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Thank you for showing us that. It will definitely be a useful read for me when I decide to go back to school.
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yeah, i wish somebody showed me that during my freshman year 
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Poland3772 Posts
Interesting read. Can't say I agree with it 100% but it's nice nevertheless.
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Anybody that is new to programming and wants to learn with some examples (android gaming) and real references should refer to this
http://www.kilobolt.com/
the author actually does an amazing job (keeping vocab low for noobies to follow) in engaging the reader. The Java tutorial is a great guide in teaching you a lot of the fundamentals.
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That is just crazy... now I know what sorts of classes to look into when I get into college.
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Thanks for the link, interesting read. And while don't necessarily agree with everything mentioned either I don't even have a CS degree so I suspect the author might know better. 
From reading that I got a few nice ideas on skills to improve. Aside from that, this article along with some of Paul Graham's essays (which I also found through this thread I think) has made me think about how to improve as a software developer in general.
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I feel bad now after reading that, I just realized how much my uni is lacking :/ some things that are in there I had to learn from myself or friends cause they don't cover it, mostly System Administration, Unix systems. Cryptography and Software/Network Security are complete taboos, they are afraid someone is going to ruin their network
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i think those topics are being taught online for free, there are some sites (i forgot, coursera i think) that teach them for free and very understandable. I took a cryptography online class once.
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Keep in mind that you will do perfectly well without knowing all of those coming out of college. They will make you more attractive to employers.
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On June 25 2013 07:51 Craton wrote:
Keep in mind that you will do perfectly well without knowing all of those coming out of college. They will make you more attractive to employers.
Also keep in mind that learning a little bit more of any of those sections can make you understand CS more. Great Summer activity ^^'.
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Do you guys think a master's degree in the current software industry is necessary/extremely helpful? I'm currently studying for a Bachelor's at CS at Carnegie Mellon but my parents seem to want me to get a masters. I understand of course that it obviously would extend my understanding of CS as well as probably yield a slightly higher salary, but is paying for the two extra years of tuition worth it? Or would real world experience be better?
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CMU BS is sufficient to get a job at any tech company in the US. A master's degree may raise your initial pay by a little bit (very little), but with an extra year or two of actual work experience you can outstrip that by just doing good work.
Anecdotally, I'm making like 40% more total liquid comp than I did when I started working two years ago (same company), way more than I would be if I did a master's program instead of going directly in to the workforce.
Unfortunately I don't have any numbers to back this up Would be nice if someone could look some up, ha.
So no, if the goal is "make more money," MS is not necessarily a good choice. Especially for you, coming from basically one of the top 5/3/1 CS programs in the world. This obviously changes for someone with an undergrad degree from, say, Wuhan University in China.
Now, there are other reasons to get a master's degree. If you have stuff you particularly want to learn from top-rate professors, it may be worth it to just stick around and soak up the knowledge. Graduate courses can be really, really fun. (You can also typically take graduate courses as an undergrad, so there's that too)
I would recommend applying for a good internship program for next summer (depending on what year you are) and see how much you like the real world of software. If it doesn't appeal to you, maybe you'd want to stay in Uni for awhile and learn cool stuff (maybe even a PhD, if you're not terribly opposed to slave labor).
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On June 25 2013 08:52 jWavA wrote:
Do you guys think a master's degree in the current software industry is necessary/extremely helpful? I'm currently studying for a Bachelor's at CS at Carnegie Mellon but my parents seem to want me to get a masters. I understand of course that it obviously would extend my understanding of CS as well as probably yield a slightly higher salary, but is paying for the two extra years of tuition worth it? Or would real world experience be better?
It's good resume padding, though I don't feel you gain much practical knowledge. I went ahead and got my M.S. in a 5 year program largely to have a better resume, but both of my job offers out of college came through contacts and would have been available with just a B.S. (interned at one place, very longtime friend of someone at another).
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On June 25 2013 08:52 jWavA wrote:
Do you guys think a master's degree in the current software industry is necessary/extremely helpful? I'm currently studying for a Bachelor's at CS at Carnegie Mellon but my parents seem to want me to get a masters. I understand of course that it obviously would extend my understanding of CS as well as probably yield a slightly higher salary, but is paying for the two extra years of tuition worth it? Or would real world experience be better?
In general, I recommend undergraduates at strong programs like CMU jump into the workforce immediately. Practically speaking, there's not much that a Masters will offer that a similar amount work experience will get you. Furthermore, at a place like CMU, you should be able to get a Masters-level education by pursuing graduate courses in the fields of CS that interest you.
A CS Masters only really makes sense for folk that:
(1) Want the degree for the sake of having a Masters,
(2) Have no CS degree and want to branch into CS, or
(3) Have a CS degree from a weaker institution and want to beef up their knowledge accordingly.
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Also keep in mind that many good employers will pay for a master's degree later. Take night classes, free master's degree while earning $$.
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I'd have wanted to hang myself taking my masters courses doing a 40 hour workweek and 10 hours of commute. It was bad enough working 3 days a week while doing it.
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I think worry less about "which is best" and just go do some of them.
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On June 25 2013 21:47 Craton wrote:
I'd have wanted to hang myself taking my masters courses doing a 40 hour workweek and 10 hours of commute. It was bad enough working 3 days a week while doing it.
A 5 year bs & ms program is way more fast paced than taking night courses for a master's over like 2-3 years.
Also if someone can afford to just drop $60k / year on tuition without working at the same time, then maybe the discussion of which direction is better financially doesn't really apply.
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Where did 60k a year come from? According to the NCSE, the average yearly public college costs 16k a year, while the average yearly private college costs 33k.
Arguing cost of a bachelor's isn't even relevant when it's a matter of getting a Master's. Obviously the best option financially is to get your job to pay for it, but it's also the hardest time commitment. The worst financially is to take the master's separately after your undergraduate, before you start working, but that's the easiest time commitment.
The middleground is to take part of the master's during your undergrad (at no additional cost, i.e. $0) while not working and then finish your master's while working part time in your field. This is the approach I took. 7 of my 12 master's courses cost me nothing. I also had 4 scholarships as an undergrad.
It would obviously be harder to take 18 credits a semester while working a significant amount of time, but that's still largely a different matter than getting the master's.
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EPT
