UFC 144: Edgar vs. Henderson Light Heavyweight Title Date: Feb 25, 2012 Location: Saitama, Japan Venue: Saitama Super Arena Broadcast: Pay-per-view
MAIN CARD (Pay-per-view) Champ Frankie Edgar vs. Ben Henderson (for lightweight title) Ryan Bader vs. Quinton "Rampage" Jackson Cheick Kongo vs. Mark Hunt Yoshihiro Akiyama vs. Jake Shields Joe Lauzon vs. Anthony Pettis
PRELIMINARY CARD Tim Boetsch vs. Yushin Okami Takanori Gomi vs. Eiji Mitsuoka Hatsu Hioki and Bart Palaszewski Vaughan Lee vs. Norifumi "Kid" Yamamoto Steve Cantwell vs. Riki Fukuda Chris Cariaso vs. Takeya Mizugaki Tiequan Zhang vs. TBA*
I'll get on the fight analysis much later. I haven't gotten my head to this quite yet. If you have any please post here so we can include this in the OP.
For now, let me address a very important issue that I've always been complaining about - the UFC Art Department. I'm sick and tired of the usual balanced lame ass official poster that UFC is coming up with. It's always the same, with a few tweaks in the layout here and there. The only "creative" thing I've seen them do lately is the Silva vs Belfort fight in Brazil. Don't even get me started on the promotional videos! God, they are the worst videos for a promotion of their caliber ever. Even low budget Kespa SPL have kick ass intro videos.
On another topic, I don't feel anything about this card. I don't know why. The preliminaries are filled with crowd-friendly cards. Nothing in the main card is all that interesting, except maybe Lauzon vs Pettis. But I like Frankie. I hate him for beating Penn twice, but he got my respect in the last two Maynard fights. He's surprised me before, so maybe this one will prove to be exciting after all.
I think Henderson might give Edgar problems, sure he's fast, but Bendo just looked so powerful in his last few fights. Of course Edgar's KO of Gray Maynard was pretty damn impressive, so I ain't counting out a KO victory. However if it goes to the distance I'm willing to bet on Bendo.
Also as a BJ nuthugger I hope he doesn't come near BJ's LW title defense streak lolol.
I hope Rampage KO's Bader. I think he can deal with Bader's wrestling and keep it standing.
Cheick vs Hunt should be fun (barring nutshots) but I think kongo will win.
I'm pulling for Akiyama but I think Shields will beat him like he did everybody before GSP.
Hoping Lauzon wins and shows that his win over Guillard wasn't just Guillard being a tard.
Amazing card. But it's hilarious that Kongo vs Hunt gets a main card spot over those prelims. I mean, come on, Okami goes from title shot against Silva to the prelims, that's insane.
Going to be an awesome card, although I'm so sad Rampage didn't make weight. He's my favourite fighter, and it isn't like him to miss weight. Hope it doesn't turn into another retirement announcement or anything.
I'm surprised they didn't bring more big jap names like wanderlei over. Could've been the perfect card for a nog vs cro cop fight but i'm hoping this means they're saving those names for future japan events.
I'm glad they're at least respecting Japan with a title fight and a proper card, not like that rubbish they originally had planned. Edgar fights are never boring these days so I won't miss this one.
Ben Henderson's weight cut looked increasingly difficult. He is a very big man at LW. I hope that plays into Edgars favor. I LOVE YOU FRANKIE!! The come back kid~!~!~!~!~!~!~1
Just recently got into watching UFC but have been a long time fan of SexYama, but don't really know Jake Shields, why is everyone in the cardpick threads voting against our superhero here? is sexyama really the underdog?
btw how much does watching it actually cost? do I have to buy the 60bucks/6 months subscription? thx!
On February 26 2012 07:41 absalom86 wrote: so im terrible with these random timezones especially since it's in japan now. How long till the card starts?
Climb! You must climb! Climb to the mountain top that is five posts above you! There, and only there, will you encounter the information you seek!!!! hisssss hissssssssssssssss
On February 26 2012 07:41 absalom86 wrote: so im terrible with these random timezones especially since it's in japan now. How long till the card starts?
On February 26 2012 09:51 clementdudu wrote: cant find the fights on fb or vipbox oO
Facebook had only one (Tamura-Zhang) and that one is over. Next up is FX in 5 minutes Should have a working stream here http://www.vipbox.tv/sports/ufc.html
Wow what the fuck? Lackluster fight overall, nothing big from either. BUT 3 takedowns 1 each round for Mizugaki and yet he lost UD? I consider this quite the robbery.
Certainly am ^^ He also seems like a smart and fun guy from his twitter/facebook posts. His fights are always entertaining and Pettis is no slouch either, so should be good =) Sadly I've really got to go to bed so I'll see it in the morning
On February 26 2012 11:45 SoMuchBetter wrote: yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh gomi some vintage gomi aggression in the 2nd round
i thought he was going to tap for sure in the triangle in the first but he held on and came back strong
Gomi's technique is like the reverse of Lyoto Machida. Sticks his head way infront of his body and leads with it while attacking. Dangerous but fun to watch when he gets some combos in.
Ariel Helwani @arielhelwani Reply Retweet Favorite · Open According to the UFC, Takeya Mizugaki will get his win bonus tonight because they all think he deserved to win.
yo im not into ufc ppv system so i got a quick question. is the preliminary card free to watch and the maincard is ppv or how does their system work? thanks for your help
Thinking about a bet on Rampage at -150 what do you guys think? He was injured and the line has gone from like -250 all the way to -150 now I wonder if it's worth a bet.
On February 26 2012 13:00 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: Hioki vs Aldo would be like -600
Have a small bet on Edgar -125 $125
Thinking about a bet on Rampage at -150 what do you guys think? He was injured and the line has gone from like -250 all the way to -150 now I wonder if it's worth a bet.
Okami didn't cover up properly, so those uppercuts just went right past the arm he had low defending with. Not sure why he didn't cover up, he could have survived that.
On February 26 2012 13:25 floor exercise wrote: Akiyama's strategy was to spend enough time in a tanning bed that Jake will get radiation sickness if he tries to wrestle him
This has to be close. Jake is throwing more strikes but without power, and failed all his takedowns. Whilst Akiyama stuffed all takedowns and took Jake down several times.
Sexy only had his takedowns and takedown defense that whole fight. The striking was really unimpressive by both parties. Strange to score this fight, but the end of the 3rd puts it into Shields' favor I think.
I wonder if the fight will be scored a draw if a point gets taken away. Shields did not look impressive tonight, but Akiyama got pretty greedy at the end.
On February 26 2012 13:47 MaZza[KIS] wrote: REALLY? all 3? What the fuck is going on. Am I watching the same sport as these judges? Where am I? What day is it?
Shields outstruck him in all three rounds... Shields and Akiyama both got the takedown in the first, with Akiyama's being flashy and Shields getting Akiyamas back briefly. Really close for the first two rounds.
I just woke up. I'm glad I didn't sleep through the main event (Edgar vs Bendo)
LOL seriously I knew Akiyama was going to lose, but I didn't know he was going to get blown away in scoring. Is he being kicked from UFC soon? I don't think he's challenging on any weight level for the organization at the moment.
PS: Rampage wife looks pretty hot in that picture.
Feel like some MMA fighters should go to Sub Wrestling fulltime.. I dont mind people like Jon Fitch who at least works and does damage while humping.. Imagine what Jon Jones will do with all these scrubs if they even get there. 3 people are untouchable right now imo; Bones Jones, Aldo and Anderson.
On February 26 2012 14:36 DaPyro wrote: I really hate the fact that MMA has become a sport of points and strategy instead of whos the better fighter....
On February 26 2012 14:36 DaPyro wrote: I really hate the fact that MMA has become a sport of points and strategy instead of whos the better fighter....
Depends on what you mean by better.
I know a lot of people who hate the judging system and I would be one of them, but Bader controlled the fight.
On February 26 2012 14:36 DaPyro wrote: I really hate the fact that MMA has become a sport of points and strategy instead of whos the better fighter....
This comes with the maturation of any sport.
This is why guys like Jon Jones, Anderson Silva and Jose Aldo are so special and this is why guys like that are going to start earning MILLIONS. Guys like the ones I mentioned will be the only ones that will have enough skill and talent to fight for a finish... and make it look easy, impressive and flashy.
On February 26 2012 14:42 _Darwin_ wrote: After Frankie teaches Bendo to fear someone other than God, he needs to drop down to FW and take Aldo's belt.
Which would suck, coz he has >50% chance of outpointing Aldo via "the Condit"
On February 26 2012 14:42 _Darwin_ wrote: After Frankie teaches Bendo to fear someone other than God, he needs to drop down to FW and take Aldo's belt.
Which would suck, coz he has >50% chance of outpointing Aldo via "the Condit"
On February 26 2012 14:35 Diamond wrote: If this next fight sucks, after all I have seen tonight, I officially don't know anything about MMA anymore 0_o!
Frankie Vs Bendo can't suck... These are top notch fighters.
On February 26 2012 14:42 _Darwin_ wrote: After Frankie teaches Bendo to fear someone other than God, he needs to drop down to FW and take Aldo's belt.
Which would suck, coz he has >50% chance of outpointing Aldo via "the Condit"
TKO in the fourth?
fuck frankie is a gangsta
My "the condit" was in reference to the Diaz fight, i.e. franky will just punch and move
Gonna have to see how all these kicks are piling up, could really fuck Edgar up. His movement is sick which is how he survived versus Maynard but against Hendo?
Damn, I'm feeling for Frankie right now... He's sooo much smaller, needs to change divisions... Might end in medical stoppage if the fight keeps going like this...
Man... I was not a fan at all when Frankie took the belt of BJ but he has earned my respect... Kids got MAD heart... I hope he wins this... Originally rooting for Hendo.
If Frankie's fights all end up like this the kid is going to be dead before 40... Jesus. The amount of punishment he takes in every fight he's in is brutal.
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Just look at Edgar's face?
Most people have Edgar winning round one and Bendo round two, and all the damage was already done after those two rounds. Not sure why you would argue how someone looks, because how someone looks after five rounds really doesn't decide who wins what round.
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
Bendo won. It kinda saddens me that there will be debate based on strikes landed as though all strikes have equal effectiveness. One guy beat up another guy really badly, even if that guy got more ineffectual takedowns and landed a few more strikes without any power on them
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
All the damage you see on Edgars face is from the first two rounds. Please educate yourself it means nothing regarding the three rounds after, and I'm pretty sure all judges and viewers had Edgar winning round one anyway.
Some guys bruise easier, sometimes one round you take more damage than the four rounds you win after, etc. It's seriously ignorant and uneducated about the sport to look at someones face and have that be the end all of your winner.
On February 26 2012 15:27 floor exercise wrote: Bendo won. It kinda saddens me that there will be debate based on strikes landed as though all strikes have equal effectiveness. One guy beat up another guy really badly, even if that guy got more ineffectual takedowns and landed a few more strikes without any power on them
On February 26 2012 15:24 absalom86 wrote: Jesus fighters ... Such a huge turn-off. God decided to bless Hendo with his athleticism while he lets children starve to death in Africa apparently.
Seriously, right? -_-
(ah well, let's not turn this into another religion debate thread...)
and yeah, people with scar tissue from previous damage bruise and bleed WAY easier than others who haven't taken punishment. Frankie was gushing in large part because of scar tissue
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
It isn't though. There is a lot more to it than just strikes. In fact strikes mean very little in a fight. It's all about control, staying on top and takedowns.
That's why we have TKOs and stoppages if a guy cannot continue from the damage.
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
All the damage you see on Edgars face is from the first two rounds please educate yourself it means nothing regarding the three rounds after and I'm pretty sure all judges and viewers had Edgar winning round one anyway. Some guys bruise easier, sometimes one round you take more damage than the four rounds you win after, etc. It's seriously ignorant and uneducated about the sport to look at someones face and have that be the end all of your winner.
Im not saying you should ONLY look at his face, but you are acting as if every strike Edgar throws does X amount of damage when in reality it does not. Also I dont see how the damage was JUST done in the first two, it's harder to spot damage done to a guy who is already bleeding.
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
It isn't though. There is a lot more to it than just strikes. In fact strikes mean very little in a fight. It's all about control, staying on top and takedowns.
That's why we have TKOs and stoppages if a guy cannot continue from the damage.
Yeah, and look at fights that are decided by takedowns and "octagon control". It's not fights as much as WWE.
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
All the damage you see on Edgars face is from the first two rounds please educate yourself it means nothing regarding the three rounds after and I'm pretty sure all judges and viewers had Edgar winning round one anyway. Some guys bruise easier, sometimes one round you take more damage than the four rounds you win after, etc. It's seriously ignorant and uneducated about the sport to look at someones face and have that be the end all of your winner.
I can't quite agree with you on the scoring. You seem to haze over that Benderson had two ( If i remember correctly ) close finishes. One by guillotine, One in top position pounding Frankie out in the fifth and probably some other moments I don't remember right now.
Frankie's punches just had no effect on Hendo. He looked the same when he came out as when he went into the fight. When you have close rounds ( not so close in terms of damage being done or closeness to finishes ) you subconsciously will look at the fighters as a judge so if you are all bloody and looking zombified it will factor into the decision.
On February 26 2012 15:24 absalom86 wrote: Jesus fighters ... Such a huge turn-off. God decided to bless Hendo with his athleticism while he lets children starve to death in Africa apparently.
Bendo clearly landed the harder, more powerful strikes throughout the fight. Frankie got take downs but he accomplished little with them and Bendo got up immediately. I think it would be a mistake to count fast take downs where the guy gets up immediately more than hard kicks to the legs and body. Damage and impact do matter and are accounted for in the judging criteria. The judging criteria also takes into account take downs that accomplish nothing.
I don't think that the higher quantity of strikes landed should be more valued than quality strikes. I think that damage, proximity to finishing the fight, and control of the fight should be prioritized in judging a fight. I'm not saying that a fighter that relies on speed and volume striking can't win, I'm just saying that for them to win, they have to avoid taking too much damage or clearly control the majority of the fight. I don't think Edgar did either of these things, so I agree with the decision. TBH though, I wish that fights were judged on the PRIDE criteria.
Frankie Edgar lost no doubt in my opinion. I seriously think he needs to move down a weight class for his own safety. It's not fun watching him get destroyed physically wise. He has the heart of a lion, but later he's going to have the brain of a lion as well if he keeps taking all that punishment.
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
All the damage you see on Edgars face is from the first two rounds please educate yourself it means nothing regarding the three rounds after and I'm pretty sure all judges and viewers had Edgar winning round one anyway. Some guys bruise easier, sometimes one round you take more damage than the four rounds you win after, etc. It's seriously ignorant and uneducated about the sport to look at someones face and have that be the end all of your winner.
I can't quite agree with you on the scoring. You seem to haze over that Benderson had two ( If i remember correctly ) close finishes. One by guillotine, One in top position pounding Frankie out in the fifth and probably some other moments I don't remember right now.
Frankie's punches just had no effect on Hendo. He looked the same when he came out as when he went into the fight. When you have close rounds ( not so close in terms of damage being done or closeness to finishes ) you subconsciously will look at the fighters as a judge so if you are all bloody and looking zombified it will factor into the decision.
How do you score Edgars knockdown in the fifth? I had that round 10-10 because of the knockdown versus the ending. Either way it was very close it's not a robbery in any way, I definitely don't think Bendo nor Edgar clearly won that one.
It's depressing to see how many people are quoting 'damage done' when in reality there wasn't an observable difference after round two. All the observable damage was done in the first two rounds of which Edgar won the first. What does that tell you about looking at damage? If the damage is done in the first two rounds that doesn't mean you score the next three based on that as well, it's just not how it works.
For those of you who think it was a close fight or if any of you think that Edgar won (did you see the fight?), what aspects do you think Edgar won in? Or was beating Benson in ?
I feel like P4P Frankie is the better fighter, but it turns out that weight matters. More strikes and more take downs isn't the same as rocking a guy and controlling him on the ground, and I feel like Frankie and his corner are ignorant for not knowing how the fight was going (especially his corner). More strikes isn't the same thing as better striking.
Personally I would have rather been hit with the 2/3 punch Frankie combo than one of the meaty kicks Henderson was throwing.
Hopefully Frankie cuts down 145, if he's not scared that Aldo will do the same thing to him.
On February 26 2012 15:41 NexaS wrote: For those of you who think it was a close fight or if any of you think that Edgar won (did you see the fight?), what aspects do you think Edgar won in? Or was beating Benson in ?
bloodyelbow, mmafighting, mmamania, etc scored the fight for Edgar. don't pretend like it was black and white
On February 26 2012 15:24 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I think the statisticians will go over this one and rage a little bit.
Man do I dislike opinions like this.. It's a FIGHT, the damage done should be the main factor. To make an exaggeraded example it's like you can shoot a guy 5 times in the leg, but if he shoots you in the head it doesnt matter.
It's a fight, you are there to damage and take the guy out. Not see who can amount the most strikes. Sort of like you can throw 50 strikes, but it only takes one to KO someone.
All the damage you see on Edgars face is from the first two rounds please educate yourself it means nothing regarding the three rounds after and I'm pretty sure all judges and viewers had Edgar winning round one anyway. Some guys bruise easier, sometimes one round you take more damage than the four rounds you win after, etc. It's seriously ignorant and uneducated about the sport to look at someones face and have that be the end all of your winner.
I can't quite agree with you on the scoring. You seem to haze over that Benderson had two ( If i remember correctly ) close finishes. One by guillotine, One in top position pounding Frankie out in the fifth and probably some other moments I don't remember right now.
Frankie's punches just had no effect on Hendo. He looked the same when he came out as when he went into the fight. When you have close rounds ( not so close in terms of damage being done or closeness to finishes ) you subconsciously will look at the fighters as a judge so if you are all bloody and looking zombified it will factor into the decision.
How do you score Edgars knockdown in the fifth? I had that round 10-10 because of the knockdown versus the ending. Either way it was very close it's not a robbery in any way, I definitely don't think Bendo nor Edgar clearly won that one.
It's depressing to see how many people are quoting 'damage done' when in reality there wasn't an observable difference after round two. All the observable damage was done in the first two rounds of which Edgar won the first. What does that tell you about looking at damage? If the damage is done in the first two rounds that doesn't mean you score the next three based on that as well, it's just not how it works.
Seeing as Bendo took him down at the end of the round and finished on top with some GnP I think bendo stole the last round. :3
On February 26 2012 15:42 Postman wrote: I feel like P4P Frankie is the better fighter, but it turns out that weight matters. More strikes and more take downs isn't the same as rocking a guy and controlling him on the ground, and I feel like Frankie and his corner are ignorant for not knowing how the fight was going (especially his corner). More strikes isn't the same thing as better striking.
Personally I would have rather been hit with the 2/3 punch Frankie combo than one of the meaty kicks Henderson was throwing.
Hopefully Frankie cuts down 145, if he's not scared that Aldo will do the same thing to him.
Aldo will no doubt fuck him up. This was close, a fight vs Aldo will not be.
On February 26 2012 15:42 Postman wrote: I feel like P4P Frankie is the better fighter, but it turns out that weight matters. More strikes and more take downs isn't the same as rocking a guy and controlling him on the ground, and I feel like Frankie and his corner are ignorant for not knowing how the fight was going (especially his corner). More strikes isn't the same thing as better striking.
Personally I would have rather been hit with the 2/3 punch Frankie combo than one of the meaty kicks Henderson was throwing.
Hopefully Frankie cuts down 145, if he's not scared that Aldo will do the same thing to him.
Aldo will no doubt fuck him up. This was close, a fight vs Aldo will not be.
That depends on which Aldo shows up. I personally think the Aldo that fought Homminick and Florian loses to Edgar. When Aldo is in attack mode, yeah...he's nasty.
On February 26 2012 15:24 absalom86 wrote: Jesus fighters ... Such a huge turn-off. God decided to bless Bendo with his athleticism while he lets children starve to death in Africa apparently.
God sent his son to die for us so that we may learn to follow him and live selfless lives loving one another. Jesus healed the poor, feed the hungry and protected the defenseless. The reason there are starving children is because we allow it not God, Bendo thanking God because he is creator is a different debate. You can't argue with the example Jesus set and how we fail to come close to him. If it bothers you so much then it is probably for good reason.
On February 26 2012 15:24 absalom86 wrote: Jesus fighters ... Such a huge turn-off. God decided to bless Bendo with his athleticism while he lets children starve to death in Africa apparently.
God sent his son to die for us so that we may learn to follow him and live selfless lives loving one another. Jesus healed the poor, feed the hungry and protected the defenseless. The reason there are starving children is because we allow it not God, Bendo thanking God because he is creator is a different debate. You can't argue with the example Jesus set and how we fail to come close to him. If it bothers you so much then it is probably for good reason.
Funny fight that couldn't have been more one sided but that shows that you shouldn't look at how easy someone bleeds or bruises up to score rounds. There's hundreds of fights like this one out there that are reasons not to take damage as a key judging criteria. Saying Bendo won is of course fine, the fight was incredibly close. To look at damage done, but to be ignorant of how the damage came to be (i.e. rounds one 10-9 and two 9-10), is just dumb.
On February 26 2012 15:56 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: Funny fight that couldn't have been more one sided but that shows that you shouldn't look at how easy someone bleeds or bruises up to score rounds.
i agree with you but this one doesn't apply. silva finished the fight
On February 26 2012 15:56 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: Funny fight that couldn't have been more one sided but that shows that you shouldn't look at how easy someone bleeds or bruises up to score rounds.
i agree with you but this one doesn't apply. silva finished the fight
How does the fact that Silva finished the fight disprove his point at all?
On February 26 2012 15:56 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: Funny fight that couldn't have been more one sided but that shows that you shouldn't look at how easy someone bleeds or bruises up to score rounds. There's hundreds of fights like this one out there that are reasons not to take damage as a key judging criteria. Saying Bendo won is of course fine, the fight was incredibly close. To look at damage done, but to be ignorant of how the damage came to be (rounds one and two) is just dumb.
I think some of the posters were talking about the fact that Frankie Edgar looked like a zombie at the end of the fight. You can look at him and see that he looked like he was hurting. Bendo looked like the fight just started.
There's no doubt some fighters are "bleeders" and they can't help it, but I think Henderson won this fight. I don't agree with the judge score cards, but I do think Bendo won.
On February 26 2012 16:02 _Darwin_ wrote: Rampage sounding surprisingly optimistic. Has many more years left.
Pettis gets the title shot. FOR A SPLIT DECISION OVER JEREMY STEPHENS AND A WIN OVER JOE LAUZON? lol
I think 90% of the motivation there is having a win over Bendo, which is a legitimate boost to his claim to a title shot. Personally, I always want to see champions get a shot at redeeming their losses, and fighters who have a win over the champion get a shot at the belt. Whenever there is a decent claim for a title shot, by a guy that has a win over the current champ, it's just a good time to make it happen.
On February 26 2012 16:02 _Darwin_ wrote: Rampage sounding surprisingly optimistic. Has many more years left.
Pettis gets the title shot. FOR A SPLIT DECISION OVER JEREMY STEPHENS AND A WIN OVER JOE LAUZON? lol
I think 90% of the motivation there is having a win over Bendo, which is a legitimate boost to his claim to a title shot. Personally, I always want to see champions get a shot at redeeming their losses, and fighters who have a win over the champion get a shot at the belt. Whenever there is a decent claim for a title shot, by a guy that has a win over the current champ, it's just a good time to make it happen.
And it gives the UFC an excuse to play the showtime kick on repeat for a few months. The first fight was amazing and Jim/Nate don't fight till may. Winner of that fight will get the winner of Pettis/Bendo.
1st - Edgar 2nd - Bendo 3rd - Edgar 4th - Bendo 5th - At first 10-10, havent made my mind yet, but I lean towards Bendo because I think edgars effective strinking just was not as meaningfull as Bendos octagon control
On February 26 2012 16:02 _Darwin_ wrote: Rampage sounding surprisingly optimistic. Has many more years left.
Pettis gets the title shot. FOR A SPLIT DECISION OVER JEREMY STEPHENS AND A WIN OVER JOE LAUZON? lol
I think 90% of the motivation there is having a win over Bendo, which is a legitimate boost to his claim to a title shot. Personally, I always want to see champions get a shot at redeeming their losses, and fighters who have a win over the champion get a shot at the belt. Whenever there is a decent claim for a title shot, by a guy that has a win over the current champ, it's just a good time to make it happen.
And it gives the UFC an excuse to play the showtime kick on repeat for a few months. The first fight was amazing and Jim/Nate don't fight till may. Winner of that fight will get the winner of Pettis/Bendo.
Melendez is also an option to fight the winner of Bendo/Pettis.
On February 26 2012 16:02 _Darwin_ wrote: Rampage sounding surprisingly optimistic. Has many more years left.
Pettis gets the title shot. FOR A SPLIT DECISION OVER JEREMY STEPHENS AND A WIN OVER JOE LAUZON? lol
I think 90% of the motivation there is having a win over Bendo, which is a legitimate boost to his claim to a title shot. Personally, I always want to see champions get a shot at redeeming their losses, and fighters who have a win over the champion get a shot at the belt. Whenever there is a decent claim for a title shot, by a guy that has a win over the current champ, it's just a good time to make it happen.
And it gives the UFC an excuse to play the showtime kick on repeat for a few months. The first fight was amazing and Jim/Nate don't fight till may. Winner of that fight will get the winner of Pettis/Bendo.
Melendez is also an option to fight the winner of Bendo/Pettis.
Nah I'm pretty sure he is contractually stuck in strikeforce (by showtime).
On February 26 2012 16:02 _Darwin_ wrote: Rampage sounding surprisingly optimistic. Has many more years left.
Pettis gets the title shot. FOR A SPLIT DECISION OVER JEREMY STEPHENS AND A WIN OVER JOE LAUZON? lol
I think 90% of the motivation there is having a win over Bendo, which is a legitimate boost to his claim to a title shot. Personally, I always want to see champions get a shot at redeeming their losses, and fighters who have a win over the champion get a shot at the belt. Whenever there is a decent claim for a title shot, by a guy that has a win over the current champ, it's just a good time to make it happen.
And it gives the UFC an excuse to play the showtime kick on repeat for a few months. The first fight was amazing and Jim/Nate don't fight till may. Winner of that fight will get the winner of Pettis/Bendo.
Melendez is also an option to fight the winner of Bendo/Pettis.
Nah I'm pretty sure he is contractually stuck in strikeforce (by showtime).
Damn, if it's true that Zuffa can't get him out of his contract that sucks.
I really hope they give Edgar whatever he wants. After he fought two rematches for the UFC, the first time he loses in a close fight he doesn't get one.
On February 26 2012 16:21 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I really hope they give Edgar whatever he wants. After he fought two rematches for the UFC, the first time he loses in a close fight he doesn't get one.
i agree, i know if i was frankie, id be asking to fight aldo
On February 26 2012 16:21 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I really hope they give Edgar whatever he wants. After he fought two rematches for the UFC, the first time he loses in a close fight he doesn't get one.
i agree, i know if i was frankie, id be asking to fight aldo
I know what you mean and I'd love to see it, but career wise he can fight Bendo again, lose, and still fight Aldo after. That's two title shots, which greatly improves his chances at having a good career.
On February 26 2012 16:21 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I really hope they give Edgar whatever he wants. After he fought two rematches for the UFC, the first time he loses in a close fight he doesn't get one.
i agree, i know if i was frankie, id be asking to fight aldo
I know what you mean and I'd love to see it, but career wise he can fight Bendo again, lose, and still fight Aldo after. That's two title shots, which greatly improves his chances at having a good career.
On February 26 2012 16:21 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: I really hope they give Edgar whatever he wants. After he fought two rematches for the UFC, the first time he loses in a close fight he doesn't get one.
It sounds like it will be Pettis who will face Bendo. I don't think Edgar will get the rematch
Usually guys stay at the higher weight for as long as they are making good money and getting wins. Being able to do that basically gives you two careers, because once you do get your ass kicked you go down in weight and the hype starts all over again. Even Akiyama who is now on a four fight losing streak will probably stay around because he is pretty decent at 170.
I wouldn't be surprised if Edgar took the Rashad approach and just stay at the same weight, and have going down only as a backup plan. That said though I would love to see Edgar vs Aldo that could be worth going down for.
On February 26 2012 16:30 ThatGuy wrote: Frankie's not going down in weight, and I'm really not a fan of everyone trying to talk him into it. Let the man fight where he wants to fight.
More importantly... let Frankie get some got damn REST!
I swear that guy looks like he needs to go take a break for a bit. His eye looks completely fucked up.
Frankie won that fight for my money. Sure he got his ass kicked and came out damaged, but those were still 10-9 rounds, which Frankie won more of, even if not by the same degree.
On February 26 2012 16:36 arterian wrote: Frankie won that fight for my money. Sure he got his ass kicked and came out damaged, but those were still 10-9 rounds, which Frankie won more of, even if not by the same degree.
Frankie would have won if he was playing a game of tag.
Fights have never been about who lands strikes the most. I admit I saw Frankie connect more, but it did no damage while the ones Henderson landed probably requires Frankie to rest for six months.
Rua got a rematch against machida even though the cards weren't close. I think letting rematches happen sets a bad standard. Now anyone who loses a title match wants one.
Dana should tell people they get one fucking shot, and only themselves are to blame if they don't get another for ~4 years.
On February 26 2012 17:36 SnK-Arcbound wrote: Rua got a rematch against machida even though the cards weren't close. I think letting rematches happen sets a bad standard. Now anyone who loses a title match wants one.
Dana should tell people they get one fucking shot, and only themselves are to blame if they don't get another for ~4 years.
I don't think setting absolutes is the way to go. I agree that I don't want to see rematch after rematch, but as far as I'm concerned if Edgar can win his next fight then a rematch is fair game. It's not like either fighter embarrassed themselves. Edgar vs Ben Henderson 2 would be a good fight so I'm not gonna complain.
On February 26 2012 17:36 SnK-Arcbound wrote: Rua got a rematch against machida even though the cards weren't close. I think letting rematches happen sets a bad standard. Now anyone who loses a title match wants one.
Dana should tell people they get one fucking shot, and only themselves are to blame if they don't get another for ~4 years.
Shogun got a rematch because he deserved it. Not to say Edgar doesn't because he does, but I think Dana wants to try to talk Edgar in going down to fight Aldo for the belt, which as Naz put it. Would be a little too soon considering he can still bring in big bucks at this weight class.
Just goes to show you how the judges can affect the score cards when it comes to defining strikes and how much weight they carry. I wish I knew who the judges were scoring this fight because they did the right thing while Shogun got robbed in the first fight. Many people including Dana thought Shogun outworked Machida including myself. Shogun totally dissected Machida's gameplan with his Thai kicks. He solved the riddle yet it didn't show in the cards until the 2nd fight.
That's why we have the old cliche, "To be the champ, you got to beat the champ."
I don't want to call this match a foil to Shogun's first bout because there was more to look at in this one including Hendo slipping and sliding.
Shockingly Frankie didn't even outland Bendo according to fightmetric. That's surprising because if the only criteria were # of strikes landed I would have said he won last night. I think we're all just a bit mesmerized by Frankie being the smaller, faster fighter and his high energy style. He always looks like he's doing something when apparently he kind of isn't a lot of the time
I mean he was clearly less effective than Bendo all night, but if he didn't even outland him, how could he have won other than by virtue of being Frankie Edgar?
I would personally love to see him a 145 facing guys with similar speed/size just to see the true efficacy of his fighting style. I think he's great but the only performances I've loved were the Gray Maynard ones, where there was a real sense of urgency because of the early rounds.
Not to look close at the rounds and who out-striked who. Measuring the fight by the saying "You got to beat the champ to become the champ". Bendo was unscratched at the end of round 5 while Franky was totally messed up.
Always hilarious to watch rampage jackson walking into the ring like he is an animal, but when fight starts nothing happens. He just struggles with his stamina and lands nothing ...........
Dana thinks Edgar won, but he would rather see him at 145 so no rematch even though he fought two rematches for the UFC.
I'm really torn on that. On one hand I could see Frankie deserving a rematch, but the 155 division is so stacked right now it seems like a waste of talent to just have rematches.
I think giving Frankie a top contender fight to determine who gets next title shot would be an elegant solution. Maybe winner of Diaz/Miller fights Frankie while Pettis gets the next title shot.
I think dana is overhyped on frankie. After edgar vs maynard 3 he had said frankie has the best boxing in the ufc and after last night's fight which imo Benson clearly won, Dana remarks about how he thought Frankie won. Maybe what pisses me off most is he didn't do the same for diaz after his fight which was more lopsided then last night's (once again, imo)
Wanted to bump on an interesting piece of news: Frankie's manager says he's very likely going to move down to 145 now.
I would not be opposed to him getting an immediate title shot, but I don't really see what he has on Aldo. He might be able to outwork him and hope that Aldo gasses, but I think Aldo will just knock Frankie out.
I think Aldo would be such a terrible matchup for Frankie. Frankie relies on footwork massively, and relies on speed quite a lot, and that's the type of fighters that Aldo just straight shuts down. While Frankie caught a couple of Ben Henderson's kicks, I think Aldo's leg kicks would just be way too fast for Edgar to catch and even if he does catch one or two, Aldo's takedown defense is AWESOME, especially for a Brazilian fighter. While I think Edgar would probably land a few good combos, I think once Edgar's legs start getting attacked and his ability to move in and out start to fade, his game would completely unravel. I'd pick Aldo by TKO 3rd round here.
"There is no doubt, when you talk about respecting a guy, I have so much respect for Frankie Edgar and what he's been able to do at 155 pounds because he had to -- because there wasn't a 145-pound division -- and he did it," said White. "I really like and respect Frankie Edgar as a human being -- take the whole fighting thing out of it. This guy belongs at 145 pounds. When you are a professional fighter, you have a small window of opportunity to compete and be a professional athlete. There are only so many wars you have in you. You can't have this long, amazing career fighting wars all the time. So, I don't know."
The good news is that White is offering Edgar an immediate title shot against UFC Featherweight Champion Jose Aldo, who has actually expressed his desire to compete at 155 pounds in the near future. "Scarface" is on a ridiculous 14-fight win streak and has essentially cleared out the division.
A fight against Edgar would certainly be the stiffest test of his promising career.
"He will walk straight into a title shot, absolutely," White said of Edgar. "If I'm going to deny him the rematch for a 155-pound title and make him move to 145 pounds, and then say, 'Yeah, you're going to have to fight a couple fights to get the title,' does that sound right? No."
And everyone in that forum, literally almost everyone thinks it was no contest. Go read their comments as well.
Edgar didn't even land more strikes, take downs were useless and were countered, Bendo being floored was DEFINITELY a slip (he grabbed and pointed his foot to show it was slip or perhaps checking for injury)
Edgar did 0 dmg on Bendo, all around it was no contest. Go rewatch the fight and turn the volume off to cut off Rogan's Edgar biased commentary. Clearly Bendo won outright, and anyone who thinks otherwise has no clue or were watching a different fight.
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