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On March 10 2010 00:57 Klive5ive wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2010 00:49 CubEdIn wrote:+ Show Spoiler +What about 21. ...g5? I know it's not a particularly strong move by black but it's annoying. We won't have any place on the 4th rank to take our rook to, and we'll have to move it back to h3/h2/h1 (h2 being the best I think), none of which seem really useful at this point, and we'll have lost tempo (again).
If we play Rh4 and he also does a silent move like Kb8, then our best option in my view would be to capture on c5, forcing 22. ...Bc5. I played with this line a bit and it seems to increase our attacking potential.
Also, I don't see what's wrong with his Qe4. We would trade queens, and then as I see it, we would trade our bishop/pawn for his knight/pawn, which isn't the best thing at this moment but the positioning should still be on our side.
I fail to think of a better move than Rh4 though, even though I don't like it. I'd vote Re1 but that would make the game stall even longer.
So yeah, Rh4 it is then. Vote: 21. Rh4 + Show Spoiler + Are you aware of En passant?
21. Rh4 g5
22. hxg6
We can take the g pawn if he moves past us.
Edit: What's with all the negativity?! Claiming it's a draw or we've somehow lost tempo. We're in a decent position with a lot of Chess to play ahead. By the way, Karpov has been in this exact position a few times.
And lost to a nobody in a simul.
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On March 10 2010 13:53 Lefnui wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2010 00:57 Klive5ive wrote:On March 10 2010 00:49 CubEdIn wrote:+ Show Spoiler +What about 21. ...g5? I know it's not a particularly strong move by black but it's annoying. We won't have any place on the 4th rank to take our rook to, and we'll have to move it back to h3/h2/h1 (h2 being the best I think), none of which seem really useful at this point, and we'll have lost tempo (again).
If we play Rh4 and he also does a silent move like Kb8, then our best option in my view would be to capture on c5, forcing 22. ...Bc5. I played with this line a bit and it seems to increase our attacking potential.
Also, I don't see what's wrong with his Qe4. We would trade queens, and then as I see it, we would trade our bishop/pawn for his knight/pawn, which isn't the best thing at this moment but the positioning should still be on our side.
I fail to think of a better move than Rh4 though, even though I don't like it. I'd vote Re1 but that would make the game stall even longer.
So yeah, Rh4 it is then. Vote: 21. Rh4 + Show Spoiler + Are you aware of En passant?
21. Rh4 g5
22. hxg6
We can take the g pawn if he moves past us.
Edit: What's with all the negativity?! Claiming it's a draw or we've somehow lost tempo. We're in a decent position with a lot of Chess to play ahead. By the way, Karpov has been in this exact position a few times. And lost to a nobody in a simul.
Lol? + Show Spoiler +More random negativity. I was talking off the top of my head before so I went and looked it up, turns out he plays from here a lot more than a few times.
In 2007 alone he won 8, drew 2 from this position. Including wins over Kasmidzhavoz and Guliyev. Stop being ridiculous.
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It's not negative to say that this is a drawish position, it's a fact. If you can't see that then you're a patzer.
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It is drawish, but I feel white has a nice edge - you can play for a win from here, and I will just have to defend. I think Rhe8 instead of Nf6 was a *slight* blunder, but nothing too serious. I certainly have played worse moves! :D
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22. Re1
..I'm tired of elaborating moves/ideas because of lack of contribution from most other players. 
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On March 11 2010 08:00 Lefnui wrote:
It's not negative to say that this is a drawish position, it's a fact. If you can't see that then you're a patzer.
You've changed your tune, you just said "and lost to a nobody in a simul"; as if our position was bad.
We've done well to get to this position. It's only a drawish position in the sense that Black is now playing for a draw. We are playing for a win.
However, with the quality of our opponent a win for us is still very unlikely.
On March 11 2010 13:27 Lefnui wrote:
22.Re1
+ Show Spoiler +I don't really like that move, can you explain your thoughts? We put our Queen on e2 for a reason and the file isn't open yet. It seems a couple of moves too early.
A better move would be 22. Rc1 or we could consider Ne5.
I gotta go to work but I'll look into it in more detail soon.
Edit: Dam, now 3 of you vote Re1 with no reason? Just wait if you're not sure.
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On March 11 2010 19:24 Klive5ive wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 08:00 Lefnui wrote:
It's not negative to say that this is a drawish position, it's a fact. If you can't see that then you're a patzer. You've changed your tune, you just said "and lost to a nobody in a simul"; as if our position was bad. We've done well to get to this position. It's only a drawish position in the sense that Black is now playing for a draw. We are playing for a win. However, with the quality of our opponent a win for us is still very unlikely. + Show Spoiler +I don't really like that move, can you explain your thoughts? We put our Queen on e2 for a reason and the file isn't open yet. It seems a couple of moves too early.
A better move would be 22. Rc1 or we could consider Ne5.
I gotta go to work but I'll look into it in more detail soon.
Edit: Dam, now 3 of you vote Re1 with no reason? Just wait if you're not sure.
I have my reasons but it's only you that's willing to actually explain their moves. Even if we both agree, I noticed that there are at least 4-5 more people that just vote what the previous person voted without giving any explanation for it. I'll just think on my own and try to come up with the best move. In this case, I happen to think that this will cause the least damage to our positional-play. I'm not 100% sure but unless others start to explain their choices, it's pretty pointless that we express ours. That's why I'm disappointed.
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On March 11 2010 19:24 Klive5ive wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 08:00 Lefnui wrote:
It's not negative to say that this is a drawish position, it's a fact. If you can't see that then you're a patzer. You've changed your tune, you just said "and lost to a nobody in a simul"; as if our position was bad. We've done well to get to this position. It's only a drawish position in the sense that Black is now playing for a draw. We are playing for a win. However, with the quality of our opponent a win for us is still very unlikely. + Show Spoiler +I don't really like that move, can you explain your thoughts? We put our Queen on e2 for a reason and the file isn't open yet. It seems a couple of moves too early.
A better move would be 22. Rc1 or we could consider Ne5.
I gotta go to work but I'll look into it in more detail soon.
Edit: Dam, now 3 of you vote Re1 with no reason? Just wait if you're not sure.
I haven't contradicted myself at all. As I said earlier, this is a drawish position. You mentioned that Karpov had been in the same position a number of times, as if that means it isn't drawish. If anything that supports the idea that it's dead even. I merely pointed out the fact that in one of those games you referenced he lost to a complete nobody in a simul. I doubt even Karpov could squeeze the opponent enough for a win in this situation, unless Black makes a mistake.
If I had said that White's position was terrible, or that we have to struggle for a draw then that would have been your favorite word, "negative". In reality all I did was state a fact: this is drawish. White is not playing for a win, there is barely any edge at all. And Black doesn't have to play for a draw, he already has it. All he has to do is follow through and keep from going wrong.
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Can you guys get a room please?
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ne5 it attacks the opponents quenn giving more movable space to work with and 1 extra move next moves will then be advantageous for white
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WTF?!?!
+ Show Spoiler +Did jfazz just did a MAYOR screw up? He just tied all of his pieces and his trades are not as good.
+ Show Spoiler +Now I'm kinda lost here... But! I think a good move could be Ne5? Safely trade his bishop for our Knight and give our Rooks some breathing room, while still suntanning good control over the center of the board.
+ Show Spoiler +Ne5 Bxe5, Qxe5 ..., d5 ....
If someone could help me continue that line up there I would appreciate it :D
Oh, yeah and stop the silly arguments, and Cube dude seriously that was your excuse for not posting an analysis? "Nobody's posting one so I wont either"? >.< Come on guys this is supposed to be fun! Our position is OK but jfazz is good enough so that OK migh not cut it. Can we leave it at that?
+ Show Spoiler +Now I really think we just caught a break here even thou Ne5 would had been better on the short term since jfazz MIGHT had screwed up that Re1 move could become pretty useful.
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Any big tournaments happening in Western Europe during the summer? I might visit Amsterdam for Sensation White.
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On March 14 2010 00:46 Arhkangel wrote:WTF?!?! + Show Spoiler +Did jfazz just did a MAYOR screw up? He just tied all of his pieces and his trades are not as good. Now I'm kinda lost here... But! I think a good move could be Ne5? Safely trade his bishop for our Knight and give our Rooks some breathing room, while still suntanning good control over the center of the board. Ne5 Bxe5, Qxe5 ..., d5 .... If someone could help me continue that line up there I would appreciate it :D Oh, yeah and stop the silly arguments, and Cube dude seriously that was your excuse for not posting an analysis? "Nobody's posting one so I wont either"? >.< Come on guys this is supposed to be fun! Our position is OK but jfazz is good enough so that OK migh not cut it. Can we leave it at that? + Show Spoiler +Now I really think we just caught a break here even thou Ne5 would had been better on the short term since jfazz MIGHT had screwed up that Re1 move could become pretty useful.
+ Show Spoiler +Ne5 is bad now, he can just play xd4 and we lose material.
23. Ne5 xd4
If we take 24. Nxf7 xBc3 we lose.
If we swap off on d4 we still lose.
Our new plan has to be to attack down our Queenside. Probably 23. a2 is a good move now. Attempting to play 24. Ka2.
If he swaps off xd4 he won't win in the exchange
Edit: Actually to that end we could play 23. xc5
23 ... Qxc5
24. Bxf6 xf6 (we've doubled his pawns up)
25. a2 Now we can play a2 followed by Ka2 and try and break through. If we do that move order we free up our Knight to assist and leave little space for the black bishop to get into play.
If anyone wants to add to my analysis that would be great. At the moment I'm leaning on 23. xc5.
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+ Show Spoiler +True, but after that:
25. Ne5 Bxe5
26 Qxe5 Qxe5
27. Bxe5
...and we got him an open d-file, even though we got rid of his bishop as planned
I do agree that a queen move is best now, I just can't decide on which queen move.
My friend says Qc2 would be a good idea since it locks down the c2->h7 diagonal and strengthens our middle a bit more. I played this out and it can't really interfere with our exchanges, so it seems a better idea than Qe3.
So... 23. Qc2?
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c353/jamesfazzolari/21.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c353/jamesfazzolari/22a.jpg)
