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Drug Cost A Likely Death Sentence - Page 7

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bonifaceviii
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada2890 Posts
June 22 2011 14:25 GMT
#121
I don't really have any advice, dude, that sucks as a situation.

The government isn't going to cave on this, because that would open the floodgates. Remember that really hideously expensive autism treatment that BC parents took their health plan to court over? They didn't get it.

Sorry mate.
Stay a while and listen || http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=354018
Trentelshark
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada385 Posts
June 22 2011 14:25 GMT
#122
On June 22 2011 11:31 Voltaire wrote:
I thought Canada had universal healthcare? Or is this friend in the US?

We do, but what most from outside Canada don't realise is the system makes the yes/no decision to treatment, particularly experimental or in this case absurdly expensive to the point the manufacturer should be ashamed. It isn't a free-for-call get whatever you want and changes need to be made for it to continue to hold up financially.

BlackJack
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
United States10574 Posts
June 22 2011 14:29 GMT
#123
On June 22 2011 11:48 Fruscainte wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 11:40 T.O.P. wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:35 Kamais_Ookin wrote:
What's the point of a cure if pretty much 99% of the people can't afford it? I understand profits and stuff but come on now...

If that guy was an American and he bought insurance the insurance would cover it. The problem is that the Canadian government won't cover it.



All of it?

Don't fool yourself.

Especially since this is considered a "pre-existing condition", they would at the most pay for maybe half of it. No insurance company (AKA a business) would spit out 500k a year for some guy spending less than a fraction of that in his payments. Even here in America with perfect insurance he would be paying a shit ton out of pocket.

That sucks though OP.


Sorry but this is a load of BS.

Spitting out huge sums of money to people that pay a fraction of it in premiums is exactly what insurance companies do. That's like the "definition" of insurance.

For example, my brother has an illness that requires him to get treatment multiple times a year. Each treatment costs $15,000-$20,000. My parent's pay a 1 time $300 deductible per year and after that it's entirely free. Maybe $300/year is a "shit ton" out of pocket to you but I think that's a pretty good price.
Aldehyde
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Sweden939 Posts
June 22 2011 14:51 GMT
#124
On June 22 2011 12:03 Wombatsavior wrote:
This reminds me of Dr. Burzynksi incident thats been on going for a good 20-30 years now or so. It's about the FDA's war against his different cure for cancer that does work. They try to throw him in prison while at the sametime approving him for clinical trials, but now there's a long full length documentary showing his side of the story. They were showing the full length up to June 20th.
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
The first 30 minutes is only about the medicine itself, the other hour and a half is about the national cancer institute, medical board of texas, FDA, and finally Phrma, trying to stop him every way possible.

+ Show Spoiler +

http://www.burzynskimovie.com/ <-- If it has you interested


Man... That's sad.
Eufouria
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United Kingdom4425 Posts
June 22 2011 14:53 GMT
#125
On June 22 2011 23:29 BlackJack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 11:48 Fruscainte wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:40 T.O.P. wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:35 Kamais_Ookin wrote:
What's the point of a cure if pretty much 99% of the people can't afford it? I understand profits and stuff but come on now...

If that guy was an American and he bought insurance the insurance would cover it. The problem is that the Canadian government won't cover it.



All of it?

Don't fool yourself.

Especially since this is considered a "pre-existing condition", they would at the most pay for maybe half of it. No insurance company (AKA a business) would spit out 500k a year for some guy spending less than a fraction of that in his payments. Even here in America with perfect insurance he would be paying a shit ton out of pocket.

That sucks though OP.


Sorry but this is a load of BS.

Spitting out huge sums of money to people that pay a fraction of it in premiums is exactly what insurance companies do. That's like the "definition" of insurance.

For example, my brother has an illness that requires him to get treatment multiple times a year. Each treatment costs $15,000-$20,000. My parent's pay a 1 time $300 deductible per year and after that it's entirely free. Maybe $300/year is a "shit ton" out of pocket to you but I think that's a pretty good price.

The insurance companies aren't going to insure someone for $300 per year if they know that they will be paying $500,000 per year for their treatment, which would be the case here since its pre-existing condition. They don't want to help you, they want to make money. When they sell insurance they want you to pay for it, and then never need it. Effectively they are gambling on you staying healthy, which would be better than a company hoping you get sick like the drug companies, except when you do get sick, they are going to try and worm their way out of paying, which would probably happen here even if it wasn't pre-existing.
TanGeng
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sanya12364 Posts
June 22 2011 15:02 GMT
#126
The "slip through the cracks" bit is systemic. The universal health care system refuses coverage for nearly all expensive treatment options and certainly won't invent a treatment that doesn't exist.

The death sentence is the disease not the cost of the treatment. The expensive drug treatment at least offers some hope for those with plenty of money. The drug companies are clearly targeting the extremely wealthy in the niche market as they recoup their research and clinical trial investments.

Per the online article, the treatment wasn't even available on the market two years ago and the disease was considered terminal. One option is to pretend that the expensive treatment never existed and go on thinking of the disease as terminal. The other option is to raise the money.
Moderator我们是个踏实的赞助商模式俱乐部
JouriCarver
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom59 Posts
June 22 2011 15:02 GMT
#127
just read in a post that some1 had to robb a bank to get healthcare, what is this world comming to?
ThreeAcross
Profile Joined January 2011
172 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-22 15:11:12
June 22 2011 15:07 GMT
#128
On June 22 2011 23:53 Eufouria wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 23:29 BlackJack wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:48 Fruscainte wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:40 T.O.P. wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:35 Kamais_Ookin wrote:
What's the point of a cure if pretty much 99% of the people can't afford it? I understand profits and stuff but come on now...

If that guy was an American and he bought insurance the insurance would cover it. The problem is that the Canadian government won't cover it.



All of it?

Don't fool yourself.

Especially since this is considered a "pre-existing condition", they would at the most pay for maybe half of it. No insurance company (AKA a business) would spit out 500k a year for some guy spending less than a fraction of that in his payments. Even here in America with perfect insurance he would be paying a shit ton out of pocket.

That sucks though OP.


Sorry but this is a load of BS.

Spitting out huge sums of money to people that pay a fraction of it in premiums is exactly what insurance companies do. That's like the "definition" of insurance.

For example, my brother has an illness that requires him to get treatment multiple times a year. Each treatment costs $15,000-$20,000. My parent's pay a 1 time $300 deductible per year and after that it's entirely free. Maybe $300/year is a "shit ton" out of pocket to you but I think that's a pretty good price.

The insurance companies aren't going to insure someone for $300 per year if they know that they will be paying $500,000 per year for their treatment, which would be the case here since its pre-existing condition. They don't want to help you, they want to make money. When they sell insurance they want you to pay for it, and then never need it. Effectively they are gambling on you staying healthy, which would be better than a company hoping you get sick like the drug companies, except when you do get sick, they are going to try and worm their way out of paying, which would probably happen here even if it wasn't pre-existing.


His parents aren't only paying $300 a year. That is just the deductible. They will pay a monthly charge (bi-weekly, monthly, whatever) as well.
It really depends on when you got your insurance to when you become ill. Being on an employer plan, I pay my fees directly from my checks then my deductible (if needed) and the rest is covered up to $1 million. If I had the condition and then tried to get insurance, through an individual plan, it is a different story.

Home and car insurers take the same gamble as health insurers. They have you pay a fee for protection and hope that nothing happens.
ThreeAcross
Profile Joined January 2011
172 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-22 15:10:25
June 22 2011 15:09 GMT
#129
Edit: Somehow it was double posted.
Mottz
Profile Joined September 2010
Portugal101 Posts
June 22 2011 15:21 GMT
#130
He should make his story public, like world wide, get connection with some tv stations and spread the word.

In order to make some pressure on the pharmacuticals(probly misstyped)
samaNo4
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Spain245 Posts
June 22 2011 15:28 GMT
#131
On June 23 2011 00:21 Mottz wrote:
He should make his story public, like world wide, get connection with some tv stations and spread the word.

In order to make some pressure on the pharmacuticals(probly misstyped)


This, not to make pressure on pharmaceuticals, it won't work. But goverments always like to show a good image and thus somebody could pay it for him. I think it's his best option. Show himself on TV and hope an angel falls from heaven.

I don't blame companies though, developing a drug costs bilions of dollars and they ahve to make profit from somewhere.
And then do you know what happens all of a sudden? Trumpets!!
Sablar
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Sweden880 Posts
June 22 2011 15:35 GMT
#132
On June 22 2011 23:51 Aldehyde wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 12:03 Wombatsavior wrote:
This reminds me of Dr. Burzynksi incident thats been on going for a good 20-30 years now or so. It's about the FDA's war against his different cure for cancer that does work. They try to throw him in prison while at the sametime approving him for clinical trials, but now there's a long full length documentary showing his side of the story. They were showing the full length up to June 20th.
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
The first 30 minutes is only about the medicine itself, the other hour and a half is about the national cancer institute, medical board of texas, FDA, and finally Phrma, trying to stop him every way possible.

+ Show Spoiler +

http://www.burzynskimovie.com/ <-- If it has you interested


Man... That's sad.


I agree. I'm sure there are plenty of worthless miracle drugs and treatments out there that can be bought much cheaper from non-certified or persons that spend less money on hour-long advertisements.
Levistus
Profile Joined December 2009
1134 Posts
June 22 2011 15:58 GMT
#133
msg huk. he'll take care of it.

seriously though, that's really sad. i wonder how many cures are there for the deadly diseases that are kept secret.

i hope your friend gets cured asap!
hey man just curious
Chargelot
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
2275 Posts
June 22 2011 16:08 GMT
#134
On June 22 2011 11:35 Kamais_Ookin wrote:
What's the point of a cure if pretty much 99% of the people can't afford it? I understand profits and stuff but come on now...


The scientists who develop the cures aren't in it for the money. 99% of the time it's a government job, where they are paid a fixed rate in line with other government employees of similar rank. In the US most cures are found by the NIH, 27 federal health organizations, where the highest paid researchers earn about 100K a year, despite being the people most likely to cure cancer, and other big named diseases.

Pharmaceutical companies, AKA the Devil to most doctors and scientists, are the ones who make the cost of living so damned expensive.
if (post == "stupid") { document.getElementById('post').style.display = 'none'; }
Warillions
Profile Joined November 2010
United States215 Posts
June 22 2011 16:09 GMT
#135
Tell him to marry military and have the government pay for it
Roeder
Profile Joined July 2010
Denmark735 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-22 16:11:39
June 22 2011 16:10 GMT
#136
On June 22 2011 12:15 Medrea wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 12:14 Arnstein wrote:
Move to Norway. You actually aren't allowed to pay more than 300 dollars each year for any kind of treatment, after the first 300 dollars it's free.


Who pays for it then?

Tax-money.
It's the same in Denmark.

But yeah, TL;DR to read every single post, but isn't there some where (il)legal or not?
It's a life, for Christ sake.

Also; Facebook, twitter, anything. I'd gladly throw along a message on facebook for people to join it - the bigger the facebook group is (as long as it's actually something worth supporting), the more publicity it gets.
Starcraft is a mix between chess, poker and a Michael Bay movie.
Selkie
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States530 Posts
June 22 2011 16:22 GMT
#137
Yes, but look at it this way- if a drug is so expensive noone can afford it, then they can make none of their money back.

Supply and demand curves. These companies need to hire an economist =D
BlackJack
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
United States10574 Posts
June 22 2011 16:35 GMT
#138
On June 22 2011 23:53 Eufouria wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 23:29 BlackJack wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:48 Fruscainte wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:40 T.O.P. wrote:
On June 22 2011 11:35 Kamais_Ookin wrote:
What's the point of a cure if pretty much 99% of the people can't afford it? I understand profits and stuff but come on now...

If that guy was an American and he bought insurance the insurance would cover it. The problem is that the Canadian government won't cover it.



All of it?

Don't fool yourself.

Especially since this is considered a "pre-existing condition", they would at the most pay for maybe half of it. No insurance company (AKA a business) would spit out 500k a year for some guy spending less than a fraction of that in his payments. Even here in America with perfect insurance he would be paying a shit ton out of pocket.

That sucks though OP.


Sorry but this is a load of BS.

Spitting out huge sums of money to people that pay a fraction of it in premiums is exactly what insurance companies do. That's like the "definition" of insurance.

For example, my brother has an illness that requires him to get treatment multiple times a year. Each treatment costs $15,000-$20,000. My parent's pay a 1 time $300 deductible per year and after that it's entirely free. Maybe $300/year is a "shit ton" out of pocket to you but I think that's a pretty good price.

The insurance companies aren't going to insure someone for $300 per year if they know that they will be paying $500,000 per year for their treatment, which would be the case here since its pre-existing condition. They don't want to help you, they want to make money. When they sell insurance they want you to pay for it, and then never need it. Effectively they are gambling on you staying healthy, which would be better than a company hoping you get sick like the drug companies, except when you do get sick, they are going to try and worm their way out of paying, which would probably happen here even if it wasn't pre-existing.


Well of course he can't just come to the states and buy insurance and have it covered. He couldn't do that in any country. But if he were born in the states we would have no idea what his situation would be and whether his insurance would cover it or if he we would even have insurance. But saying perfect insurance would at most pay for half of the treatment is patently false. In fact one source I read said that some Canadians are able to get the treatment and that is because they had private insurance.
bonifaceviii
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada2890 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-22 16:42:15
June 22 2011 16:42 GMT
#139
On June 23 2011 01:35 BlackJack wrote:
But saying perfect insurance would at most pay for half of the treatment is patently false. In fact one source I read said that some Canadians are able to get the treatment and that is because they had private insurance.

Bingo. Canadians generally have to pay for their prescription drugs, as it's most often not in their provincial health insurance (there are exceptions, hence the wishy-washy language).

It's not like Canadians don't pay for private medical insurance, we do. It's just that the private insurance covers supplementals like (most) prescription drugs, eyeglasses and dental.
Stay a while and listen || http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=354018
Antares777
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1971 Posts
June 22 2011 16:54 GMT
#140
$500,000 a year is absurd. It's so depressing to hear about your friend, and I hope he can somehow find a way to pay for the drug, but I think it would be more plausible for the government to just lower the cost of the drug.
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