shattered temple (i think, its the old lost temple from bw am i right? lol) close positions.
idra fast expands forgg tried to do 2rax bunker pressure early on, with landing one of the rax outside his base. idra prevented the second rax from landing with a profe so bunker canceled, defended it perfectly. idra fast exapanded so was ahead, forgg moved out with10 marines killed a queen a bunch of zergling and stoped mining at natural. (saw 3 spores)
after a few moments second push came: 17 marines 4 maraudesrs, idra loses 2 sunkens but clears up everything with zerglings/banelings
forgg has vision of only idras natural, goes for medivac/3rd cc.
first medivac drop 8 marines, idra defends reasonably well lost a few zerglings saved medivac tho. second medivac drop comes very soon after, 3 medivacs this time.
idra just got 5 mutes out and a bunch of zerglings, he loses spawning pool and doesnt have nearly enough to defend, loses zerglings and has like 4 mutas vs 3 medivacs and ~10 marines. idra leaves the game.
On January 20 2012 19:29 Allwars wrote: The thing is muta/ling/bling has no counter. You can make a lot of little adjustments on it and be perfectly fine against all that a terran can throw at you. In fact, each pro plays it differently.
It has no hard counter, but builds can be adjusted to be more effective against it. Why do you think Taeja was able to expand and get a macro lead each game, and why every game looked almost exactly alike? Because Idra played like he always does and Taeja countered his play really well. Idra should have done something to throw him out of the loop, the roach rush seemed like a good start but he followed it up with the same exact thing he did in the previous game.
Or are you really trying to argue that a great player only needs one build/playstyle in their repertoire?
On January 20 2012 19:29 Allwars wrote: The thing is muta/ling/bling has no counter. You can make a lot of little adjustments on it and be perfectly fine against all that a terran can throw at you. In fact, each pro plays it differently.
Or are you really trying to argue that a great player only needs one build/playstyle in their repertoire?
yea i feel like it is his BW stubborness is the reason why he'll only play one style ZvT. being stylistic in BW was undershadowed by have great mechanics. look at his ZvP he doesnt always play the same style in that....i wonder why he is unwilling to try new things in n sc2. having different styles to call upon in TvZ is strengh. it makes it harder for your opponent to perpare against you
On January 20 2012 19:29 Allwars wrote: The thing is muta/ling/bling has no counter. You can make a lot of little adjustments on it and be perfectly fine against all that a terran can throw at you. In fact, each pro plays it differently.
It has no hard counter, but builds can be adjusted to be more effective against it. Why do you think Taeja was able to expand and get a macro lead each game, and why every game looked almost exactly alike? Because Idra played like he always does and Taeja countered his play really well. Idra should have done something to throw him out of the loop, the roach rush seemed like a good start but he followed it up with the same exact thing he did in the previous game.
Or are you really trying to argue that a great player only needs one build/playstyle in their repertoire?
I'm arguing the opposite actually. The problem in the series was that IdrA did two base muta(IMO obviously, im not a pro). Two base muta is not muta/ling/bling. He could've built a couple of roaches to be able to get the third safely without worrying about hellions and then build his muta/ling/bling army. He could've gone double evo and get fast +2/+2 with less mutas because they weren't being effectively enough, but the army would still be ling/bling/muta. He could've skipped the 3rd and go for a big 2 base push.
There is so much room for improvements in the build without having to completely change your core unit (muta) to infestor.
My point is, IdrA could've been as reactive as TaeJa did to adjust to his playstyle, because IMO the build allows it.
Didn't see the early game, but after 2 bases were secured by both players:
IdrA went for a third quicker than Catz, but Catz went for a gold, Catz managed to kill a macro hatch and the then morphing gold hatch of IdrA with infested marines, but made a huge mistake (as he said) when IdrA attacked with Ultalisks. He had his infestors still burrowed and basically did nothing with them to hold the attack which killed almost all infestors + natural and I believe the gold (Catz stated that it is entirely possible to hold an ultra attack with infestors, if you don't mess up), from then on IdrA just had to producce units and send them at Catz. gg
On January 20 2012 19:29 Allwars wrote: The thing is muta/ling/bling has no counter. You can make a lot of little adjustments on it and be perfectly fine against all that a terran can throw at you. In fact, each pro plays it differently.
It has no hard counter, but builds can be adjusted to be more effective against it. Why do you think Taeja was able to expand and get a macro lead each game, and why every game looked almost exactly alike? Because Idra played like he always does and Taeja countered his play really well. Idra should have done something to throw him out of the loop, the roach rush seemed like a good start but he followed it up with the same exact thing he did in the previous game.
Or are you really trying to argue that a great player only needs one build/playstyle in their repertoire?
Idra didn't play like he always did? What are you talking about? Idra did a drastic different build, its basically the agressive variant that leenock did so extrodinary well with.
Idra usually cuts a tons of corners for mutas and that 1+/bspeed doesn't do that. If a terran is effective vs mutas it isn't because it is effective agaisnt... well mutas. It is more if it punishes greedy play or not :3
Same with ling/infestor, a zerg going quick third, double evos and just being very greedy is also going to die against something that punishes that.
On January 21 2012 00:54 Lefaa wrote: Idra held Naama's mech push pretty nicely in one game today, and he built roaches!
We've seen roaches more often from IdrA since he's been in Korea. I think it's really great. Sure, it slows down the mutas, but it lets you take a third more quickly, really kills the hellions quickly, etc.
Part 2 of the BM is the best :D used to watch it so many times. I love the "eZ?" after Combat death ball evaporates to roach hydra corruptor :D and Idra's "Yes, It was" at 0:22. Man, Greg must be quite upset as hell over the losses in GSL and Taeja showmatch. Last time he streamed was like 15 days ago and he even made a poll for people which time he should stream. Best luck to him and hopefully that extra time we cant watch his stream will help him get to code S.
People have to read that from page 24 on. Basically, it is a tournament thread from the Beta, Idra didn't GG in one of the tournament matches and was banned from future tournaments. The thread then turns into a grudge match between Idra and Smuft (the host of the tourney) when idra challenges him to a $500 BO5 Showmatch and Smuft shortly afterwards raises it up to $5000 a piece.
I'm sure a lot of you have read it, but I'm also sure there are a lot of Idra fans here that weren't around in the beta. A lot of other notable people were involved at times in the thread as well - Catz, Tyler, Day9, InControl, HuK, Artosis, etc.
EPT
