Looks like Nintendo has taken a page out of Valve's book and announced its first ever Super Smash Bros. Invitational tournament. The event takes place during E3 in LA, where 16 players will battle it out at the Nokia theater, where thousands of smash fans can see the new game in action, in the hands of the best!
Also in the video Nintendo announced that the new Smash Bros. game will be able to be played at Best Buys across the country.
If you haven't seen the video yet, I suggest it. It's pretty funny and has some other Nintendo E3 goodies announced in it.
On April 30 2014 05:37 kuresuti wrote: Did Nintendo drop the anti-competitive act? Might not be a supercompetitive tournament, but a tournament none the less.
probably. i think they're realizing how popular competitive gaming is and is getting
they need the good ingredients from diablo 2 plus the good ingredients from soul caliber with a promise of continued benefit something from previous games. imagine a character that could take part in all genres of games then the tournament would get attention from gamers from all genres. smash bros wont attract attention of questors or hack and slashers or rts players or first person shooters but it could. it could potentially add another level of strategy of rts which to level raynor or kerrigan. and it would add another level of team work. why they aint doing that? it would be greater chance to play with friends of different tastes imagine terran with whirlwind start against necro zerglings and fire golem. a place to level and rts. d2 chars would need size upgrade or ride upgrade, sonszilla !!! ultralisk or supersized barbarian!! and imagine bonus quests where the questor would benefit with the help of a rts captain that has the ability to go to the native questors game. what would you expect the tournament attention would be. I can imagine barcrafters and arcades with ultralisk ride options similar to mechanical bull!!
On April 30 2014 07:06 WilliamDonaldLewis wrote: they need the good ingredients from diablo 2 plus the good ingredients from soul caliber with a promise of continued benefit something from previous games. imagine a character that could take part in all genres of games then the tournament would get attention from gamers from all genres. smash bros wont attract attention of questors or hack and slashers or rts players or first person shooters but it could. it could potentially add another level of strategy of rts which to level raynor or kerrigan. and it would add another level of team work. why they aint doing that? it would be greater chance to play with friends of different tastes imagine terran with whirlwind start against necro zerglings and fire golem. a place to level and rts. d2 chars would need size upgrade or ride upgrade, sonszilla !!! ultralisk or supersized barbarian!! and imagine bonus quests where the questor would benefit with the help of a rts captain that has the ability to go to the native questors game. what would you expect the tournament attention would be. I can imagine barcrafters and arcades with ultralisk ride options similar to mechanical bull!!
what?
I like how they didn't actually say which game will be played
On April 30 2014 07:06 WilliamDonaldLewis wrote: they need the good ingredients from diablo 2 plus the good ingredients from soul caliber with a promise of continued benefit something from previous games. imagine a character that could take part in all genres of games then the tournament would get attention from gamers from all genres. smash bros wont attract attention of questors or hack and slashers or rts players or first person shooters but it could. it could potentially add another level of strategy of rts which to level raynor or kerrigan. and it would add another level of team work. why they aint doing that? it would be greater chance to play with friends of different tastes imagine terran with whirlwind start against necro zerglings and fire golem. a place to level and rts. d2 chars would need size upgrade or ride upgrade, sonszilla !!! ultralisk or supersized barbarian!! and imagine bonus quests where the questor would benefit with the help of a rts captain that has the ability to go to the native questors game. what would you expect the tournament attention would be. I can imagine barcrafters and arcades with ultralisk ride options similar to mechanical bull!!
what?
I like how they didn't actually say which game will be played
Ya, this is the big question. PM would be way too much to ask, I think, but Melee instead of (or in addition to, I guess is more likely) Brawl...
supousedly the 3ds versión will be out in the summer, but i hope they also have the wii u version as a demo or in the tournament (obiously as a beta or something not finished).
On April 30 2014 07:06 WilliamDonaldLewis wrote: they need the good ingredients from diablo 2 plus the good ingredients from soul caliber with a promise of continued benefit something from previous games. imagine a character that could take part in all genres of games then the tournament would get attention from gamers from all genres. smash bros wont attract attention of questors or hack and slashers or rts players or first person shooters but it could. it could potentially add another level of strategy of rts which to level raynor or kerrigan. and it would add another level of team work. why they aint doing that? it would be greater chance to play with friends of different tastes imagine terran with whirlwind start against necro zerglings and fire golem. a place to level and rts. d2 chars would need size upgrade or ride upgrade, sonszilla !!! ultralisk or supersized barbarian!! and imagine bonus quests where the questor would benefit with the help of a rts captain that has the ability to go to the native questors game. what would you expect the tournament attention would be. I can imagine barcrafters and arcades with ultralisk ride options similar to mechanical bull!!
what?
I like how they didn't actually say which game will be played
logically, if they want to show off smash4 there then it'll be smash4. otherwise, hoping for melee :3
he tournament will see sixteen highly-skilled Smashers converge to compete in the Wii U version of the new title, streamed live for the world to see it in the hands of these dedicated competitors for the first time.
he tournament will see sixteen highly-skilled Smashers converge to compete in the Wii U version of the new title, streamed live for the world to see it in the hands of these dedicated competitors for the first time.
Thanks for that! Now all we have to do is wait to see who's invited... I have no idea what the scene looks like now-Any chance liquid will be represented?
On April 30 2014 09:26 Yergidy wrote: Smash 4 is going to be the game played.
he tournament will see sixteen highly-skilled Smashers converge to compete in the Wii U version of the new title, streamed live for the world to see it in the hands of these dedicated competitors for the first time.
Thanks for that! Now all we have to do is wait to see who's invited... I have no idea what the scene looks like now-Any chance liquid will be represented?
i would say ken is probably going. they probably want to invite big names to get more attention, even if they're not the best right now.
On April 30 2014 09:26 Yergidy wrote: Smash 4 is going to be the game played.
he tournament will see sixteen highly-skilled Smashers converge to compete in the Wii U version of the new title, streamed live for the world to see it in the hands of these dedicated competitors for the first time.
Thanks for that! Now all we have to do is wait to see who's invited... I have no idea what the scene looks like now-Any chance liquid will be represented?
i would say ken is probably going. they probably want to invite big names to get more attention, even if they're not the best right now.
Especially because it will be a new game, so no one should be that much more skilled than anyone else. He'd definitely draw in the viewers
I'm going to assume they will try and invite as many different players as they can that player different characters. So I doubt the 3 best foxes are gonna make the tourney or multiple Marth guys.
On April 30 2014 20:14 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: this is awesome
I disagree. This is Nintendo we are talking about, so they will probably give the players the game one or two days before the tournament and then tell them to put up a good show. And after SSBB, I lost any trust I had in them. The new game might be better than SSBB but it will be far behind SSBM or even PM.
Brawl has its problems but I really feel like it's pretty underrated. It doesn't have the huge issue that crouch canceling is that kills aggression in Melee, at least.
It also shouldn't take much longer than a day or two to learn to play a new super smash bros game if you've been competitive in the past titles.
This sounds like less of a competition and more of a promotional event. Much like everything else it's a nice step in the right direction, but it's not a giant leap.
On May 01 2014 00:35 Lucumo wrote: I disagree. This is Nintendo we are talking about, so they will probably give the players the game one or two days before the tournament and then tell them to put up a good show. And after SSBB, I lost any trust I had in them. The new game might be better than SSBB but it will be far behind SSBM or even PM.
Would you rather have them continue ignoring the smash scene? At best, this is a gesture of goodwill towards the competitive players and scene that hints that Nintendo is willing to foster and support their game in a competitive medium. At worst, 16 players are given the opportunity to play on one of the biggest stages that the gaming industry can offer and given attention by many casual smash enthusiasts who want to see the new game being played out.
Shouldn't be so quick to judge the game before it's been properly exposed and evaluated!
+ didn't savior and some other guys at blizzcon play the sc2 alpha while they were hosted by blizzard and people were like fuck this is awesome and shit. if the proper players are invited, really doubt it'll be an issue for them to pick up on the basic new nuances of the game and maybe even develop some tricks.
maybe this is some huge plot by nintendo to have pro players dissect the game and learn its advanced techniques so they can take them out of the final game
On May 01 2014 12:41 chipmonklord17 wrote: maybe this is some huge plot by nintendo to have pro players dissect the game and learn its advanced techniques so they can take them out of the final game
Mmm. Reminds me of when people were allowed to test Wind Waker HD and someone found some speedrunning glitches that carried over into the remake, so they patched them out then.
On May 01 2014 12:41 chipmonklord17 wrote: maybe this is some huge plot by nintendo to have pro players dissect the game and learn its advanced techniques so they can take them out of the final game
Mmm. Reminds me of when people were allowed to test Wind Waker HD and someone found some speedrunning glitches that carried over into the remake, so they patched them out then.
there's a conspiracy theory that holds that this actually happened with Brawl also, actually. there was definitely an event that competitive smashers went to to play Brawl pre-release, and there was definitely a bunch of stuff observed and written about on GF and SWF as being neat things for competitive play that was gone in the final game. and that could easily be coincidence, but that's why i said "conspiracy theory".
On May 01 2014 00:35 Lucumo wrote: I disagree. This is Nintendo we are talking about, so they will probably give the players the game one or two days before the tournament and then tell them to put up a good show. And after SSBB, I lost any trust I had in them. The new game might be better than SSBB but it will be far behind SSBM or even PM.
Would you rather have them continue ignoring the smash scene? At best, this is a gesture of goodwill towards the competitive players and scene that hints that Nintendo is willing to foster and support their game in a competitive medium. At worst, 16 players are given the opportunity to play on one of the biggest stages that the gaming industry can offer and given attention by many casual smash enthusiasts who want to see the new game being played out.
Shouldn't be so quick to judge the game before it's been properly exposed and evaluated!
Well, I didn't judge the game, unless you want to count the part with SSBM.
And yes, I want them to. Nintendo hasn't shown any positive things so far and they seem more like any other big company that wants to control everything. Do I need to say any more than "Youtube" or EVO last year?
On May 01 2014 05:04 Gamegene wrote: Would you rather have them continue ignoring the smash scene?
I don't know what world you live in, but Nintendo hasn't been ignoring the smash scene, they have been trying to kill it. If you wanted to be objective the best thing would be for Nintendo to stop making new Smash games all together and to ignore the scene. Smash is a game driven by a community of passionate individuals who love the game, and their efforts are causing the game to grow and break records more than a decade after its release. I can only see a profit driven entity interfering with said community as a negative thing, but that is just me.
On May 01 2014 00:35 Lucumo wrote: I disagree. This is Nintendo we are talking about, so they will probably give the players the game one or two days before the tournament and then tell them to put up a good show. And after SSBB, I lost any trust I had in them. The new game might be better than SSBB but it will be far behind SSBM or even PM.
Would you rather have them continue ignoring the smash scene? At best, this is a gesture of goodwill towards the competitive players and scene that hints that Nintendo is willing to foster and support their game in a competitive medium. At worst, 16 players are given the opportunity to play on one of the biggest stages that the gaming industry can offer and given attention by many casual smash enthusiasts who want to see the new game being played out.
Shouldn't be so quick to judge the game before it's been properly exposed and evaluated!
Well, I didn't judge the game, unless you want to count the part with SSBM.
And yes, I want them to. Nintendo hasn't shown any positive things so far and they seem more like any other big company that wants to control everything. Do I need to say any more than "Youtube" or EVO last year?
I think EVO was an eye opening thing for Nintendo, to see how many viewers competitive smash got. It may have even played a role in them doing more for the competitive scene.
On May 01 2014 05:07 Gamegene wrote: + didn't savior and some other guys at blizzcon play the sc2 alpha while they were hosted by blizzard and people were like fuck this is awesome and shit. if the proper players are invited, really doubt it'll be an issue for them to pick up on the basic new nuances of the game and maybe even develop some tricks.
I don't remember the players but yes I was one of those :D
Did you all take stupid pills this morning? (not trying to be offensive, just a good Toy Story quote for this situation).
Do you guys remember Brawl? Do you guys remember how they had a tournament for that too? Do any of you remember that Nintendo themselves attempted to stop Melee from being streamed at EVO last year, then barely gave permission to EVO to let it be played again and streamed? And Sakurai still being against competitive gaming?
What this news means is that Nintendo still doesn't give a shit about Smash bros. - They're low on money, and need some good press. They're not going to help the competitive scene, and more than likely, is attempting to kill both Melee and PM so people will play the new smash game. Remember, the Wii U has done horribly, and they need a title to make them money. Once they have the smash community in their hands, they will break it again, and they will not feel bad.
I like Nintendo, don't get me wrong, but I'm not stupid enough to believe that they've suddenly decided to appreciate the smash community. They've been nothing but tyrants lately when it comes to their games (see: Youtube Witch Hunt for Nintendo content), and I don't think they suddenly fizzled out. THey're going to do what every entity with power does - which is convince the masses they are good, then slowly do what said entity originally planned.
I want to be excited about this news, I do - But given the evidence and circumstances, I have serious doubts about Nintendo being completely legit about this whole thing.
On May 01 2014 00:35 Lucumo wrote: I disagree. This is Nintendo we are talking about, so they will probably give the players the game one or two days before the tournament and then tell them to put up a good show. And after SSBB, I lost any trust I had in them. The new game might be better than SSBB but it will be far behind SSBM or even PM.
Would you rather have them continue ignoring the smash scene? At best, this is a gesture of goodwill towards the competitive players and scene that hints that Nintendo is willing to foster and support their game in a competitive medium. At worst, 16 players are given the opportunity to play on one of the biggest stages that the gaming industry can offer and given attention by many casual smash enthusiasts who want to see the new game being played out.
Shouldn't be so quick to judge the game before it's been properly exposed and evaluated!
Yes, I would definitely prefer they ignored the scene. It has done fine without them. The only thing we need from Nintendo is to let us play and stream the game. Everything else can be taken care of by the scene.
I'm shocked. Welcome to the party, Nintendo. Where were you 7 years ago when you broke my heart? I hope the players really genuinely enjoy it. The last thing Nintendo needs is another brawl where 90% of the competitive scene immediately quits or sees glaring problems with the mechanics of high level play.
On May 03 2014 09:30 hoby2000 wrote: Did you all take stupid pills this morning? (not trying to be offensive, just a good Toy Story quote for this situation).
Do you guys remember Brawl? Do you guys remember how they had a tournament for that too? Do any of you remember that Nintendo themselves attempted to stop Melee from being streamed at EVO last year, then barely gave permission to EVO to let it be played again and streamed? And Sakurai still being against competitive gaming?
What this news means is that Nintendo still doesn't give a shit about Smash bros. - They're low on money, and need some good press. They're not going to help the competitive scene, and more than likely, is attempting to kill both Melee and PM so people will play the new smash game. Remember, the Wii U has done horribly, and they need a title to make them money. Once they have the smash community in their hands, they will break it again, and they will not feel bad.
I like Nintendo, don't get me wrong, but I'm not stupid enough to believe that they've suddenly decided to appreciate the smash community. They've been nothing but tyrants lately when it comes to their games (see: Youtube Witch Hunt for Nintendo content), and I don't think they suddenly fizzled out. THey're going to do what every entity with power does - which is convince the masses they are good, then slowly do what said entity originally planned.
I want to be excited about this news, I do - But given the evidence and circumstances, I have serious doubts about Nintendo being completely legit about this whole thing.
at the same time, there's reasons why nintendo would want to flip flop now: smash documentary, successful esports tournaments in FGC,LoL,Dota2 (with the latter two being extremely profitable for the developer companies) with more and more general acceptance of this stuff, a good way to show off their new game
also its an invitiational. im not sure who theyre going to invite, but if theyre going to invite well known players the last thing they would want to do is make them and the community mad.
valve has done the whole ignorance of esports in the past with the way they squashed css, after dota2 they completely changed and are very attentive to these things now
On May 03 2014 11:24 rabidch wrote: at the same time, there's reasons why nintendo would want to flip flop now: smash documentary, successful esports tournaments in FGC,LoL,Dota2 (with the latter two being extremely profitable for the developer companies) with more and more general acceptance of this stuff, a good way to show off their new game
also its an invitiational. im not sure who theyre going to invite, but if theyre going to invite well known players the last thing they would want to do is make them and the community mad.
valve has done the whole ignorance of esports in the past with the way they squashed css, after dota2 they completely changed and are very attentive to these things now
Valve are gods because they did the thing that every other developer has been to retarded to do, and that is to make a .99 to 1 port of the previous game with updated graphics. The only way that Smash4 could possibly be completely successful and good for the community would for it to be a .99 to 1 port of Melee with updated graphics and new characters + stages. This would be the only reason why many competitive smashers would buy a WiiU. I see setups being a GIGANTIC issue with smash4, as fucking no one owns a WiiU. Can you even use gamecube controllers on a wiiU? That would also be a deal breaker, because if you can't use them no one will switch.
On May 03 2014 11:24 rabidch wrote: at the same time, there's reasons why nintendo would want to flip flop now: smash documentary, successful esports tournaments in FGC,LoL,Dota2 (with the latter two being extremely profitable for the developer companies) with more and more general acceptance of this stuff, a good way to show off their new game
also its an invitiational. im not sure who theyre going to invite, but if theyre going to invite well known players the last thing they would want to do is make them and the community mad.
valve has done the whole ignorance of esports in the past with the way they squashed css, after dota2 they completely changed and are very attentive to these things now
Valve are gods because they did the thing that every other developer has been to retarded to do, and that is to make a .99 to 1 port of the previous game with updated graphics. The only way that Smash4 could possibly be completely successful and good for the community would for it to be a .99 to 1 port of Melee with updated graphics and new characters + stages. This would be the only reason why many competitive smashers would buy a WiiU. I see setups being a GIGANTIC issue with smash4, as fucking no one owns a WiiU. Can you even use gamecube controllers on a wiiU? That would also be a deal breaker, because if you can't use them no one will switch.
There are also 3rd party connectors for game cube to wii u.
I don't understand why everyone is so insistant on shutting this down with negativity.. but I'll say a gamecube controller as a dealbreaker is really scraping the bottom of the barrel. Why doesn't everyone just have a "wait and see" feeling towards it. Worst case scenario you keep playing melee the same as you always have. Who knows, you may be pleasantly surprised.
I really hope this is just the first step towards Nintendo becoming the best gaming company in the world. I love Nintendo, but their decisions ever since N64 have just been so bad
On May 03 2014 13:09 Yergidy wrote: Worst case scenario you keep playing melee the same as you always have.
The worst case scenario is that the community fragments AGAIN, melee/PM is thrown back another couple of years, and people can no longer play the game they want to play as much as they do now. Go look up what happened to Melee in the immediate few years after brawl, what happened to the counterstrike community after Source, what happened to the Quake community after Quake 4, and what happened to the Halo community after Halo Reach before you post your optimistic 'lets wait and see guys! Whats the worse that could happen?!'.
On May 03 2014 13:09 Yergidy wrote: Worst case scenario you keep playing melee the same as you always have.
The worst case scenario is that the community fragments AGAIN, melee/PM is thrown back another couple of years, and people can no longer play the game they want to play as much as they do now. Go look up what happened to Melee in the immediate few years after brawl, what happened to the counterstrike community after Source, what happened to the Quake community after Quake 4, and what happened to the Halo community after Halo Reach before you post your optimistic 'lets wait and see guys! Whats the worse that could happen?!'.
The worst case scenario is Smash 4 awakens some sodomy demon who enslaves the human race and repeatedly rapes your urethra.
However, I will just wait and see as you were so kindly advised to do. Fretting about it won't change anything. Besides, Nintendo is making this game with severe help from a "real" fighting game developer, so it could easily be competitive viable. Who knows. Wait and see.
On May 03 2014 13:09 Yergidy wrote: Worst case scenario you keep playing melee the same as you always have.
The worst case scenario is that the community fragments AGAIN, melee/PM is thrown back another couple of years, and people can no longer play the game they want to play as much as they do now. Go look up what happened to Melee in the immediate few years after brawl, what happened to the counterstrike community after Source, what happened to the Quake community after Quake 4, and what happened to the Halo community after Halo Reach before you post your optimistic 'lets wait and see guys! Whats the worse that could happen?!'.
While I do have my own doubts about how well it'll do as a competitive game, at least Nintendo is actually acknowledging the competitive community this time.
Smash 4 is coming out whether we like it or not, and it sure as hell isn't going to be a melee port. If it does end up splintering the scene again, we'll just have to deal with it when the time comes. It's pointless worrying about this sort of thing.
On May 03 2014 12:44 Reuental wrote: Can you even use gamecube controllers on a wiiU? That would also be a deal breaker, because if you can't use them no one will switch.
How exactly is that a deal breaker haha The GC controller is NOT by any means the be-all-end-all of smash.
On May 03 2014 12:44 Reuental wrote: Can you even use gamecube controllers on a wiiU? That would also be a deal breaker, because if you can't use them no one will switch.
How exactly is that a deal breaker haha The GC controller is NOT by any means the be-all-end-all of smash.
I am sorry, I should been more clear, I should have said 'gamecube equivalent controller'. All I remember is that the original Wii classic controller wasn't so hot(they might have not updated and put out a new version, not sure). Also, I after a 10 second google search I couldn't find any wired WiiU controllers which is important, not because of lag+ Show Spoiler +
I don't want people to think that I have implied that modern wireless controllers have noticeable delay, they don't
, but because they might interfere with each other at large events. I remember this being a issue at large xbox 360 events, but technology might have progressed to the point where this is no longer a issue.
On May 03 2014 12:44 Reuental wrote: Can you even use gamecube controllers on a wiiU? That would also be a deal breaker, because if you can't use them no one will switch.
How exactly is that a deal breaker haha The GC controller is NOT by any means the be-all-end-all of smash.
I am sorry, I should been more clear, I should have said 'gamecube equivalent controller'. All I remember is that the original Wii classic controller wasn't so hot(they might have not updated and put out a new version, not sure). Also, I after a 10 second google search I couldn't find any wired WiiU controllers which is important, not because of lag+ Show Spoiler +
I don't want people to think that I have implied that modern wireless controllers have noticeable delay, they don't
, but because they might interfere with each other at large events. I remember this being a issue at large xbox 360 events, but technology might have progressed to the point where this is no longer a issue.
Rumors on twitter today says the current list of invited players sucks ass. Although nothing official has been released, such rumors aren't difficult to believe.
Whether the invitational is for competitive players or personalities with a strong connection to Nintendo products is still up in the air, as these Tweets indicate either a personality showcase or a very involved event.
On May 01 2014 02:20 EchOne wrote: Are you saying that crouch canceling kills aggression in Melee? That's an odd statement to make, care to elaborate further?
It doesn't lol, CC is peanuts compared to what actually "kills agression" in Brawl.
This tournament is garbage. 4 player FFA with items? FD only finals? No Mang0, Mew2king, or Armada? The players they invited are good, but they're not the best.
Nintendo still sucks, and this tournament is going to suck. Anyone who believes differently only has hope because from what I'm seeing here - Nintendo still doesn't give enough of a shit for anyone to get hyped. They only care enough to take the monies from players, and that's it. I get they're a business, but pretending that they're into the competitive scene with this crap disgusts me, and the fact that everyone is believing this hype is even worse.
i like Smash, and honestly, I've been a big fan of Nintendo for most of my life, but I'm not dumb enough to believe they actually care about the scene. They don't, and everyone is going to realize this after the game comes out, and it still sucks.
Eh, I'm not so pessimistic about the tournament itself; Nintendo's goal is to sell to casuals, so they need to show some 4-player FFAs with items on As for the lack of Mang0/Mew2king, that's definitely an "image" thing--Nintendo needs professional-looking, well-adjusted people to be playing, not LMFAOOOOOOOOOO Mang0 :/
The Gamecube controller thing is actually pretty exciting, tbh. Yeah, I still have pretty low hopes for the game being any good competitively, but we'll have to wait a year or two to see.
On May 30 2014 04:08 hoby2000 wrote: This tournament is garbage. 4 player FFA with items? FD only finals? No Mang0, Mew2king, or Armada? The players they invited are good, but they're not the best.
Nintendo still sucks, and this tournament is going to suck. Anyone who believes differently only has hope because from what I'm seeing here - Nintendo still doesn't give enough of a shit for anyone to get hyped. They only care enough to take the monies from players, and that's it. I get they're a business, but pretending that they're into the competitive scene with this crap disgusts me, and the fact that everyone is believing this hype is even worse.
i like Smash, and honestly, I've been a big fan of Nintendo for most of my life, but I'm not dumb enough to believe they actually care about the scene. They don't, and everyone is going to realize this after the game comes out, and it still sucks.
lmao don't be an entitled baby. For the people complaining about the rules, this tournament isn't just for you lol You can't expect them to host a 1v1, FD, fox only, no items tournament in the (probably) most important E3 in their recent history. So much depends on this game for Nintendo, they're seriously leaving no stone un-turned in the dev of this game, and they want to show it all off to the world at E3. This isn't a full out competitive tourney, it's a showcase of the new game. The GF on battlefield 1v1 no items is there for us. Stop b*tching.
As for the players, I'm glad they didn't invite mango and his BM, who knows what M2K would comment on with his no-filter attitude, and I wish they would've brought armada, but who knows what those circumstances are.
On May 30 2014 04:08 hoby2000 wrote: This tournament is garbage. 4 player FFA with items? FD only finals? No Mang0, Mew2king, or Armada? The players they invited are good, but they're not the best.
Nintendo still sucks, and this tournament is going to suck. Anyone who believes differently only has hope because from what I'm seeing here - Nintendo still doesn't give enough of a shit for anyone to get hyped. They only care enough to take the monies from players, and that's it. I get they're a business, but pretending that they're into the competitive scene with this crap disgusts me, and the fact that everyone is believing this hype is even worse.
i like Smash, and honestly, I've been a big fan of Nintendo for most of my life, but I'm not dumb enough to believe they actually care about the scene. They don't, and everyone is going to realize this after the game comes out, and it still sucks.
lmao don't be an entitled baby. For the people complaining about the rules, this tournament isn't just for you lol You can't expect them to host a 1v1, FD, fox only, no items tournament in the (probably) most important E3 in their recent history. So much depends on this game for Nintendo, they're seriously leaving no stone un-turned in the dev of this game, and they want to show it all off to the world at E3. This isn't a full out competitive tourney, it's a showcase of the new game. The GF on battlefield 1v1 no items is there for us. Stop b*tching.
As for the players, I'm glad they didn't invite mango and his BM, who knows what M2K would comment on with his no-filter attitude, and I wish they would've brought armada, but who knows what those circumstances are.
i agree a little bit, but i do hope that those that were invited and do attend speak up about the game if its not good. that is way more important than this invitational
On May 30 2014 04:08 hoby2000 wrote: This tournament is garbage. 4 player FFA with items? FD only finals? No Mang0, Mew2king, or Armada? The players they invited are good, but they're not the best.
Nintendo still sucks, and this tournament is going to suck. Anyone who believes differently only has hope because from what I'm seeing here - Nintendo still doesn't give enough of a shit for anyone to get hyped. They only care enough to take the monies from players, and that's it. I get they're a business, but pretending that they're into the competitive scene with this crap disgusts me, and the fact that everyone is believing this hype is even worse.
i like Smash, and honestly, I've been a big fan of Nintendo for most of my life, but I'm not dumb enough to believe they actually care about the scene. They don't, and everyone is going to realize this after the game comes out, and it still sucks.
Mew2King at least was a developer, they couldn't invite those.
It's not supposed to be a competitive tournament, it's to show off the game. Everyone can only pick one character so there's no mirror matchups at all, that's to show off as many champions as possible. Obviously items will be on - Even I who never play with items want to see what the new items are like. Aren't you just misunderstanding completely? It's incredible that they have a fun event like this to show off the game by players that are actually good(Even if they aren't the best).
Where did you get the idea that it was supposed to be a competitive tournament, anyway? The grand finals also being in the competitive format is in my opinion a great move and also will show a bit of the competitive aspect as well, after we've received information on a lot of the new stages, items and characters. I don't understand what you were expecting.
About the game potentially being good competitively - If a game as shitty as Brawl can have the level of competitive play it does, if this game is just a bit better and more fluid, it'll be wonderful. Them removing L-canceling and reducing all aerial lag by 50% is still the dream.
On May 30 2014 04:08 hoby2000 wrote: This tournament is garbage. 4 player FFA with items? FD only finals? No Mang0, Mew2king, or Armada? The players they invited are good, but they're not the best.
Nintendo still sucks, and this tournament is going to suck. Anyone who believes differently only has hope because from what I'm seeing here - Nintendo still doesn't give enough of a shit for anyone to get hyped. They only care enough to take the monies from players, and that's it. I get they're a business, but pretending that they're into the competitive scene with this crap disgusts me, and the fact that everyone is believing this hype is even worse.
i like Smash, and honestly, I've been a big fan of Nintendo for most of my life, but I'm not dumb enough to believe they actually care about the scene. They don't, and everyone is going to realize this after the game comes out, and it still sucks.
Mew2King at least was a developer, they couldn't invite those.
Lol did people actually expect this to be a competitive tournament? Let's not be delusional, they are trying to appeal to as big of an audience as possible. If I was Nintendo I wouldn't run a full competitive ruleset either even though I'm a staunch competitive player.
I'm excited both for the tournament and for the adapter. Nintendo at least cares somewhat about the people that take this game seriously, enough to sell us a way to play this new game with the same controller we all love. The tournament is just a hodge podge of semi recognizable faces playing to show of the new characters, mechanics, and items. It should be entertaining at the very least.
I Rofl'd at 4 player FFA with items in a competitive setting. Yes, it is a competitive setting, i get nintendo only care about the casual £££ advertising, but then don't host a competitive tournament to advertise ?
On May 30 2014 15:33 Capped wrote: I Rofl'd at 4 player FFA with items in a competitive setting. Yes, it is a competitive setting, i get nintendo only care about the casual £££ advertising, but then don't host a competitive tournament to advertise ?
Guess you gotta take what you can get.
Where do you get that it's a competitive tournament?
Literally the video says it's for FUN. They're hosting an invitational not so you can jack off to a competitive tourney, but rather so they can show case a new game with new stages, items, characters and controls for all their audiences, not just hardcore gamers. They picked a handful of recognizable and competent players so that people could see the potential this game has when played by people not completely unfamiliar with SSB.
Literally this is the best move they can make, they can show a bunch of 'casuals' how fun this game can be, and you can see some decent players testing out new characters and stages for when/if a competitive scene is born from this.
man leffen was bitching about the tournament format all over twitter, that was really annoying. Looks like it'll be fun though, I'll be watching a little bit of it
It's shows game casual fun format and it's glorious competitive form.
Also remember that smash4 online will also feature those 2 modes: competitive and casual,in the same format as the modes being played in the invitational.
It's also cool that every stage has a final destination version.
On May 31 2014 00:30 ArvickHero wrote: man leffen was bitching about the tournament format all over twitter, that was really annoying. Looks like it'll be fun though, I'll be watching a little bit of it
I don't take anything leffen says seriously. He's a good fox and all, but it doesn't mean he's worth listening to. He strikes me as the kind of person who would complain at the drop of a hat.
I've probably played hundreds of Smash 64 and Melee games over the years, I'm pretty sure almost all of them were FFA with items on, the percentage of people who actually care about 1v1 without items is tiny.
On June 04 2014 01:53 Cheren wrote: I've probably played hundreds of Smash 64 and Melee games over the years, I'm pretty sure almost all of them were FFA with items on, the percentage of people who actually care about 1v1 without items is tiny.
On June 04 2014 01:53 Cheren wrote: I've probably played hundreds of Smash 64 and Melee games over the years, I'm pretty sure almost all of them were FFA with items on, the percentage of people who actually care about 1v1 without items is tiny.
Lol. Hundreds.
Yea you aren't COOL if you haven't played MILLIONS of games with one arm behind your back and two eye patches on!
My casual player sample are some friends at school and my little sisters and their friends and while we play with items on low-ish from time to time, it's still always stock matches and generally teams or 1v1.
SSBM we play with items on far more often than SSBB, almost all SSBB items suck and are unfun for the casuals I know.
On June 04 2014 01:53 Cheren wrote: I've probably played hundreds of Smash 64 and Melee games over the years, I'm pretty sure almost all of them were FFA with items on, the percentage of people who actually care about 1v1 without items is tiny.
Obviously. But Nintendo went out of their way to contact representatives from the community who do care about it, which is why people here are excited at all .
The GameCube Controller Adapter for Wii U, which supports up to four GCN controllers (including WaveBird), will be available for $19.99 USD.
Nintendo will also sell Smash Bros. branded GameCube controllers for $29.99 USD each. Lastly, a special Smash Bros. for Wii U bundle, which includes a copy of the game, one adapter, and a GCN controller, will be sold for $99.99 USD.
The GameCube Controller Adapter for Wii U, which supports up to four GCN controllers (including WaveBird), will be available for $19.99 USD.
Nintendo will also sell Smash Bros. branded GameCube controllers for $29.99 USD each. Lastly, a special Smash Bros. for Wii U bundle, which includes a copy of the game, one adapter, and a GCN controller, will be sold for $99.99 USD.
Im not so into the scene...how much "elite" is this E3 tour? I might have seen one of the casters at another Smash tour before...but as i said, im not so into the scene. >.>
On June 11 2014 08:23 Roggay wrote: Is it just me or does this game looks exactly like brawl?
There's no tripping. Definetly a step forward. Also we don't know if there's stuff like L-cancel, wavedash etc yet. Stuff like get figured out eventually.
Whoever played WiiFit Trainer was playing the most coward possible. Like if you ever play with 4 friends, there's always this one friend, who just stands back, throws items from afar or just using the characters projectiles, waiting to land that one final blow, but when it comes down to 1v1 he gets rekt.
#E: It didn't look like Rosalina had more votes to me.
On June 11 2014 08:41 Talron wrote: Whoever played WiiFit Trainer was playing the most coward possible. Like if you ever play with 4 friends, there's always this one friend, who just stands back, throws items from afar or just using the characters projectiles, waiting to land that one final blow, but when it comes down to 1v1 he gets rekt.
#E: It didn't look like Rosalina had more votes to me.
Rosalina didn't have more votes, Rosalina had the better score. There never should even have been a fan vote.
The actual winner of a match goes on and then they vote for their favorite for a ffa so they have a 2nd chance, okay? But what about the guy placing 2nd after score?
On June 11 2014 08:49 Talron wrote: Okay I don't understand this.
The actual winner of a match goes on and then they vote for their favorite for a ffa so they have a 2nd chance, okay? But what about the guy placing 2nd after score?
Well, it looks less floaty than brawl, and there is not tripping (yet <.<).
If people were expecting meele, they were going to be dissapointed. But i'll also wait to see how the finals with no items end up like. I don't watch that much smash, so for me it won't make that much of a difference, but it would be nice that this game can create a healthy professional community.
On June 11 2014 09:01 [SXG]Phantom wrote: Well, it looks less floaty than brawl, and there is not tripping (yet <.<).
If people were expecting meele, they were going to be dissapointed. But i'll also wait to see how the finals with no items end up like. I don't watch that much smash, so for me it won't make that much of a difference, but it would be nice is this game can create a healthy professional community..
I don't mind brawl apart from the few things that make it a chore(no good stopping mechanic out of dash, tripping). I don't even mind no combos, I like the airdodge / jump mindgames.
On June 11 2014 09:01 [SXG]Phantom wrote: Well, it looks less floaty than brawl, and there is not tripping (yet <.<).
If people were expecting meele, they were going to be dissapointed. But i'll also wait to see how the finals with no items end up like. I don't watch that much smash, so for me it won't make that much of a difference, but it would be nice is this game can create a healthy professional community..
I don't mind brawl apart from the few things that make it a chore(no good stopping mechanic out of dash, tripping). I don't even mind no combos, I like the airdodge / jump mindgames.
guys, there are 242,949 people watching the tournament if we add the nintendo stream and the twitch channel stream (wich is also showing the tournament)
I would like convince all other players to gang up on the wii fit trainer and just kill her off, really annoying playing against people like this who only run away because they suck at the game
On June 11 2014 09:18 RaiKageRyu wrote: You can feel that the casters are starting to get tired. Realized the mistake of shouting too loud too much in the first rounds.
Hbox / kirby is more of a coward then the wiifit trainer. I sat and watched him ledgegrab / huffpuff off the edge for 20+ seconds, been doing shit like that both matches lol? Stop hating on one then cheering for the other O.o
On June 11 2014 09:23 Capped wrote: Hbox / kirby is more of a coward then the wiifit trainer. I sat and watched him ledgegrab / huffpuff off the edge for 20+ seconds, been doing shit like that both matches lol?
On June 11 2014 09:23 Capped wrote: Hbox / kirby is more of a coward then the wiifit trainer. I sat and watched him ledgegrab / huffpuff off the edge for 20+ seconds, been doing shit like that both matches lol? Stop hating on one then cheering for the other O.o
On June 11 2014 09:23 Capped wrote: Hbox / kirby is more of a coward then the wiifit trainer. I sat and watched him ledgegrab / huffpuff off the edge for 20+ seconds, been doing shit like that both matches lol? Stop hating on one then cheering for the other O.o
Needs to or the wiifit trainer wins.
Hungrybox is a lot more legit a player and played the last round better. And comparing to 20 seconds to 10 minutes? And saying more of a coward?
On June 11 2014 09:23 Capped wrote: Hbox / kirby is more of a coward then the wiifit trainer. I sat and watched him ledgegrab / huffpuff off the edge for 20+ seconds, been doing shit like that both matches lol? Stop hating on one then cheering for the other O.o
pretty sad the bias here...and the ratio of camping between them wasn't 20 seconds to 10 minutes so learn2count or shut up and enjoy the show lol. also this is not a serious tournament
On June 11 2014 09:23 Capped wrote: Hbox / kirby is more of a coward then the wiifit trainer. I sat and watched him ledgegrab / huffpuff off the edge for 20+ seconds, been doing shit like that both matches lol? Stop hating on one then cheering for the other O.o
LOL DUDE Wii fit trainer did it in both games. It was totally bm
"20 seconds" was an example of what he had been doing continuously, please read again. He did the exact same shit as the wiifit trainer in both his games, regardless of whether or not he is a "more legit competitor" (Yes im aware of who he is and have never heard of the chick playing wiifit trainer.)
On June 11 2014 09:29 RaiKageRyu wrote: Wish I could see the brackets. Not sure how this is working out. Fan favorite is like losers bracket or an entirely spun-off pity braceket?
It's a completely different bracket. There are 2 different trophies.
On June 11 2014 09:31 kirsed wrote: So have the players been playing this for a few weeks or is this their first time playing? (I know nothing about anything regarding smash)
On June 11 2014 09:31 kirsed wrote: So have the players been playing this for a few weeks or is this their first time playing? (I know nothing about anything regarding smash)
The way I understand it they only had "practice time"(how ever long that is) today before the tourney.
These finals give me a lot of hope for the competitive side of the game - watching the 2 side-by-side in the traditional format, Smash 4 is a LOT faster than Brawl.
On June 11 2014 10:11 JJH777 wrote: How long does a 4stock match typically take in melee at the pro level?
Less than this, but keep in mind that these are players on a new game with minimal experience, were character-locked from the start, and are tired from playing this as a big stage show.
Pretty exciting overall. The sudden death victory is sure to be bitter with some people but to be fair Hungrybox was asking for that kind of loss the way he played in the earlier rounds ^^. Just a taste of his own medicine.
On June 11 2014 10:16 Roggay wrote: Why did they put a time limit anyway?...
because thats normally how 1v1s are played, except its not decided by sudden death but by percentage.
anyway im not hyped for this game at all. its basically a marginally better brawl and i doubt they'll make any huge changes this soon before release
In Brawl you would have 3 stocks in a 8 minute match which would have been perfect. In Brawl 4 stock matches would time out all the time as well.
While it is WAAAAAAAAAAAY too early to make assessment based on a single no-items 1v1, it seems that 3-stock might be a perfect setup for Smash 4, with few to no timeouts. We'll see what develops when MikeHaze and Keitaro and the like get their hands on it.
On June 11 2014 10:16 Roggay wrote: Why did they put a time limit anyway?...
Because there is a clock on every competitive Smash match in every tournament ever.
Im not a Smash brothers follower , but that Sudden Death didnt looked very good. Was it always like that? The one who gets a lucky hit first wins. Looks really bad for a competitive scene. If they really want to build up a big scene they should change that.
On June 11 2014 10:16 Roggay wrote: Why did they put a time limit anyway?...
Because there is a clock on every competitive Smash match in every tournament ever.
Im not a Smash brothers follower , but that Sudden Death didnt looked very good. Was it always like that? The one who gets a lucky hit first wins. Looks really bad for a competitive scene. If they really want to build up a big scene they should change that.
Competitive SSBM never has sudden death, games are decided by who has higher % at the end(Which is stupid as well since Snake for example would naturally tend to have higher % than Jigglypuff)
On June 11 2014 10:16 Roggay wrote: Why did they put a time limit anyway?...
Because there is a clock on every competitive Smash match in every tournament ever.
Im not a Smash brothers follower , but that Sudden Death didnt looked very good. Was it always like that? The one who gets a lucky hit first wins. Looks really bad for a competitive scene. If they really want to build up a big scene they should change that.
Tournament rules just take the %age when the time runs out.
On June 11 2014 10:16 Roggay wrote: Why did they put a time limit anyway?...
Because there is a clock on every competitive Smash match in every tournament ever.
Im not a Smash brothers follower , but that Sudden Death didnt looked very good. Was it always like that? The one who gets a lucky hit first wins. Looks really bad for a competitive scene. If they really want to build up a big scene they should change that.
Tournament rules just take the %age when the time runs out.
Which has caused some extremely epic moments in tourney, like hbox vs armada or shroomed vs soft
On June 11 2014 10:16 Roggay wrote: Why did they put a time limit anyway?...
Because there is a clock on every competitive Smash match in every tournament ever.
Im not a Smash brothers follower , but that Sudden Death didnt looked very good. Was it always like that? The one who gets a lucky hit first wins. Looks really bad for a competitive scene. If they really want to build up a big scene they should change that.
Competitive SSBM never has sudden death, games are decided by who has higher % at the end(Which is stupid as well since Snake for example would naturally tend to have higher % than Jigglypuff)
That's PM or Brawl for you. It's actually more in favor or the heavier characters like Snake since they will live longer and win with the stock lead if it does come to a timeout. Either way, the % rule rarely comes into play in Melee since the game is so fast. Other rules such as no stage bans in Bo5 sets affect the game and certain characters way more, such as Captain Falcon which Scar mentioned in his interview.
On June 11 2014 10:27 Talron wrote: On a scale from 0-10 how hyped are you guys for SSB4?
I'm somewhere around 6. 7 if I'm being generous.
Probably a 2 or 3. It looked good, but it's not gonna make me go out and buy a Wii U. It's also not gonna supplant Melee as the competitive Smash title IMO, so no hype there either.
Well, ssb 4 is going to be fun to play with some friends or my little sisters, I'm sure. Although I don't get the point of playing it over brawl or melee - What exactly is new and revolutionary in comparison to those games?
I wanted the game to be somewhat good but it seems like I'll be sticking with Melee for the foreseeable future. Which I don't mind. By the way, Melee still has much better art than either Brawl or SSB4. I don't get how they butchered so many characters and animations especially(Marth Sword, Fox/Falco leg animations look disgusting in Brawl and SSB4)
On June 11 2014 10:42 Shikyo wrote: Well, ssb 4 is going to be fun to play with some friends or my little sisters, I'm sure. Although I don't get the point of playing it over brawl or melee - What exactly is new and revolutionary in comparison to those games?
I wanted the game to be somewhat good but it seems like I'll be sticking with Melee for the foreseeable future. Which I don't mind. By the way, Melee still has much better art than either Brawl or SSB4. I don't get how they butchered so many characters and animations especially(Marth Sword, Fox/Falco leg animations look disgusting in Brawl and SSB4)
i agree with the comment about the art. It's too fucking flashy with lens glare effect to clearly see wtf is happening
" A competitive Smash player is trying to challenge Sakurai to see if he can win and help balance the game. Sakurai asked "have you ever made a game?""
On June 11 2014 12:06 amazingxkcd wrote: FUCK SAKURAI, FUCK YOU SAKURAI
" A competitive Smash player is trying to challenge Sakurai to see if he can win and help balance the game. Sakurai asked "have you ever made a game?""
On June 11 2014 13:33 Thrillz wrote: Looks like another dud.
Why can't it be both competitive and casual? Would that be so hard?
Guess we'll see PM WiiU
Well, exactly. Melee was both. Back when Melee came out my friends and family didn't know anything about wavedashing/l-canceling etc and yet we still really enjoyed the game. Sakurai claims he is "trying to make the game appeal to a wider audience" when he's really doing just the opposite by alienating most of the competitive community. Not only that but the game also doesn't appeal to what I would call "long-term casuals" ie. people who don't expect to get very good but want to invest time and do their best. As soon as you realize the game has very little depth it gets boring really quick and you quit (my experience with Brawl). I spent a heck of a lot more time playing Melee than I did playing Brawl and most of my time on Brawl was spent trying to get unlockables. I feel Nintendo's stance on how to design multiplayer games is quite flawed and I'm afraid a lot of their new games won't be as successful as they were pre-wii. I kinda found it funny hearing all the "boos" when Zero won. I'm not sure it was so much that they wanted H-box to win as they were disappointed in what winning looks like in smash 4.
Lol this is starcraft 2 all over again. Everyone complaining.
People, we already have melee. If you love it, stick to it. There is never gonna be a successor that intentionally holds the same depth and potential for high level play.
On June 11 2014 15:17 Xeofreestyler wrote: Lol this is starcraft 2 all over again. Everyone complaining.
People, we already have melee. If you love it, stick to it. There is never gonna be a successor that intentionally holds the same depth and potential for high level play.
lol? DOTA 2 is the easy answer. Many fighting game sequels for the most part too (even if I think Third Strike or MvC2 is ultimately superior at least the successor is designed to have some depth).
And BW was doing fine in SK until Blizzard beat it to death with SC2 so if that's the comparison you're going to make then there's a reason to be concerned.
On June 11 2014 15:17 Xeofreestyler wrote: Lol this is starcraft 2 all over again. Everyone complaining.
People, we already have melee. If you love it, stick to it. There is never gonna be a successor that intentionally holds the same depth and potential for high level play.
lol? DOTA 2 is the easy answer. Many fighting game sequels for the most part too (even if I think Third Strike or MvC2 is ultimately superior at least the successor is designed to have some depth).
And BW was doing fine in SK until Blizzard beat it to death with SC2 so if that's the comparison you're going to make then there's a reason to be concerned.
As long as Nintendo doesn't try to kill Melee and/or release Melee HD I'm content.
I still have a sliver of hope for Smash 4. Honestly it doesn't have to be Melee 2.0, it just needs to be a good competitive game, which Brawl lacked elements of.
"Nobody" is a vast exaggeration. It's mostly TL.net generally being butthurt as always. We have a big tradition of being grumpy guys complaining about new games being made "only for the casuals".
Somehow many have expected to see advanced techniques (which have been discovered only years after the melee release) and skillful combos. In the very first 1on1 under competitive rules. To make that happen the game would have to be a exact copy of Melee down to the engine flaws. And Sakurai already said that's not gonna happen.
Id say it's naivety at best and ignorance at worst. It's like Blizzard announcing Starcraft 3 and having an invitational at blizzcon, and the reaction of TL.net after the first game would be "It's not like Broodwar thus trash. Where's my muta-stacking and stupid unit pathing? It's like Starcraft 2 all over again".
On June 11 2014 17:07 shin ken wrote: "Nobody" is a vast exaggeration. It's mostly TL.net generally being butthurt as always. We have a big tradition of being grumpy guys complaining about new games being made "only for the casuals".
Somehow many have expected to see advanced techniques (which have been discovered only years after the melee release) and skillful combos. In the very first 1on1 under competitive rules. To make that happen the game would have to be a exact copy of Melee down to the engine flaws. And Sakurai already said that's not gonna happen.
Id say it's naivety at best and ignorance at worst. It's like Blizzard announcing Starcraft 3 and having an invitational at blizzcon, and the reaction of TL.net after the first game would be "It's not like Broodwar thus trash. Where's my muta-stacking and stupid unit pathing? It's like Starcraft 2 all over again".
Ah, thanks! I thought there was something inherently wrong with it that I didn't see or know about yet
This exact cycle happened 7 years ago. It's experienced skepticism. You can pretend people wanted Melee 2.0 but you won't be able to point to a single person in this thread who realistically had this thought.
And by the way using SC2 as an argument is kind of funny, given its status now. Maybe people were more right than you'd like to admit.
edit: To answer the question though the game just looks slow without any decent offensive options.
You really have to wonder why they bothered with "For Glory" and the gamecube controller adaptor if Sakurai disregards the competitive side of his game so much.
well, there's a couple of things that you could see from first glance.
It's slower than melee (even compared to early videos of it) None of the ATs in Melee are still in (Dashdance/Lcancel/WD most importantly) Many features of the Brawl engine were used (AutoSweetspot, Dodge-engine) Other things: apparently there is lag when airdodging into the ground. might be good or bad, dunno, and some move's aren't DIable (rumor)
But my overall impression is, that there hasn't been much improvement for the competitive crowd from brawl. They will find ATs to improve movement and everything, but is it going to be enough to make agressive play rewarding, or does the game reward defensive play over pressure?
But all in all the tournament was pretty fun :D nonsense, but fun. Instant Zelda-Williams Fan :D
Gratz to Zero and Hbox for getting top place. (considering how similar Zamus (and Kirby) were were from brawl, not really a huge surprise ^^)
On June 11 2014 16:41 Torte de Lini wrote: Sorry, I had to sleep so I missed everything, but why does nobody like SSBB Wii U as a competitive game?
Cause people are being retarded as usual, they judge the game like 5-6 months before release based mostly on fucking 4 player games LOL.
We had like 2 games that was 1v1's and they werent even tournament rules really. It's not like the game FORCES the players or tournament creators to play with sudden death on and shit.
A community who's played 4 major iterations of the genre over 15 years apparently can't have any valid impressions of a very similar game they just watched for 3 hours. Right.
planning to play this tonight at best buy for several hours. going in with expectations that it will be equal to or worse than brawl. hopefully it will surprise me but from the stream i kinda doubt it
I was pretty disappointed. The game looked a lot slower paced than even Brawl. I'm not sure. It'd have been nice to see an actual tournament instead of smash ball + FFA format up until the finals. I had very little interest watching a FFA with some items on it.
I did notice that many of ZSS' skills were improved, making her a bit more viable. I think this game will have better balance, but I really doubt it will ever be played competitively like Melee.
On June 11 2014 23:24 Blargh wrote: I was pretty disappointed. The game looked a lot slower paced than even Brawl. I'm not sure. It'd have been nice to see an actual tournament instead of smash ball + FFA format up until the finals. I had very little interest watching a FFA with some items on it.
I did notice that many of ZSS' skills were improved, making her a bit more viable. I think this game will have better balance, but I really doubt it will ever be played competitively like Melee.
it does offer the potential to be patched over time so balance should be one of the selling points
I think it's okay to be pessimistic given the game is still in Sakurai's hands. A couple last-minute gestures to the competitive community do not a Melee-beater make. However it also doesn't look worse than Brawl which is a good thing.
I was just thinking about how Melee vs 4 is going to be just like BW vs SC2. Brawl is best forgotten, like WOL SC2 kinda, while HOTS/LOTV is a shadow of a truly great thing but still playable. Hopefully 4 can at least give us that.
On June 12 2014 02:37 theqat wrote: I think it's okay to be pessimistic given the game is still in Sakurai's hands. A couple last-minute gestures to the competitive community do not a Melee-beater make. However it also doesn't look worse than Brawl which is a good thing.
I was just thinking about how Melee vs 4 is going to be just like BW vs SC2. Brawl is best forgotten, like WOL SC2 kinda, while HOTS/LOTV is a shadow of a truly great thing but still playable. Hopefully 4 can at least give us that.
And project M is Starbow of course
Then Nintendo is going to slowly choke out Melee before its time like Blizzard with BW?
On June 12 2014 02:37 theqat wrote: I think it's okay to be pessimistic given the game is still in Sakurai's hands. A couple last-minute gestures to the competitive community do not a Melee-beater make. However it also doesn't look worse than Brawl which is a good thing.
I was just thinking about how Melee vs 4 is going to be just like BW vs SC2. Brawl is best forgotten, like WOL SC2 kinda, while HOTS/LOTV is a shadow of a truly great thing but still playable. Hopefully 4 can at least give us that.
And project M is Starbow of course
Then Nintendo is going to slowly choke out Melee before its time like Blizzard with BW?
That's the reaction I had to the "competitive people will still play melee" posts as well, if Nintendo doesn't support a tournament scene then the players will play the most competitive game, Melee. If Nintendo throws a bunch of money at SSB4 tournaments then that's where the players will go.
Mew2King RT'd and stated agreement with SolidJake's position that Smash 4 2v2s in particular have massive competitive potential, and team competition is great for the business side of esports.
On June 11 2014 17:07 shin ken wrote: "Nobody" is a vast exaggeration. It's mostly TL.net generally being butthurt as always. We have a big tradition of being grumpy guys complaining about new games being made "only for the casuals".
Somehow many have expected to see advanced techniques (which have been discovered only years after the melee release) and skillful combos. In the very first 1on1 under competitive rules. To make that happen the game would have to be a exact copy of Melee down to the engine flaws. And Sakurai already said that's not gonna happen.
Id say it's naivety at best and ignorance at worst. It's like Blizzard announcing Starcraft 3 and having an invitational at blizzcon, and the reaction of TL.net after the first game would be "It's not like Broodwar thus trash. Where's my muta-stacking and stupid unit pathing? It's like Starcraft 2 all over again".
Ah, thanks! I thought there was something inherently wrong with it that I didn't see or know about yet
No there is a metric-ton of stuff you can see from the onset, even as a casual.
-The game is ridiculously slow -Combos seem almost non-existent (sure talk about how they havent played the game before, not like anyone can pick up a fighter and smash inputs for combos) there is like a delay on skills, way too much recovery after each one. -Floaty. Oh my god so floaty. It was like watching moon gravity, this stood out especially on KDJ's Luna.
These three things combined makes for some really bad gameplay IMO, its not fast, its not responsive. You dont need to figure out the game and have wavedashing, l-cancels and all manner of glitches to see these things.
EDIT: Dont get me wrong, you're entirely entitled to your opinion of the game but dont say our reactions to it are just jaded hate. We could all be entirely wrong and it be amazing but it doesnt look like it from what ive currently seen, alot of that stuff could be changed on release.
played the game on both 3ds and wii u today at best buy dash mechanics kinda suck ass right now it is definitely faster paced than brawl was and given that the devs are at least open to suggestions at this point i have some hope for the game.
On June 11 2014 17:31 hariooo wrote: This exact cycle happened 7 years ago. It's experienced skepticism. You can pretend people wanted Melee 2.0 but you won't be able to point to a single person in this thread who realistically had this thought.
I dunno. It seems that a large number of complaints circle around "It doesn't have <feature that we liked from Melee>."
I can appreciate that things like wavedashing increase the skill ceiling and make for a more competitive experience, however I whole-heartedly disagree with the idea that something from Melee being absent is inherently bad when we have no idea what sorts of things might be there instead.
Coupled with the fact that these techniques took years (If I recall correctly) to develop and master, and that we've seen a grand total of 1 tournament-style match, and less than a day of total playtime, I think the "well, guess we'll just cling to Melee" comments are premature.
Though I do recognize that it still seems pretty floaty, but at least there's no tripping...?
On June 11 2014 17:31 hariooo wrote: This exact cycle happened 7 years ago. It's experienced skepticism. You can pretend people wanted Melee 2.0 but you won't be able to point to a single person in this thread who realistically had this thought.
I dunno. It seems that a large number of complaints circle around "It doesn't have <feature that we liked from Melee>."
I can appreciate that things like wavedashing increase the skill ceiling and make for a more competitive experience, however I whole-heartedly disagree with the idea that something from Melee being absent is inherently bad when we have no idea what sorts of things might be there instead.
Coupled with the fact that these techniques took years (If I recall correctly) to develop and master, and that we've seen a grand total of 1 tournament-style match, and less than a day of total playtime, I think the "well, guess we'll just cling to Melee" comments are premature.
Though I do recognize that it still seems pretty floaty, but at least there's no tripping...?
a lot of the issues people are bringing up between melee brawl and this game come from the fact that they keep removing options from characters
wave dash meant you had crazy platform games and lots of approach options, same with being able to crouch out of dashes. now these aren't here so approaches are limited and defensive play is really really strong right now
On June 11 2014 17:31 hariooo wrote: This exact cycle happened 7 years ago. It's experienced skepticism. You can pretend people wanted Melee 2.0 but you won't be able to point to a single person in this thread who realistically had this thought.
I dunno. It seems that a large number of complaints circle around "It doesn't have <feature that we liked from Melee>."
I can appreciate that things like wavedashing increase the skill ceiling and make for a more competitive experience, however I whole-heartedly disagree with the idea that something from Melee being absent is inherently bad when we have no idea what sorts of things might be there instead.
Coupled with the fact that these techniques took years (If I recall correctly) to develop and master, and that we've seen a grand total of 1 tournament-style match, and less than a day of total playtime, I think the "well, guess we'll just cling to Melee" comments are premature.
Though I do recognize that it still seems pretty floaty, but at least there's no tripping...?
a lot of the issues people are bringing up between melee brawl and this game come from the fact that they keep removing options from characters
wave dash meant you had crazy platform games and lots of approach options, same with being able to crouch out of dashes. now these aren't here so approaches are limited and defensive play is really really strong right now
I wouldn't try to argue that wavedashing being absent is a good thing. I'm simply saying that one missing technique does not a game break. (That works, right? Yeah. Goin' with it) Especially not when we can't really know if it's an option removed or actually an option replaced (intentionally or not). Brawl had some glaring flaws that turned off a lot of people immediately. I'd just ask that unless there's something on the scale of tripping that ruins this game out of the gate, not to write it off because it doesn't share something (or even several somethings) with Melee.
As for the defensive play, it seems to me that a lot of new fighting/war games favor defensive play. SC2 started out as most people hanging out at home until they threw their maxed army blobs at each other, metagames do evolve, though.
I just think it's stifling a lot of potential to retreat back to the familiar when we see something different.
it's not "different = hate". it's lack of competitive options, at least that we have seen so far. wavedashing is certainly not a necessary feature. if they made you able to act out of a roll by interrupting the invincibility that would be sweet. if all moves had way lower endlag we wouldn't need l cancel. it's that certain key aspects, NOT specific techniques, of competitive smash that we as a community have identified over the years are missing, and that is what's causing concern. pretty sure 99% of melee players didn't want melee 2.0. floatiness, huge lag, lack of movement options, and no combo followups just don't make a good game.
it's also unfair to compare to sc2. much as I was not a fan of that game, at least the developers set out with competition in mind and repeatedly tried to address the issue. Nintendo will never do that ever.
On June 12 2014 07:26 Circumstance wrote: Mew2King RT'd and stated agreement with SolidJake's position that Smash 4 2v2s in particular have massive competitive potential, and team competition is great for the business side of esports.
Can you tell us what is specially good about 4's 2v2s?
On June 11 2014 17:31 hariooo wrote: This exact cycle happened 7 years ago. It's experienced skepticism. You can pretend people wanted Melee 2.0 but you won't be able to point to a single person in this thread who realistically had this thought.
I dunno. It seems that a large number of complaints circle around "It doesn't have <feature that we liked from Melee>."
I can appreciate that things like wavedashing increase the skill ceiling and make for a more competitive experience, however I whole-heartedly disagree with the idea that something from Melee being absent is inherently bad when we have no idea what sorts of things might be there instead.
Coupled with the fact that these techniques took years (If I recall correctly) to develop and master, and that we've seen a grand total of 1 tournament-style match, and less than a day of total playtime, I think the "well, guess we'll just cling to Melee" comments are premature.
Though I do recognize that it still seems pretty floaty, but at least there's no tripping...?
You seriously think that the difference is in the advanced techs? Have you played vs a casual scrub Fox in Melee and Brawl? The difference is gigantic. You also don't need to be a super advanced megaturbopro advanced tech godplayer to ftilt -> fair as Sheik in Melee.
Also I've stated the issue of lacking good options out of dash/run outside of jumping. You only have shield, pretty much. Nothing that quickly moves you backwards. No instant attacks by canceling dash to crouch.
On June 12 2014 09:55 Thrillz wrote: Played it at BestBuy, and can confirm what players at the E3 event said about the mechanics.
It feels more like an updated version of Brawl more than anything else. It will be better than Brawl, but still might not be a good competitive game.
Did the hitboxes feel strange/bad to you?
I don't think it's the hitboxes that are the main problem, they did increase the hitstun and that's noticeable. But the floatiness and the defensive tactics still feel a bit too much. It feels like while it's improved, the predominant strategy is still to play defensive.
On June 12 2014 09:55 Thrillz wrote: Played it at BestBuy, and can confirm what players at the E3 event said about the mechanics.
It feels more like an updated version of Brawl more than anything else. It will be better than Brawl, but still might not be a good competitive game.
Did the hitboxes feel strange/bad to you?
I don't think it's the hitboxes that are the main problem, they did increase the hitstun and that's noticeable. But the floatiness and the defensive tactics still feel a bit too much. It feels like while it's improved, the predominant strategy is still to play defensive.
i think there just aren't enough ways to approach people your options are dash and jump short hop aerials kinda suck and there isn't any way to pressure a shield
On June 12 2014 09:55 Thrillz wrote: Played it at BestBuy, and can confirm what players at the E3 event said about the mechanics.
It feels more like an updated version of Brawl more than anything else. It will be better than Brawl, but still might not be a good competitive game.
Did the hitboxes feel strange/bad to you?
I don't think it's the hitboxes that are the main problem, they did increase the hitstun and that's noticeable. But the floatiness and the defensive tactics still feel a bit too much. It feels like while it's improved, the predominant strategy is still to play defensive.
i think there just aren't enough ways to approach people your options are dash and jump short hop aerials kinda suck and there isn't any way to pressure a shield
And dashing apparently sucks. (can't shield/crouch out of it)
On June 11 2014 10:16 Shikyo wrote: Lol Zero gets outplayed whole game, then runs away for a minute like a lamer and wins sudden death
That is an exaggeration and not true.
They were fairly even and Zero even had a stock lead at one point (3 stock to 2 stock). Only at the end did he play safe (and only because of the rules).
Yes, the sudden death rule is silly but those were the rules of that tournament. Due to the rules, he was given the option (when they were both on even stocks) to wait out the timer to force a sudden death and he took that option (and there is nothing wrong with that since the rules of the tournament gave him the option to do that).
On June 15 2014 04:31 WarioMCP wrote: The grand finals of this tournament was a big letdown. Competitive, yes, but the timer only being set to five minutes for four stocks was a blunder.
EPT![[image loading]](http://media1.gameinformer.com/filestorage/CommunityServer.Components.SiteFiles/imagefeed/featured/nintendo2014/gamecube-adapter/GCWiiU-610.jpg)
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