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SPOILER WARNING If you only watch the show, this thread will spoil you of future events in HBO's Game of Thrones. Thread contains discussion of all books of the series A Song of Ice and FireClick Here for the spoiler-free thread. |
Pretty Awesome stuff. I was always wondering why the hell Jojen and Meera were being so mopey and depressed. I guess that would explain it
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I think it's possible. Makes sense. I liked Jojen, though. Obviouslyu, if true, Bran has no idea.
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Also I personally want to see Victarion betray his brother for the sake of it and not marry, but ally Danaerys and return to take over Westeros
No way Daenerys will ally Victarion. Victarion will play his role with helping Daenerys to conquer Westeros, but the red priest (Moqorro) goal is reaching Daenerys and when that is done he will have no problem punish/sacrifice Victarion.
Victarion is Ironborn and like the most of them they just slaughter and conquer like bounty hunters, they don't care about ruling. Victarion will pay for all his atrocities and I think the Red God will betray him.
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Heh, if the Jojen theory is true, Bran will be heartbroken when he finds out. Will he do something rash? Warg into Hodor and try to kill all the children? ^^
What else did you guys pick up on while reading? Everything below deals only with the books published so far, up to and including aDwD. Don't wanna spoil the teaser tWoW chapter at all! 
- I'm kinda disappointed in myself that I didn't catch the Frey pie until it was spelled out to me. Even asking for the Rat Cook to be played... + Show Spoiler +
The idea being that Wyman Manderly had the three Frey envoys who were at White Harbour killed and baked into pies, which he then served to Bolton & Co at Winterfell.
- Likewise, I was completely oblivious as to where Wex tracked Rickon. Sure, Davos mentions cannibals, and Jon "dreamt" about Shaggydog eating a unicorn, but where do we first hear about these things being connected to + Show Spoiler +
Skagos? I honestly can't remember. Some Old Nan story in Game of thrones?
- Moving on, I don't trust any character being dead unless we get to witness his/her last breath anymore. Arya left Sandor bleeding and weak, and I knew it was someone else under that helm who was ravaging Saltpans, but + Show Spoiler +
I never drew the connection to the new brother at Quiet Isle. If that's him, I hope he gets a triumphant return later on, or at least an opportunity to get that kiss from Sansa.
- Robert Strong is so obviously + Show Spoiler +
Gregor Clegane, headless or not. Doubt this even needs a spoiler tag. My problem with this whole ordeal is this: Why would the other kingsguard, Kevan, Mace Tyrell and other higher-ups tolerate this abomination in a white cloak? Everything they "know" about him has been told by proxy of Qyburn, who is NOT a trustworthy person - being kicked out from the Citadel due to experimenting on humans, joining the bloody mummers etc. It's as absurd as if Cersei had put Vargo Hoat on her little council. How or why would they let Cersei (sure, she's the queen, but she was not exactly in a position of power when she made the nomination) shame the Lannister name, the reputation of the Kingsguard and risk another war?
- Rounding up, the letter Jon recieves from Ramsay. Would GRRM kill off someone like Stannis off-screen? All we get from this important battle is a biased letter from a biggest douchebag in Westeros? Remembering both Manderly (and lady Dustin?) and Arnolf Karstark were planning on betraying their respective sides, I feel like most of the letter is bullshit, and we're not done with the battle of Winterfell. I realize there's a tWoW chapter out with a PoV that probably touches on this, but leave that out of this.
 Since Ramsay + Show Spoiler +Or is it Roose? Roose is way more cunning, and might have his reasons to provocate the Night's Watch. Does Roose know Jon is losing the support of his brothers? Did he work together with Bowen Marsh, tricking Jon into deciding to march on Winterfell? Roose Bolton would be a fantastic character to have in King's Landing, giving Littlefinger and Varys a real match!
- At least I got Mance=Abel fairly quickly. ^^
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Skagos is mentioned fairly often in aDwD and I think in previous books too. But afaik Davos mentions Skagos specifically in combination with cannibals one time.
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To me it was pretty obvious that Jojen is dead/about to die soon. Yet I didn't think of him being the paste.
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On February 22 2012 09:54 moopie wrote:
I refuse to believe this theory, its too fucked up, even for Martin. At least I hope so.
#7 (the taste of blood) could be explained as the memories of the weirwood. Its likely that blood sacrifices were used to activate/wake the weirwoods. Bran and Jon both tasted blood through warging into Summer/Ghost, it doesn't have to be a literal meaning of Bran eating blood.
The thought of Bran eating his only real friend is too... bah.
#1 - #6 I understand the thoughts behind. It seems plausible, but you can never know what GRRM plans until you've read it.
I just think people try to interpret too much into #7.
Why not the obvious: When Bran/Jon are inside their wolves they taste as them. Bran is at that moment basically the
weirwood, so why wouldn't he just taste that man's blood through the roots?
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On February 22 2012 09:35 Rayeth wrote:Oh I like this theory. I have not heard it before, but it makes some sense. It also make a lot of delicious, delicious strife to come between Bran (and whatever he is now) and Jojen's sister (assuming she is sticking around while Bran chills in the chair).
My mind had shied away from the theory, but I had made the connection. I just didn't want to believe it (and still don't).
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fk jojen sacrifice theory only makes me want to read the next book sooner
also remember when bloodraven is teaching bran about greenseers etc (1 in 1000 = green dream, 1 in 1000 of those are greenseers), that might tie in with a jojen sacrifice assuming u need the blood of a green dreamer or w/e to "make" a green seer
still that makes me sad 
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On February 23 2012 00:29 Shichibukai wrote:Heh, if the Jojen theory is true, Bran will be heartbroken when he finds out. Will he do something rash? Warg into Hodor and try to kill all the children? ^^ What else did you guys pick up on while reading? Everything below deals only with the books published so far, up to and including aDwD. Don't wanna spoil the teaser tWoW chapter at all! - I'm kinda disappointed in myself that I didn't catch the Frey pie until it was spelled out to me. Even asking for the Rat Cook to be played... + Show Spoiler +
The idea being that Wyman Manderly had the three Frey envoys who were at White Harbour killed and baked into pies, which he then served to Bolton & Co at Winterfell.
- Likewise, I was completely oblivious as to where Wex tracked Rickon. Sure, Davos mentions cannibals, and Jon "dreamt" about Shaggydog eating a unicorn, but where do we first hear about these things being connected to + Show Spoiler +
Skagos? I honestly can't remember. Some Old Nan story in Game of thrones?
- Moving on, I don't trust any character being dead unless we get to witness his/her last breath anymore. Arya left Sandor bleeding and weak, and I knew it was someone else under that helm who was ravaging Saltpans, but + Show Spoiler +
I never drew the connection to the new brother at Quiet Isle. If that's him, I hope he gets a triumphant return later on, or at least an opportunity to get that kiss from Sansa.
- Robert Strong is so obviously + Show Spoiler +
Gregor Clegane, headless or not. Doubt this even needs a spoiler tag. My problem with this whole ordeal is this: Why would the other kingsguard, Kevan, Mace Tyrell and other higher-ups tolerate this abomination in a white cloak? Everything they "know" about him has been told by proxy of Qyburn, who is NOT a trustworthy person - being kicked out from the Citadel due to experimenting on humans, joining the bloody mummers etc. It's as absurd as if Cersei had put Vargo Hoat on her little council. How or why would they let Cersei (sure, she's the queen, but she was not exactly in a position of power when she made the nomination) shame the Lannister name, the reputation of the Kingsguard and risk another war?
- Rounding up, the letter Jon recieves from Ramsay. Would GRRM kill off someone like Stannis off-screen? All we get from this important battle is a biased letter from a biggest douchebag in Westeros? Remembering both Manderly (and lady Dustin?) and Arnolf Karstark were planning on betraying their respective sides, I feel like most of the letter is bullshit, and we're not done with the battle of Winterfell. I realize there's a tWoW chapter out with a PoV that probably touches on this, but leave that out of this. Since Ramsay + Show Spoiler +
Or is it Roose? Roose is way more cunning, and might have his reasons to provocate the Night's Watch. Does Roose know Jon is losing the support of his brothers? Did he work together with Bowen Marsh, tricking Jon into deciding to march on Winterfell? Roose Bolton would be a fantastic character to have in King's Landing, giving Littlefinger and Varys a real match!
- At least I got Mance=Abel fairly quickly. ^^
The only one I got myself was Abel, and that took me a while. Well, that and Skagos.
Another one related to theon, although I'm sure it's already been mentioned somewhere in here:
+ Show Spoiler [aDwD] +Ramsay castrated Theon. Or removed his wang. Or something.
Theon is no longer a man, pretty much.
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On February 23 2012 06:01 Crazyeyes wrote:Show nested quote +On February 23 2012 00:29 Shichibukai wrote:Heh, if the Jojen theory is true, Bran will be heartbroken when he finds out. Will he do something rash? Warg into Hodor and try to kill all the children? ^^ What else did you guys pick up on while reading? Everything below deals only with the books published so far, up to and including aDwD. Don't wanna spoil the teaser tWoW chapter at all! - I'm kinda disappointed in myself that I didn't catch the Frey pie until it was spelled out to me. Even asking for the Rat Cook to be played... + Show Spoiler +
The idea being that Wyman Manderly had the three Frey envoys who were at White Harbour killed and baked into pies, which he then served to Bolton & Co at Winterfell.
- Likewise, I was completely oblivious as to where Wex tracked Rickon. Sure, Davos mentions cannibals, and Jon "dreamt" about Shaggydog eating a unicorn, but where do we first hear about these things being connected to + Show Spoiler +
Skagos? I honestly can't remember. Some Old Nan story in Game of thrones?
- Moving on, I don't trust any character being dead unless we get to witness his/her last breath anymore. Arya left Sandor bleeding and weak, and I knew it was someone else under that helm who was ravaging Saltpans, but + Show Spoiler +
I never drew the connection to the new brother at Quiet Isle. If that's him, I hope he gets a triumphant return later on, or at least an opportunity to get that kiss from Sansa.
- Robert Strong is so obviously + Show Spoiler +
Gregor Clegane, headless or not. Doubt this even needs a spoiler tag. My problem with this whole ordeal is this: Why would the other kingsguard, Kevan, Mace Tyrell and other higher-ups tolerate this abomination in a white cloak? Everything they "know" about him has been told by proxy of Qyburn, who is NOT a trustworthy person - being kicked out from the Citadel due to experimenting on humans, joining the bloody mummers etc. It's as absurd as if Cersei had put Vargo Hoat on her little council. How or why would they let Cersei (sure, she's the queen, but she was not exactly in a position of power when she made the nomination) shame the Lannister name, the reputation of the Kingsguard and risk another war?
- Rounding up, the letter Jon recieves from Ramsay. Would GRRM kill off someone like Stannis off-screen? All we get from this important battle is a biased letter from a biggest douchebag in Westeros? Remembering both Manderly (and lady Dustin?) and Arnolf Karstark were planning on betraying their respective sides, I feel like most of the letter is bullshit, and we're not done with the battle of Winterfell. I realize there's a tWoW chapter out with a PoV that probably touches on this, but leave that out of this. Since Ramsay + Show Spoiler +
Or is it Roose? Roose is way more cunning, and might have his reasons to provocate the Night's Watch. Does Roose know Jon is losing the support of his brothers? Did he work together with Bowen Marsh, tricking Jon into deciding to march on Winterfell? Roose Bolton would be a fantastic character to have in King's Landing, giving Littlefinger and Varys a real match!
- At least I got Mance=Abel fairly quickly. ^^
The only one I got myself was Abel, and that took me a while. Well, that and Skagos. Another one related to theon, although I'm sure it's already been mentioned somewhere in here: + Show Spoiler [aDwD] +Ramsay castrated Theon. Or removed his wang. Or something.
Theon is no longer a man, pretty much.
Ah yeah, that one I got too. Poor Theon. ^^ So many people keep mentioning how much more they notice on their second readthrough, with all the foreshadowing in this series. Will probably start over again once season 2 has finished and long wait begins.
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On February 23 2012 06:21 Shichibukai wrote:Show nested quote +On February 23 2012 06:01 Crazyeyes wrote:On February 23 2012 00:29 Shichibukai wrote:Heh, if the Jojen theory is true, Bran will be heartbroken when he finds out. Will he do something rash? Warg into Hodor and try to kill all the children? ^^ What else did you guys pick up on while reading? Everything below deals only with the books published so far, up to and including aDwD. Don't wanna spoil the teaser tWoW chapter at all! - I'm kinda disappointed in myself that I didn't catch the Frey pie until it was spelled out to me. Even asking for the Rat Cook to be played... + Show Spoiler +
The idea being that Wyman Manderly had the three Frey envoys who were at White Harbour killed and baked into pies, which he then served to Bolton & Co at Winterfell.
- Likewise, I was completely oblivious as to where Wex tracked Rickon. Sure, Davos mentions cannibals, and Jon "dreamt" about Shaggydog eating a unicorn, but where do we first hear about these things being connected to + Show Spoiler +
Skagos? I honestly can't remember. Some Old Nan story in Game of thrones?
- Moving on, I don't trust any character being dead unless we get to witness his/her last breath anymore. Arya left Sandor bleeding and weak, and I knew it was someone else under that helm who was ravaging Saltpans, but + Show Spoiler +
I never drew the connection to the new brother at Quiet Isle. If that's him, I hope he gets a triumphant return later on, or at least an opportunity to get that kiss from Sansa.
- Robert Strong is so obviously + Show Spoiler +
Gregor Clegane, headless or not. Doubt this even needs a spoiler tag. My problem with this whole ordeal is this: Why would the other kingsguard, Kevan, Mace Tyrell and other higher-ups tolerate this abomination in a white cloak? Everything they "know" about him has been told by proxy of Qyburn, who is NOT a trustworthy person - being kicked out from the Citadel due to experimenting on humans, joining the bloody mummers etc. It's as absurd as if Cersei had put Vargo Hoat on her little council. How or why would they let Cersei (sure, she's the queen, but she was not exactly in a position of power when she made the nomination) shame the Lannister name, the reputation of the Kingsguard and risk another war?
- Rounding up, the letter Jon recieves from Ramsay. Would GRRM kill off someone like Stannis off-screen? All we get from this important battle is a biased letter from a biggest douchebag in Westeros? Remembering both Manderly (and lady Dustin?) and Arnolf Karstark were planning on betraying their respective sides, I feel like most of the letter is bullshit, and we're not done with the battle of Winterfell. I realize there's a tWoW chapter out with a PoV that probably touches on this, but leave that out of this. Since Ramsay + Show Spoiler +
Or is it Roose? Roose is way more cunning, and might have his reasons to provocate the Night's Watch. Does Roose know Jon is losing the support of his brothers? Did he work together with Bowen Marsh, tricking Jon into deciding to march on Winterfell? Roose Bolton would be a fantastic character to have in King's Landing, giving Littlefinger and Varys a real match!
- At least I got Mance=Abel fairly quickly. ^^
The only one I got myself was Abel, and that took me a while. Well, that and Skagos. Another one related to theon, although I'm sure it's already been mentioned somewhere in here: + Show Spoiler [aDwD] +Ramsay castrated Theon. Or removed his wang. Or something.
Theon is no longer a man, pretty much. Ah yeah, that one I got too. Poor Theon. ^^ So many people keep mentioning how much more they notice on their second readthrough, with all the foreshadowing in this series. Will probably start over again once season 2 has finished and long wait begins.
Poor Theon my ass. Theon's chapters in aDwD rocked, because we could finally get some sympathy for the twat. But even so, he deserves every second of being Reek (rhymes with meak ).
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On February 23 2012 01:22 DURRHURRDERP wrote:fk jojen sacrifice theory only makes me want to read the next book sooner also remember when bloodraven is teaching bran about greenseers etc (1 in 1000 = green dream, 1 in 1000 of those are greenseers), that might tie in with a jojen sacrifice assuming u need the blood of a green dreamer or w/e to "make" a green seer still that makes me sad
You got that wrong. Only one man in a thousand is born a skinchanger, and only one skinchanger in a thousand can be a greenseer. Lord Brynden
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On February 22 2012 11:30 InDaHouse wrote:Show nested quote +Also I personally want to see Victarion betray his brother for the sake of it and not marry, but ally Danaerys and return to take over Westeros No way Daenerys will ally Victarion. Victarion will play his role with helping Daenerys to conquer Westeros, but the red priest (Moqorro) goal is reaching Daenerys and when that is done he will have no problem punish/sacrifice Victarion. Victarion is Ironborn and like the most of them they just slaughter and conquer like bounty hunters, they don't care about ruling. Victarion will pay for all his atrocities and I think the Red God will betray him.
Look at the back of the book, if you look at Dannies 'khalsar' Victarions name is in there....just saying
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On February 23 2012 22:58 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On February 23 2012 06:21 Shichibukai wrote:On February 23 2012 06:01 Crazyeyes wrote:On February 23 2012 00:29 Shichibukai wrote:Heh, if the Jojen theory is true, Bran will be heartbroken when he finds out. Will he do something rash? Warg into Hodor and try to kill all the children? ^^ What else did you guys pick up on while reading? Everything below deals only with the books published so far, up to and including aDwD. Don't wanna spoil the teaser tWoW chapter at all! - I'm kinda disappointed in myself that I didn't catch the Frey pie until it was spelled out to me. Even asking for the Rat Cook to be played... + Show Spoiler +
The idea being that Wyman Manderly had the three Frey envoys who were at White Harbour killed and baked into pies, which he then served to Bolton & Co at Winterfell.
- Likewise, I was completely oblivious as to where Wex tracked Rickon. Sure, Davos mentions cannibals, and Jon "dreamt" about Shaggydog eating a unicorn, but where do we first hear about these things being connected to + Show Spoiler +
Skagos? I honestly can't remember. Some Old Nan story in Game of thrones?
- Moving on, I don't trust any character being dead unless we get to witness his/her last breath anymore. Arya left Sandor bleeding and weak, and I knew it was someone else under that helm who was ravaging Saltpans, but + Show Spoiler +
I never drew the connection to the new brother at Quiet Isle. If that's him, I hope he gets a triumphant return later on, or at least an opportunity to get that kiss from Sansa.
- Robert Strong is so obviously + Show Spoiler +
Gregor Clegane, headless or not. Doubt this even needs a spoiler tag. My problem with this whole ordeal is this: Why would the other kingsguard, Kevan, Mace Tyrell and other higher-ups tolerate this abomination in a white cloak? Everything they "know" about him has been told by proxy of Qyburn, who is NOT a trustworthy person - being kicked out from the Citadel due to experimenting on humans, joining the bloody mummers etc. It's as absurd as if Cersei had put Vargo Hoat on her little council. How or why would they let Cersei (sure, she's the queen, but she was not exactly in a position of power when she made the nomination) shame the Lannister name, the reputation of the Kingsguard and risk another war?
- Rounding up, the letter Jon recieves from Ramsay. Would GRRM kill off someone like Stannis off-screen? All we get from this important battle is a biased letter from a biggest douchebag in Westeros? Remembering both Manderly (and lady Dustin?) and Arnolf Karstark were planning on betraying their respective sides, I feel like most of the letter is bullshit, and we're not done with the battle of Winterfell. I realize there's a tWoW chapter out with a PoV that probably touches on this, but leave that out of this. Since Ramsay + Show Spoiler +
Or is it Roose? Roose is way more cunning, and might have his reasons to provocate the Night's Watch. Does Roose know Jon is losing the support of his brothers? Did he work together with Bowen Marsh, tricking Jon into deciding to march on Winterfell? Roose Bolton would be a fantastic character to have in King's Landing, giving Littlefinger and Varys a real match!
- At least I got Mance=Abel fairly quickly. ^^
The only one I got myself was Abel, and that took me a while. Well, that and Skagos. Another one related to theon, although I'm sure it's already been mentioned somewhere in here: + Show Spoiler [aDwD] +Ramsay castrated Theon. Or removed his wang. Or something.
Theon is no longer a man, pretty much. Ah yeah, that one I got too. Poor Theon. ^^ So many people keep mentioning how much more they notice on their second readthrough, with all the foreshadowing in this series. Will probably start over again once season 2 has finished and long wait begins. Poor Theon my ass. Theon's chapters in aDwD rocked, because we could finally get some sympathy for the twat. But even so, he deserves every second of being Reek (rhymes with meak ).
After second reading this is not sure. It is hinted at some parts but those hints might also be referencing his lack of courage. Manhood = courage in those times. When Reek becomes Theon again he starts to mention fucking girls a lot. A person without any genitals would not care.
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Im in the "anything that happens to Theon he deserves" club. I hate that prick and all the words his name rhymes with. I hope he dies without even redeeming himself. He'll probably die soon after he lets the world know that the Starks live on.
Jojen paste theory is pretty cool, blew my mind a little. Makes sense. I don't think there are going to be very many Bran chapters from here on out, you'll probably be seeing Bran through his actions in other peoples chapters. I guess Meera wouldn't do shit to the Children because she knows his fate? She really hasn't tried to get in the way of his "visions", she just lets him succumb to these visions. If she knew he was going to be killed Jojen probably talked her out of doing anything to save him, he must know that for Bran to reach full power that he has to be killed.
Anyway I just hope GRRM tells you next book, just like he told us Benjen was Coldhands.
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On February 24 2012 03:20 Flik wrote:
Anyway I just hope GRRM tells you next book, just like he told us Benjen was Coldhands.
He did? I can find no reference of that confirmation. I mean, to me it seems like the best fitting theory (although I don't much like it), but I can't find any interview or anything with GRRM confirming that. It's also not on the ASOIAF wiki.
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Braavos36389 Posts
What the fuck at the Jojen sacrifice theory, holy shit
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On February 24 2012 03:46 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2012 03:20 Flik wrote:
Anyway I just hope GRRM tells you next book, just like he told us Benjen was Coldhands. He did? I can find no reference of that confirmation. I mean, to me it seems like the best fitting theory (although I don't much like it), but I can't find any interview or anything with GRRM confirming that. It's also not on the ASOIAF wiki.
No he hasn't yet, thats was a bit of internet sarcasm sorry. Who knows if he'll confirm any of these theories ever? Or is it better that they're just theories and us nerds can sit and talk about it? Gotta admit, I love Game of Thrones talk.
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So that makes not three, but four uhmmm.. interesting pies in ADwD? I wonder if Martin should have renamed the book A Taste for People instead.
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EPT
