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On January 11 2010 11:14 synapse wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2010 10:17 daz wrote:On January 11 2010 03:28 synapse wrote:On January 09 2010 11:07 cz wrote:
This story is a fabrication; I know this because Islam is the religion of peace, and thus what you stated cannot have happened. All religions are "religions of peace" - until they are twisted to fit individual ideologies. Actually it's the other way around, all religions are religions of extreme and barbaric violence. Modern people have had to twist it around so that they can still live in society without being lunatics. For example, here is a quote from the bible from Deuteronomy 20:10-14 As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.Here's another fun one from Deuteronomy 22:28-29 If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her LOL at the second example xD Well, what you said is kind of what I mean. In general, religious literature does use violence in stories and in rules, etc. but (for the most part) tries to promote goodwill, peace, morality, all the good stuff. This is because the only way to spread a religion is to make it seem like its doing some kind of good to the individual: "believe in our god... or you go to hell!" The bible is obviously full of shit, but what most people get from attending church isn't "kill your family and friends" or anything terribly absurd. Like you said, if people did follow exactly what the bible stated, this world would be... well, you know. Christians would obviously think of Christianity as a "religion of peace" rather than one of violence - either because they associate both peace and their own religion with good, or because they don't actually read the bible. Extremists of certain religions are convinced that what they are doing (killing people) will somehow benefit them; even if most followers of a certain religion believe their religion to be a "religion of peace" (though most really aren't - hence the quotation marks), any religion can be twisted to go from story violence to actual violence.
They don't require "twisting" to become actual violence. You have to remember these aren't stories they are commands from GOD. The bible is the word of god himself. It requires "twisting" in order for there to NOT be actual violence.
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United States22883 Posts
On January 11 2010 10:29 daz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2010 20:43 Jibba wrote:On January 10 2010 11:14 Savant wrote:On January 10 2010 10:46 daz wrote:On January 10 2010 10:27 Savant wrote:On January 10 2010 02:52 MannerMan wrote:
It is very sad that so many can be moved so strongly by religion.
I hope one day they can see the beautiful truths behind our existence instead of the lies and tyranny of those who oppress them with fear. LOL at the atheists and science-worshippers. Sure, if we eliminate all religion we can get rid of all that's wrong in the world. Oh wait, I forgot that Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Castro, etc. were all devout worshippers of God who didn't massacre innocent members of religious minorities. And certainly the innumerable humanitarian programs fueled by religious belief would certainly continue if everyone came to their senses and became atheist (hint: look at China for this dream state). Let's not forget that Eugenics was a direct result of scientific, not religious, ideas. Let's face it people, looking at history being inhuman is the natural state of humanity, and just because people manipulate religion (along with everything else) to justify their greed, bigotry, or racism doesn't make religion the villain. If anything, religion provides a check to some of these tendencies: without religion Hitler, Mao, etc. could still exist, but Mother Teresa could not. If you're atheist fine, but don't go calling people who differ with your OPINION ignorant mislead retards because that's just announcing that you're an ignorant mislead retard, and puts you on the same level as that Muslim/Christian/Hindu who right now is calling you an ignorant mislead retard. Believe it or not, there is a way to rationally discuss sensitive issues like this without resorting to name calling and displays of your intellectual bigotry. Thank you very much. There's no way for YOU to rationally discuss them because you're not capable of rational thinking. I'm an applied physics major at Cornell with a 3.8 GPA. I think I'm entitled to be considered at least a somewhat rational human being. And no, I'm not denying that religion can be bad as well as good. I'm just calling out the idiots who make religion the scapegoat for all that is wrong with the world. My personal opinion on the matter is that the people involved should be tried and punished as criminals. I also think there is something seriously wrong within the Muslim religion that would inspire so many of its adherents to religious violence. No, your 3.8 GPA in applied physics at Cornell doesn't mean shit on this topic since WE'RE NOT DISCUSSING APPLIED PHYSICSGod, TL General is such an awful place now. The closer we get to SC2, the more ignorant the average poster becomes. On January 10 2010 20:25 Mykill wrote:
The holocaust was not based on Christianity.
The crusades were fought a LONG time ago when everybody fought over "holy land" you don't see Christians getting together to take over Jerusalem.
I'm not religious but I'll give Christians some credit for not going overboard. Christian Serbs and Croats slaughtered, raped, destroyed thousands of Muslim Bosnians (and each other) less than 20 years ago - people of the very same fucking ethnicity and language - because of a political struggle combined with a ridiculous Serb religious myth about Prince Lazarus. 15 years ago, a Jewish doctor stormed into a mosque in Hebron and killed 29 people praying and wounded 150 others The Turner Diaries still influences thousands of people, some of which decided to blow up the Federal Building in Oklahoma. If you want to enter this discussion, maybe you should stop studying applied physics and take a course or two in history or sociology or poli sci. This clash of civilizations, 'other'ing bullshit is not only wrong, but it's the exact same process used to demonize the "West" by the disenfranchised idiots you have a problem with. A political/economic problems get reframed into a religious/cultural one, and all of the sudden you have a reason to enter direct conflict rather than use mechanisms like the political process to solve things. This is a problem with the Malaysian government, not a fucking religion. I agree with what you wrote in most of your post but maybe you should take a course in modern history before you start posting about events that you have no knowledge of. Normally I wouldn't care but you're using Serbia as an example and that's where I'm from so I would appreciate if you did some research about what happened there before you start throwing around terms like destroyed and slaughtered and raped and "Serb religious myth about Prince Lazarus".
That's funny, because I have and what I said was true. That myth was created in the early 20th century, but it was revived in the 80s and 90s by ultra nationalists. Do you want to discuss what the Serbian military was doing in 93 and 94? Regardless of the fears of another Ustashe or the ridiculous lies about militant Bosnia, Serbian nationalism was fueled by religion and vice versa.
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On January 10 2010 10:27 Savant wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2010 02:52 MannerMan wrote:
It is very sad that so many can be moved so strongly by religion.
I hope one day they can see the beautiful truths behind our existence instead of the lies and tyranny of those who oppress them with fear. LOL at the atheists and science-worshippers. Sure, if we eliminate all religion we can get rid of all that's wrong in the world. Oh wait, I forgot that Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Castro, etc. were all devout worshippers of God who didn't massacre innocent members of religious minorities. And certainly the innumerable humanitarian programs fueled by religious belief would certainly continue if everyone came to their senses and became atheist (hint: look at China for this dream state). Let's not forget that Eugenics was a direct result of scientific, not religious, ideas. Let's face it people, looking at history being inhuman is the natural state of humanity, and just because people manipulate religion (along with everything else) to justify their greed, bigotry, or racism doesn't make religion the villain. If anything, religion provides a check to some of these tendencies: without religion Hitler, Mao, etc. could still exist, but Mother Teresa could not. If you're atheist fine, but don't go calling people who differ with your OPINION ignorant misled retards because that's just announcing that you're an ignorant misled retard, and puts you on the same level as that Muslim/Christian/Hindu who right now is calling you an ignorant misled retard. Believe it or not, there is a way to rationally discuss sensitive issues like this without resorting to name calling and displays of your intellectual bigotry. Thank you very much.
I'm pretty sure Hitler was the only one (out of those you listed) who killed religious minorities, and eugenics was the direct result of racism, not science.
Anyways: http://imgur.com/pKya4
On January 11 2010 11:27 daz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2010 11:14 synapse wrote:On January 11 2010 10:17 daz wrote:On January 11 2010 03:28 synapse wrote:On January 09 2010 11:07 cz wrote:
This story is a fabrication; I know this because Islam is the religion of peace, and thus what you stated cannot have happened. All religions are "religions of peace" - until they are twisted to fit individual ideologies. Actually it's the other way around, all religions are religions of extreme and barbaric violence. Modern people have had to twist it around so that they can still live in society without being lunatics. For example, here is a quote from the bible from Deuteronomy 20:10-14 As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.Here's another fun one from Deuteronomy 22:28-29 If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her LOL at the second example xD Well, what you said is kind of what I mean. In general, religious literature does use violence in stories and in rules, etc. but (for the most part) tries to promote goodwill, peace, morality, all the good stuff. This is because the only way to spread a religion is to make it seem like its doing some kind of good to the individual: "believe in our god... or you go to hell!" The bible is obviously full of shit, but what most people get from attending church isn't "kill your family and friends" or anything terribly absurd. Like you said, if people did follow exactly what the bible stated, this world would be... well, you know. Christians would obviously think of Christianity as a "religion of peace" rather than one of violence - either because they associate both peace and their own religion with good, or because they don't actually read the bible. Extremists of certain religions are convinced that what they are doing (killing people) will somehow benefit them; even if most followers of a certain religion believe their religion to be a "religion of peace" (though most really aren't - hence the quotation marks), any religion can be twisted to go from story violence to actual violence. They don't require "twisting" to become actual violence. You have to remember these aren't stories they are commands from GOD. The bible is the word of god himself. It requires "twisting" in order for there to NOT be actual violence.
Then again, I know more atheists who have read the bible for fun than Christians who have read the bible out of piety. But you're right, of course 
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On January 10 2010 14:37 Loanshark wrote:lol it's ALLAHU AKBAR
I can't believe no one has trolled this yet with
ALLAHUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU AKBAR.
./shrug
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On January 11 2010 11:30 Jibba wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2010 10:29 daz wrote:On January 10 2010 20:43 Jibba wrote:On January 10 2010 11:14 Savant wrote:On January 10 2010 10:46 daz wrote:On January 10 2010 10:27 Savant wrote:On January 10 2010 02:52 MannerMan wrote:
It is very sad that so many can be moved so strongly by religion.
I hope one day they can see the beautiful truths behind our existence instead of the lies and tyranny of those who oppress them with fear. LOL at the atheists and science-worshippers. Sure, if we eliminate all religion we can get rid of all that's wrong in the world. Oh wait, I forgot that Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Castro, etc. were all devout worshippers of God who didn't massacre innocent members of religious minorities. And certainly the innumerable humanitarian programs fueled by religious belief would certainly continue if everyone came to their senses and became atheist (hint: look at China for this dream state). Let's not forget that Eugenics was a direct result of scientific, not religious, ideas. Let's face it people, looking at history being inhuman is the natural state of humanity, and just because people manipulate religion (along with everything else) to justify their greed, bigotry, or racism doesn't make religion the villain. If anything, religion provides a check to some of these tendencies: without religion Hitler, Mao, etc. could still exist, but Mother Teresa could not. If you're atheist fine, but don't go calling people who differ with your OPINION ignorant mislead retards because that's just announcing that you're an ignorant mislead retard, and puts you on the same level as that Muslim/Christian/Hindu who right now is calling you an ignorant mislead retard. Believe it or not, there is a way to rationally discuss sensitive issues like this without resorting to name calling and displays of your intellectual bigotry. Thank you very much. There's no way for YOU to rationally discuss them because you're not capable of rational thinking. I'm an applied physics major at Cornell with a 3.8 GPA. I think I'm entitled to be considered at least a somewhat rational human being. And no, I'm not denying that religion can be bad as well as good. I'm just calling out the idiots who make religion the scapegoat for all that is wrong with the world. My personal opinion on the matter is that the people involved should be tried and punished as criminals. I also think there is something seriously wrong within the Muslim religion that would inspire so many of its adherents to religious violence. No, your 3.8 GPA in applied physics at Cornell doesn't mean shit on this topic since WE'RE NOT DISCUSSING APPLIED PHYSICSGod, TL General is such an awful place now. The closer we get to SC2, the more ignorant the average poster becomes. On January 10 2010 20:25 Mykill wrote:
The holocaust was not based on Christianity.
The crusades were fought a LONG time ago when everybody fought over "holy land" you don't see Christians getting together to take over Jerusalem.
I'm not religious but I'll give Christians some credit for not going overboard. Christian Serbs and Croats slaughtered, raped, destroyed thousands of Muslim Bosnians (and each other) less than 20 years ago - people of the very same fucking ethnicity and language - because of a political struggle combined with a ridiculous Serb religious myth about Prince Lazarus. 15 years ago, a Jewish doctor stormed into a mosque in Hebron and killed 29 people praying and wounded 150 others The Turner Diaries still influences thousands of people, some of which decided to blow up the Federal Building in Oklahoma. If you want to enter this discussion, maybe you should stop studying applied physics and take a course or two in history or sociology or poli sci. This clash of civilizations, 'other'ing bullshit is not only wrong, but it's the exact same process used to demonize the "West" by the disenfranchised idiots you have a problem with. A political/economic problems get reframed into a religious/cultural one, and all of the sudden you have a reason to enter direct conflict rather than use mechanisms like the political process to solve things. This is a problem with the Malaysian government, not a fucking religion. I agree with what you wrote in most of your post but maybe you should take a course in modern history before you start posting about events that you have no knowledge of. Normally I wouldn't care but you're using Serbia as an example and that's where I'm from so I would appreciate if you did some research about what happened there before you start throwing around terms like destroyed and slaughtered and raped and "Serb religious myth about Prince Lazarus". That's funny, because I have and what I said was true. That myth was created in the early 20th century, but it was revived in the 80s and 90s by ultra nationalists. Do you want to discuss what the Serbian military was doing in 93 and 94? Regardless of the fears of another Ustashe or the ridiculous lies about militant Bosnia, Serbian nationalism was fueled by religion and vice versa.
Serbian nationalism had nothing to do with religion. You have to understand how Yugoslavia worked to understand the source of the Serbian nationalism. It stemmed mostly from the fact that Serbia was always the most powerful nation and then centre of Yugoslavia, and in order to keep Yugoslavia together Serbia had to forgo its own national interests for the interests of the other states and for Yugoslavia as a whole. After Tito died, a lot of Serbians started to resent this, since Tito was basically holding the country together. Milosevic came along and he basically ran on a platform of "hey we're the most powerful country why should we have to let everyone else have their way, we should start promoting our own interests". Of course Serbian people loved it so he was hugely popular. This rise in Serbian nationalism combined with the rise in nationalism of all the other states and the United States denying Yugoslavia trade credits and then offering economic aid to states that declared independence is was led to the breakup. After this basically everyone was at each others throats. And i wouldn't mind discussing what the Serbian military was doing in 93 and 94 if you wouldn't mind discussing what Bosnian Muslmis were doing to Bosnian Serbs before the military got there. Or what the Croation miliatry was doing at the same time. OR maybe you'd like to discuss what the American military was doing a few years later
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On January 11 2010 11:27 daz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2010 11:14 synapse wrote:On January 11 2010 10:17 daz wrote:On January 11 2010 03:28 synapse wrote:On January 09 2010 11:07 cz wrote:
This story is a fabrication; I know this because Islam is the religion of peace, and thus what you stated cannot have happened. All religions are "religions of peace" - until they are twisted to fit individual ideologies. Actually it's the other way around, all religions are religions of extreme and barbaric violence. Modern people have had to twist it around so that they can still live in society without being lunatics. For example, here is a quote from the bible from Deuteronomy 20:10-14 As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.Here's another fun one from Deuteronomy 22:28-29 If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her LOL at the second example xD Well, what you said is kind of what I mean. In general, religious literature does use violence in stories and in rules, etc. but (for the most part) tries to promote goodwill, peace, morality, all the good stuff. This is because the only way to spread a religion is to make it seem like its doing some kind of good to the individual: "believe in our god... or you go to hell!" The bible is obviously full of shit, but what most people get from attending church isn't "kill your family and friends" or anything terribly absurd. Like you said, if people did follow exactly what the bible stated, this world would be... well, you know. Christians would obviously think of Christianity as a "religion of peace" rather than one of violence - either because they associate both peace and their own religion with good, or because they don't actually read the bible. Extremists of certain religions are convinced that what they are doing (killing people) will somehow benefit them; even if most followers of a certain religion believe their religion to be a "religion of peace" (though most really aren't - hence the quotation marks), any religion can be twisted to go from story violence to actual violence. They don't require "twisting" to become actual violence. You have to remember these aren't stories they are commands from GOD. The bible is the word of god himself. It requires "twisting" in order for there to NOT be actual violence.
i'm not religious at all, but
a) it is not worded like that at all in the bible. i have with me the king james version and it is completely different.
b) if someone were to back the "teachings" in the bible, you have to take into context when it was written. It was much more simpler times with a simple moral code. Like for your second point, which never mentions rape btw, that man having sex with the woman out of wedlock has to basically give away a fortune to the father of the woman. it is a pretty simple deterrent for premarital sexualations. unmarried sex, loose money, no good for you! dont do it!
basically for a God to explain to the masses what is right and wrong, whom still believe the world is flat for fucks sake, think how one would communicate with them. try explaining a 3D universe to someone who still wanders in a 2D world
They are moral teachings that are instilled into families, and passed down through generations and through changing times.
and in terms of these violent muslims, I find that they are just uneducated people, who are getting pissed off easily, who are being fed bullshit by those same people they rely on to communicate the message from their god.
when i hear terrorists or any of this muslim extremism BS, I immediately think of some fuck redneck KKK christian who would probably react the same way as them if fucked with enough.
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On January 11 2010 13:35 alex5050 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2010 11:27 daz wrote:On January 11 2010 11:14 synapse wrote:On January 11 2010 10:17 daz wrote:On January 11 2010 03:28 synapse wrote:On January 09 2010 11:07 cz wrote:
This story is a fabrication; I know this because Islam is the religion of peace, and thus what you stated cannot have happened. All religions are "religions of peace" - until they are twisted to fit individual ideologies. Actually it's the other way around, all religions are religions of extreme and barbaric violence. Modern people have had to twist it around so that they can still live in society without being lunatics. For example, here is a quote from the bible from Deuteronomy 20:10-14 As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.Here's another fun one from Deuteronomy 22:28-29 If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her LOL at the second example xD Well, what you said is kind of what I mean. In general, religious literature does use violence in stories and in rules, etc. but (for the most part) tries to promote goodwill, peace, morality, all the good stuff. This is because the only way to spread a religion is to make it seem like its doing some kind of good to the individual: "believe in our god... or you go to hell!" The bible is obviously full of shit, but what most people get from attending church isn't "kill your family and friends" or anything terribly absurd. Like you said, if people did follow exactly what the bible stated, this world would be... well, you know. Christians would obviously think of Christianity as a "religion of peace" rather than one of violence - either because they associate both peace and their own religion with good, or because they don't actually read the bible. Extremists of certain religions are convinced that what they are doing (killing people) will somehow benefit them; even if most followers of a certain religion believe their religion to be a "religion of peace" (though most really aren't - hence the quotation marks), any religion can be twisted to go from story violence to actual violence. They don't require "twisting" to become actual violence. You have to remember these aren't stories they are commands from GOD. The bible is the word of god himself. It requires "twisting" in order for there to NOT be actual violence. i'm not religious at all, but a) it is not worded like that at all in the bible. i have with me the king james version and it is completely different. b) if someone were to back the "teachings" in the bible, you have to take into context when it was written. It was much more simpler times with a simple moral code. Like for your second point, which never mentions rape btw, that man having sex with the woman out of wedlock has to basically give away a fortune to the father of the woman. it is a pretty simple deterrent for premarital sexualations. unmarried sex, loose money, no good for you! dont do it! basically for a God to explain to the masses what is right and wrong, whom still believe the world is flat for fucks sake, think how one would communicate with them. try explaining a 3D universe to someone who still wanders in a 2D world They are moral teachings that are instilled into families, and passed down through generations and through changing times. and in terms of these violent muslims, I find that they are just uneducated people, who are getting pissed off easily, who are being fed bullshit by those same people they rely on to communicate the message from their god. when i hear terrorists or any of this muslim extremism BS, I immediately think of some fuck redneck KKK christian who would probably react the same way as them if fucked with enough.
a) Ok yeah the passages are gonna be worded a little differently but the message is still carried across, and even if those two I quoted aren't as bad in other versions there's still hundreds of similar passages of God commanding people to murder and rape, murdering people himself, encouraging murder, genocide, rape, the taking of slaves I mean it just goes on and on.
b) Regardless of how "simple" the times are I still wouldn't teach them to slaughter each other ruthlessly and take each other as slaves and rape women. As far as the the time it was written , I don't see why that matters seeing as that the bible is supposed to be written by god. Why would god pass down morals that involve rape and murder, you don't think god is capable of the same morals we are today? And your third point I'm not even sure I understand correctly, are you saying that it's good that rapists are forced to marry the women that they rape because its a deterrent for premarital sex.. what?
Oh and by the way it also says in the bible that world is flat, so at that time, God, the creator of the universe also thought the Earth was flat, so can you really blame the people? Also if I tried to explain a 3d universe to someone who wanders in the 2d world I certainly wouldn't tell him to slaughter people or rape women.
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there was no mention of rape so it just kind pisses me off you keep going off about it.. for your entire post.
it is, for just about any rational person who reads it, a simple scccarrrryyy story to not engage in premarital sex. it is for a "man who is caught lying with a damsel." Not a man raping a young girl. Pretty two fucking different things.
and do you honestly know any religious person who will argue with you that rape is alright as long as i give your dad fifty bucks? No, didn't think so. Stop being a fucking tool.
anything about war, yeah, you are right and I don't care to argue anything about that. but anybody who is taking the bible that literal and will knock on my door with terms of peace or slavery, because that is what they read in the bible, then they are more of a tool than you are.
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oh and btw i'd love know where they say that the world is flat. I'd love to get the passage and show my Dad to watch him explain that. Nevertheless, the bible is not a science textbook :p telling those people that the world was a sphere, floating in space, would probably cause some heads to explode.
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On January 11 2010 14:06 alex5050 wrote:
there was no mention of rape so it just kind pisses me off you keep going off about it.. for your entire post.
it is, for just about any rational person who reads it, a simple scccarrrryyy story to not engage in premarital sex. it is for a "man who is caught lying with a damsel." Not a man raping a young girl. Pretty two fucking different things.
and do you honestly know any religious person who will argue with you that rape is alright as long as i give your dad fifty bucks? No, didn't think so. Stop being a fucking tool.
anything about war, yeah, you are right and I don't care to argue anything about that. but anybody who is taking the bible that literal and will knock on my door with terms of peace or slavery, because that is what they read in the bible, then they are more of a tool than you are.
Deuteronomy 22:28-29
If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her[/QUOTE]
No I don't know any religious person who would argue that rape would be alright. I also don't know where you got the idea that I claimed that at any point. Maybe your reading comprehension skills need a little work because it seems that not only did you gloss over the word 'raping' in my earlier post you also completely missed the entire point of the post. What I said was basically that it required "twisting" in order for religion to NOT cause violence. At no point did I make any claim on what religious people are currently doing, what they would argue, their stance on rape. I also didn't mention anything about war so I have no idea why you included that. Also at no point did I claim or even imply that people should or do take the bible literally, actually my post was much closer to implying the contrary. And yes I agree that people who take the the bible literally are tools, but I don't see why you had to call me a tool.
Edit: Sorry forgot this, here's something for your dad
Isaiah 11:12
12 And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH. (KJV)
Revelation 7:1
1 And after these things I saw four angels standing on FOUR CORNERS OF THE EARTH, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. (KJV)
Job 38:13
13 That it might take hold of the ENDS OF THE EARTH, that the wicked might be shaken out of it? (KJV)
Jeremiah 16:19
19 O LORD, my strength, and my fortress, and my refuge in the day of affliction, the Gentiles shall come unto thee from the ENDS OF THE EARTH, and shall say, Surely our fathers have inherited lies, vanity, and things wherein there is no profit. (KJV)
Daniel 4:11
11 The tree grew, and was strong, and the height thereof reached unto heaven, and the sight thereof to the ENDS OF ALL THE EARTH: (KJV)
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Lol, you understand that Deuteronomy is heavily qualified by subsequent developments that are in the bible, or in the accompanying rabbinical texts, right?
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No I have no idea about that and I'm not even sure I understand what you're saying.
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On January 11 2010 15:10 daz wrote:
No I have no idea about that and I'm not even sure I understand what you're saying.
Exactly.
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On January 11 2010 15:18 L wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2010 15:10 daz wrote:
No I have no idea about that and I'm not even sure I understand what you're saying. Exactly.
Would you like to clarify? At least clarify how it relates to anything I've said earlier.
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On January 11 2010 11:35 synapse wrote:I'm pretty sure Hitler was the only one (out of those you listed) who killed religious minorities, Then again, I know more atheists who have read the bible for fun than Christians who have read the bible out of piety. But you're right, of course
You're "pretty sure"? Awesome. Now I can tell the Russian Orthodox Church that Stalin's (begun by Lenin) attempt at complete eradication of the church and the slaughter and imprisonment of thousands of church leaders and priests and monks was all a fabrication!
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Some like to have peace in this life, others in the afterlife.
Funny when you think that one can only be certain of only the other.....
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Would you like to clarify? Not really. I'd rather go to sleep. Suffice it to say, your last few posts have shown that you know very little about that which you're talking about.
If I can point you in the right direction, look at the role of the talmud in judaism. Also, distinguish between Islam and Christianity when saying things like "god wrote the bible".
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On January 11 2010 15:35 L wrote: Not really. I'd rather go to sleep. Suffice it to say, your last few posts have shown that you know very little about that which you're talking about. If I can point you in the right direction, look at the role of the talmud in judaism. Also, distinguish between Islam and Christianity when saying things like "god wrote the bible".
All of that is completely irrelevant to the point that I made. It looks like based on your post you know even less about what I'm talking about.
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On January 10 2010 11:42 pubbanana wrote:Show nested quote +
LOL at the atheists and science-worshippers. Sure, if we eliminate all religion we can get rid of all that's wrong in the world. Oh wait, I forgot that Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, Castro, etc. were all devout worshippers of God who didn't massacre innocent members of religious minorities.
Nothing those people did was in the name of atheism.
One has to be a little more sophisticated than that in addressing the issue. In particular, the idea of God being dead, of the complete freedom afforded by the lack of any foundational morality, the idea that humans were vessels to be molded by man, and not inherently endowed with rights and duties by a Creator; these were distinctly made possible by atheist belief systems such as communism. In such belief systems, humans had no instrinsic worth (why should they? The idea that humans have intrinsic worth comes via religion) and were acceptable sacrifices for the State (ultimately, both Hitler and Lenin met by way of Hegel; the State was supreme).
Whatever the faults of religion, of which there are many, its impossible to deny that we arrived at the ideas of the sacred inviolability of the individual, the inherent human rights afforded to us all, by way of religion. That's simply how those ideas were arrived at. The idea of all men being equal and guaranteed certain freedoms comes through religion. Any atheist not living in denial (including myself) needs to come to grips with that.
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On January 11 2010 15:41 daz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2010 15:35 L wrote:Would you like to clarify? Not really. I'd rather go to sleep. Suffice it to say, your last few posts have shown that you know very little about that which you're talking about. If I can point you in the right direction, look at the role of the talmud in judaism. Also, distinguish between Islam and Christianity when saying things like "god wrote the bible". All of that is completely irrelevant to the point that I made. It looks like based on your post you know even less about what I'm talking about.
No, it isn't.
I don't think it would be easy to see the relevance coming from a position of ignorance, though.
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EPT
