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On April 28 2011 21:44 MagmaRam wrote:
And so you have no problem with abortions a very short time before birth (as in less than one week), because they're not a person, right? It doesn't matter because they haven't been born yet, right?
I would personally be fine with that if it wouldn't have any serious health consequences for the mother.
Birth signifies the key difference between being a part of mother's own body and being an autonomous, living human being. A mother can do anything she wants with her body that would make her feel better or easier. You can't force a person to accept pain and burden of pregnancy or responsibility for a child (once it is actually born) that they don't want.
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On April 28 2011 21:03 -Archangel- wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 20:42 Ghostcom wrote:On April 28 2011 20:04 -Archangel- wrote:
12 week fetus is already a really small baby, 20 weeks is pure murder. Statements like these are so detrimental to any worthwhile debate >_> In the end it all comes down to how you define life - is it when sperm meets egg? is it self-sustainability? is it awareness - and what degree of awareness? And 20 weeks seems like an odd time, but if I'm to guess it's because the earliest a baby can survive being born is 15 weeks premature, thus at 20 weeks it still can't survive AND by giving time until week 20 you can actually test for Downs syndrome which is done @ week 16. As a father I felt the need to say this because it is the truth. Even in europe the 3 month limit of being able to preform an abortion is probably too high, but 20 weeks that, I will say it again, is murder. I know how my little girl looked at 20 weeks and nobody can tell me she is not a person or alive. No law can tell me that. Laws are artificial constructions of men, this is nature that is above any human law.
It's not the truth - it's your perception which isn't based on anything objective, but "merely" your feelings as a dad. The only reason WHY you even knew how your daughter looked at week 20 in the first place was because you were getting an ultrasound to test wheter or not there were any developmental defects which would make life impossible meaning your wife would've had to abort or give birth to a dead baby. You are being a total hypocrit so take your "I'm telling the truth" BS and shut up or bring some valid arguments. I know I'm VERY blunt, but you do not hold any moral highground in this, stop trying to make it seem like that. And congratulations with your daughter, kids can really be a blessing, but don't try and make your subjective feelings a universal standard.
Exactly where the limit should be placed is very hard to decide and tbh I don't think there is any 100% correct answer. I DO however support the option of being able to abort a child with trisomy 21 and thus I also support abortion @ week 16-20 as that is the earliest you can with certainty say wheter or not the mutation is present without an unacceptable risk to the mother or fetus.
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On April 28 2011 21:48 SpiffD wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 21:39 MagmaRam wrote:On April 28 2011 21:29 SpiffD wrote:On April 28 2011 21:20 eLiE wrote:On April 28 2011 21:07 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:03 -Archangel- wrote:On April 28 2011 20:42 Ghostcom wrote:On April 28 2011 20:04 -Archangel- wrote:
12 week fetus is already a really small baby, 20 weeks is pure murder. Statements like these are so detrimental to any worthwhile debate >_> In the end it all comes down to how you define life - is it when sperm meets egg? is it self-sustainability? is it awareness - and what degree of awareness? And 20 weeks seems like an odd time, but if I'm to guess it's because the earliest a baby can survive being born is 15 weeks premature, thus at 20 weeks it still can't survive AND by giving time until week 20 you can actually test for Downs syndrome which is done @ week 16. As a father I felt the need to say this because it is the truth. Even in europe the 3 month limit of being able to preform an abortion is probably too high, but 20 weeks that, I will say it again, is murder. I know how my little girl looked at 20 weeks and nobody can tell me she is not a person or alive. No law can tell me that. Laws are artificial constructions of men, this is nature that is above any human law. It wasn't sentient, it wasn't a person in any definition of the word. Your embarassing anecdote about your precious little angel is an artifical construction to women's rights  . God, you're so condescending. Have some decency describing the man's pride and joy. Who gives a fuck about a definition, I can guarantee the word, "life", has a million difference meanings for every single person in the world. It's this sweeping trend of rationality that seems to be trying to destroy any sense of morality. The current world view is just making a bunch of ass holes who see only in black and white, disregarding the emotional impact of their actions. Know what? Make every single woman see the baby they are killing. They want to be rational? Doctors are supposed to outline the costs and benefits of every single procedure they offer the patient. Know how you can show them the emotional impact of an abortion? Show them what they are removing from the body. If the baby is nothing, then the woman should have no problem going through with the abortion. Low blow? There is no low blow because you don't consider it a life anyway. And if you want to get really technical on the rationality of abortion, go all black and white, you can argue that one of the only purposes, if not the sole purpose of being alive on this pointless, rational world, is to reproduce and keep the human race moving into the future. So in killing a potential life, you are acting against the meaning of life. Well she's not killing a baby, she's killing some cells which does not add up to a person. Stop with the rhetoric. At what point do those cells add up to a person? Birth? Then is a baby 1 day from birth not a person, despite not being significantly different from the baby born the next day. A baby isn't fully developed, they have about two decades to go until then. At the end of growth? Then you should have no problem killing anyone under the age of 18. In fact, what makes anyone specifically a person? If the cells don't add up to a person until birth, then are babies born with defects not a person, because the cells don't add up the same way everyone else's do? Hell, what makes me a person? I just considered some pretty sick stuff, I think most would agree that it's not normal to do that. Wow, i love this kind of argument. Let me see if i understand how this works: You take what the other person wrote wrote, add a lot of stuff they never mentioned and then tell them what the consequences will be of what they (never) wrote. Nice. In all seriousness in modern societies we use ethics to determine this. The limit for abortions in many countries is set before the fetus is believed to become a person. To determine this we use this thing called science.
According to you, the cells "[do] not add up to a person." So when do they add up to a person? How do you define person? I define it as a living human being, human meaning any living thing of the species Homo Sapiens, as determined by their state when fully developed. This would make (according to my definition) a fetus human. I don't know if your definition is different, tell me if it is. I just want to know what makes birth the point where they can be considered a person. Independence? A baby still needs to be provided for, which is in most cases for mammals (which humans are) by breastfeeding. It's still depending on its mother, or at least somebody to provide for it. That doesn't seem like independence to me.
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On April 28 2011 21:54 SacredSoul wrote:
The only time it should be acceptable to abort a child is if it was conceived after a rape, and only if it still can't feel pain.
Im pretty damn pissed that so many people are for the killing of babies that were conceived during a fun night out, or after being drunk and making a night of poor decisions, I AM ONE OF THOSE BABIES! If my parents were as anti-life as you I wouldn't be alive! I think Im making the best of it too as I am going to college at 17, having fun with friends, and playing SC2...
Some of you on this forum are heartless and if everyone were like you I bet a good couple of million of GOOD, HARDWORKING, people would be dead and never would have had an effect on your life.
Those that have aborted because you didn't think you might have had the means to raise a kid, shame on you. My mom ended up having 4 kids on a 15k salary and I LOVE life. If you fuck up one night live with the consequences, don't murder some kid that could have made your life brighter. Honestly the way I see it aborting mothers should think about how their kid will be at 17-18 and then try and kill them.
My rant is over, but why do so many people want kids like me dead?
lol, I want you alive. And I agree about the rape thing, although I'll admit, there was a movie (in religion class, yes, now we must discount the story >_<) I saw about a woman who was conceived through rape, and the mother carried her to birth and gave her up for an adoption. That woman went on to advocate for protecting the lives of the fetuses in those situations. Both the mother and the child were pretty outstanding people in my opinion.
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On April 28 2011 21:54 SacredSoul wrote:
The only time it should be acceptable to abort a child is if it was conceived after a rape, and only if it still can't feel pain.
Im pretty damn pissed that so many people are for the killing of babies that were conceived during a fun night out, or after being drunk and making a night of poor decisions, I AM ONE OF THOSE BABIES! If my parents were as anti-life as you I wouldn't be alive! I think Im making the best of it too as I am going to college at 17, having fun with friends, and playing SC2...
Some of you on this forum are heartless and if everyone were like you I bet a good couple of million of GOOD, HARDWORKING, people would be dead and never would have had an effect on your life.
Those that have aborted because you didn't think you might have had the means to raise a kid, shame on you. My mom ended up having 4 kids on a 15k salary and I LOVE life. If you fuck up one night live with the consequences, don't murder some kid that could have made your life brighter. Honestly the way I see it aborting mothers should think about how their kid will be at 17-18 and then try and kill them.
My rant is over, but why do so many people want kids like me dead?
stop, really. just stop. no one wants you to be dead, no one wants to kill babies.
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On April 28 2011 22:00 turdburgler wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 21:54 SacredSoul wrote:
The only time it should be acceptable to abort a child is if it was conceived after a rape, and only if it still can't feel pain.
Im pretty damn pissed that so many people are for the killing of babies that were conceived during a fun night out, or after being drunk and making a night of poor decisions, I AM ONE OF THOSE BABIES! If my parents were as anti-life as you I wouldn't be alive! I think Im making the best of it too as I am going to college at 17, having fun with friends, and playing SC2...
Some of you on this forum are heartless and if everyone were like you I bet a good couple of million of GOOD, HARDWORKING, people would be dead and never would have had an effect on your life.
Those that have aborted because you didn't think you might have had the means to raise a kid, shame on you. My mom ended up having 4 kids on a 15k salary and I LOVE life. If you fuck up one night live with the consequences, don't murder some kid that could have made your life brighter. Honestly the way I see it aborting mothers should think about how their kid will be at 17-18 and then try and kill them.
My rant is over, but why do so many people want kids like me dead? stop, really. just stop. no one wants you to be dead, no one wants to kill babies.
It's a very popular 'argument' in the States that you want to kill babies, and/or them. It never sounds any less stupid, trust me.
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If only these people cared about taking care of all the children that are born instead of just the fetus stage.
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On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do.
My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming.
The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later.
As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain.
Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass?
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On April 28 2011 22:01 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 22:00 turdburgler wrote:On April 28 2011 21:54 SacredSoul wrote:
The only time it should be acceptable to abort a child is if it was conceived after a rape, and only if it still can't feel pain.
Im pretty damn pissed that so many people are for the killing of babies that were conceived during a fun night out, or after being drunk and making a night of poor decisions, I AM ONE OF THOSE BABIES! If my parents were as anti-life as you I wouldn't be alive! I think Im making the best of it too as I am going to college at 17, having fun with friends, and playing SC2...
Some of you on this forum are heartless and if everyone were like you I bet a good couple of million of GOOD, HARDWORKING, people would be dead and never would have had an effect on your life.
Those that have aborted because you didn't think you might have had the means to raise a kid, shame on you. My mom ended up having 4 kids on a 15k salary and I LOVE life. If you fuck up one night live with the consequences, don't murder some kid that could have made your life brighter. Honestly the way I see it aborting mothers should think about how their kid will be at 17-18 and then try and kill them.
My rant is over, but why do so many people want kids like me dead? stop, really. just stop. no one wants you to be dead, no one wants to kill babies. It's a very popular 'argument' in the States that you want to kill babies, and/or them. It never sounds any less stupid, trust me.
I was going to comment on it, but thanks for doing it for me - is that REALLY what you have to discuss against in the states?
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On April 28 2011 22:03 Adila wrote:
If only these people cared about taking care of all the children that are born instead of just the fetus stage.
Wonder how many of them are foster parents, or volunteer at orphanages?
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On April 28 2011 21:53 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 21:49 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:15 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:10 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 20:58 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 20:56 vetinari wrote:
If women have the sole right to choose, should she not have the sole burden of responsibility?
Note how on all of these imagined and highly biased 'well if i wuz in this position' provided, the woman always runs off with the child . Thanks for responding to the question, mate. ... Really. At this point, I'm pretty convinced that you are a troll.  Do you think I'm trolling because I don't show your opinions respect or something? They don't deserve it, the question you asked is irrelevent to the discussion of abortion, unless you're making the point that if a woman has the sole right to abortion, then she should raise the child on her own as well? That if born, and the father leaves her, he wouldn't have to pay child support by this logic right? I imagine this is the crux of what you're trying to get across, and it's reprehensible . Yes. By not showing respect to other people, you debase yourself and the position for which you stand. By denigrating all who disagree with you, no matter how slight to point of contention, you prove yourself to be an person who has no place in civil society. You will note, if you bothered to read, instead of skimming the thread and quote mining, that I am firmly in the pro-choice camp. Now, you seem to be of the opinion, that a woman has all of the right to choose, and need bear none of the fiscal responsibility. I, however, am of the opinion, that should a child be born out of wedlock, a man need not bear ANY of the fiscal responsibility. This would have the three fold benefit of: women would be discouraged from having children outside of marriage (a net public good, as single parents unfortunately do not do well at raising children, statistically speaking*). men would have financial security, not needing to worry about failed contraception making him a wage slave. Children are much more likely to be born into families where they are wanted, as marriage would only occur if both parties wanted children at some point. *children raised by single parents are on average less educated, earn lower incomes later in life and more criminal. Ironically enough, children raised by single mothers do far more poorly on each of these metrics than those raised by single fathers. "Now, you seem to be of the opinion, that a woman has all of the right to choose, and need bear none of the fiscal responsibility. " Never said this, not even hinted at it . It's almost like you have some kind of unconscious bias, how strange. "I, however, am of the opinion, that should a child be born out of wedlock, a man need not bear ANY of the fiscal responsibility." This is fucking disgusting, the poor man and his precious ~wedlock~. Marriage was historically used to oppress women in society, just a heads up. "men would have financial security, not needing to worry about failed contraception making him a wage slave." At this point you're so crazy I don't need to say anything. Those poor, poor single men, when will they ever get a break?
Congratulations for proving yourself to be a quote mining troll. GG?
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On April 28 2011 22:04 vetinari wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do. My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming. The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later. As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain. Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass?
Child birth? No biggie, just give me a huge dose of opiates for 10 hours, no sweat. It's not like the pain and intensity of the experience is so immense that many women die in the procedure in the modern day and age or anything.
Just so you know sweety, your mother saying it was a magical experience is the nice way of putting it. Once your wife is pregnant I'm sure you'll have a more balanced view of pregnancy.
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On April 28 2011 21:54 SacredSoul wrote:
The only time it should be acceptable to abort a child is if it was conceived after a rape, and only if it still can't feel pain.
Im pretty damn pissed that so many people are for the killing of babies that were conceived during a fun night out, or after being drunk and making a night of poor decisions, I AM ONE OF THOSE BABIES! If my parents were as anti-life as you I wouldn't be alive! I think Im making the best of it too as I am going to college at 17, having fun with friends, and playing SC2...
Some of you on this forum are heartless and if everyone were like you I bet a good couple of million of GOOD, HARDWORKING, people would be dead and never would have had an effect on your life.
Those that have aborted because you didn't think you might have had the means to raise a kid, shame on you. My mom ended up having 4 kids on a 15k salary and I LOVE life. If you fuck up one night live with the consequences, don't murder some kid that could have made your life brighter. Honestly the way I see it aborting mothers should think about how their kid will be at 17-18 and then try and kill them.
My rant is over, but why do so many people want kids like me dead?
I read through the thread and you are arguing with NO ONE. No one here is wishing for the death of a person out of the womb. The question is WHEN do you consider a child a person? There's no science that can teach us that, it's different from one person to the next.
When did you become a person? Was it when your parents decided to fuck? If so, does not fucking equal "killing babies"? Was it when the sperm reached the egg? Would you consider it "killing babies" if someone used an "acute birth control pill" (eh, English word for it? The ones used the days after conception) to flush the round clump of cells out of their system?
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On April 28 2011 22:06 vetinari wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 21:53 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:49 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:15 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:10 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 20:58 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 20:56 vetinari wrote:
If women have the sole right to choose, should she not have the sole burden of responsibility?
Note how on all of these imagined and highly biased 'well if i wuz in this position' provided, the woman always runs off with the child . Thanks for responding to the question, mate. ... Really. At this point, I'm pretty convinced that you are a troll. Do you think I'm trolling because I don't show your opinions respect or something? They don't deserve it, the question you asked is irrelevent to the discussion of abortion, unless you're making the point that if a woman has the sole right to abortion, then she should raise the child on her own as well? That if born, and the father leaves her, he wouldn't have to pay child support by this logic right? I imagine this is the crux of what you're trying to get across, and it's reprehensible . Yes. By not showing respect to other people, you debase yourself and the position for which you stand. By denigrating all who disagree with you, no matter how slight to point of contention, you prove yourself to be an person who has no place in civil society. You will note, if you bothered to read, instead of skimming the thread and quote mining, that I am firmly in the pro-choice camp. Now, you seem to be of the opinion, that a woman has all of the right to choose, and need bear none of the fiscal responsibility. I, however, am of the opinion, that should a child be born out of wedlock, a man need not bear ANY of the fiscal responsibility. This would have the three fold benefit of: women would be discouraged from having children outside of marriage (a net public good, as single parents unfortunately do not do well at raising children, statistically speaking*). men would have financial security, not needing to worry about failed contraception making him a wage slave. Children are much more likely to be born into families where they are wanted, as marriage would only occur if both parties wanted children at some point. *children raised by single parents are on average less educated, earn lower incomes later in life and more criminal. Ironically enough, children raised by single mothers do far more poorly on each of these metrics than those raised by single fathers. "Now, you seem to be of the opinion, that a woman has all of the right to choose, and need bear none of the fiscal responsibility. " Never said this, not even hinted at it . It's almost like you have some kind of unconscious bias, how strange. "I, however, am of the opinion, that should a child be born out of wedlock, a man need not bear ANY of the fiscal responsibility." This is fucking disgusting, the poor man and his precious ~wedlock~. Marriage was historically used to oppress women in society, just a heads up. "men would have financial security, not needing to worry about failed contraception making him a wage slave." At this point you're so crazy I don't need to say anything. Those poor, poor single men, when will they ever get a break? Congratulations for proving yourself to be a quote mining troll. GG?
Uh, I quoted exactly what you said, and preserved exactly what you meant by each point? I'm not twisting your words in any way, simply articulating them in a more real fashion. This isn't "quote mining", especially in such a small amount of text. I even quoted the whole thing at first, so people can see it in context. You are very sensitive
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On April 28 2011 22:08 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 22:04 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do. My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming. The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later. As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain. Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass? Child birth? No biggie, just give me a huge dose of opiates for 10 hours, no sweat. It's not like the pain and intensity of the experience is so immense that many women die in the procedure in the modern day and age or anything. Just so you know sweety, your mother saying it was a magical experience is the nice way of putting it. Once your wife is pregnant I'm sure you'll have a more balanced view of pregnancy.
Estimates for the United states are between 11-17/100000 or about .0002% of women die in childbirth, lets not exaggerate.
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On April 28 2011 22:12 feanor1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 22:08 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 22:04 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do. My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming. The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later. As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain. Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass? Child birth? No biggie, just give me a huge dose of opiates for 10 hours, no sweat. It's not like the pain and intensity of the experience is so immense that many women die in the procedure in the modern day and age or anything. Just so you know sweety, your mother saying it was a magical experience is the nice way of putting it. Once your wife is pregnant I'm sure you'll have a more balanced view of pregnancy. Estimates for the United states are between 11-17/100000 or about .0002% of women die in childbirth, lets not exaggerate.
Ah the United States is the whole world, gotcha. Thanks for this addition friend.
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On April 28 2011 22:13 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 22:12 feanor1 wrote:On April 28 2011 22:08 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 22:04 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do. My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming. The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later. As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain. Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass? Child birth? No biggie, just give me a huge dose of opiates for 10 hours, no sweat. It's not like the pain and intensity of the experience is so immense that many women die in the procedure in the modern day and age or anything. Just so you know sweety, your mother saying it was a magical experience is the nice way of putting it. Once your wife is pregnant I'm sure you'll have a more balanced view of pregnancy. Estimates for the United states are between 11-17/100000 or about .0002% of women die in childbirth, lets not exaggerate. Ah the United States is the whole world, gotcha. Thanks for this addition friend.
Which developed (so that we have the effect of "the modern day and age") country are you thinking of where "many women die in the procedure"?
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On April 28 2011 22:13 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 22:12 feanor1 wrote:On April 28 2011 22:08 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 22:04 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do. My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming. The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later. As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain. Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass? Child birth? No biggie, just give me a huge dose of opiates for 10 hours, no sweat. It's not like the pain and intensity of the experience is so immense that many women die in the procedure in the modern day and age or anything. Just so you know sweety, your mother saying it was a magical experience is the nice way of putting it. Once your wife is pregnant I'm sure you'll have a more balanced view of pregnancy. Estimates for the United states are between 11-17/100000 or about .0002% of women die in childbirth, lets not exaggerate. Ah the United States is the whole world, gotcha. Thanks for this addition friend.
The pain has nothing to do with the women dying >_> The reason why women die whilst giving birth is due to a rapture of the uterus which results in a MASSIVE bleeding. Seriously, has anyone here read anything more complex than "the flower and the honeybee" regarding pregnancy?
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On April 28 2011 22:13 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 22:12 feanor1 wrote:On April 28 2011 22:08 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 22:04 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do. My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming. The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later. As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain. Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass? Child birth? No biggie, just give me a huge dose of opiates for 10 hours, no sweat. It's not like the pain and intensity of the experience is so immense that many women die in the procedure in the modern day and age or anything. Just so you know sweety, your mother saying it was a magical experience is the nice way of putting it. Once your wife is pregnant I'm sure you'll have a more balanced view of pregnancy. Estimates for the United states are between 11-17/100000 or about .0002% of women die in childbirth, lets not exaggerate. Ah the United States is the whole world, gotcha. Thanks for this addition friend.
This law is for Indiana, a state in the United States. The third world seems irrelevant in this discussion? Please explain how it is relevant, enlighten us. You specifically mention modern health care.
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On April 28 2011 22:08 scouting overlord wrote:Show nested quote +On April 28 2011 22:04 vetinari wrote:On April 28 2011 21:45 scouting overlord wrote:On April 28 2011 21:42 Frigo wrote:
Daily 8 hours of hard work for 20+ years to support a kid financially is nothing compared to an 8-hour labour once, yeah right, after all, money grows on trees. And pregnancy is the worst thing to happen to someone. Get a reality check.
Frigo out, the discussion took a sharp turn to the retarded thanks to this oh-so-irreplaceable self-important nice person.
Quoting for posterity. Of course only men can work 8 hours for 20 years . Please ask your mother how labor felt for her, and how much she enjoyed having you grow inside of her constantly. It's a greater pain, physically and mentally (I stress mentally because you can't even imagine it) than you will ever experience in your life. But sure, you can take your toys and leave the discussion if you feel people aren't taking your precious opinions seriously, it's a very mature thing to do. My mother greatly enjoyed her pregnancy, she tells me it was one of the happiest times of her life, knowing that she had life growing inside her, a child that she wanted so much was finally coming. The physical effects of pregnancy, outside of childbirth itself, were inconviniences, but minor, far less inconvenient than her fractured ankle years later. As for child birth itself, it was 10 hours of pain, that would have been far worse were it not for the massive flood of oxytocin in her brain. Are you speaking from the experience of carrying an unwanted child to term? Or just out of your ass? Child birth? No biggie, just give me a huge dose of opiates for 10 hours, no sweat. It's not like the pain and intensity of the experience is so immense that many women die in the procedure in the modern day and age or anything.Just so you know sweety, your mother saying it was a magical experience is the nice way of putting it. Once your wife is pregnant I'm sure you'll have a more balanced view of pregnancy.
Wtf? Maternal death during child birth is extremely rare in developed countries, with 20 deaths per 100,000 live births.
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EPT
