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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on.
Posts of the following nature are banned:
1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post.
2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no.
3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture.
4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments.
Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating. |
On August 13 2013 08:53 Killscreen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 08:45 maggle wrote:On August 13 2013 08:08 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 08:04 sunprince wrote:On August 13 2013 08:01 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 07:55 sunprince wrote:On August 13 2013 06:29 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 04:22 sunprince wrote:On August 12 2013 19:29 Killscreen wrote:On August 12 2013 08:40 sunprince wrote:
[quote]
Your assumption here is that in any relationship, one partner rises to the level of the other and/or one partner sinks to the level of the other.
You have absolutely no basis for that assumption, aside from possibly too many romance movies. There is also the assumption that having a new partner lined up before ending it with the previous one makes you a shitty person. It doesn't. It stings. Trust me I know it does, but it doesn't make her a bad person you should harbor resentment for. It makes you a shitty person if the other person is unaware that this is acceptable behavior in your relationship. And while this varies across cultures, I would argue that this is typically not considered acceptable in modern first-world societies unless specified beforehand. I don't care what any particular society expects. If following society's rules is the primary concern then fine, but realize this: Every society has these constructs that protect men from jealousy. The problem is that they are all misogynistic in nature, designed to control women with guilt under the guise of moral and religion, so that they may not wield the power of sexual jealousy over men. I refuse to obey such archaic, unnatural and evil constructs. They became obsolete with the condom. Jealousy is an illusion.It is simply your brain giving you a chemical signal, so that you focus your time and resources on your own offspring. Not having this response increases the risk of raising another male's offspring and thus not efficiently reproducing yourself. It is a chemical response to an ancient problem we no longer face, and yet it so severely limits our life, if we let it. Learning to handle jealousy makes you a better man and gives you a more fulfilling love life with less drama. No jealousy means no shame, guilt or inhibition. Conquering jealousy is no easy task, but then most worthwhile tasks in life aren't. Without jealousy, you are sad to see the girl go, but glad she has found someone who makes her happy, and glad you got to fuck her while she looked around. Without jealousy she can even be honest about it, and you too can see other people. It's just better that way. No anger, resentment or drama. Just love. While I generally take a similar viewpoint on jealousy, there is a difference between an agreed-upon open relationship and an open relationship that only one partner is aware of. So its the fact that our hypothetical girl waited too long to break up. The break up was happening anyway, so I don't really see much difference. How does it hurt the person being left more? Simply because a violation of an existing contract does not end up hurting anyone doesn't change the fact that the contract was violated. You're just rationalizing away shitty behavior by examining the consequences, but that's not how ethical systems work. If something is dishonest behavior, then it is dishonest regardless of whether anyone was hurt by it. We have philosophical differences regarding right and wrong then. I'm more concerned with consequences than technicalities. Wait. Are you saying that you think there's nothing wrong with being dishonest as long as there are no consequences? I think it depends on what's being lied about. There are situations where I would want to be lied to.
And therefore you assume that others would want to be lied to, too? And, thus, you lie to others without feeling bad about it.
Nice.
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On August 13 2013 09:05 Conti wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 08:53 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 08:45 maggle wrote:On August 13 2013 08:08 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 08:04 sunprince wrote:On August 13 2013 08:01 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 07:55 sunprince wrote:On August 13 2013 06:29 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 04:22 sunprince wrote:On August 12 2013 19:29 Killscreen wrote:
[quote]
There is also the assumption that having a new partner lined up before ending it with the previous one makes you a shitty person. It doesn't.
It stings. Trust me I know it does, but it doesn't make her a bad person you should harbor resentment for. It makes you a shitty person if the other person is unaware that this is acceptable behavior in your relationship. And while this varies across cultures, I would argue that this is typically not considered acceptable in modern first-world societies unless specified beforehand. I don't care what any particular society expects. If following society's rules is the primary concern then fine, but realize this: Every society has these constructs that protect men from jealousy. The problem is that they are all misogynistic in nature, designed to control women with guilt under the guise of moral and religion, so that they may not wield the power of sexual jealousy over men. I refuse to obey such archaic, unnatural and evil constructs. They became obsolete with the condom. Jealousy is an illusion.It is simply your brain giving you a chemical signal, so that you focus your time and resources on your own offspring. Not having this response increases the risk of raising another male's offspring and thus not efficiently reproducing yourself. It is a chemical response to an ancient problem we no longer face, and yet it so severely limits our life, if we let it. Learning to handle jealousy makes you a better man and gives you a more fulfilling love life with less drama. No jealousy means no shame, guilt or inhibition. Conquering jealousy is no easy task, but then most worthwhile tasks in life aren't. Without jealousy, you are sad to see the girl go, but glad she has found someone who makes her happy, and glad you got to fuck her while she looked around. Without jealousy she can even be honest about it, and you too can see other people. It's just better that way. No anger, resentment or drama. Just love. While I generally take a similar viewpoint on jealousy, there is a difference between an agreed-upon open relationship and an open relationship that only one partner is aware of. So its the fact that our hypothetical girl waited too long to break up. The break up was happening anyway, so I don't really see much difference. How does it hurt the person being left more? Simply because a violation of an existing contract does not end up hurting anyone doesn't change the fact that the contract was violated. You're just rationalizing away shitty behavior by examining the consequences, but that's not how ethical systems work. If something is dishonest behavior, then it is dishonest regardless of whether anyone was hurt by it. We have philosophical differences regarding right and wrong then. I'm more concerned with consequences than technicalities. Wait. Are you saying that you think there's nothing wrong with being dishonest as long as there are no consequences? I think it depends on what's being lied about. There are situations where I would want to be lied to. And therefore you assume that others would want to be lied to, too? And, thus, you lie to others without feeling bad about it. Nice.
Obviously. You tell your girl the truth if she asks you if she looks fat after gaining a few pounds? Sometimes people and particularly girls just want validation, and I think it's OK to give them that, even if its not 100% true.
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On August 13 2013 08:08 Killscreen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 08:04 sunprince wrote:On August 13 2013 08:01 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 07:55 sunprince wrote:On August 13 2013 06:29 Killscreen wrote:On August 13 2013 04:22 sunprince wrote:On August 12 2013 19:29 Killscreen wrote:On August 12 2013 08:40 sunprince wrote:On August 10 2013 23:45 BisuEver wrote:On August 10 2013 19:03 sunprince wrote:[quote] Just-world fallacy. If anything, you've got it backwards: being a bad person increases the likelihood that you will be taking advantage of other people rather than the other way around, so if you are a "shitty" person you are less likely to date "shitty" people. No, I'm saying it will be a shitty relationship. There's 2 people in 1. It's like a prisoner's dilemma thing. Either you can be a worse person or they can be a better one. Otherwise you're both in for some shit. Your assumption here is that in any relationship, one partner rises to the level of the other and/or one partner sinks to the level of the other. You have absolutely no basis for that assumption, aside from possibly too many romance movies. There is also the assumption that having a new partner lined up before ending it with the previous one makes you a shitty person. It doesn't. It stings. Trust me I know it does, but it doesn't make her a bad person you should harbor resentment for. It makes you a shitty person if the other person is unaware that this is acceptable behavior in your relationship. And while this varies across cultures, I would argue that this is typically not considered acceptable in modern first-world societies unless specified beforehand. I don't care what any particular society expects. If following society's rules is the primary concern then fine, but realize this: Every society has these constructs that protect men from jealousy. The problem is that they are all misogynistic in nature, designed to control women with guilt under the guise of moral and religion, so that they may not wield the power of sexual jealousy over men. I refuse to obey such archaic, unnatural and evil constructs. They became obsolete with the condom. Jealousy is an illusion.It is simply your brain giving you a chemical signal, so that you focus your time and resources on your own offspring. Not having this response increases the risk of raising another male's offspring and thus not efficiently reproducing yourself. It is a chemical response to an ancient problem we no longer face, and yet it so severely limits our life, if we let it. Learning to handle jealousy makes you a better man and gives you a more fulfilling love life with less drama. No jealousy means no shame, guilt or inhibition. Conquering jealousy is no easy task, but then most worthwhile tasks in life aren't. Without jealousy, you are sad to see the girl go, but glad she has found someone who makes her happy, and glad you got to fuck her while she looked around. Without jealousy she can even be honest about it, and you too can see other people. It's just better that way. No anger, resentment or drama. Just love. While I generally take a similar viewpoint on jealousy, there is a difference between an agreed-upon open relationship and an open relationship that only one partner is aware of. So its the fact that our hypothetical girl waited too long to break up. The break up was happening anyway, so I don't really see much difference. How does it hurt the person being left more? Simply because a violation of an existing contract does not end up hurting anyone doesn't change the fact that the contract was violated. You're just rationalizing away shitty behavior by examining the consequences, but that's not how ethical systems work. If something is dishonest behavior, then it is dishonest regardless of whether anyone was hurt by it. We have philosophical differences regarding right and wrong then. I'm more concerned with consequences than technicalities.
Your philosophical views have no relevance to the original discussion, which is whether or not cheating on your partner makes you a shitty person.
It is readily apparent that according to most people's definition of "shitty person", the answer is yes. This is why I brought up society a few posts back; to indicate to you that you are playing semantics and changing definitions from their common usage in order to suit your argument.
If your argument is that you don't consider cheating on your partner to be shitty, then that would be reasonable. However, this doesn't change the fact that most people would consider this to be shitty behavior, so my original "assumption" that cheating on your partner makes you a shitty person (by most people's standards, a clarification wouldn't need to be said if not for nitpickers like you) stands.
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On August 13 2013 09:16 Killscreen wrote:
Obviously. You tell your girl the truth if she asks you if she looks fat after gaining a few pounds? Sometimes people and particularly girls just want validation, and I think it's OK to give them that, even if its not 100% true.
So, you think she's fat but you'll lie to her to spare her feelings. Through all of this, I think I have a pretty good read on you...
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On August 13 2013 06:02 Recognizable wrote:
Okay guys. I just recently broke up and another girl just plainly asked to fuck me. With zero strings attached. She isn't pretty. Barely doable, not fat but chubby. I'm sorry for her, but she should lose about 15 lb's and she would be much hotter :/ Anyway. Do it. Yes/no? It seems like a great idea but then I fap and I honestly could not be bothered.
Dude you're in the same situation 100% I'm in. And yes she does give good head as someone else said. If I can somehow just get that arranged without anything more it'd be awesome.
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Let's just ignore killscreen lol. Also, I'm kinda interested in how Recognizable's story turns out here. Zooper, what exactly do you mean?
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Of course you do it. You are single. Think of your dick as a pen, the tool which will help you author a story about terrible and regrettable drunk decisions.
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On August 13 2013 12:15 docvoc wrote:
Let's just ignore killscreen lol. Also, I'm kinda interested in how Recognizable's story turns out here. Zooper, what exactly do you mean?
Recently broke up. Now this somewhat chubby, etc chick wants to hook up with me. Done her before and it was something I regretted, pity fuck so low. But she was really good at oral and she did it a lot. I'd only be willing to let her do that but I don't wanna actually do her again lol. Guess I have to figure out how to get that message across without making her mad or hurting her feelings.
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I think at that point you just politely decline. You can't assume there is a response that won't make her mad or hurt her feelings.
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My girlfriend who i loved with all of my heart recently cheated on me with my best friend. I've been completely lost since it happened and I don't even know what to do. They are going out now and its just ruining my life. It feels like I'm never going to get over this situation, but I know I have to. Its just so hard.
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Northern Ireland26802 Posts
It's really fucking awkward, I have yet to find a 'no strings' girl who is as advertised.
I recall banging some girl I had only talked to via Xbox Live lol, she was quite flirtatious and elicited this young and innocent Wombat to exchange phone numbers, after which she bombarded me with rather filthy SMS messages. I think I got drunk one night and challenged her to 'put her money where her mouth is' to paraphrase.
I neglected to mention my relative ignorance of her physical appearance, that said it is true that fat girls give better head, but with an oft-neglected mention that in terms of penetrative sex they're a bit awkward to get around.
Anyway yeah, despite laying what I thought were pretty clear casual ground rules she got a bit batshit for a bit with me, eugh.
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On August 13 2013 13:34 -FaLLeN wrote:
My girlfriend who i loved with all of my heart recently cheated on me with my best friend. I've been completely lost since it happened and I don't even know what to do. They are going out now and its just ruining my life. It feels like I'm never going to get over this situation, but I know I have to. Its just so hard.
That's brutal mate. Your best friend is scum. You need to channel all that misery and hatred into something productive - hit the gym and get shredded. That way, your scummy best friend will be intimidated and scared straight every time he sees you - even when you have no intention of hurting him.
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On August 13 2013 13:48 maggle wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 13:34 -FaLLeN wrote:
My girlfriend who i loved with all of my heart recently cheated on me with my best friend. I've been completely lost since it happened and I don't even know what to do. They are going out now and its just ruining my life. It feels like I'm never going to get over this situation, but I know I have to. Its just so hard. That's brutal mate. Your best friend is scum. You need to channel all that misery and hatred into something productive - hit the gym and get shredded. That way, your scummy best friend will be intimidated and scared straight every time he sees you - even when you have no intention of hurting him.
I know. When i found out about it, I went over to his house and he told me everything. I then beat the living shit out of him and left him on the side of the road and haven't talked to him since.
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On August 13 2013 13:51 -FaLLeN wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 13:48 maggle wrote:On August 13 2013 13:34 -FaLLeN wrote:
My girlfriend who i loved with all of my heart recently cheated on me with my best friend. I've been completely lost since it happened and I don't even know what to do. They are going out now and its just ruining my life. It feels like I'm never going to get over this situation, but I know I have to. Its just so hard. That's brutal mate. Your best friend is scum. You need to channel all that misery and hatred into something productive - hit the gym and get shredded. That way, your scummy best friend will be intimidated and scared straight every time he sees you - even when you have no intention of hurting him. I know. When i found out about it, I went over to his house and he told me everything. I then beat the living shit out of him and left him on the side of the road and haven't talked to him since.
Uh oh, my BS meter is capped out.
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So I'm curious what TL's views are on open relationships. I really like this girl and she really likes me. We share similar views in our approach to sex. She's cheated on every BF and her ex husband, hence the past tenses. Now I am no player or anything, very little skill in womanizing but feel that sex does not equal love and that its possible to have sex for fun. And sex is such a broad thing. One person cannot possibly offer all their is sexually. She's very clearly going to benefit from this more then I will but the option for me exists to sleep with another woman(she offered to help me get better at picking chicks up too).
We had a chat about that a few days back and laid some ground rules like always wear protection, regular STD tests at the clinic. (before she used an alias since they allow that. I told her she should be using her real name and info. Medical personal deserve to know if you have something when they work on you so they may take the steps necessary to protect themselves. Got no resistance surprisingly) ALWAYS tell the other person before hand if possible (spur of the moment at a bar can happen/phones die and via text is ok because the questions from the other party may be weird) or after if you couldn't and basically just use common sense.
What are your guys views? Can open relationships work?
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On August 13 2013 13:56 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 13:51 -FaLLeN wrote:On August 13 2013 13:48 maggle wrote:On August 13 2013 13:34 -FaLLeN wrote:
My girlfriend who i loved with all of my heart recently cheated on me with my best friend. I've been completely lost since it happened and I don't even know what to do. They are going out now and its just ruining my life. It feels like I'm never going to get over this situation, but I know I have to. Its just so hard. That's brutal mate. Your best friend is scum. You need to channel all that misery and hatred into something productive - hit the gym and get shredded. That way, your scummy best friend will be intimidated and scared straight every time he sees you - even when you have no intention of hurting him. I know. When i found out about it, I went over to his house and he told me everything. I then beat the living shit out of him and left him on the side of the road and haven't talked to him since. Uh oh, my BS meter is capped out.
I honestly really wish it was BS. Everything I have said is completely true. But I wish it wasn't.
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On August 13 2013 14:30 Orcasgt24 wrote:
So I'm curious what TL's views are on open relationships. I really like this girl and she really likes me. We share similar views in our approach to sex. She's cheated on every BF and her ex husband, hence the past tenses. Now I am no player or anything, very little skill in womanizing but feel that sex does not equal love and that its possible to have sex for fun. And sex is such a broad thing. One person cannot possibly offer all their is sexually. She's very clearly going to benefit from this more then I will but the option for me exists to sleep with another woman(she offered to help me get better at picking chicks up too).
We had a chat about that a few days back and laid some ground rules like always wear protection, regular STD tests at the clinic. (before she used an alias since they allow that. I told her she should be using her real name and info. Medical personal deserve to know if you have something when they work on you so they may take the steps necessary to protect themselves. Got no resistance surprisingly) ALWAYS tell the other person before hand if possible (spur of the moment at a bar can happen/phones die and via text is ok because the questions from the other party may be weird) or after if you couldn't and basically just use common sense.
What are your guys views? Can open relationships work?
They certainly can. That said, they often don't, because few people possess the mindset and maturity required to make them work. Most people are socio-culturally conditioned in a manner that is not at all conducive to open relationships, at least, not for any extended period of time. Someone falls in love, someone becomes jealous, etc.
On August 13 2013 13:34 -FaLLeN wrote:
My girlfriend who i loved with all of my heart recently cheated on me with my best friend. I've been completely lost since it happened and I don't even know what to do. They are going out now and its just ruining my life. It feels like I'm never going to get over this situation, but I know I have to. Its just so hard.
Posts like these remind me that among the benefits of having a female best friend includes not needing to worry about this particular problem.
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Being the OP, I have a quick update on my relationship status, I had a girlfriend for a while, and it was great, then she started doing drugs and we broke up, and she was my best friend of the past 15 years, and i'm now watching meth eat her life away. That is my luck.
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On August 13 2013 15:30 Metalreflux wrote:
Being the OP, I have a quick update on my relationship status, I had a girlfriend for a while, and it was great, then she started doing drugs and we broke up, and she was my best friend of the past 15 years, and i'm now watching meth eat her life away. That is my luck.
THE OP HAS RETURNED TO US AFTER 2 YEARS!
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On August 13 2013 15:32 Zooper31 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 13 2013 15:30 Metalreflux wrote:
Being the OP, I have a quick update on my relationship status, I had a girlfriend for a while, and it was great, then she started doing drugs and we broke up, and she was my best friend of the past 15 years, and i'm now watching meth eat her life away. That is my luck. THE OP HAS RETURNED TO US AFTER 2 YEARS!
I read this often, I just have had no need to post, I was acutally thinking of asking a mod to close this thread, but I'd hate to do that to you guys because this seems like a good place for TL'ers to vent
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EPT
