EPTFacebook troll jailed - Page 18
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Half
United States2554 Posts
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:06 Ryka wrote: Nobody would argue that I'm sure. But is jail a fair/reasonable punishment considering the cost to the tax payer and the benefit gained? Definitely for violent crimes jail is the best option, get them out of society asap, but for (albeit severe) internet trolling? I think jailing in this case is meant for a scare tactic and a way of scaring others into not doing it (I forget the criminological terminology for this, it's one of the five forms of correction or something. Let me get my book and recall). In this case, one person gets a harsh punishment to scare and deter others from doing it. As you can see, the outrageousness of it is causing quite a stir :B! If we punished or used correctional tools in regards to how much it would cost, we'd have a lot more deviants on the streets and less in the correctional facilities. While that isn't such a bad idea in many situations or countries, it's very difficult to ensure the balance of on aspect of society (law enforcement, judicial system, etc.) and then keep in mind of a financial situation of an entire country and their people. It's just not something feasibly reasonable to talk about when speaking of one specific crime or doer. | ||
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jinorazi
Korea (South)4948 Posts
i'd personally volunteer to bitch slap him every half hour for 4 weeks. | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:25 jinorazi wrote: jailing is too much of a waste on him. i'd personally volunteer to bitch slap him every half hour for 4 weeks. I'd volunteer to supervise this ;D | ||
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Ryka
United Kingdom254 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:27 Torte de Lini wrote: I'd volunteer to supervise this ;D Someone's gotta supervise the superviser, I'm there. | ||
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BlackJack
United States10574 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:15 MozzarellaL wrote: Go look up the defamation laws of European countries. Jail time for any offenders. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation While most civilized groups are in consensus that a person should never be jailed on account of his mere speech, the following European countries currently jail people for making defamatory statements: Albania Austria Belgium Croatia Czech Republic Denmark Finland Germany Greece Italy Norway Poland Portugal Spain Sweden Switzerland You call that freedom of speech? No country which sends people to jail on account of what they said can ever be considered to protect speech. I don't think there is any consensus that nobody should be sent to jail for mere speech. I think it's a consensus that people should be sent to jail for things like bomb threats. But you are right that Europeans typically have stricter laws on things like hate speech or offensive speech. | ||
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zyglrox
United States1168 Posts
On September 14 2011 20:38 HereticSaint wrote: Completely stupid and pointless case and a waste of money for everyone involved. This is the equivalent to prosecuting a random 14 year old girl for illegally downloading music, sure it stirs up some press and may make it into the paper but in the end it deters absolutely no one from doing said action because in the end they aren't going to go after everyone doing it and you are just as likely to win the lottery as you are to get prosecuted for it. As for the family and parents? They need to toughen up, I've had people comment about family members of mine that are dead probably thousands of times, you don't see me sitting in a courtroom every time that happens, even the especially bad times. Who cares what the mother wants, that has absolutely no relevance. I want a million dollars, I want idiots to die, I want to know how to pilot an F-16. What the hell is your point? Really? watch out, this guy is fucking tough | ||
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Voldron
Greece91 Posts
On September 14 2011 20:21 Lumi wrote: Deezer's next User was warned for this post hahah yea | ||
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Jongl0
631 Posts
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Kyhol
Canada2575 Posts
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Voltaire
United States1485 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:15 MozzarellaL wrote: Go look up the defamation laws of European countries. Jail time for any offenders. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation While most civilized groups are in consensus that a person should never be jailed on account of his mere speech, the following European countries currently jail people for making defamatory statements: Albania Austria Belgium Croatia Czech Republic Denmark Finland Germany Greece Italy Norway Poland Portugal Spain Sweden Switzerland You call that freedom of speech? No country which sends people to jail on account of what they said can ever be considered to protect speech. You should have read the part of that article on the U.S. Apparently there is criminal defamation in a number of states (more than 10). Certainly there are countries in Europe where censorship still exists (Germany), but countries like Denmark essentially have the same level of freedom of speech as the US. I definitely think a lot of European countries need to reform their laws, though. Hate speech should not be a crime. I'll just quote Wikipedia to show that the US is not impeccable when it comes to freedom of speech: In the United States freedom of expression is protected by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. There are several statutory and common law exceptions including obscenity,[73][74] defamation,[73][74] incitement,[74] incitement to riot or imminent lawless action,[73][74] fighting words,[73] information decreed to be related to national security such as classified information,[75] false advertising,[74] perjury,[74] harassment, privileged communications, trade secrets, copyright, patents, military conduct, and time, place and manner restrictions. So you are both exaggerating the lack of free speech throughout Europe and the presence of free speech in America. Either way they both need more free speech. | ||
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JimSocks
United States968 Posts
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hmmm...
632 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:00 MozzarellaL wrote: It happens in Europe all the time. The USA is the only country that truly has freedom of speech, everyone else pretends to, while the rest of the world doesn't even make any pretense. no country "truly" has freedom of speech. the constitution does not cover fighting words. another example, is the courts ruled that you can't apply freedom of speech to advertising because it would damage the economy; in this case, the courts ruled that the smooth regulation of money flow outweighs freedom of speech. i guess this case fell under "fighting words" and hence the guy was jailed. | ||
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Belial88
United States5217 Posts
It'd be one thing if he was emailing harassment constantly, directly and privately to someone, but he did it on a public forum. Free speech, you know the whole argument. People shouldn't be punished by the government just because someone else got offended, no matter how offensive it is. What's to say someone can't go to jail for saying "LOL BRONZE" on a forum to someone. | ||
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Dreamscythe
Finland273 Posts
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RogerX
New Zealand3180 Posts
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Chriscras
Korea (South)2812 Posts
If someone were to find his actions appalling but also darkly and sadisticly humourous (I mean OP reposting the youtube video only gives it more prominence...) and make a post expressing such feelings possibly including an "lol", would they be penalized for it? | ||
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FabledIntegral
United States9232 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:15 BadgerBadger8264 wrote: Wow, a kid with a SOCIAL HANDICAP is mean to someone on the internet (no, this is not harrassment, he posted a couple of posts on a public facebook page and made a video of a train), and somehow people find it acceptable to send him to jail for 6 months? Are people really THAT petty and vindicative? "Justice" no matter the cost, right? We should probably just execute anyone for small scale robbery, right? No, this is going to make society better, you're right, take anyone that is mean on the internet or with social handicaps and lock them up for 6 months along with rapists and murderers. This is clearly a logical answer to the problem and will prevent any future problems with this person. Sure. Straight thinking there buddy. So clever. Yes, it is harassment, he repeatedly did it on the site. Not to mention he had done it to countless others. He didn't just post some video of a train, he took the time to go out of his way, edit the video, post her face on the front of it, etc. How in the world you could criticize the family for being vindictive is beyond me. Your only daughter is killed suddenly and you experience immense emotional trauma, while someone torments you behind a computer screen by mocking the fact she's dead, making completely horrendous comments about her, and even goes out of his way to post a friggin' edited video of how hilarious it is that she got hit by a train with her FACE on the front of it. Really? You find it over the top that they wanted to prosecute him? LOL. On September 15 2011 05:06 Chriscras wrote: So related question about TL moderation. If someone were to find his actions appalling but also darkly and sadisticly humourous (I mean OP reposting the youtube video only gives it more prominence...) and make a post expressing such feelings possibly including an "lol", would they be penalized for it? Completely different. This isn't the memorial site. The guy would have been free to make his OWN blog about it, I'm sure. It's when you're actively going about to communicate to the victims of the family that it becomes an issue. If he was fully aware that hte family frequented TL.net and posted it here with the intention of causing distress (in other words, he knew they would see it and he's posting it so they can't escape the trauma they're experiencing), that's when it's an issue. | ||
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BlackJack
United States10574 Posts
On September 15 2011 04:48 Voltaire wrote: You should have read the part of that article on the U.S. Apparently there is criminal defamation in a number of states (more than 10). Certainly there are countries in Europe where censorship still exists (Germany), but countries like Denmark essentially have the same level of freedom of speech as the US. I definitely think a lot of European countries need to reform their laws, though. Hate speech should not be a crime. I'll just quote Wikipedia to show that the US is not impeccable when it comes to freedom of speech: In the United States freedom of expression is protected by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution. There are several statutory and common law exceptions including obscenity,[73][74] defamation,[73][74] incitement,[74] incitement to riot or imminent lawless action,[73][74] fighting words,[73] information decreed to be related to national security such as classified information,[75] false advertising,[74] perjury,[74] harassment, privileged communications, trade secrets, copyright, patents, military conduct, and time, place and manner restrictions. So you are both exaggerating the lack of free speech throughout Europe and the presence of free speech in America. Either way they both need more free speech. Denmark definitely has much stricter laws regarding hate speech than the U.S. Look at the people that have been fined for insulting Islam, in some cases just for stating facts. e.g. + Show Spoiler + http://my.telegraph.co.uk/riteman/riteway/16309018/danish-mp-guilty-of-hate-crime-strange-justice/ | ||
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ampson
United States2355 Posts
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