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I wonder what makes the difference between a good barrel and a bad one though. I mean, we can safely assume that a barrel that has been used 4 times to mature garbage grain whisky for cheap blends is going to be a bad barrel, yet the proper single malt distilleries surely buy by large single fill barrels of various provenance. What's the difference between Jack Daniel's casks though, are they all good, are they all bad for some reason? Aren't fresh sherry casks going to be pretty good, with some exceptions... I understand that some woods are better than others but surely not to the point where whisky would get vastly inferior all of a sudden.
I've been hearing about the shortage of quality casks and I never questioned it until your post, and so now I'm wondering what they're talking about. Plenty of enthusiasts complaining about how whisky used to be much better and outside of certain pearls from Ardbeg and the smaller distilleries, the increased need for mass production is resulting in worse bottlings for the big distilleries like Glenlivet and Glenfiddich and all that. So what's wrong?
To me it seems plausible that due to higher demand, the distilleries have begun to produce more spirits and have cut corners to achieve it. And that means perhaps they re-use casks more times than they would previously have. So my concern is that there is an influx of bad spirits on the market, which makes it harder to figure out what is actually good. I agree though, the good stuff won't disappear.
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Whoa.
http://www.statista.com/statistics/259730/leading-whiskey-brands-worldwide-based-on-sales-volume/
The top 2 selling brands globally are both Indian but Johnnie Walker is 3rd. That tells you where most of their barrels must be coming from ... it only makes sense?!?!!?
Mind = Blown. Jack Daniels and Jim bean are further down the list than I imagined, but still above all other Scotches except Johnnie. I am amazed how much Indian whisky is dominating - I've gotta try some of this stuff just for the reckoning!!
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Can't access that data without a subscription 
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I can't see the data either, but I'm guessing the sheer volume of the Indian brands is just because of their population - and the price at which these will be available to the local public. They should make a graph for export only.
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On July 30 2015 19:01 aseq wrote:
I can't see the data either, but I'm guessing the sheer volume of the Indian brands is just because of their population - and the price at which these will be available to the local public. They should make a graph for export only.
I'm sure Johnnie Walker is way ahead in terms of income seeing how they sell garbage spirits in JW red for a fair bit of money. On the other hand, I've only heard good things about the Amrut distillery from India. They have a big advantage, because of the climate their whisky doesn't need to mature for very long before it taps into the flavors from the casks.
Really do wonder how much they charge for it in India, because their stuff is by no means cheap around here or anywhere in Europe really.
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Had a few goes at some Balvenie Doublewood I got for my birthday and really enjoying it so far, it's the first whisky where I've had a whole bottle of my own. The others I've tried are Nikka from the barrel, and Aberlour 10 year old. I think I enjoyed them in that order really. The Nikka is really expensive for a blend, though I'd love to get some more, and it comes in half litre bottles as well.
Thinking ahead, I thought my next should maybe be something a bit more peaty. Any recommendations? (I probably won't get round to getting it till christmas though.)
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On August 04 2015 07:23 deakachu wrote:
Had a few goes at some Balvenie Doublewood I got for my birthday and really enjoying it so far, it's the first whisky where I've had a whole bottle of my own. The others I've tried are Nikka from the barrel, and Aberlour 10 year old. I think I enjoyed them in that order really. The Nikka is really expensive for a blend, though I'd love to get some more, and it comes in half litre bottles as well.
Thinking ahead, I thought my next should maybe be something a bit more peaty. Any recommendations? (I probably won't get round to getting it till christmas though.)
My recommendations are the following.
If you want to buy something nice but very peaty and perhaps challenging for a "beginner", I'd suggest Ardbeg 10 years or the Laphroaig Quarter Cask.
If you want something a little bit softer but still very peaty, you can go for the Lagavulin 16, a big classic that's consistently good. The peaty and smoky taste of a whisky slowly fades as the whisky ages in casks, so while the Lagavulin malt is fairly heavily smoked, the 16 years tone it down quite a bit.
If you want to buy something with subtle peat, the Talisker 10 is the way to go. A very well rounded scotch.
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Sipping on the Glenlivet Naddura 16 -- Much better than the typical Glenlivet 12. Bottled at 55.3%
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On July 30 2015 01:06 Djzapz wrote:
I wonder what makes the difference between a good barrel and a bad one though. I mean, we can safely assume that a barrel that has been used 4 times to mature garbage grain whisky for cheap blends is going to be a bad barrel, yet the proper single malt distilleries surely buy by large single fill barrels of various provenance. What's the difference between Jack Daniel's casks though, are they all good, are they all bad for some reason? Aren't fresh sherry casks going to be pretty good, with some exceptions... I understand that some woods are better than others but surely not to the point where whisky would get vastly inferior all of a sudden.
I've been hearing about the shortage of quality casks and I never questioned it until your post, and so now I'm wondering what they're talking about. Plenty of enthusiasts complaining about how whisky used to be much better and outside of certain pearls from Ardbeg and the smaller distilleries, the increased need for mass production is resulting in worse bottlings for the big distilleries like Glenlivet and Glenfiddich and all that. So what's wrong?
To me it seems plausible that due to higher demand, the distilleries have begun to produce more spirits and have cut corners to achieve it. And that means perhaps they re-use casks more times than they would previously have. So my concern is that there is an influx of bad spirits on the market, which makes it harder to figure out what is actually good. I agree though, the good stuff won't disappear.
Short answer is taste preference. Nothing else makes a barrel "better" than anything else. Post Bourbon barrels will tend to be sweet. Post-wine barrels more fruity. Etc etc. but even then it depends a lot on the prior bass spirit. Fresh barrels have the most wood taste etc. Functionally it has nothing to do with the "quality" of the grain since that is a misunderstanding of the whiskey process (though I personally don't like wheat and that makes Makers Mark shit loads of other people love it).
In terms of barrel cost that has to do with the cost of oak (very high). And I supposed bad oak could have an effect but I don't think it would be that significant.
I mean people complaining about Glendfiddich being bad aren't wrong. But it's always been bad. (I mean decent quality it just tastes like shit)
What makes primarily makes "bad whiskey" is bad "heads and tails" selection rather than bad grain or type. Very few distilleries should have much of a problem with that* since the cost in making whiskey is not in the grain (so you don't lose much by being selective in expunging heads/tails) but in the fact that it has to sit around for a lot of years. All those cheapish bourbons you don't like are mainly that way by choice.
there will be slight variations of non sour mash whiskeys each year but distillers mix their barrels to produce the taste they want, one year to the next you're not likely to see any taste difference. So people saying that whiskey is worse are wrong. Glenfiddich did not forget the taste of their whiskey, he'll they can probably taste compare the 2015 12 year to their 1950 12 year.
*in a cost sense. Many young distillers haven't figured it out yet and I'm pretty sure McCormacks just doesn't care
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Well I was not suggesting that the previous content makes for a better barrel in the sense that "sherry is better than bourbon" or anything like that. But apparently certain types of wood make for barrels which are more likely to lead to better tasting whisky, and other woods just put make the whisky bitter.
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I just cracked open my bottle of Benriach 12 Sherry finish and wow is this different, very pleasant little whisky for the beginners who want a "dessert" type whisky. Pairs well with nothing at all, don't go eat stuff while you drink this.
If you don't like whisky but you've liked other "softer" and fruity spirits like cognac, this might be for you, except a whole lot more interesting than cognac.
Edit: Also, yay!
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/w4UrDMu.jpg)
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Where are you people
I find the whisky forums to be shitty.
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Just picked up a Dewars 18 Founder's Reserve -- Not sure I'll be purchasing again.
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Baltimore, USA22256 Posts
Actually just picked up some Cherry whiskey tonight to mix with some Cheerwine (a cherry soda). Wish me luck!
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On August 17 2015 09:15 Chewbacca. wrote:
Just picked up a Dewars 18 Founder's Reserve -- Not sure I'll be purchasing again.
Unfortunate to pay that much for an underwhelming product. What do you not like about it?
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Benromach Peat Smoke! A little over halfway gone at this point. Still my favorite whisky, I am quite sure. I have trouble thinking of something I get excited about opening like this, maybe next to a Springbank Longrow or 10yo or an Ardbeg 10 ... but I think this is more interesting.
When its first opened the sourness kind of stands out, still smokey of course, but maybe the reason I like it so much is that you can pick out other things through the smoke, a sort of sour-citrusy type flavor. So good. As you drink it over a couple weeks the sourness starts to dissipate and it becomes very smokey. At about the point I'm at now, it starts to lose a strong smoke attack and become just a lovely complex whisky with a that really strong mineral almost vitamin type taste? Very pleasant and probably one of my favorite qualities of a whisky.
Something about this one seems so organic (as in living) ... constantly evolving. I'd say its quite the opposite of that super flat, over processed, dry texture you get from Johnnie Walker Reds or Cutty Sark or even a Genlivet 12 or something similar (which I generally just despise) ... yeup this stuff is complex and vibrant. #1
Thanks for encouraging me to open it a few weeks ago, gents 
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On August 04 2015 07:51 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 04 2015 07:23 deakachu wrote:
Had a few goes at some Balvenie Doublewood I got for my birthday and really enjoying it so far, it's the first whisky where I've had a whole bottle of my own. The others I've tried are Nikka from the barrel, and Aberlour 10 year old. I think I enjoyed them in that order really. The Nikka is really expensive for a blend, though I'd love to get some more, and it comes in half litre bottles as well.
Thinking ahead, I thought my next should maybe be something a bit more peaty. Any recommendations? (I probably won't get round to getting it till christmas though.) My recommendations are the following. If you want to buy something nice but very peaty and perhaps challenging for a "beginner", I'd suggest Ardbeg 10 years or the Laphroaig Quarter Cask. If you want something a little bit softer but still very peaty, you can go for the Lagavulin 16, a big classic that's consistently good. The peaty and smoky taste of a whisky slowly fades as the whisky ages in casks, so while the Lagavulin malt is fairly heavily smoked, the 16 years tone it down quite a bit. If you want to buy something with subtle peat, the Talisker 10 is the way to go. A very well rounded scotch.
I love islay malts. Lagavulin is good just expensive (at least outside of Costco in California where I've bought 5ths for $65). Ardbeg and Laphroig Quarter Cask are a bit cheaper. I absolutely love Laphroig 10 as well. I can get it from Kroger here in Michigan for around $40.
Id recommend Bowmore 12 if you like peaty scotches to start with. Can't go wrong with most islay malts.
bruichladdich I'd recommend for someone who wants to try an Islay with no peat.
Also, for anyone who lives in Michigan.......when you go to Canada stop at duty free ftw Liters of Knob Creek for $23 (for those of you who like Bourbons)
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On August 19 2015 11:27 Sadist wrote:Show nested quote +On August 04 2015 07:51 Djzapz wrote:On August 04 2015 07:23 deakachu wrote:
Had a few goes at some Balvenie Doublewood I got for my birthday and really enjoying it so far, it's the first whisky where I've had a whole bottle of my own. The others I've tried are Nikka from the barrel, and Aberlour 10 year old. I think I enjoyed them in that order really. The Nikka is really expensive for a blend, though I'd love to get some more, and it comes in half litre bottles as well.
Thinking ahead, I thought my next should maybe be something a bit more peaty. Any recommendations? (I probably won't get round to getting it till christmas though.) My recommendations are the following. If you want to buy something nice but very peaty and perhaps challenging for a "beginner", I'd suggest Ardbeg 10 years or the Laphroaig Quarter Cask. If you want something a little bit softer but still very peaty, you can go for the Lagavulin 16, a big classic that's consistently good. The peaty and smoky taste of a whisky slowly fades as the whisky ages in casks, so while the Lagavulin malt is fairly heavily smoked, the 16 years tone it down quite a bit. If you want to buy something with subtle peat, the Talisker 10 is the way to go. A very well rounded scotch. I love islay malts. Lagavulin is good just expensive (at least outside of Costco in California where I've bought 5ths for $65). Ardbeg and Laphroig Quarter Cask are a bit cheaper. I absolutely love Laphroig 10 as well. I can get it from Kroger here in Michigan for around $40. Id recommend Bowmore 12 if you like peaty scotches to start with. Can't go wrong with most islay malts. bruichladdich I'd recommend for someone who wants to try an Islay with no peat. Also, for anyone who lives in Michigan.......when you go to Canada stop at duty free ftw Liters of Knob Creek for $23 (for those of you who like Bourbons)
You know, that's awesome! I started with Bowmore 12 and that is what got me into Islay's to begin with. I didn't like it at first but after a few nights I think I "got it" ... I am looking to treat myself to some of that Bowmore Tempest pretty soon huehuehuehue
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Thats the first I've heard of tempest. have never seen it here in Michigan. I see Black Rock and Gold Reef all the time at duty free when I cross the border for work. Will have to investigate tempest Black rock is pretty good, smoother than 12 year with a little less peat. Haven't tried Gold Reef yet.
Personally my favorite that ive had is bowmore 18 but at around $125 thats way too steep for my tax bracket. id skip bowmore 15 as I think for one reason or another the peat flavor is dilluted in it and it has way more sherry and berry notes.
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Picked up a Middleton Very Rare this past week. It's like drinking a dark whiskey chocolate.
I'm trying to find some stuff that's pretty similar in quality, but shying away from anything non-Irish. Thoughts?
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EPT
