These vids are for the people who keep calling slandering him
Oh, so Ron Paul "only" published and profited off of racist newsletters.
cool
Yea he's rolling in the dough he made from them. Ron Paul such a horrible person for the one time he trusted other people to run his newsletter, what a bad person he is!
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
How about the NDAA he promised to veto?
Or bringing the troops home, 4 years ago?
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
All politicians, and I mean all, take decisions that go against what they have previously stated in one form or another. It's just how politics works, you don't get everything you want, unless you are a dictator. You are calling him a liar and then cherry picks decisions that supposedly proves this. Compare him to other presidents and you might have a case.
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
Well no, the main point though is an election is a choice, so you have to make the choice between the lesser of two evils. Everyone on the Republican side wanted to cut Pell Grants. Obama didn't want to but eventually did. So yes, the end result is the same and both cut them, but if they're a key issue for you why would you ever pick the GOP's side?
Clearly one side is the "greater evil" in this situation.
Here's a great example that you might relate to -- gay marriage. I am very much pro-gay marriage. If it came down to Obama and Romney, Obama would win on that issue. However, if it came to Paul and Obama, Paul would win. All three of those men think homosexuality is a sin, which is pretty fucked up IMO. However, Paul is in favor of full marriage equality, Obama is mostly in favor of full equality, and Romney is against it. So while I think all three of them are wrong in calling it a sin, there are clearly "lesser evils."
In the Pell Grant situation, Obama is clearly the lesser evil. You are completely justified in attacking Obama for allowing them to be cut, but you can't turn and support Ron Paul or any other Republican then.
You're aware of how these things work, right? Republicans add certain provisions to bills Obama wants or needs and refuse to vote on the bill unless Obama agrees to keep those provisions in. Guess who put the unlawful detention parts into the NDAA. Oh, wait, the GOP. And the military budget: when Obama announced his cuts last week, who immediately began to attack him as a dangerous president? Oh, that's right, the GOP.
It is absolutely relevant why a president allows certain bills and why bills end up the way they do, because there are two sides and any intelligent voter needs to understand which sides stand for what.
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
"Ugh! I can't believe politicians have to make compromises that disagree with my views! Anybody that does so certainly doesn't care about me and is a liar!"
Welcome to the real world. The best programs and legislation have come out of compromise, even if it did sacrifice the interests of some party. Nobody wins every battle.
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
All politicians, and I mean all, take decisions that go against what they have previously stated in one form or another. It's just how politics works, you don't get everything you want, unless you are a dictator. You are calling him a liar and then cherry picks decisions that supposedly proves this. Compare him to other presidents and you might have a case.
These vids are for the people who keep calling slandering him
Oh, so Ron Paul "only" published and profited off of racist newsletters.
cool
Yea he's rolling in the dough he made from them. Ron Paul such a horrible person for the one time he trusted other people to run his newsletter, what a bad person he is!
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
"Ugh! I can't believe politicians have to make compromises that disagree with my views! Anybody that does so certainly doesn't care about me and is a liar!"
Welcome to the real world. The best programs and legislation have come out of compromise, even if it did sacrifice the interests of some party.
Again, how much did this "Nobel Peace Prize winner" cut the military budget by?
"Current military spending is higher than at any time in our entire history. The Pentagon budget for 2010 was $693 billion—more than all other discretionary spending programs combined. That’s nearly half of all military spending on earth. Military spending has doubled over the past decade when adjusted for inflation. Under President Bush, military spending averaged 3.9 percent of Gross Domestic Product. It has increased to 4.9 percent—a full percentage point higher under President Obama."
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
This just shows how clueless you are about how politics work. You need to take a dose of reality and realize that politicians have to make compromises like this in order to get anything done at all.
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
The question that arises then is who are you going to vote for. Guys that will slash education without blink of an eye (Republicans in general and Ron Paul specifically) or someone who while a terrible disappointment tried not to cut the funding.
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
This just shows how clueless you are about how politics work. You need to take a dose of reality and realize that politicians have to make compromises like this in order to get anything done at all.
I'm not clueless about politics. It's all about the money, just like most everything else.
On January 16 2012 10:05 hmunkey wrote: You guys are aware Obama hasn't even started a donation drive yet, right? When Obama kicks his campaign off in a few months, he'll start soliciting individual donors in much larger numbers than Paul has so far if the last election was any indication. And that image is fairly biased since it doesn't show the individual citizens' total for either of the other two.
Oh, and that image isn't even accurate. Someone added their own fake donations in to make it look better for Paul.
First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
This just shows how clueless you are about how politics work. You need to take a dose of reality and realize that politicians have to make compromises like this in order to get anything done at all.
I'm not clueless about politics. It's all about the money, just like most everything else.
Elaborate? This doesn't really make any sense...
How is Obama making money off this? Even better, how are the Republicans (who absolutely wanted the cuts) profiting?
I really feel like you're a little clueless or misinformed.
What is even going on the past few pages it's like people are completely oblivious to the fact that Obama brought hundreds of thousands of troops home from Iraq.
On January 16 2012 10:11 gold_ wrote: [quote] First, DNC has been running donation drives for Obama. Second, is there proof that your claim of fake donations added is true? I find it hard to believe people are coming here defending Obama, what hope and change has he brought to you guys? 4.2 trillion in debt? I just read the DNC has raised a 220$ million "war chest" for Obama's re-election campaign, then the next article was Obama wants to raise the debt limit by 1.2 trillion.
If Obama cared more about his country than just being re-elected he would issue a huge press conference and donate at least half to to government to pay down the debt. What American would not love him for doing that? That would be a massively generous show of commitment, no?
You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
These tables list the top donors to these candidates in the 2012 election cycle. The organizations themselves did not donate , rather the money came from the organizations' PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals' immediate families. Organization totals include subsidiaries and affiliates
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
On January 16 2012 10:14 Zalithian wrote: I agree with gold here. Obama has been proven to be a liar with no hope or change, and I recently found out he cut summer pell grants already. Ridiculous. But off topic as this is the republican nominations thread.
You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
This just shows how clueless you are about how politics work. You need to take a dose of reality and realize that politicians have to make compromises like this in order to get anything done at all.
I'm not clueless about politics. It's all about the money, just like most everything else.
Elaborate? This doesn't really make any sense...
One word: Lobbying.
Theoretically it would work great, but in reality it ends up failing pretty poorly and benefiting those with the deepest pockets. See: SOPA. Specifically the SOPA hearings in the House Judiciary Committee.
I'm not specifically talking about Pell Grants here. This is an "in general" thing.
On January 16 2012 10:18 hmunkey wrote: [quote] You left out the part where I linked the actual table so you could see my proof. Come on bro, my post explicitly had it in there.
And all that aside, keep in mind these companies donate to the candidates they expect to win. No one wants to donate money to a losing candidate. If RP had the lead in polling and took first in Iowa/NH, he would have received quite a few corporate donations. He didn't though and no one really expects him to win, so they're holding off on their donations for now.
Also, what's with the donation thing? Are you just grasping for ways to attack Obama? Obviously he won't donate the money he raised for his campaign because people gave it to him for his campaign... If I give someone money to spend on their campaign, I expect them to use it on their campaign. If I wanted to donate to the government I'd do it myself.
Anyway, that poster was falsified propaganda meant to make Ron Paul look good in comparison but someone deliberately altered the actual tables to do so.
Sorry to ruin the circlejerk though.
[quote] You know he didn't want to cut the grants and was actually engaged in a bitter fight with the Republicans over the issue, right? The GOP wanted to cut them for months now in even more severe ways and the cut that went though last months was a compromise so the Republicans would agree to the spending deal. Facts man, they're nice.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
This just shows how clueless you are about how politics work. You need to take a dose of reality and realize that politicians have to make compromises like this in order to get anything done at all.
I'm not clueless about politics. It's all about the money, just like most everything else.
Elaborate? This doesn't really make any sense...
One word: Lobbying.
Theoretically it would work great, but in reality it ends up failing pretty poorly and benefiting those with the deepest pockets. See: SOPA. Specifically the SOPA hearings in the House Judiciary Committee.
What does that have to do with Pell Grants? Stop randomly changing the subject every time you post dude.
Edit to your edit: Well yeah, obviously lobbying affects a lot of things, but we were talking about Pell Grants? That wasn't motivated by lobbyists, it was purely ideological. The right didn't want the government to fund education and the left did.
It seems like you're attacking Obama for a variety of things that you should be attacking the Republicans for even more, but you're not doing that. It's like the things you have a problem with are only bad if Obama is involved.
Facts man. They are nice. Obama is a liar who hasn't lived up to his promises at all. I'm sure they could have cut other things besides education. Hey, I bet if Obama brought the troops home like he promised, they wouldn't have had to cut education funding! Fancy that.
?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
This just shows how clueless you are about how politics work. You need to take a dose of reality and realize that politicians have to make compromises like this in order to get anything done at all.
I'm not clueless about politics. It's all about the money, just like most everything else.
Elaborate? This doesn't really make any sense...
One word: Lobbying.
Theoretically it would work great, but in reality it ends up failing pretty poorly and benefiting those with the deepest pockets. See: SOPA. Specifically the SOPA hearings in the House Judiciary Committee.
What does that have to do with Pell Grants? Stop randomly changing the subject every time you post dude.
I'm saying money runs the government. It's not that hard to piece together, dude. I think Obama has been a complete flop as president. I've stated several reasons for this already. Obama didn't bring the troops home. He didn't cut the deficit. He didn't cut the defense budget, but he did cut education. Obviously a few people here disagree, and as I stated before it's off topic as this thread is about republicans, so I'll discontinue. But Obama did also say he would veto NDAA. Just sayin.
On January 16 2012 10:31 hmunkey wrote: [quote] ?? What are you talking about? I never claimed any of that was true nor did I say it was a fact.
I was just replying to you since you were attacking him for doing something every Republican candidate including (actually, especially) Ron Paul would've done. And to top it off, it was something he didn't even want to do but was forced into.
My point is the same. Obama is a liar. His hope and change have been a joke. Had he brought the troops home years ago, I'm pretty confident that the money saved would be more than enough to NOT cut educational funding.
You know he wants to and has always wanted to bring them home, right? It's like Obama is sitting in his office happy that the war is still going on.
Here's the thing though: Senate is controlled by the GOP, which does not the war to end. Additionally, his generals and advisers aren't so keen on ending the war either.
Even if Ron Paul won the presidency he would not be able to immediate bring all the troops home. There are some uncomfortable realities that presidents have to deal with regarding these things. This is why is best to not start a war in the first place, because ending it is extremely dangerous.
All I can say is I'm glad Iraq is over. That said, I do wish Obama had ended the Afghanistan War. The thing is, I know for a fact no Republican would end the war and Ron Paul's position on the war is pretty much the same as Obama's was, and I don't really think Ron Paul will somehow be able to change everyone's minds any more than Obama can.
But yes, Obama did not hold his word and do everything he said he would. It's a shame. But keep in mind no president has really done so, and I have absolutely no reason to believe anyone this time around is any different. I'm sorry, but RP is just as idealistic as Obama was (just with different ideals) and if he ever got the office, he'd be stuck in the same position with gridlock and advisers going against him.
And what did you mean when you said your point was the same? All I was replying to you for was to let you know that you had the facts wrong on the Pell Grants thing. Now I'm confused...
I don't have my facts wrong. Obama did indeed agree to cut Pell Grant funding, yes? It's not really relevant whether or not he claims he wanted to. He also "claimed" he didn't want to sign the NDAA, but he still did. Education should be a priority, and I expected that Obama would have found a way to avoid the cut. Answer me this. How much did Obama cut the Military Budget by during his term?
This just shows how clueless you are about how politics work. You need to take a dose of reality and realize that politicians have to make compromises like this in order to get anything done at all.
I'm not clueless about politics. It's all about the money, just like most everything else.
Elaborate? This doesn't really make any sense...
One word: Lobbying.
Theoretically it would work great, but in reality it ends up failing pretty poorly and benefiting those with the deepest pockets. See: SOPA. Specifically the SOPA hearings in the House Judiciary Committee.
What does that have to do with Pell Grants? Stop randomly changing the subject every time you post dude.
I'm saying money runs the government. It's not that hard to piece together, dude. I think Obama has been a complete flop as president. I've stated several reasons for this already. Obviously a few people here disagree, and as I stated before it's off topic as this thread is about republicans, so I'll discontinue. But Obama did also say he would veto NDAA. Just sayin.
Sorry! You edited your post and I didn't see it! Scroll up.
And yeah I'll agree that Obama has been somewhat of a flop. He hasn't done everything he said he would and he's done some things his voters would not have wanted him to do. That said, how could anyone side with the Republicans when it comes down to the two sides? All the things you've attacked Obama for are 10 times worse on the Republican side. Obama ended one war, but not both. The GOP didn't even want to end either war and accused Obama of being a coward when he did. The situation with Pell Grants, the NDAA, etc. are all similar. Obama should have vetoed the NDAA and I'm angry that he didn't. However, the provisions in question were put in by the Republicans and Obama tried to have them removed. Of course, as said previously, it's impossible to have everything you want unless you're a dictator.
I can completely understand being against Obama for what he's done, but the problem is the 2012 election is not Obama vs another Democrat, it's Obama vs a Republican.
On January 16 2012 11:36 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: Huntsman dropping out of race. Surprised about the Romney endorsement though.
It makes sense though. Romney is the most moderate of the remaining candidates and the one who aligns most to Huntsman's views. Honestly, it's Romney, Obama, then the rest of the candidates if we're ranking them in how closely they align to Hunstman.
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/wmpeN.png)
