EPTOn August 06 2012 00:44 Aocowns wrote:
I don't get what you are trying to argue here. You said you thought Idra was not getting better, and I counter argued that, and then you show up and say that Idra played bad vs Moon and Puma(as if we didn't know that) and you say that every noticable player is improving. I just don't get what you're trying to argue with this
Show nested quote +
On August 05 2012 22:01 syriuszonito wrote:
I know this is a funclub but try to be at least a bit less biased. Yes I do know he heavily relies on momentum and thats his biggest problem. As long as he falls apart whenever something goes wrong ingame chances of him dominating the foreign scene are close to 0. Going into the match vs Moon he should be in a good shape after the sucessful day 1 yet he played poor. In 2 games he had the build order advantage and wasted it. I am sure he got frustrated but its not because moon played extremely cheesy or stupid, its just that IdrA didnt play good at all. As for games vs Puma yes I did see them. Game 1 and 2 all ins that didnt work, game 3 bad micro vs the bunker rush at third, not much here to comment , he was either tilted after games vs moon or didnt feel comfortable to play a straight up game vs Puma for some reason.
I can Objectively look at every noticable player right now and few months ago and tell you that they have improved. The whole trick is that if you are not a top notch player and you want to be one you need to get better compared to the other players
On August 05 2012 21:43 Aocowns wrote:
You know Idra is a player that relies heavily on momentum, right? That series against Moon must've been one of the most frustrating ways he could've lost that series, and that prolly affected him going into the fucking elimination series 5 minutes after, don't you think? Did you see the games vs Puma? It was pretty much a bad roach/ling/bling attack, then a 2 base muta build on Ohana, and the last game I don't even remember. That was not Idra playing the best he could, that was more like the ridicolous bane all in game against Daisuki where he cancelled his bane nest, then his roach warren.
Objectively look at his gameplay in a stream from many months ago, then look at his more recent games. Saying he has not gotten better is just fucking retarded. Since he has not stopped improving yet, saying he isn't going to be better in the future is also equally ridicolous imo
On August 05 2012 21:29 syriuszonito wrote:
While games vs Taeja were indeed very impressive I am starting to wonder if it was IdrA playing good or Taeja bad. I mean can you honestly look at the games vs moon and puma and say that he is getting better?
On August 05 2012 00:33 Whole wrote:
He was doing well in Code S when he was in Korea practicing. Then he went back to America and got no practice because he was going to tournaments every week...and he said he's bad at traveling. I don't know if you traveled across an ocean, but when I came back from Europe, it literally took a week for me to stop getting stupidly exhausted at random intervals everyday.
So the lack of practice finally caught up to him to a point of losing to lesser opponents...or opponents that a normal IdrA should not lose to at all. Just go here to see a bunch of losses that should never happened. But think about it like this. From the start of July, IdrA went from losing to Kas, Darkforce, Socke, Feast, Daisuki CatZ, and STX
...well before some people flame me, it's not like I'm downplaying these guys. I know some of them are legitimately good, but I'm talking about them from an old dominating IdrA standpoint, AND you can't just look at it from a results standpoint. If you look at the games, IdrA played like shit...
Anyway, from the start of July, IdrA went from losing to those foreigners (IdrA should be #1 foreigner in top form) to dominating the first group stages (HSCV & ASUS ROG) and playing respectable games against Koreans and better opponents. I didn't watch it, but people saying the IdrA games vs Taeja were actually just IdrA losing to one decision (and larva bug), and after HSCV, IdrA said he didn't mind his losses because he could easily identify what he did wrong, and he can fix it in the future.
So just because IdrA said before his last MLG & WCS scheduling nightmare that he was confident, it doesn't mean that he'll go from dropping series to Daisuki to winning Code S overnight. Improvement is a process, so I think you guys need to stop predicting the IdrA apocalypse after every tournament and actually look at what is happening. He is getting better, and considering only a month has passed so far, I think IdrA and his fans have a pretty bright future ahead of us.
On August 04 2012 22:36 Punti wrote:
Well, I think you guys have to be more specific. Losing is definitely a part of the game, but how you react to it at a mayor tournament is a different thing and separates a real champ from someone like Idra. I mean, since the start of SC2 Idra has always been complaining about balance and stuff where others just made out the best of it because they knew things will change.
Also, Idras mindset 1 1/2 year ago wasn't better, maybe even worse and he was doing pretty good, even at Code S. I personally think that Idra may have reached his highest possible skill level and that's it. I mean, Idra had tons of Starcraft training, very good mechanics and so on, that really gave him an edge at the beginning of Starcraft 2 compared to other players, but normally, as time goes by that relativizes.
On August 04 2012 22:09 tragedy wrote:
You are really wrong and missed the point of that quote.
It describes how people react to losses and how they take in losses to improve and get better.
Nothing to do with what you wrote. Every loss is a lesson to learn from. People like me, will get angry/frustrated and take every loss "hard" and improve out of every loss.
On August 04 2012 21:25 Tachion wrote:
It makes no sense in the context of Starcraft. People lose all the time, it's part of growing and learning. If you're not losing you're not playing the damn game. If you can't accept losing in starcraft it prob means you're whiney and cry imba imba all the time blaming your losses on outside factors and not growing as a player.
On August 04 2012 21:14 tragedy wrote:
If you don't understand it, doesn't make it stupid.
It is actually an excelent quote from a great american football coach.
On August 04 2012 19:27 RageBot wrote:
[quote]
This is beyond stupid,
[quote]
This is beyond stupid,
If you don't understand it, doesn't make it stupid.
It is actually an excelent quote from a great american football coach.
It makes no sense in the context of Starcraft. People lose all the time, it's part of growing and learning. If you're not losing you're not playing the damn game. If you can't accept losing in starcraft it prob means you're whiney and cry imba imba all the time blaming your losses on outside factors and not growing as a player.
You are really wrong and missed the point of that quote.
It describes how people react to losses and how they take in losses to improve and get better.
Nothing to do with what you wrote. Every loss is a lesson to learn from. People like me, will get angry/frustrated and take every loss "hard" and improve out of every loss.
Well, I think you guys have to be more specific. Losing is definitely a part of the game, but how you react to it at a mayor tournament is a different thing and separates a real champ from someone like Idra. I mean, since the start of SC2 Idra has always been complaining about balance and stuff where others just made out the best of it because they knew things will change.
Also, Idras mindset 1 1/2 year ago wasn't better, maybe even worse and he was doing pretty good, even at Code S. I personally think that Idra may have reached his highest possible skill level and that's it. I mean, Idra had tons of Starcraft training, very good mechanics and so on, that really gave him an edge at the beginning of Starcraft 2 compared to other players, but normally, as time goes by that relativizes.
He was doing well in Code S when he was in Korea practicing. Then he went back to America and got no practice because he was going to tournaments every week...and he said he's bad at traveling. I don't know if you traveled across an ocean, but when I came back from Europe, it literally took a week for me to stop getting stupidly exhausted at random intervals everyday.
So the lack of practice finally caught up to him to a point of losing to lesser opponents...or opponents that a normal IdrA should not lose to at all. Just go here to see a bunch of losses that should never happened. But think about it like this. From the start of July, IdrA went from losing to Kas, Darkforce, Socke, Feast, Daisuki CatZ, and STX
...well before some people flame me, it's not like I'm downplaying these guys. I know some of them are legitimately good, but I'm talking about them from an old dominating IdrA standpoint, AND you can't just look at it from a results standpoint. If you look at the games, IdrA played like shit...
Anyway, from the start of July, IdrA went from losing to those foreigners (IdrA should be #1 foreigner in top form) to dominating the first group stages (HSCV & ASUS ROG) and playing respectable games against Koreans and better opponents. I didn't watch it, but people saying the IdrA games vs Taeja were actually just IdrA losing to one decision (and larva bug), and after HSCV, IdrA said he didn't mind his losses because he could easily identify what he did wrong, and he can fix it in the future.
So just because IdrA said before his last MLG & WCS scheduling nightmare that he was confident, it doesn't mean that he'll go from dropping series to Daisuki to winning Code S overnight. Improvement is a process, so I think you guys need to stop predicting the IdrA apocalypse after every tournament and actually look at what is happening. He is getting better, and considering only a month has passed so far, I think IdrA and his fans have a pretty bright future ahead of us.
While games vs Taeja were indeed very impressive I am starting to wonder if it was IdrA playing good or Taeja bad. I mean can you honestly look at the games vs moon and puma and say that he is getting better?
You know Idra is a player that relies heavily on momentum, right? That series against Moon must've been one of the most frustrating ways he could've lost that series, and that prolly affected him going into the fucking elimination series 5 minutes after, don't you think? Did you see the games vs Puma? It was pretty much a bad roach/ling/bling attack, then a 2 base muta build on Ohana, and the last game I don't even remember. That was not Idra playing the best he could, that was more like the ridicolous bane all in game against Daisuki where he cancelled his bane nest, then his roach warren.
Objectively look at his gameplay in a stream from many months ago, then look at his more recent games. Saying he has not gotten better is just fucking retarded. Since he has not stopped improving yet, saying he isn't going to be better in the future is also equally ridicolous imo
I know this is a funclub but try to be at least a bit less biased. Yes I do know he heavily relies on momentum and thats his biggest problem. As long as he falls apart whenever something goes wrong ingame chances of him dominating the foreign scene are close to 0. Going into the match vs Moon he should be in a good shape after the sucessful day 1 yet he played poor. In 2 games he had the build order advantage and wasted it. I am sure he got frustrated but its not because moon played extremely cheesy or stupid, its just that IdrA didnt play good at all. As for games vs Puma yes I did see them. Game 1 and 2 all ins that didnt work, game 3 bad micro vs the bunker rush at third, not much here to comment , he was either tilted after games vs moon or didnt feel comfortable to play a straight up game vs Puma for some reason.
I can Objectively look at every noticable player right now and few months ago and tell you that they have improved. The whole trick is that if you are not a top notch player and you want to be one you need to get better compared to the other players
I don't get what you are trying to argue here. You said you thought Idra was not getting better, and I counter argued that, and then you show up and say that Idra played bad vs Moon and Puma(as if we didn't know that) and you say that every noticable player is improving. I just don't get what you're trying to argue with this
All I am saying is that IdrA is still in bad shape and even if he is improving like you claim, other players improve faster. Being optimistic is good, being blind not.
