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Pokerstars is an online poker site. Pokerstrategy is an educational training site. They are not the same site. The TSL3 is sponsored by pokerstrategy.com. | ||
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jalstar
United States8198 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:10 zTz wrote: wait.... is online gambling a crime? I thought that the sites were getting shut down for laundering, fraud, and other crimes, not because of "gambling." only in the us i believe, and operating a site is a much bigger crime than playing on one. | ||
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matthewfoulkes
United Kingdom246 Posts
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Modafinil
United States35 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:08 jalstar wrote: if you buy drugs you're breaking the law. non-us players weren't breaking any laws by playing on stars and full-tilt. That's not the point at all. The point is that the money is evidence against the drug dealer, even if he was selling weed somewhere legal as well as illegal. The point is he was laundering the money, and some of it came from illegal activities, whether or not some also came from legal activities. | ||
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Mailing
United States3087 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:10 zTz wrote: wait.... is online gambling a crime? I thought that the sites were getting shut down for laundering, fraud, and other crimes, not because of "gambling." It shouldn't be a crime, but since the US government can't tax it, they will make it a fucking crime. | ||
CTStalker
Canada9720 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:06 jalstar wrote: i think non-us sites like party and ipoker are still open though. none of the sites who had their domains seized are run in the states. they had their .com domains seized, which is a US-controlled domain. the danger isn't even operating in the states anymore, it's having any tie to any US-controlled body at all | ||
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rabidch
United States20289 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:08 jalstar wrote: if you buy drugs you're breaking the law. non-us players weren't breaking any laws by playing on stars and full-tilt. like if you invest in a bank (legal) and the bank doesn't pay their taxes (illegal) should you lose your money? non-US players weren't breaking any laws, so they arent going to jail... for their money they may have a case but theyre unlikely to get it back, figure its not "local drug dealer" but "international drug dealer" which may be legal in some other country | ||
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jalstar
United States8198 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:13 CTStalker wrote: none of the sites who had their domains seized are run in the states. they had their .com domains seized, which is a US-controlled domain. the danger isn't even operating in the states anymore, it's having any tie to any US-controlled body at all http://www.ipoker.com/html/ seems to be up while ft and stars are not, maybe it's just me though. | ||
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Wohmfg
United Kingdom1292 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:07 StarStruck wrote: It's just one of the risks you take by doing it. :/ No it really isn't. Don't make it sound like it's the poker players' fault for losing the money. This is not something anyone could have ever foreseen. Ever. There were maybe like a few thousand people in the whole world who knew what was going on. Say you get struck by a meteor playing golf. That is not one of the risks of playing golf. I think I just lost my £400 for my euro trip then.  | ||
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slls
Czech Republic28 Posts
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contraSol
United States185 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:06 Modafinil wrote: It's not "your money". It is money that was sitting in the bank account of an entity engaged in a criminal enterprise. The money has been seized as part of a federal criminal investigation. Trying to get your money through legal action against the US government here would be like trying to get your money back from your local drug dealer after he was arrested. Your money is gone. You have a 0% chance of ever getting it back. Yes, it IS my money. I spent countless hours studying poker theory, played and analyzed hundreds of thousands of hands. Don't tell me that isn't my own hard-earned money. They have not seized funds from these sites yet, nor are these sites "criminal organizations." They're based in countries where what they're doing is completely legal, and the US has no jurisdiction. Comparing this with getting back money from a drug dealer demonstrates your ignorance on the subject. | ||
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munchmunch
Canada789 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:13 CTStalker wrote: none of the sites who had their domains seized are run in the states. they had their .com domains seized, which is a US-controlled domain. the danger isn't even operating in the states anymore, it's having any tie to any US-controlled body at all To add to this, the DHS combined with US customs has been "seizing" domain names for the last six months or so, originally concentrating on copyright violation. This has not been really been reported in the mainstream media, although it has had heavy coverage on tech websites such as slashdot. A lot of people are questioning the legality of these seizures as well, but so far it seems that nothing can be done about it. | ||
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heishe
Germany2284 Posts
One can always dream... | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17865 Posts
On April 15 2011 14:13 VanDerMeyde wrote: Conspiracy to Commit Bank Fraud and Wire Fraud ISAI SCHEINBERG,RAYMOND BITAR,BRENT BECKLEY,NELSON BURTNICK,PAUL TATE,RYAN LANG,BRADLEY FRANZEN,IRA RUBIN,CHAD ELIE 30 years in prison; fine of $1,000,000 or twice the gross gain or loss; 5 years supervised release; forfeiture of proceeds of offense Money Laundering Conspiracy ISAI SCHEINBERG,RAYMOND BITAR,BRENT BECKLEY,NELSON BURTNICK,PAUL TATE,RYAN LANG,BRADLEY FRANZEN,IRA RUBIN,CHAD ELIE,JOHN CAMPOS 20 years in prison; fine of $500,000 or twice the amount laundered; 3 years supervised release; forfeiture of proceeds of offense Is that who's getting charged and what they can get? | ||
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Modafinil
United States35 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:15 Wohmfg wrote: No it really isn't. Don't make it sound like it's the poker players' fault for losing the money. This is not something anyone could have ever foreseen. Ever. There were maybe like a few thousand people in the whole world who knew what was going on. Say you get struck by a meteor playing golf. That is not one of the risks of playing golf. I think I just lost my £400 for my euro trip then. While I sympathize with the players who lost money, I think "meteor while playing golf" is a bit over-dramatic. The fact is online poker has always been a grey area, whether it was the passage of the UIGEA in 2006 or just the sites themselves having problems with cheating and shills. A lot of you are probably too young to remember this but online poker has been on the government's radar for almost a decade. It was always a question of WHEN the "meteor" would hit, not IF. That said there was no telling when. It sucks that it happened now, but it was inevitable. | ||
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BeMannerDuPenner
Germany5638 Posts
this is insane. angry american government stole/freezed my money! remember when the first steps in us were taken against online gambling coule years ago. was already scary... | ||
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thebigdonkey
United States354 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:19 Manit0u wrote: From LP.net Is that who's getting charged and what they can get? There's a link to the Department of Justice pdf of the filing in the OP. It details the charges. | ||
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D_K_night
Canada615 Posts
On April 16 2011 04:08 jalstar wrote: if you buy drugs you're breaking the law. non-us players weren't breaking any laws by playing on stars and full-tilt. sure if you're playing from a different country, then ok you were not doing anything illegal sure, by playing on these online gambling sites. But as to whether you'll get your money back, is a totally different story as others have stated here. Anytime your money is at the mercy of a company which isn't even in your country, how much is your government going to be able to do? | ||
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Propane
United States4 Posts
If the United States were acting rationally they would simply tax online gambling at a reasonable rate and allow poker players to continue doing what they enjoy. If you live in the United States or any other jurisdiction which is attempting to ban online gaming please contact your representative and let them know that you are in favor of allowing people to play poker online. By outlawing online poker the United States is wasting resources enforcing a silly law when they could instead allow a business to thrive and produce entertainment for millions of people. Additionally, allowing companies to operate inside the USA would allow better consumer protection. | ||
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JFO
184 Posts
And I am not over extending here, if those people are declared guilty, trust me, once pokerstars go down, and billions of dollars are lost within tens of thousands of users, it could get like a pyramid and a lot of sites are going to go down because players leaving or afraid of the same and so on... poker players need to show support or at least do something right now before the trials and all. | ||
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Soap
Brazil1546 Posts
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