EPTRepublican nominations - Page 396
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alpinefpOPP
United States134 Posts
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acker
United States2958 Posts
On February 03 2012 09:45 Kiarip wrote: Historical data isn't against my claims. When talking about purely socialized medicine like you have in Scandinavia the costs are largely nominal, because if all doctors, pharmacies, nurses, and all other health-care related industry is employed only by the government the cost can only really be seen in the government spending, which comes from the taxes, and they in fact do pay a lot of taxes. I'm sorry, but has the OECD made a mistake so simple a ten year old could spot it? That they only took out-of-pocket costs of healthcare without factoring in government expenditure on health insurance? And that the only way to filter this effect is to aggregate every tax other countries might impose on their citizens for whatever reason and call that healthcare spending? + Show Spoiler + http://www.oecd.org/document/16/0,3746,en_2649_34631_2085200_1_1_1_1,00.html (Note the split of private and government spending on healthcare) Do you really believe what you're saying? + Show Spoiler + Edit: Forget the OECD, I can't find a single study by a similar entity that has made this error when comparing healthcare costs across nations. | ||
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Derez
Netherlands6068 Posts
The same bs austrian economics get spilled out over this thread every couple of pages and for all our sanity I would suggest not engaging with it. | ||
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BobTheBuilder1377
Somalia335 Posts
![[image loading]](http://geke.us/GS.001.jpg) | ||
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forgottendreams
United States1771 Posts
On February 03 2012 11:02 Derez wrote: There's no point in actually trying to argue your point, as good as they may be. Any actual practical evidence gets relegated because 'no market ever has been truly free, so all your empirical evidence is invalid'. Only our austrian economic overlords know how things really work because of their deeper insight into markets, which were handed down to them much in the similar fashion the 10 commandments were handed down to Moses. Sorry, Mises. The same bs austrian economics get spilled out over this thread every couple of pages and for all our sanity I would suggest not engaging with it. Austrian economic overlords O_O Are you trying to give me nightmares before bed tonight? | ||
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1Eris1
United States5797 Posts
On February 03 2012 12:33 BobTheBuilder1377 wrote: What does Obama and Goldman Sach's have in common? You say Obama but then there are guys from the Clinton and Bush administration on there  Honestly dude, your oustanding bias is turning me away from Paul more than anything | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
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red_b
United States1267 Posts
On February 03 2012 10:02 pindleskin wrote: This guy romney.. he has changed pretty much 95% of his views over the last 4 years. Ron paul hasn't changed any of his views except 1 about capital punishment. o america = /... would have been better if he had changed his mind about that whole racism thing. and before the Paul people get on me about how Randian thinking eschews racism as illogical, Ayn Rand was very biggoted about Arabs. I have seen the interviews myself; for all of her talk she was a racist and Paul is no different. It is very easy to say things; it is another to live them. oh and that whole thing about getting rid of the Fed; I would give the US 12 months MAXIMUM before our economic power had been diminished to pre-civil war levels as the Chinese, Germans and Saudis mercilessly rape our terms of trade to benefit their exporting companies. you know, Mitt Romney takes this way, way too far but having some give and not being a hard headed ass is actually preferable. For all of his faults, Nixon at least showed that capacity when it really mattered. | ||
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Rabbet
Canada404 Posts
On February 03 2012 06:40 Focuspants wrote: Health care should not be a business. It should be an essntial service. Period. Corporations cut corners to maximize profits, they artificially inflate prices, they try to deny expensive services in an effort to make moe money. The Canadian system isnt perfect, but it is very very good. I just had to rush my grandma to the hospital after she had a blood test, which was processed within hours, and the lab doctor called our house at 11:30pm (the lab is open 24 hours) to let us know her hemoglobin level was critically low and to rush her to emergency (she had 4 hours before her heart would have seized). We rushed to the hospital, she was in the ER with 2 doctors and a team of nurses within 1 minute of arriving, she got a blood transfusion (5 bags). She got a stomach scope, they found she was bleeding from her stomach, they fixed it immediately. She stayed in the hospital for 4 nights, and it cost us 0 dollars. Shes at home happy and healthy. Anyone that thinks you should have to pay out the ass for that, or deal with corporations and insurance companies is out of their mind. Ive had many experiences with many family friends and relatives and the health care system, and I cant understand how a free market system is even remotely considered to be an option. I dont understand how Santorum could look a woman in the eye and say that to her. Its really sad. When did being conservative become being bat shit crazy. None of the remaining candidates have realistic positions that benefit normal people, and they have even less to show for the poor. It cost you 0 dollars, but it cost me $6000. Why should my family and I have to suffer because your grandma is dying? The problem with health care in general is people like you that think that because you don't pay the hospitals directly that it all occurs for free. It is not free, we pay taxes out the ass to support central medical care. People who are healthy and live healthy lives are punished by government through taxation to pay for your grandma's stomach. What incentive is there to live properly to extend your own life when you can just suckle off the government tit to cure what ails you? ~20% of all taxation goes to healthcare, which is very high. | ||
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Rabbet
Canada404 Posts
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TOloseGT
United States1145 Posts
On February 03 2012 13:42 Rabbet wrote: It cost you 0 dollars, but it cost me $6000. Why should my family and I have to suffer because your grandma is dying? The problem with health care in general is people like you that think that because you don't pay the hospitals directly that it all occurs for free. It is not free, we pay taxes out the ass to support central medical care. People who are healthy and live healthy lives are punished by government through taxation to pay for your grandma's stomach. What incentive is there to live properly to extend your own life when you can just suckle off the government tit to cure what ails you? ~20% of all taxation goes to healthcare, which is very high. The fact that you're healthy enough without ailments to stop you from doing whatever activity you wish. That's what's keeping the majority of people healthy, but that's besides the point. You're acting like without universal healthcare, your pittance would be given back to you to spend on something life changing. Even better, why should your tax dollars go to police and fire departments, or why should they go into roads you never use? Your fucking argument makes no sense. | ||
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red_b
United States1267 Posts
On February 03 2012 13:42 Rabbet wrote: It cost you 0 dollars, but it cost me $6000. Why should my family and I have to suffer because your grandma is dying? because when it's your turn to get shot up with cancer drugs or a heart stint everyone else will pay for it. everyone pays a small amount so that the big costs get spread out. you are very short sighted. your anger would be better directed at a real cause like American paid contractors killing brown people for sport or the way AIDs is decimating the African population instead of the wool that's been pulled over your eyes. do they not teach you how insurance works in high school where you live? | ||
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eyeballball3
United States93 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On February 03 2012 13:42 Rabbet wrote: It cost you 0 dollars, but it cost me $6000. Why should my family and I have to suffer because your grandma is dying? The problem with health care in general is people like you that think that because you don't pay the hospitals directly that it all occurs for free. It is not free, we pay taxes out the ass to support central medical care. People who are healthy and live healthy lives are punished by government through taxation to pay for your grandma's stomach. What incentive is there to live properly to extend your own life when you can just suckle off the government tit to cure what ails you? ~20% of all taxation goes to healthcare, which is very high. Where do you think the money should have gone to, then? Corporate tax cut? | ||
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AUGcodon
Canada536 Posts
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red_b
United States1267 Posts
On February 03 2012 14:03 eyeballball3 wrote: Makes sense to me. People should have health savings account or buy their own health insurance independent from the government. Having on mandate on insurance is worst than having a mandate on high school education. Government should only do what people can't do best themselves. Whenever government intervenes with anything, the prices inflate so much that a normal person can buy their health insurance independently. Look at what happened to education when government got involved. yep and while we're at it let's ditch the post office for private couriers (nevermind people who live in rural areas that are too expensive to service), stop paving roads (private toll roads were just find) and go back to having private armies (hey, they worked in Europe for hundreds of years, who are we to say no to that?!) I mean, just look at all of these countries and how much they waste on health care while us glorious Americans enjoy the low costs provided by our private insurers! ![[image loading]](http://soc101.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/health-care-per-capita-total-current-health-care-expenditures-us-and-selected-countries-2006.jpg) | ||
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BobTheBuilder1377
Somalia335 Posts
On February 03 2012 13:13 1Eris1 wrote: + Show Spoiler + On February 03 2012 12:33 BobTheBuilder1377 wrote: What does Obama and Goldman Sach's have in common? You say Obama but then there are guys from the Clinton and Bush administration on there Honestly dude, your oustanding bias is turning me away from Paul more than anything Honestly dude, It's all about status quo and you can cry all you want but these people are all related in one form or another. If you want to live under a rock and ignore the facts, that's fine by me. | ||
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Rabbet
Canada404 Posts
On February 03 2012 13:57 TOloseGT wrote: The fact that you're healthy enough without ailments to stop you from doing whatever activity you wish. That's what's keeping the majority of people healthy, but that's besides the point. You're acting like without universal healthcare, your pittance would be given back to you to spend on something life changing. Even better, why should your tax dollars go to police and fire departments, or why should they go into roads you never use? Your fucking argument makes no sense. Good point, why should my tax dollars go to roads I don't use? It is completely unfair to pedestrians that they have to pay for roads. Don't get mad about it, there is no need to be swearing I am just standing up to the injustice. As far as police, I believe security and law enforcement is what governments are mandated to handle. Government are given the exclusive right to use force when necessary by me and you, the people that form the governments right? With the extra 6 per year I would save on taxes I would likely put an addition on our cabin and build a better boat house. | ||
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Rabbet
Canada404 Posts
On February 03 2012 14:10 Sufficiency wrote: Where do you think the money should have gone to, then? Corporate tax cut? In my pocket, where it was to begin with. | ||
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red_b
United States1267 Posts
On February 03 2012 14:17 Rabbet wrote: With the extra 6 per year I would save on taxes I would likely put an addition on our cabin and build a better boat house. you hear that guys? he has to put an addition on his house and build a better boat house gee, sorry to ask you to help people who are dying with a few dollars. what a dick. | ||
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