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Please stop posting that he shouldn't have invited her into his bed since that's apparently not what happened... read the OP and links BEFORE commenting. | ||
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Traiel
Australia10 Posts
On July 06 2011 22:39 Detwiler wrote: Dude i dont know how old you are but im 26. 16 is a little girl to me and any other grown man. I'm 30.. but i'm not talking about little girl in terms of i'd want to sleep with her, i'm talking about the fact that shes not a 'little girl' like a 5 year old who couldn't work out that this was a bad idea. | ||
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HereticSaint
United States240 Posts
For starters, who tells a 16 year old to sleep in the same bed as a 43 year old because the room is a little cooler? What the hell? Who also does that without awaking the man to alert him to this fact, either the person who told the girl to sleep in his bed or the girl herself should have told him even if neither of them had any idea of his condition (If the girl was incredibly sick to the point she didn't have much cognitive awareness she is less at fault here, but if she were that sick you wouldn't throw her in bed with someone else that could have gotten sick as well) and furthermore if it was really just that the room was cooler and it was -THAT- important that she feels cooler then either they could have asked the man to sleep wherever the girl had initially planned on sleeping, gotten a couch/air mattress/padding so one of them could sleep on the floor. The girl is at fault here because there's no way she was so sick that she didn't have cognitive thought (Because no one would tell her to sleep with the man then, because he'd have the off-chance of getting really sick as well, unless that person is just a douchebag, so yeah there's the chance, but likely not) meaning that she was aware enough to realize what was going on, she could have slept on the floor, asked the man to sleep on the floor or in another room, slept in her initial room, woken the man and at least warned him, or asked whoever initially told her to sleep in the room to facilitate any of that. Instead, she didn't, she jumped in bed and went to sleep. I'm a little older than half that guys age and let me tell you, if I woke up and randomly found a 16 year old chick in my I would be filled with serious amounts of WTF. Nothing that was done was fair to the man in the least, he's had his name released to the World for an awful crime that came about due to a medical condition and the negligence of others, of course others want to entirely ignore that medical condition and just shun the man to the point of thinking he should be put in jail. "I would prefer a small, not big like 10 year prison sentences, but something instead of nothing" -- Hey idiot, I'm pretty sure 10 years is a long time, even if you are 90 right now, which I know you aren't that is still over 1/10th your life because you have an uncontrollable medical condition and due to other peoples negligence. The mere fact that he's gotten accused of this will surely follow him for the rest of his life and whoever had the girl over there and actually created the situation should feel terrible and should really be the one to blame here, again though I feel absolutely no sympathy for the girl whatsoever unless she was deathly ill to the point she wasn't really aware of what was going on in which case the person who told her to share the bed is even more at fault and should be charged criminally. Also, it's jokes that people think the man should warn people of his condition, at least in the way they've been suggesting. "Hey, if you let your 16 year old stay over here I may just randomly rape her, sorry, I can't control it!" I'm not saying nothing should be done, but depending on if the guy has actually slept walk before or not there should be measures put in place to prevent this from happening. If it's that he doesn't sleep walk at all he should place a lock on his door and lock it before he sleeps (If he wants air circulation use an indoor screen door), if he does sleep walk and has high levels of use of his body to the extent of potentially finding a key, unlocking the door and going into another room and raping/groping someone then he should install a door much like the other but with a time lock. Only issue accounting for that would be if he had to use the restroom and it isn't attached to his room, then just have something ready to use... This is only for when he'd have guests over too (Unless they were living there) and only if his situation was that bad. But really, the people who put any blame at all on the man disgust me. I hope you randomly do some shit you control in your sleep at some point and then get put in jail for the "not a long sentence" of 10 years (or more) and everyone laughed at you when you explain, "I couldn't control it, I was sleeping". | ||
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Ceril
Sweden1343 Posts
Anyhow. During the night I first kicked her alittle, she woke up and said something to me only to see I was asleep, the next moment my leg 'leaped up and dropped down with heel first force on her chest'. Only luck it was her chest, only luck she was awake and managed to get an arm or two inbetween. ...I was awakened by a crying girl and I had no idea what had just happened. And in more relation to this: friend and his gf were sleeping only a month or so relationship. During the night. she had woken up and he was already inside her, since she felt a wee bit on the mood she went full on and engaged in the act to return to sleep after. Now ehm, needless to say in the morning he had no clue, they joked alot about it. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On July 06 2011 22:26 EtohEtoh wrote: people have been found not guilty for killing other people in their sleep. Homicidal sleepwalking is quite rare but it does happen. And due to it's rarity not many people are sure what to do about it, some have been found guilty some not guilty. From what I know, the people found guilty of sleep murder generally tried to fake it, and that's why they didn't get away with it. Usually evidence that shows they researched into other cases of sleep killing recently before the act itself occurred. To all those who are saying he deserves something just for the act, you are forgetting a key fucking principle of law. Mens Rea. If you do NOT have the intent to commit a crime and can prove you didn't have the intent to do it, then you are not guilty of the crime. If you are unable to control yourself, or are not cognitively aware of what you are doing, then you can not be held liable for your actions, assuming you can prove said state never existed. I don't give a fuck if he raped some girl, if he didn't do it on purpose then he shouldn't be charged. I would even put that farther then this case and say statutory rape is a bullshit crime. I really don't like the idea of strict liability crimes. I feel like its a loophole that shouldn't be there. In this case I am happy rape isn't some sort of strict liability crime because this guy actually getting in trouble would be a load of shit. | ||
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Shamrock_
South Africa276 Posts
On July 06 2011 22:45 oursblanc wrote: Congratulations on the most terrifying post in a thread full of winners. Haha I'm sorry. Lemme clarify then, in my opinion, regardless of whether he was AWARE of it or not, the fact that he's capable of doing it makes him dangerous -- right? I also think it's a little weird that the girl didn't...I dunno, wake up, scream, kick, protest, something like that, but the point is, if someone blacks out and beats someone up he will still get arrested for assault but when it comes to sex it's not the same. | ||
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oursblanc
Canada1450 Posts
On July 06 2011 23:22 Shamrock_ wrote: Haha I'm sorry. Lemme clarify then, in my opinion, regardless of whether he was AWARE of it or not, the fact that he's capable of doing it makes him dangerous -- right? I also think it's a little weird that the girl didn't...I dunno, wake up, scream, kick, protest, something like that, but the point is, if someone blacks out and beats someone up he will still get arrested for assault but when it comes to sex it's not the same. Well, I have experienced sexsomnia several times and before now never considered it dangerous or a disease. There are several others in this thread saying the same, so it seems quite common. His acquittal is more to do with the technicalities of a rape charge without intent. He probably could have been convicted of various other assault charges if they had come about. | ||
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Existential
Australia2107 Posts
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On July 06 2011 23:22 Shamrock_ wrote: Haha I'm sorry. Lemme clarify then, in my opinion, regardless of whether he was AWARE of it or not, the fact that he's capable of doing it makes him dangerous -- right? I also think it's a little weird that the girl didn't...I dunno, wake up, scream, kick, protest, something like that, but the point is, if someone blacks out and beats someone up he will still get arrested for assault but when it comes to sex it's not the same. Your clarification makes you look even worse. Being aware of what you are doing completely matters in a criminal case. Furthermore, blacking out and sleeping are not the same. If you use drugs/alcohol and those cause you to black out and do something stupid, you are responsible unless you can prove you didn't willingly drink/use drugs that caused you to do it. The guy suffers from a disorder, one that is not generally dangerous barring certain scenarios that can be avoided. It wasn't his fault the girl came into his bed, and its not like putting him in some sort of clinic would make a difference, he doesn't have a mind that makes him dangerous so there is nothing to treat. Not much more can be said except your opinion is completely wrong and to treat this guy like hes a murder or a serial rapist is completely unfair. | ||
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chaopow
United States556 Posts
And what exactly is this "was told to share his bed because his room was cooler". Who told her to share the bed then? Was it the man or is there another person in this house? And, again the question of why didn't the man do anything about it applies here. In his defense he claims he has a disease where he basically has sleep sex and does not remember it. It has happened to him in the past so I'm sure he is aware of it after his partners told him. Why would he let the girl sleep in the same bed as him? I'm sure any 43 year old with or without any diseases would not even risk the chance of being accused of something they didnt even do, but in this case, a rape actually did occur. Just being in the bed could lead to trouble/accusations. If he knew about this, he should have switched rooms or went to a different bed than the girl. I feel like they missed putting a couple really important details on the news. | ||
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oursblanc
Canada1450 Posts
On July 06 2011 23:47 chaopow wrote: Why would the girl stay at his house in the first place? If the man knew he had this disease, he would probably try to get rid of any possibility of something like this to happen. The girl wouldn't have any idea about the disease but the man should really have done something. And what exactly is this "was told to share his bed because his room was cooler". Who told her to share the bed then? Was it the man or is there another person in this house? And, again the question of why didn't the man do anything about it applies here. In his defense he claims he has a disease where he basically has sleep sex and does not remember it. It has happened to him in the past so I'm sure he is aware of it after his partners told him. Why would he let the girl sleep in the same bed as him? I'm sure any 43 year old with or without any diseases would not even risk the chance of being accused of something they didnt even do, but in this case, a rape actually did occur. Just being in the bed could lead to trouble/accusations. If he knew about this, he should have switched rooms or went to a different bed than the girl. I feel like they missed putting a couple really important details on the news. You didn't even read all of the available details. He did not know she was in the bed. He was asleep when she got in. | ||
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chaopow
United States556 Posts
On July 06 2011 23:50 oursblanc wrote: You didn't even read all of the available details. He did not know she was in the bed. He was asleep when she got in. Then who told her to sleep in his bed becauase it was cooler? Also, why was the girl there in the first place, and my first point still stands here. | ||
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Simberto
Germany11424 Posts
On July 06 2011 23:54 chaopow wrote: Then who told her to sleep in his bed becauase it was cooler? Also, why was the girl there in the first place, and my first point still stands here. That is the big question everybody has, and noone has an answer for. Which you would no if you had read any of the 20 pages of this thread, because it comes up at least once per page. | ||
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oursblanc
Canada1450 Posts
On July 06 2011 23:54 chaopow wrote:Then who told her to sleep in his bed becauase it was cooler? Also, why was the girl there in the first place, and my first point still stands here. That information doesn't appear to be known. I don't see why he should have to do anything more than go to sleep alone, which he did. | ||
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_-NoMaN-_
Canada250 Posts
On July 05 2011 23:00 qrs wrote: Everything else aside, the whole idea of telling a 16-year-old girl to go "share the bed" of a 43-year-old man because his room is cooler is incredibly inappropriate, sexsomniac or not. (I can't believe I'm the first one to say this.) ya, rly, how the fuck is that ok? | ||
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SolHeiM
Sweden1264 Posts
The only reason you think it's inappropriate is because when you "share a bed" you snuggle and cuddle as opposed to sleep on complete opposite sides a large bed where there is no possibility of contact. There is nothing sexual about sharing a bed and sleeping on opposite sides with someone. | ||
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ninini
Sweden1204 Posts
On July 06 2011 00:37 KwarK wrote: We're not talking about lying flat unconscious sleep. You can be in a state of sleep with your eyes open and your muscles working. I am a terrible liar when asleep, I can be woken, hold long conversations about how I'll get up in just a minute, make promises, agree to things to do later that day, argue etc and have zero recollection of it later. You just get used to it and tell people to ignore you when you're in that state and leave a note for when you wake if they need you to do something. This happens to everybody. You wake up by your alarm clock and turn it off in an instant, then you fall asleep again, because you were woken up at a bad time. It feels instinctual, but it's not. It's just that you haven't truly woken up, so your memory doesn't register that you turned it off. I have noticed that when I tell myself before I go to sleep that I have to get up when the alarm rings, I always do. I only oversleep when I don't care or when I'm not convinced that I have to go up at the exact time that the clock is ringing. So, as you can see, I make a conscious choice of going up or not going up, even if I may not be fully remember ever making a choice. The human brain is like a computer, and you could say that the Hard Disk drive is the last thing that gets activated. This means that if you can "shut off" the disruptive sound before you fully activate your brain, you can fall asleep fast enough that you won't even register it, and thus it never happened according to your memory. It's the same if you're talking to someone in your sleep. So all of this is situational and depends on where in the sleep cycle you are, and if you're a heavy sleeper it's obviously worse. If you wake up during the latter parts, you can regain your conscience in pretty much an instant, while it can take a longer time if you're waking up during the peak of your sleep cycle. Even if he wasn't completely aware, i.e he didn't fake being half-asleep, you could still question his morals. I think it's complete BS that one wouldn't be able to control oneself and make a decision in this situation. Just because you don't remember making a decision, doesn't mean you didn't make the decision. Any person is responsible for their actions. It doesn't matter if you're drunk, asleep or whatever. Also, about the girl not waking him up? I don't know about you, but if I was a girl, and woke up in that situation, I would definately make it a first priority to get out of the bed and then walk or take the first bus home. I don't think I would even consider the fact that he could have been asleep, so why would I try to wake him up? Under these situations he shouldn't get a full penalty, but only because of the fact that someone else put her in his bed without him knowing it. This fact changes everything drastically, because he didn't put himself in a situation where he could be tempted. It was she who did it. If a hot girl laid down in my bed when I was already sleeping, and I voke up, I would definately feel tempted to have sex with her. I would also consider that she chose my bed as a way to hit on me. That's why you don't sleep in the same bed as people of different genders, (unless you're partners), because you don't want to tempt yourself into doing something stupid. If he had known from the get-go that she would sleep in his bed, he wouldn't have been cleared. | ||
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BlazingGlory
Bulgaria854 Posts
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Slaynte
United States155 Posts
"The court heard how the 16-year-old stayed in Mr Davies' bed after falling ill, while Mr Davies - who did not know of the teen's presence - slept elsewhere in the house." Source: http://www.metro.co.uk/news/868366-sexsomniac-cleared-of-rape-because-he-slept-through-intercourse | ||
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THE_DOMINATOR
United States309 Posts
On July 07 2011 02:34 BlazingGlory wrote: This is stupid. My brother is a sleepwalker. And although he is quite stronger than me, I can stop him wandering around without breaking a sweat. She should have been able to escape. Yea what a weakling! | ||
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Akta
447 Posts
For example where I live it's rape to have sex with a sleeping person which could change this case a lot. Another angle could be what if it was "only" oral sex(which as far as I know is also rape where I live) and the roles were the opposite, as in a guy waking up by a sexsomniac girl performing oral sex on him. I know what I think personally, especially since my brother in law have such serious "sleep walking" problems that it almost killed him(injured for life). But those that think the society should punish this guy, would it matter if it for example was the girl that had sexsomnia instead? | ||
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