether you want to contribute to the society or not because you want to "be yourself". | ||
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Xiron
Germany1233 Posts
On March 23 2012 19:31 Mr_Kzimir wrote: + Show Spoiler + For example , this is what socialism look from the french perspective : This one made me laugh. Retiring age at 60? Trolololol. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10974 Posts
On March 23 2012 20:08 Xiron wrote: This one made me laugh. Retiring age at 60? Trolololol. Sarkozy seems a little... negative... ^^ | ||
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xavra41
United States220 Posts
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Red112
20 Posts
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