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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
![[image loading]](/staff/Sn0_Man/Starladder13/deleteme.jpg) http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/Star_Ladder_Star_Series/Season_13 GRAND FINAL Match starts in ![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/images/2/28/Eglogo_std.png)  Evil Geniuses vs Alliance![[image loading]](http://wiki.teamliquid.net/dota2/images/8/84/Alliancelogo_std.png) POLLS Poll: (Head) Which team will win? Evil Geniuses (85) Alliance (80) 165 total votes Your vote: (Head) Which team will win? Poll: (Heart) Which team should win? Alliance (84) Evil Geniuses (52) 136 total votes Your vote: (Heart) Which team should win? | ||
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zdfgucker
China594 Posts
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AndyNeuro
Brazil3 Posts
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bluzi
4703 Posts
 did SL commented on it ???? i guess its the venue or something like that.... | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
On January 17 2016 02:26 bluzi wrote: I wonder why its not a BO5 did SL commented on it ???? i guess its the venue or something like that....liquipedia says bo5 grand finals is there a reliable source that says bo3? | ||
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jmbthirteen
United States10734 Posts
On January 17 2016 02:26 lolnoty wrote: liquipedia says bo5 grand finals is there a reliable source that says bo3? Well Loda thinks its a bo5, he said so in the post match interview. EG's diverse hero pool will prove to be too much. EG can play all of Alliance's signature heroes, while Alliance cannot do the same. EG doesn't need to automatically ban LD/NP/Batrider and so on because they can just pick them for themselves. This is why EG has been the most dominant team over the last couple years. Huge hero pool and flexibility in the roles. Alliance is playing some fantastic Dota, I think it will be a good series. But it goes 3-1 for EG. | ||
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Atoissen
Norway1737 Posts
On January 17 2016 02:33 jmbthirteen wrote: Well Loda thinks its a bo5, he said so in the post match interview. EG's diverse hero pool will prove to be too much. EG can play all of Alliance's signature heroes, while Alliance cannot do the same. EG doesn't need to automatically ban LD/NP/Batrider and so on because they can just pick them for themselves. This is why EG has been the most dominant team over the last couple years. Huge hero pool and flexibility in the roles. Alliance is playing some fantastic Dota, I think it will be a good series. But it goes 3-1 for EG. Wow, spot on!! EG will win 3-1 or 3-2 ;-) | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
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Spicy_Curry
United States10573 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
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PhoenixVoid
Canada32740 Posts
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Danzo
2820 Posts
On January 17 2016 02:13 zdfgucker wrote: Alliance will win. I hate EG fangays. Feels the same for bandwagon Alliance fans as well. | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
On January 17 2016 02:26 lolnoty wrote: liquipedia says bo5 grand finals is there a reliable source that says bo3? Reliable source is on the stream when Sheever just official announce it was a best of 3. | ||
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
They have the most dedicated haters of any team out there, I love it. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
Since I won't be around for the event itself, more than likely, I'll take a second run at figuring out what PPD will attempt to ban away from Alliance. I managed to figure out the bans again LGD simply because LGD didn't play too much beyond a certain set of heroes. Alliance is a little trickier, as EG has used much of the same hero pool this tournament. Especially as other people are picking Nature's Prophet a lot. There's also a benefit to forcing s4 to pick up the Bulldog hero early, as it saves him a ban on Broodmother. But ppd banned Chen & Nature's Prophet in their group stage game, while Puppey banned Wisp + Batrider/Nature's Prophet (x2). I think ppd is going to ban Chen + 1 other. So I'm going to go with Chen + Batrider in the first phase. Both are signature heroes that are currently well in the Meta, plus early roamers, which Alliance has done well lately. Second phase bans are going to be dependent who they lock in during the first phase. Though if EG has first pick, don't be surprised to see Chen + Nature's Prophet Bans with First Pick Lone Druid. | ||
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Nyan
Germany1931 Posts
they had 4 series today. I don't understand both bo3 finals -_-' in cs teams made clear that they don't want a bo5 final if it is the same day as the semi final. but that's not the case with this tournament | ||
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emperorchampion
Canada9496 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On January 17 2016 08:09 Nyan wrote: they have two grand finals tomorrow and even cs is bo3. it's always disappointing when a final isn't a bo5 (or has a WB advantage). they had 4 series today. I don't understand both bo3 finals -_-' in cs teams made clear that they don't want a bo5 final if it is the same day as the semi final. but that's not the case with this tournament It's gotta be scheduling. A Dota2 Bo5 could be anywhere from 2.5 hours to 6 hours to complete. Depending on how quickly some games go and if you get a barn-burner of a super-long game. | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
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trinxified
Canada7774 Posts
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yookstah
Australia655 Posts
On January 17 2016 11:01 Danzo wrote: Man, why is it going to start so late. As American, this sucks =/ 9PM for Australia woo hoo actually a non terrible time \o/ | ||
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
At the same time, however, Alliance does offer some significant threats to EG. PPD has never faced their strategy in the flesh before, and it's totally possible that the Swedes will work the game from an angle that he's just not prepared to handle. One of EG's flaws is also their uncoordinated teamfights, which are generally carried by superb individual performances by Universe, Sumail, and occasionally Fear, rather than having all the players operate in perfect unity. Alliance, on the other hand, rarely has knockout performances in teamfights by anyone but s4 and EGM, and instead win them through a level of coordination only matched by some rare few Chinese teams. Teamfights could just backfire on EG insanely hard. Similarly, Alliance's lanes tend to perform shockingly well, sometimes in defiance of draft, and their aggression could be a painful blow to EG. All in all, it's very hard to judge between the two. EG have the decisive advantage, and if someone held a gun to my head and forced me to put money on the match, I'd put it on them. But Alliance is their equal in mental fortitude with the attitude of champions and access to some strange dimension of play that doesn't seem to square properly with what anyone else does. In a certain sense, it's reminiscent of the TI3 finals, of a match between two enduring teams with the potential and desire to win it all. This could be just an utter stomp, if the unity of Alliance isn't enough to match the talent and strategy of EG, but it also has the potential to be a real clash of the titans and a match to remember. I'm pretty excited for it. It helps that I love both teams and will be happy with either one winning. The way that they play this game is beautiful to me, and I'm real happy to see them at the top of this stacked tournament. | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On January 17 2016 13:33 Acritter wrote: All in all, it's very hard to judge between the two. EG have the decisive advantage, and if someone held a gun to my head and forced me to put money on the match, I'd put it on them. But Alliance is their equal in mental fortitude with the attitude of champions and access to some strange dimension of play that doesn't seem to square properly with what anyone else does. In a certain sense, it's reminiscent of the TI3 finals, of a match between two enduring teams with the potential and desire to win it all. This could be just an utter stomp, if the unity of Alliance isn't enough to match the talent and strategy of EG, but it also has the potential to be a real clash of the titans and a match to remember. I'm pretty excited for it. It helps that I love both teams and will be happy with either one winning. The way that they play this game is beautiful to me, and I'm real happy to see them at the top of this stacked tournament. I just hope it'll be good overall. Both teams actually accomplished the majority of what they needed by making the final. EG showed they're still on form in the new meta (or setting it with First Pick Vengeful Spirit/Witch Doctor) and Alliance showed they should be at Shanghai. (They also showed that poise under pressure that got them the invite by winning WCA. Liquid, Empire and LGD all could have gotten that Invite by winning there, it turned out.) So at this point, while I'd like to see EG win, I really just want some good Dota. That's the important thing. And I really wish it was a Bo5, so we could see the adjustments come online. ppd could roll out either that super-sustain strategy he ran early in the Bo1 or their push-heavier style. Alliance actually had some pretty good bans against EG the first time, but I think Faceless Void probably gets First Phase Banned. I'd love to see Sumail's Invoker, but I'm fairly sure that's going to get banned right away. | ||
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
On January 17 2016 14:21 Taf the Ghost wrote: I just hope it'll be good overall. Both teams actually accomplished the majority of what they needed by making the final. EG showed they're still on form in the new meta (or setting it with First Pick Vengeful Spirit/Witch Doctor) and Alliance showed they should be at Shanghai. (They also showed that pose under pressure that got them the invite by winning WCA. Liquid, Empire and LGD all could have gotten that Invite by winning there, it turned out.) So at this point, while I'd like to see EG win, I really just want some good Dota. That's the important thing. And I really wish it was a Bo5, so we could see the adjustments come online. ppd could roll out either that super-sustain strategy he ran early in the Bo1 or their push-heavier style. Alliance actually had some pretty good bans against EG the first time, but I think Faceless Void probably gets First Phase Banned. I'd love to see Sumail's Invoker, but I'm fairly sure that's going to get banned right away. I'm a little bit in the opposite boat: EG are always going to be a monstrous team and very well-respected no matter what happens, and they're used to taking second-place finishes in events like this. For Alliance, though, winning this would be massive. It would be a huge confidence boost, and would really shake the scene up. It would be exciting as hell to see. But more than that, I want both teams to bring their best Dota and show us what it really means to be world champion. Bo5 would be by far the best, I agree. It would nudge the advantage in EG's favor for sure, but it would also bump up the quality of games. Void is gonna get banned unless Alliance run some kind of targeted punish (which is totally possible), and it's pretty likely that EG are going to ban s4 playmaking heroes. He's so central to Alliance's gameplan that interrupting him will give EG a huge advantage. I hope we get one game of full Alliance rat, to see how EG react to it, and some nice mid matchups. I'm pretty damn eager right now. By the way, did you mean "poise under pressure?" | ||
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
On January 17 2016 14:47 Acritter wrote: I'm a little bit in the opposite boat: EG are always going to be a monstrous team and very well-respected no matter what happens, and they're used to taking second-place finishes in events like this. For Alliance, though, winning this would be massive. It would be a huge confidence boost, and would really shake the scene up. It would be exciting as hell to see. But more than that, I want both teams to bring their best Dota and show us what it really means to be world champion. Bo5 would be by far the best, I agree. It would nudge the advantage in EG's favor for sure, but it would also bump up the quality of games. Void is gonna get banned unless Alliance run some kind of targeted punish (which is totally possible), and it's pretty likely that EG are going to ban s4 playmaking heroes. He's so central to Alliance's gameplan that interrupting him will give EG a huge advantage. I hope we get one game of full Alliance rat, to see how EG react to it, and some nice mid matchups. I'm pretty damn eager right now. By the way, did you mean "poise under pressure?" Whatever could you mean by that last question.  I do think the Batrider is going to be the pick that's contended for the most. ppd did draft it early in 1 game for Sumail, he normally doesn't like to give away Sumail's pick until later. (It seems like there is more value in dominating Mid Lane via a good pick/bad counter available for Sumail, since it let's him snowball a lot easier and it opens up the entire middle of the map for ganking.) But I'm going to be really surprised if Lone Druid makes it through to the second phase during the series. Especially since Arteezy can play it both safe & mid. I'm also curious if ppd breaks out the Earth Spirit in game 1. Jerax did destroy Alliance with it, but Liquid didn't have the followup to capitalize. You need burst or further catch to use all of the stun + silences well. I'm actually curious if Invoker + Earth Spirit isn't the most stupidly powerful combo in the game at the moment. Which is probably why Invoker is getting banned all 3 games. | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
Lingering in my mind is also EG using Morphling after losing to it yesterday. RTZ does like the hero, and it can fit into already comfortable EG lineups without much changing. | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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uthgard
2098 Posts
at this point my only hope is for the games to be as clowny as possible | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
On January 17 2016 16:19 uthgard wrote: I'll be both happy and unhappy when either of these two teams win due to my dislike of them at this point my only hope is for the games to be as clowny as possible yea,same here..i don't support any of these teams,neither do care for any of their players...but i would like to watch clowny series going into game 3 as much as possible. | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
On January 17 2016 16:22 Kamisamanachi wrote: yea,same here..i don't support any of these teams,neither do care for any of their players...but i would like to watch clowny series going into game 3 as much as possible. why don't you like their players? | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
i said i don't care if any of those player win...that doesnt mean i dont like them ...i just dont support them..IDK how it sounded and how u took it..not sure how to rephrase it..just as an example,i like PPD for his captainship,but i don't care if he wins or loses his games.same with both old men loda and fear because i support other teams. :D ![[image loading]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CY5wu0eWwAElUpO.jpg:large) This is quite awesome..minsk has some hardcore fans | ||
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LennX
4553 Posts
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uthgard
2098 Posts
should be very viable with the heroes in the meta | ||
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brinepumps
Indonesia753 Posts
Not trashy please. Hot busty ones | ||
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
On January 17 2016 15:34 Taf the Ghost wrote: Whatever could you mean by that last question. I do think the Batrider is going to be the pick that's contended for the most. ppd did draft it early in 1 game for Sumail, he normally doesn't like to give away Sumail's pick until later. (It seems like there is more value in dominating Mid Lane via a good pick/bad counter available for Sumail, since it let's him snowball a lot easier and it opens up the entire middle of the map for ganking.) But I'm going to be really surprised if Lone Druid makes it through to the second phase during the series. Especially since Arteezy can play it both safe & mid. I'm also curious if ppd breaks out the Earth Spirit in game 1. Jerax did destroy Alliance with it, but Liquid didn't have the followup to capitalize. You need burst or further catch to use all of the stun + silences well. I'm actually curious if Invoker + Earth Spirit isn't the most stupidly powerful combo in the game at the moment. Which is probably why Invoker is getting banned all 3 games. Oh, that must have been my mistake. Seeing things that aren't there, or something. I'll have to clean my monitor.  It's very interesting how differently Alliance and PPD treat the issue of playmaking. PPD tends to be conservative, exactly as you say, using Sumail as the X-factor in much the same way as LGD use Sylar, while Alliance are perfectly happy to broadcast an insane portion of their draft with a first phase Puck. However, the only way EG ever get LD is if they devote their first pick to the hero. Alliance have left absolutely no question about how much they value that hero. I think EG are going to make their peace with that and try to get their drafting advantage elsewhere. Or, rather, I think that if they fall into the trap of trying to contest the bear, they're going to let the rest of Alliance punish their arrogance heavily. The strong heroes that EG likes to keep in hiding until the second phase aren't going to be permitted that kind of luxury against Alliance. If EG use Earth Spirit, Alliance are probably going to play around it strategically in the same way as they did against Liquid, with high aggression making rotations just look weak, and mechanically a lot better. I can't help but feel that picking Earth Spirit against Alliance is a hidden trap in the same way as banning Bullldog heroes is. | ||
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Tegenaria
France379 Posts
I dont read everything but someone can explain me why nobody buy necro on LD considering battle cry buff all units under the control of LD ? 150 damage added seem pretty broken with a good root timing | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On January 17 2016 18:18 Tegenaria wrote: Hi everybody, I dont read everything but someone can explain me why nobody buy necro on LD considering battle cry buff all units under the control of LD ? 150 damage added seem pretty broken with a good root timing He can use other items better usually , Radiance is a must as AC , after that usually its items that he needs to keep things locked down or hit ppl with - Basher/MKB (evasion heroes) . If you go Necro (which isn't bad at all) you need to do it first item to have big impact , so skipping Radiance which means you are all in on the Necro , really risky , today`s bear is a farming machine so a Midas + Radiance is the meta , makes you scale really well. Necro as a 3rd big item is usually a waste as the impact those little dudes have diminish with time. | ||
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wooozy
3813 Posts
cmon son | ||
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Vertical
Indonesia4317 Posts
but I hate [A] more, so gonna bitterly cheer for EG but since day 2 of this tournament whoever I cheer for is losing that's why it ends up 2 of my hated team in the grand final sorry EG fans | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
Let's salt this shit up! | ||
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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Elurie
4716 Posts
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MaYuu
Sweden516 Posts
Lets see some tears from Trump country! | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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HaXxorIzed
Australia8434 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 18:58 MaYuu wrote: Welfare > Freedom Lets see some tears from Trump country! $$$ > either. So, EG wins. Actually, EG wins no matter who wins. | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:01 HaXxorIzed wrote: Real shame this isn't a bo5 final : (. IIRC it is. | ||
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:06 nojok wrote: Go alliance nojok why ? i thought you.... but.... but... | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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ASoo
2864 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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Spicy_Curry
United States10573 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:08 sunrazgriz wrote: nojok why ? i thought you.... but.... but... Started watching dota after TI2 when beta keys were easy to get, this team has a special flavor to me. I'm also a big loda defender, he's a great player. . The patch team argument was just to start a random LR argument which are usually fun. | ||
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LeeARK
509 Posts
Liquipedia says it's Bo5 finals but Sheever on stream said yesterday that it's Bo3 Finals... so vOv | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:15 HammerKick wrote: Who's casting these finals? LD+GODZ | ||
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ASoo
2864 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:17 WakaDoDo wrote: Are we getting a no-damage line-up here? I mean neither team has picked their mid or safelaner yet. I'd be more worried about Alliance's no-stuns. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
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ASoo
2864 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:18 bluzi wrote: So no stuns start , hope they know how to handle the wombo combo , EG execute those really nicely r[A]t | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:21 sunrazgriz wrote: artour too much salt , asking for luna again just like TI 5 Luna is legit. Too legit. | ||
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Tegenaria
France379 Posts
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_Fortune_
Australia2 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:21 sunrazgriz wrote: artour too much salt , asking for luna again just like TI 5 dude it's obviously fear luna as a support | ||
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
Go go go! | ||
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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ASoo
2864 Posts
I think EG got this on lock. *edit* I guess Puck + WK is a decent amount of teamfight. I take it back. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:22 plasmidghost wrote: So what's the build on Luna here, HotD into Manta or BKB second item? Aghs is the beastliest item nowadays. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:23 bluzi wrote: Alliance has almost no AoE.... how they are going to win this Rodenting. | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
If QoP goes Euls first, I could see that working, blink in with Aghs on her and Euls to buy time for the rest of the team to show up | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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Oddball28
Denmark2121 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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_Fortune_
Australia2 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:26 Kamisamanachi wrote: U know what, This is the exact same lineup alliance had against cloud9 at ESL frankfurt semifinals game 2..i am sure it is same Tree instead of Dazzle back then. | ||
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:28 Dysisa wrote: Isn't Puck vs QoP supposed to be like the ultimate skill matchup in mid? Yeah. Apparently s4 > Sufail. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:27 traumatism wrote: Uh how did that happen Orb + Silence + Autoattacks. QoP cant blink lmao | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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uthgard
2098 Posts
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
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spudde123
4814 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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SupportDotA2
Japan307 Posts
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chairs
Singapore120 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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uthgard
2098 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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chairs
Singapore120 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
"give me luna" ha ha rtz | ||
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:35 Acritter wrote: This is exactly what I saw as a serious risk for EG. Alliance's aggression and cohesion are just miles ahead of anyone but some of the Chinese teams, like how VG was at their peak. EG relies so much on individual skill that their team cohesion is lacking, making them hugely vulnerable to this kind of play. Except VG never beat PPD's team. Why do you even bring up Chinese teams when they've never done well against this very team? | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
Yeah, ESL One New York 2014 never happened /s | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
yea..they beat them at ESL new york with an insane early game outplay...go check your knowledge | ||
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:37 lolfail9001 wrote: Yeah, ESL One New York 2014 never happened /s Yeah okay let's go back two years to when PPD first started playing Dota. | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:36 nojok wrote: Fear is missing almost all ice path. That is normal. See it more as an area denial spell that occasionally stuns. | ||
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:37 Azarkon wrote: Yeah okay let's go back two years to when PPD first started playing Dota. Yeah okay, maybe you will shut up when you're spouting BS? | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:37 Azarkon wrote: Yeah okay let's go back two years to when PPD first started playing Dota. pretty sure he started playing dota wayy before that and placed 4th at TI4.. | ||
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Lorizean
Germany1330 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:38 traumatism wrote: I can't believe what I'm seeing honestly Alliance did the same thing to Liquid. DS just doesn't work against them. | ||
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:37 Azarkon wrote: Yeah okay let's go back two years to when PPD first started playing Dota. Shouldn't say never if you don't actually mean never.  | ||
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:38 lolfail9001 wrote: Yeah okay, maybe you will shut up when you're spouting BS? Why don't you get a bit of common sense? Of course I was talking about 2014. Do I actually need to explain what a figure of speech is? | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:38 Lorizean wrote: Just tuned in (overslept ...) - what the hell did EG ban if Alliance have wisp and prophet? Wisp was third picked. So went through two ban phases. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:38 Azarkon wrote: Why don't you get a bit of common sense? Of course I was talking about 2014... Of course I was, uh uh. You said "never". If you don't mean "never", you don't say "never". | ||
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:38 Kamisamanachi wrote: pretty sure he started playing dota wayy before that and placed 4th at TI4.. He joined his first fully professional Dota team in 2014 and started playing amateur in 2013. | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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rabidch
United States20289 Posts
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Spicy_Curry
United States10573 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
why would you ever pick her into furion treesSSSTREESS | ||
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Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
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GiveMeYourtTots
990 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:38 Lorizean wrote: Just tuned in (overslept ...) - what the hell did EG ban if Alliance have wisp and prophet? Well, do want to ban druid, chen, prophet and wisp every game? | ||
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uthgard
2098 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:40 rabidch wrote: really outdrafted from what i'm seeing doesn't explain why puck dumsptering qop so hard on mid though | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:38 Azarkon wrote: Why don't you get a bit of common sense? Of course I was talking about 2014. Do I actually need to explain what a figure of speech is? It seems to be obvious only to you. | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:39 lolfail9001 wrote: You said "never". If you don't mean "never", you don't say "never". Holy shit you guys are pedantic. I'm just not going to respond to this shit in the future. | ||
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:40 Kipsate wrote: im suprised Loda doesnt go for Blink first before Radiance but I suppose they don't need any initition right now He's in no rush to provide more for his team, he can wait a bit more to hit a stronger timing a bit later. | ||
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Exoteric
Australia2330 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:41 SpiritoftheTunA wrote: i missed draft was ta in the pool? Yeah, you can see the heroes banned on Gosugamers. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:41 Azarkon wrote: Holy shit you guys are pedantic. I'm just not going to respond to this shit in the future. Nah, you just putting your head in the sand here, nothing else. | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
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Sabu113
United States11048 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:43 Kipsate wrote: anyone stream lagging a little? Fine on my end. | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
Peter's game is over, he can afk in the fountain imo | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
EG's only hope is probably miracle high ground defence 'cause I don't know how pick offs are even going to happen. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:43 Sabu113 wrote: Luna is just not good these days Luna is fine. Getting destroyed by puck as QoP is inexcusable. | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
give rtz ta and put him mid and the game is easily won luna might be fine, but not against furion where he cana lways guarantee your eclipse is shitty | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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Elurie
4716 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
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Sabu113
United States11048 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:46 Elurie wrote: Such beautiful wall-sonic combo, and nobody dies. Did WD ult during that time? Wall-sonic combo is at most 600 hp worth of damage. Nothing can die from it alone. | ||
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:46 Elurie wrote: Such beautiful wall-sonic combo, and nobody dies. Did WD ult during that time? His ulti is on cooldown so I'd assume so at least | ||
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Oddball28
Denmark2121 Posts
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Jaug
Sweden249 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:46 sunrazgriz wrote: see s4 , with dagon you lack of escape mechanism He made it out alive, what is your point? | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
Wall Vac sonic wave doesnt do enough, | ||
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juff
Singapore4659 Posts
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rabidch
United States20289 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:47 Jaug wrote: Liquipedia says bo5. Commentators seem to think bo3. Anyone have reliable source on this? liquipedia is probably not updated | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:47 Jaug wrote: Liquipedia says bo5. Commentators seem to think bo3. Anyone have reliable source on this? 100% bo3 | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:46 Dysisa wrote: His ulti is on cooldown so I'd assume so at least He used it soon after the combo. When WK ulti was down so he wouldn't get stunned.. | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:47 juff wrote: actually, is radiance a good idea against dark seer? Yes. DS isn't enough to make it a bad item. | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:47 lolfail9001 wrote: He made it out alive, what is your point? he have aegis , not everytime he have that | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:48 sunrazgriz wrote: he have aegis , not everytime he have that He would not jump into that without aegis either. Well, yeah, open fights are pretty bad for EG | ||
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chairs
Singapore120 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:48 sunrazgriz wrote: he have aegis , not everytime he have that he as only so aggressive because he has aegis. | ||
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Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
Alliance vs Liquid 24-5 Alliance vs EG 23-5 I'm sensing a pattern here. | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
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Shergal
Argentina1191 Posts
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:49 Terrorbladder wrote: Alliance vs Secret 25-5 Alliance vs Liquid 24-5 Alliance vs EG 23-5 I'm sensing a pattern here. Don't forget they didnt deserve the invite plz. | ||
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
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Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:49 Sloke wrote: damn, if puppey is right and this will be prob a 2:0 this could be over in just 1 more hour :/ Good I want to see Fnatic vs Navi, the best matchup one could ask for in CSGO right now. | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Keeemy
Finland7855 Posts
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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HaXxorIzed
Australia8434 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
preety much fear > artour !! ask for more luna artour !!! go S[A]LT ! | ||
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rabidch
United States20289 Posts
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:50 Furikawari wrote: Don't forget they didnt deserve the invite plz. Never forget! | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
Hopefully EG turn it around and we at least get three games. | ||
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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Danzo
2820 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
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Danzo
2820 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:52 Dysisa wrote: Picking Luna for RTZ was definitely a mistake, but I wonder what carry they should have picked for him instead? I don't think Luna was the problem. EG draft wasn't even that bad, it just came down to laning and EG lost it hard. | ||
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brinepumps
Indonesia753 Posts
Amazing from the rodents, beautifuuly executed. | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:52 Danzo wrote: Man is Qop heavy nerf or did Sumail just choke hard? He rarely loses mid that hard. s4 is too good | ||
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MaYuu
Sweden516 Posts
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Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:52 Dysisa wrote: Picking Luna for RTZ was definitely a mistake, but I wonder what carry they should have picked for him instead? TA ? | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:54 Terrorbladder wrote: I tuned in the last 20 mins of this game so how did sumail lose mid to s4 puck? Sufail turned up. | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:52 Danzo wrote: Man is Qop heavy nerf or did Sumail just choke hard? He rarely loses mid that hard. Alliance supports were free to do whatever they wanted while s4 was safe 'cause EG's supports were focusing on shutting down Bulldog. Made a big difference. | ||
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:54 Terrorbladder wrote: I tuned in the last 20 mins of this game so how did sumail lose mid to s4 puck? Besides it being a nice match up, he had help. | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:52 Dysisa wrote: Picking Luna for RTZ was definitely a mistake, but I wonder what carry they should have picked for him instead? The DS was a much bigger problem for them in my eyes. They had nobody to initiate with before the game was over. 0 pressure on Alliance. Something like a SB there and charge might split the map up for them instead of doing nothing when being forced out of lane. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
Yeah, i just imagined TA stuck in sprout. Good hero, kek. | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
Do not dismiss akke. Him and EGM had some huge rotations early. | ||
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xAPOCALYPSEx
1418 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:54 Terrorbladder wrote: I tuned in the last 20 mins of this game so how did sumail lose mid to s4 puck? By getting severely outplayed and dying solo | ||
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Taosu
Ukraine1074 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/53PIuBJ.jpg) | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:55 lolfail9001 wrote: Yeah, i just imagined TA stuck in sprout. Good hero, kek. artour play a godly sven too , but ppd ban sven ember is on a pool too | ||
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:55 lolfail9001 wrote: Yeah, i just imagined TA stuck in sprout. Good hero, kek. If only there was a way to leave Sprout immediately... | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:55 nojok wrote: Do not dismiss akke. Him and EGM had some huge rotations early. I never said that s4 was the only mvp this game : ) | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
this patch feels like supports keeping their safe lane alive or rotating to kill enemy safe lane or offlane and not mid...this is reverse of last patch | ||
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Habitus
United Kingdom120 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
 Just one more | ||
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Elurie
4716 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:56 Kamisamanachi wrote: s4 outplayed sumail soo hard ..and that luna pick,rofl...good stuff from alliance.. this patch feels like supports keeping their safe lane alive or rotating to kill enemy safe lane or offlane and not mid...this is reverse of last patch I don't think many NP players outside of bulldog would have got so much from this lane. This T1 was up during so long and served as a bait for so many fights. | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:58 Elurie wrote: If they have to pick one or another, I'd say wisp was more ban-worthy than furion. definitely but if bulldog needs to he will surely get his farm and pressure the whole map. one very important aspect is also like he always scouts with his treants and arguably always the right spot to the right time. | ||
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On January 17 2016 19:55 Azarkon wrote: Besides it being a nice match up, he had help. Doesn't matter if he had help giving up a solo kill is inexcuseable and and something that shouldn't happen Sumail fucked up this game. | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:01 sunrazgriz wrote: guys, the draft is even or there is an outdraft ? imo it was an outdraft in the sense that alliance had more "signature" heroes | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:01 Kipsate wrote: Doesn't matter if he had help giving up a solo kill is inexcuseable and and something that shouldn't happen Sumail fucked up this game. I didn't actually see the solo kill, but depending on what happened it's somewhat excusable. When you're extremely pressured mid you sometimes have to playrisky and really push it in order to not get crushed. Sometimes that ends up killing you and crushing you more. Playing safely isn't always the best thing to do. | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:01 sunrazgriz wrote: guys, the draft is even or there is an outdraft ? Idk if it was outdraft and more of just outplay in the lane stages of the game and Alliance support rotations. Sure they shut down bulldog Nature Prophet, but at the cost of first blood on Dark Seer and Sumail losing mid and dying to rotations. | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:03 FuzzyJAM wrote: I didn't actually see the solo kill, but depending on what happened it's somewhat excusable. When you're extremely pressured mid you sometimes have to playrisky and really push it in order to not get crushed. Sometimes that ends up killing you and crushing you more. Playing safely isn't always the best thing to do. And we're talking about Sumail here who is known to never play safe in his mid lane. | ||
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roMAD
Russia2355 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:03 FuzzyJAM wrote: I didn't actually see the solo kill, but depending on what happened it's somewhat excusable. When you're extremely pressured mid you sometimes have to playrisky and really push it in order to not get crushed. Sometimes that ends up killing you and crushing you more. Playing safely isn't always the best thing to do. depends on the heroes that are being played, the pressure that was put on sumail also wasn't a BH camping him mid for the first 6 min. Qop has an escape mechanism and should never die in a 1v1 like that. | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
the only way luna was fine was such that they picked it as like a pseudo alch with 044, because eclipse was gonna do nothing as long as bulldog had something to say about it and luna isnt even particularly strong in the first place. she's a niche pick and this game was not her niche in any way. | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
. let's get CHEN AND LD BOYS | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
rtz should rly brush up on his morf | ||
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Habitus
United Kingdom120 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:04 Danzo wrote: Idk if it was outdraft and more of just outplay in the lane stages of the game and Alliance support rotations. Sure they shut down bulldog Nature Prophet, but at the cost of first blood on Dark Seer and Sumail losing mid and dying to rotations. If anything it was alliance outdrafted. All eg had to do was not lose laning really hard and then they were likely have a better teamfight and alliance would be on a clock. Eg just lost hard, even harder than they needed to for alliance to carry the advantage to a win later. | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:05 Kipsate wrote: depends on the heroes that are being played, the pressure that was put on sumail also wasn't a BH camping him mid for the first 6 min. Qop has an escape mechanism and should never die in a 1v1 like that. The pressure wasn't so much against QoP but for Puck, if that makes sense. Puck is 1,000% safe the entire laning phase and can do whatever he wants. That's a great deal of pressure in a normally even 1v1. An escape mechanism is all well and good, but it depends on what actually happened. As I said, I didn't see it, but maybe Sumail tried to make a play with Blink or whatever, IDK. | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:05 SpiritoftheTunA wrote: anyone who says luna was a fine pick is totally blind the only way luna was fine was such that they picked it as like a pseudo alch with 044, because eclipse was gonna do nothing as long as bulldog had something to say about it and luna isnt even particularly strong in the first place. she's a niche pick and this game was not her niche in any way. I mean, she would be fine pick for the plan if EG would not lose other 2 lanes so fucking hard. | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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Elurie
4716 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
oh wait | ||
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:05 roMAD wrote: bo3 finals are so anticlimatic I agree. EG is a team that could come back from a 2 0 to a 3 2 win and today they wont have this possibility | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:09 lolfail9001 wrote: I mean, she would be fine pick for the plan if EG would not lose other 2 lanes so fucking hard. "fine" is not fine when you require "near-optimal" in an "important grand finals series" with your last pick 1 position | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:09 lolfail9001 wrote: I mean, she would be fine pick for the plan if EG would not lose other 2 lanes so fucking hard. But they lost the other lanes so hard in part because of the Luna pick! IDK, could have just let Arteezy 1v1 anyway. Dunno if you can shut out a Prophet enough to ever warrant three heroes focusing on him all laning phase. | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
puck , qop banned what now s4 ? | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:10 SpiritoftheTunA wrote: "fine" is not fine when you require "near-optimal" in an "important grand finals series" Name me a carry that would do fine in circumstances like that. Even morph would not fly at all (hello, no cast point no-target silence). | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:10 sunrazgriz wrote: bat taken, puck , qop banned what now s4 ? Lina? | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:11 lolfail9001 wrote: Name me a carry that would do fine in circumstances like that. Even morph would not fly at all (hello, no cast point no-target silence). morph can survive 3 seconds of being silenced fine if he's competent. morph was fine, ta was fine (JUST BUY A QB), clinkz was fine... | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
Spec into all in push? | ||
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
MAGNUS Nah I doubt he'll do it | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:12 SpiritoftheTunA wrote: morph can survive 3 seconds of being silenced fine if he's competent. morph was fine, ta was fine (JUST BUY A QB), clinkz was fine... 3 seconds of being silenced with 2 second stun follow-up and fuckton of burst. Unless you have the reaction to smash morph strength before silence, he would pop. TA with QB could work, clinkz... not sure, but could work. | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
ppd chokedrafting standard for non dac/ti/majors shit | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:13 Gear 3rd wrote: What is the idea behind Zeus Bat? Isolated they are both good additions to the team but imo both heroes dont really work that well together (there should be better combos) Spec + Zeus buffing the Bat gank from across the map. | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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brinepumps
Indonesia753 Posts
Or Magnus? | ||
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juff
Singapore4659 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:13 SpiritoftheTunA wrote: eg lost ppd chokedrafting standard for non dac/ti/majors shit DAC/TI ..he lost at last majors | ||
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Skillver
Austria1309 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:13 Gear 3rd wrote: What is the idea behind Zeus Bat? Isolated they are both good additions to the team but imo both heroes dont really work that well together (there should be better combos) Zeus ult gives vision for good intitations with bat | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:13 Sloke wrote: magnus is obv pick. winter too smart. magnus easy to get lasso'ed it's NS , TI3 game 4 .. make us remember s4 ! | ||
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Kreb
4834 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:14 Zea! wrote: Magnus is not the pick here, Lina's way better Don't see Lina being good at all. She is so weak this patch. Even an WR would be better- | ||
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RiZu
Singapore5715 Posts
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
Spectre I guess, love her more and I want 3rd game. | ||
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Elurie
4716 Posts
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Sabu113
United States11048 Posts
edit: BOoooooooooooooo | ||
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:14 Skillver wrote: Zeus+Spectre can be really deadly though with the right skillbuild they can even do massive dmg around 10min mark but A maybe just 5 man push most of the time. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:15 Elurie wrote: Why has SF fallen out of flavor? Raze mana cost nerf + large camp stacks nerf. | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:16 HammerKick wrote: why veno Because EG are writing gg before game even started. | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:15 Elurie wrote: Why has SF fallen out of flavor? All of the jungle mids has fallen out of favour due to the jungle buffs and straight nerfs to the heroes themselves. | ||
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
Veno also makes it hard. Spectre is a godtier carry late but against a dualcore of Jug LD I dunno. | ||
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Elurie
4716 Posts
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
IDK man. IDK. | ||
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
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GiveMeYourtTots
990 Posts
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Kreb
4834 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:16 HammerKick wrote: why veno Good at early tower defense and good AoE teamfight damage together with zeus+spectre. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:17 Gear 3rd wrote: This patch O_O this tournament O_O this competitive scene O_O this meta O_O Welcome to Alliance's heyday. | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:17 sunrazgriz wrote: PPD is smart indeed , big AOE damage with veno ! With PPD's farm it's going to be irrelevant in 10 minutes. | ||
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
this is theoretically a late game draft for eg | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Kreb
4834 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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spudde123
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spudde123
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:19 spudde123 wrote: NS dewarded an obs, it gives the same xp as the min 0 bounty ok, didnt catch that | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:18 lolfail9001 wrote: With PPD's farm it's going to be irrelevant in 10 minutes. fear should play veno , ppd have nostalgia with WD | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:22 nojok wrote: Couldn't veno just do his ward farming in the woods? Not with lvl1 sting. | ||
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Asha
United Kingdom38255 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
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plasmidghost
Belgium16168 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
Guess they know Zeus needs to come online quickly. | ||
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Spain355 Posts
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Gear 3rd
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Gear 3rd
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goody153
44125 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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juff
Singapore4659 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:28 Gear 3rd wrote: I have not played 6.86 yet.. do both savage roars (bear and ld) share their cooldown? or do they work independently? it's shared cd | ||
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LethalBacon
Spain355 Posts
But bat has blink now let's see if they can come online | ||
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Habitus
United Kingdom120 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:28 Gear 3rd wrote: I have not played 6.86 yet.. do both savage roars (bear and ld) share their cooldown? or do they work independently? Share | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
Wtf is this shit lmao | ||
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LethalBacon
Spain355 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:32 LethalBacon wrote: Wait, is this bo3 in the end??? I was expecting a good old bo5 for this morning Yup BO3. If Alliance wins its over. Starladder 10/10 | ||
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woojaekeem
United States524 Posts
they just run grouped up and desolate does nothing without a lasso on a core eg can't win a fight, but eventually venge will fuck that up with 11/16 swap | ||
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Lorizean
Germany1330 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:32 LethalBacon wrote: Wait, is this bo3 in the end??? I was expecting a good old bo5 for this morning Yeah, I thought they said bo5 at some point - bo3 finals is pretty disappointing | ||
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
which will never happen unless alliance fuck up | ||
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LethalBacon
Spain355 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:34 Yurie wrote: Has bat used ulti yet? Nopeski. | ||
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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Latham
9560 Posts
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
There's a significant chance that they might be the best team on Earth again. | ||
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LethalBacon
Spain355 Posts
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Germany1330 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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Gear 3rd
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DwD
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Dysisa
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Sloke
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
OH WAIT LOL | ||
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sunrazgriz
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Germany1330 Posts
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Northern Ireland22208 Posts
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Zea!
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uthgard
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United Kingdom38255 Posts
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Netherlands527 Posts
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2718 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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CorsairHero
Canada9491 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:39 Ramiz1989 wrote: Who's gonna bet that RTZ is going to get kicked soon? roster lock. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:39 Ramiz1989 wrote: Who's gonna bet that RTZ is going to get kicked soon? PPD would be foolish to blame anyone else for him picking Spectre in this game. | ||
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Kreb
4834 Posts
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Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
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unsaeglich
260 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
2 ez outpicks 2 ez games | ||
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Austria1309 Posts
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Australia8434 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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traumatism
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kazyv
273 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:41 DwD wrote: Can you believe Alliance was super close to lose their spot and not even make it to this lmfao. EG vs Liquid finals in this case | ||
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Zenmx
Sweden163 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:41 Azarkon wrote: S4 simply came up with a strategy that, as of now, has no holes. The only way they lose is by losing early game, and that only happens when they play badly. As long as they execute, this strategy has no answer from any of the standard line ups people use. these aren't standard lineups, they're all still water-testing counter attempts 3 other top teams failing in bo3s doesn't mean counters don't exist | ||
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Skillver
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
the only one who put up a fight against the old Alliance playstyle is who? yeah puppeys secret as it seems who wouldve thought. hey hey still props to alliance, but i cant help but feel it sure helps if youre the only one who doesnt have to adjust to a patch since you are just playing your old style once more but this time it works | ||
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uthgard
2098 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:44 uthgard wrote: only exciting thing left in this game is the networth battle between zeus v spectre v chen Chen will win it when the rax start falling. | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:44 ahswtini wrote: ok they hold somehow Only because Bear died and Rosh was coming back up | ||
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trollcenter
362 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
United States20903 Posts
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konadora
Singapore66161 Posts
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CorsairHero
Canada9491 Posts
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:46 konadora wrote: WTF is RTZ DOING? Suiciding for the second time. | ||
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Rawr
Sweden624 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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SpiritoftheTunA
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
only reason eg is still in the game | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
THANKS S4 | ||
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DucK-
Singapore11447 Posts
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LethalBacon
Spain355 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:50 DucK- wrote: Ban NP and LD and half the battle is won. Why even bother. That'd work but for the fact that Alliance has other picks that you cannot give them, such as bat. | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
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WakaDoDo
Sweden1183 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:50 LethalBacon wrote: What's up with this Alfredo thing? Bulldog is very passionate about naming his different bear cosmetics. | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:50 LethalBacon wrote: What's up with this Alfredo thing? This is how bulldog names his bear during streams | ||
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:50 LethalBacon wrote: What's up with this Alfredo thing? might be a bulldog stream meme | ||
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Lorizean
Germany1330 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:51 Azarkon wrote: That'd work but for the fact that Alliance has other picks that you cannot give them, such as bat. It really does feel like you need 5 bans against Alliance this patch (LD/NP/Io/Bat/Chen). | ||
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22208 Posts
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Ramiz1989
12124 Posts
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:51 Azarkon wrote: That'd work but for the fact that Alliance has other picks that you cannot give them, such as bat. On other news: Valve just announced their International Compendium! the first crowd funded tournament prize pool! you can predict the winners and such! looks pretty cool. | ||
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Asha
United Kingdom38255 Posts
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Exoteric
Australia2330 Posts
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Acritter
Syria7637 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:44 Gear 3rd wrote: what an anticlimatic final :/ the only one who put up a fight against the old Alliance playstyle is who? yeah puppeys secret as it seems who wouldve thought. hey hey still props to alliance, but i cant help but feel it sure helps if youre the only one who doesnt have to adjust to a patch since you are just playing your old style once more but this time it works Puppey is the only person ever who brought the draft to an even footing against championship-tier Alliance. Ironically, this time he doesn't have a team that can properly match them. I'm not really a fan of Puppey's style, but his competence as a captain is beyond question. Out of the other people here, only Kuroky has really faced the horror before. It seems he never really learned from Puppey during their time together, although he put up a decent fight and really suffered from M_C's nerves. It's not all that surprising that everyone is being caught off-guard. What I'll say about Alliance is that their style is and has always been extremely strong. It withstood some pretty harsh hero nerfs before, and really it was team stress that brought them to their lowest. The patch hero thing is something that every team deals with, with the sole possible exception of EG, no matter how much people try to deny it. | ||
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
ALLIANCE IS BAKKKKKK | ||
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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chairs
Singapore120 Posts
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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Asha
United Kingdom38255 Posts
boring finals but eh, that's bo3. | ||
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LethalBacon
Spain355 Posts
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75
Germany4057 Posts
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HaXxorIzed
Australia8434 Posts
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fixed_point
Germany4891 Posts
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unsaeglich
260 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Latham
9560 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:53 LethalBacon wrote: What the fuck was that Arteezy suiciding for the 3d time??? Suicide->Buyback haunt. Usual spectre stuff. | ||
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woojaekeem
United States524 Posts
gg | ||
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Shergal
Argentina1191 Posts
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a_flayer
Netherlands2826 Posts
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Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
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ShroudeD
Greece1333 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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konadora
Singapore66161 Posts
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trinxified
Canada7774 Posts
alliance could 3-0, but still. | ||
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Keeemy
Finland7855 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
EDIT: nvm he got it it's all good | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
I wish this was a bo5, but WP Alliance. gogoshanghai | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Thezzphai
Germany1145 Posts
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traumatism
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Austria1309 Posts
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Netherlands4989 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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BobMcJohnson
France2916 Posts
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:54 trinxified wrote: Bo3 grand finals? really? alliance could 3-0, but still. VP also could have 3-0'd EG at Summit, until it was 3-2 the other way 8) | ||
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SibChil
Sweden502 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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unsaeglich
260 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:54 nojok wrote: Gratz, alliance, imo EG should have sticked with aui and pos 1 fear ofcourse, but they probably were afraid of facing rtz and then they though if we take him, who would beat us. No clue tho | ||
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uthgard
2098 Posts
wp by [A] though, well deserved | ||
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sc14s
United States5052 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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CorsairHero
Canada9491 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:56 traumatism wrote: Slacks just skipped over EGM LMAO s4 too >_> | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:56 sc14s wrote: Man, now all the alliance fanboys will come out of the woodwork again D: We did at last major already. ^^ | ||
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:57 Dysisa wrote: So much for Alliance definitely never being able to defeat EG. are you referencing something? | ||
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Rocket-Bear
3070 Posts
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Nashi
Sweden61 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
u mean at WCA? | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
Yesterday's LR included quite a bit of arrogant EG fanboys. | ||
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ChunderBoy
3242 Posts
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a-game
Canada5085 Posts
They made EG look like a tier 2 team | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
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CursedRich
United Kingdom737 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:56 sc14s wrote: Man, now all the alliance fanboys will come out of the woodwork again D: lol so funny :D | ||
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Dysisa
Sweden2376 Posts
About half the people in the thread yesterday | ||
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HammerKick
France6190 Posts
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Yurie
11836 Posts
No, those were the brand new fans. Getting to the last major was enough to get hyped again. | ||
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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toemn
Germany915 Posts
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
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Kamisamanachi
4665 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:58 Yurie wrote: No, those were the brand new fans. Getting to the last major was enough to get hyped again.oh..forgot about that..that was also hype | ||
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malcram
2752 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:58 CursedRich wrote: nothing personal, but this actionslacks dude has the power to make me cringe so hard that i have to turn away from my screen, I'm sure he's not there by accident though and there must be lots of people who are into his style you are not alone. | ||
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kazyv
273 Posts
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Mouzone
3937 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
I don't think he's great on stage like that, but I think he's fantastic with fringe content. | ||
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sc14s
United States5052 Posts
i literally mute or turn off the stream anytime i hear him. | ||
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woojaekeem
United States524 Posts
FIRST PHASE PICKS EG BAT + WD ALLIANCE LD + CHEN LOL? NICE TRADE...WP | ||
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nanaoei
3358 Posts
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traumatism
Singapore3728 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:02 woojaekeem wrote: at the END OF THE DAY FIRST PHASE PICKS EG BAT + WD ALLIANCE LD + CHEN LOL? NICE TRADE...WP In case you're not familiar with the game, there are over 100 heroes and a team may only opt to ban 2 of them during the first phase of banning. | ||
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a-game
Canada5085 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
in bo5 , EG would ..... | ||
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Yurie
11836 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:04 Azarkon wrote: Was Ancient Apparition banned this game? I'd have thought that would be the pick they wanted instead of Venomancer. 5:th ban from Alliance. They could have picked AA instead of spectre though. | ||
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deathzz
669 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:04 Azarkon wrote: Was Ancient Apparition banned this game? I'd have thought that would be the pick they wanted instead of Venomancer. Last ban from alliance because EG somehow perefered to 4th pick spectre and 3rd pick veno. | ||
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:04 Yurie wrote: 5:th ban from Alliance. They could have picked AA instead of spectre though. What was Alliance's fifth pick? | ||
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woojaekeem
United States524 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:03 traumatism wrote: In case you're not familiar with the game, there are over 100 heroes and a team may only opt to ban 2 of them during the first phase of banning. u have first pick u shouldn't take bat vs alliance when ld + chen is in the pool too bad eg is limited by fear/ppd's inability to play wisp or chen good enough to first phase pick it | ||
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nojok
France15845 Posts
NS | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:04 sunrazgriz wrote: but... but... in bo5 , EG would ..... VP looked just a good against them in the Summit up 2-0. Alliance 100% won, but don't pretend that you know how it would have gone if it were 5 games. | ||
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LethalBacon
Spain355 Posts
A briliant Night Stalker | ||
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malcram
2752 Posts
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
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unsaeglich
260 Posts
On January 17 2016 20:57 Kamisamanachi wrote: everyone is flaming rtz,but i think universe just straight up awful in that last game..he missed almost every lasso early game.the amount of the time he hesitated early game..and of course,rtz's performance was poor rtz did the best he could do with spec in that game given his useless (sry) mates. His teammates failed to get any kills with wd zeus bat, not much that spec can do there. Spec is a hero that profits a lot from his team doing good, when his team is just not doing anything really it's hard. they didn't have good lockdown or anything, perhaps they should have gotten enigma or smth. | ||
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
they were relying on the globals and the magic wave clear to hold off long enough for rtz to come online. alliance just executed to perfection, every fight they achieve some objective, rtz had to bb and join fights before he was ready, of course he will die as he was like their tank and damage. universe had to initiate but alliance was always ready... tough games... it was draft issue which ppd needs to sort out. | ||
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
Thanks, though actually, it doesn't even matter now that I think about it. Chen + Lone Druid first two picks = you already know what Alliance is going to do. PPD must have saw it coming but didn't think Ancient Apparition was the pick. I'm sure he has causes for thinking so. But I don't think Venomancer was the pick; his damage is too low to get through the heals during the first 20-30 minutes. | ||
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common_cider
342 Posts
Bulldog: Prophet, Bear S4: puck, batman Akke: Chen (EGM: Io) | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:08 lolnoty wrote: VP looked just a good against them in the Summit up 2-0. Alliance 100% won, but don't pretend that you know how it would have gone if it were 5 games. okay it's starladder fault then. | ||
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:10 haduken wrote: sheever is so happy. can't contain herself LOL She, too, had to hide for so long you know... | ||
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chairs
Singapore120 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:10 haduken wrote: I don't think RTZ played bad. the game was set up in such way it was always gonna be uphill battle for them. they were relying on the globals and the magic wave clear to hold off long enough for rtz to come online. alliance just executed to perfection, every fight they achieve some objective, rtz had to bb and join fights before he was ready, of course he will die as he was like their tank and damage. universe had to initiate but alliance was always ready... tough games... it was draft issue which ppd needs to sort out. Alliance disengaged from fights really well when Fear dropped down his Death ward as well, made a lot of difference | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
no? Alliance won. It doesn't matter how many games the finals were, the length of series makes it completely different and not worth arguing. | ||
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Lachrymose
Australia1928 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:05 nojok wrote: Last ban from alliance because EG somehow perefered to 4th pick spectre and 3rd pick veno. Their third pick was Zeus. Veno was fifth. | ||
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
EG doesn't really play Chen/IO(no since Aui left) which I feel like they should concentrate on improving for now I believe. Chen is far too strong right now to pass up on and it woul increas their strategic divertsity too. | ||
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GumBa
United Kingdom31935 Posts
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malcram
2752 Posts
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Shergal
Argentina1191 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
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common_cider
342 Posts
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:12 lolnoty wrote: no? Alliance won. It doesn't matter how many games the finals were, the length of series makes it completely different and not worth arguing. even bo7 , sumail's hero pool is limited , s4 win all day long vs sumail. | ||
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Furikawari
France2522 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:15 lolfail9001 wrote: I can't stop laughing at the fact that Navi was one of few teams to take map off of Alliance this tourney. Alliance's first day should not be considered too much though. | ||
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:11 chairs wrote: Alliance disengaged from fights really well when Fear dropped down his Death ward as well, made a lot of difference this is like TI3 alliance all over again, they forcing teams to out play them while making it look effortless. | ||
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a-game
Canada5085 Posts
for a grand finals i would of liked to see longer games but it's not alliance's fault that the opponent cant handle their dance moves | ||
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Lachrymose
Australia1928 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:15 lolfail9001 wrote: I can't stop laughing at the fact that Navi was one of few teams to take map off of Alliance this tourney. To be fair, that was Alliance's game one and they had some pretty terrible conditions leading up to it. | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:16 sunrazgriz wrote: even bo7 , sumail's hero pool is limited , s4 win all day long vs sumail. limited compared to which other mids? | ||
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:16 sunrazgriz wrote: even bo7 , sumail's hero pool is limited , s4 win all day long vs sumail. yeah sumail does look very ordinary vs s4 but then again we forget that s4 was considered THE best mid (excluding his horrendous TI performance on secret 2.0) | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
i believe the starladder final is EG vs A | ||
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
;; | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:21 sunrazgriz wrote: i believe the starladder final is EG vs A s4: NS, Puck, Bat, QoP, DP - 5 Sumail: Zeus, QoP, Ember, Bat, Brew, SK, Razor, DP, Invoker - 9 Yeah man, Sumail only almost played twice as many heroes as S4 this tournament. If only his hero pool wasn't so limited and he could do more than play a different hero almost every game. | ||
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Gear 3rd
1244 Posts
I will stop my rant about A now. I still dont like them but when they won I thought "well at least theyre celebrating: humans confirmed!" Imo if some particular players sort out their issues (which they propably will) i think Secret TL could come out really strong this patch in the long run. And i am really curious how OG and VG will approach the patch at shanghai. Off to TI3 VODs to study. | ||
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woojaekeem
United States524 Posts
artour should redirect some of that passive aggression into encouraging fear/ppd to master chen and/or wisp | ||
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SaltySam
65 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:05 nojok wrote: No....veno was last pick and zeus was 3rd pick.Last ban from alliance because EG somehow perefered to 4th pick spectre and 3rd pick veno. | ||
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:27 woojaekeem wrote: lol artour should redirect some of that passive aggression into encouraging fear/ppd to master chen and/or wisp It sounded more like a nice compliment. | ||
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Kreb
4834 Posts
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egallifangay
1 Post
Shots fired!!!!! Wait is he shooting at Alliance or Volvo? | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:06 woojaekeem wrote: u have first pick u shouldn't take bat vs alliance when ld + chen is in the pool too bad eg is limited by fear/ppd's inability to play wisp or chen good enough to first phase pick it Do you know who has a good wisp + Chen ? .... | ||
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:14 Shergal wrote: So I guess this actually puts Secret on a better position in the patch, considering they basically should've won against the champions and only barely lost. Also they can play some of these Alliance heroes. Secret had a very solid pick against Alliance the first game, that looked to have actually put Alliance off their game. They took away the Prophet, took Bat, forced Alliance to ban Chen, banned the Juggernaut the second phase, and Alliance only got to play their Lone Druid, which was not enough for their strategy to work. The second game, however, even though Secret threw, they were not as successful at shutting down the picks. Alliance got both Chen and Lone Druid that game, and that made it a lot easier for them. The third game, Puppey got his Chen but Alliance got both Bat and Lone Druid. From that series as well as this one, it looks as though you don't want to give Alliance two of Bat/Lone Druid/Prophet/Wisp, but that's of course not practical unless you're going to first pick those heroes yourself. | ||
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Sloke
Germany2433 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:27 woojaekeem wrote: lol artour should redirect some of that passive aggression into encouraging fear/ppd to master chen and/or wisp yeah, it seems PPD only plays heroes where there is only one thing he has to do proper for his team (most of the time save them in a way) and pretty much nothing more besides buying almost all support items. He never really plays some early aggression supports or does he? | ||
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woojaekeem
United States524 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:37 Azarkon wrote: Secret had a very solid pick against Alliance the first game, that looked to have actually put Alliance off their game. They took away the Prophet, took Bat, forced Alliance to ban Chen, banned the Juggernaut the second phase, and Alliance only got to play their Lone Druid, which was not enough for their strategy to work. The second game, however, even though Secret threw, they were not as successful at shutting down the picks. Alliance got both Chen and Lone Druid that game, and that made it a lot easier for them. The third game, Puppey got his Chen but Alliance got both Bat and Lone Druid. From that series as well as this one, it looks as though you don't want to give Alliance two of Bat/Lone Druid/Prophet/Wisp, but that's of course not practical unless you're going to first pick those heroes yourself. yup, agreed | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
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SaltySam
65 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:27 FuzzyJAM wrote: You forgot to add Razor, Leshrac, Brewmaster, and, Dragon Knight to S4's hero pool. Also, Lina for Sumail. (S4 continued to pick Leshrac even after he was nerfed) 9 to 10s4: NS, Puck, Bat, QoP, DP - 5 Sumail: Zeus, QoP, Ember, Bat, Brew, SK, Razor, DP, Invoker - 9 Yeah man, Sumail only almost played twice as many heroes as S4 this tournament. If only his hero pool wasn't so limited and he could do more than play a different hero almost every game. | ||
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Zvoboo
Germany160 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:31 haduken wrote: i dont think zeus was the problem but definitely AA instead of veno AA was 5th banned from Alliance | ||
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a-game
Canada5085 Posts
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spudde123
4814 Posts
People are certainly allowed to talk about it. It doesn't mean that it discredits Alliance's win. At least for now what they are doing seems to be simply better than anyone else. And yea, the biggest difference between Alliance 1 year ago and Alliance now is simply s4 being on the team. Them going from a good team to a team that could perhaps be the best in the world may be where the patch comes in. | ||
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Artisreal
Germany9235 Posts
Though due to his apparent character I never know if he's posing a serious question to, joking with or playing the interviewee. | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:27 FuzzyJAM wrote: s4: NS, Puck, Bat, QoP, DP - 5 Sumail: Zeus, QoP, Ember, Bat, Brew, SK, Razor, DP, Invoker - 9 Yeah man, Sumail only almost played twice as many heroes as S4 this tournament. If only his hero pool wasn't so limited and he could do more than play a different hero almost every game. limited because almost all sumail hero can be stomp by single s4 bat ppd moves is pick bat , and banned puck , dp , and qop. let me say once more , s4lt beat sumail all day long | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:44 SaltySam wrote: You forgot to add Razor, Leshrac, Brewmaster, and, Dragon Knight to S4's hero pool. Also, Lina for Sumail. (S4 continued to pick Leshrac even after he was nerfed) 9 to 10 ? How did I forget anything? I was going by this tournament, as I clearly stated, seeing as that was what was being discussed. S4 won the tournament despite playing half as many heroes as Sumail, so clearly Sumail's hero pool isn't too limited to win the tournament - that's total nonsense. | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:52 sunrazgriz wrote: limited because almost all sumail hero can be stomp by single s4 bat This is not what limited hero pool means, nor is it true. Bat, even S4 Bat, should not stomp all of the heroes Sumail plays. S4 playing better than Sumail isn't the same as S4 having a broader hero pool. | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:21 sunrazgriz wrote: i believe the starladder final is EG vs A Not only are they different mids, but that's not even true. S4 has 10 heroes over 23 games this patch, and sumail has 9 over 21. Statistically even in diversity. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:50 a-game wrote: I don't think alliance crumbled because of meta. loda just had to learn the hard way that the team isn't shit without s4 Alliance crumbled before s4 went away. | ||
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Shergal
Argentina1191 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:37 Azarkon wrote: Secret had a very solid pick against Alliance the first game, that looked to have actually put Alliance off their game. They took away the Prophet, took Bat, forced Alliance to ban Chen, banned the Juggernaut the second phase, and Alliance only got to play their Lone Druid, which was not enough for their strategy to work. The second game, however, even though Secret threw, they were not as successful at shutting down the picks. Alliance got both Chen and Lone Druid that game, and that made it a lot easier for them. The third game, Puppey got his Chen but Alliance got both Bat and Lone Druid. From that series as well as this one, it looks as though you don't want to give Alliance two of Bat/Lone Druid/Prophet/Wisp, but that's of course not practical unless you're going to first pick those heroes yourself. Nah I think the only real issue is Chen. All the other heroes can be countered and outplayed, it's just the performance level of the teams in this LAN was really low (IMO, including Alliance, but they're on an upwards spiral with all their heroes being viable again). | ||
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shad2810
Malaysia2682 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:57 lolfail9001 wrote: Alliance crumbled before s4 went away. Nah, Alliance stopped being the best team in the world, but TI3-TI4 season they were still a top team with plenty good finishes and some wins. It was just TI4 where they did terribly. | ||
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spudde123
4814 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:57 lolfail9001 wrote: Alliance crumbled before s4 went away. Crumbled from best of the world status yes, crumbled to the level they were at after s4 left no. Alliance was still a team that won several EU events during the TI3-TI4 gap and wasn't even looking all that bad going into TI. Their placing was definitely below expectations. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 22:01 spudde123 wrote: Crumbled from best of the world status yes, crumbled to the level they were at after s4 left no. Alliance was still a team that won several EU events during the TI3-TI4 gap and wasn't even looking all that bad going into TI. Their placing was definitely below expectations. Mind you: Alliance were winning against Eu teams. When East was much stronger. | ||
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a-game
Canada5085 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:57 lolfail9001 wrote: Alliance crumbled before s4 went away. They had a post-ti hangover and instead of having faith in the guy who captained them to an aegis, loda started to question his leadership. See Secret @ TI5 for an example of how s4 performs when there's infighting on his roster | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
On January 17 2016 22:04 a-game wrote: They had a post-ti hangover and instead of having faith in the guy who captained them to an aegis, loda started to question his leadership. See Secret @ TI5 for an example of how s4 performs when there's infighting on his roster Loda did not question s4's leadership. S4 wanted to leave cause he thought EGM wasn't supporting him mid enough for the kind of play the meta was requiring. | ||
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a-game
Canada5085 Posts
On January 17 2016 22:06 Zea! wrote: Loda did not question s4's leadership. S4 wanted to leave cause he thought EGM wasn't supporting him mid enough for the kind of play the meta was requiring. Loda stole the drafting spot from him lol | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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spudde123
4814 Posts
On January 17 2016 22:03 lolfail9001 wrote: Mind you: Alliance were winning against Eu teams. When East was much stronger. Idk what your point is. Of course Alliance wasn't a favorite or anything going into TI4, but for example they were doing better than c9 in the months leading up to the event. c9 was 5th-6th, a result like that wouldn't even look that bad for Alliance. But now in the close group stage they got knocked out and their placing looks bad. | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
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shad2810
Malaysia2682 Posts
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nojok
France15845 Posts
On January 17 2016 22:12 spudde123 wrote: Idk what your point is. Of course Alliance wasn't a favorite or anything going into TI4, but for example they were doing better than c9 in the months leading up to the event. c9 was 5th-6th, a result like that wouldn't even look that bad for Alliance. But now in the close group stage they got knocked out and their placing looks bad. All teams prepared a shit ton against alliance too. | ||
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spudde123
4814 Posts
On January 17 2016 22:13 lolnoty wrote: Alliance's reason for being good is S4's time in Secret. Alliance's entire style this tournament reminds me a lot of Secret when he was their captain. In what way? A lot of their style reminds me of what Alliance was when s4 was still with them in the old days. Bulldog plays a secondary carry, s4 is the primary initiator, a lot of their strats are timing pushes utilizing LD/NP, etc. | ||
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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brinepumps
Indonesia753 Posts
Congrats to them, well deserved, top notch performance. On a side note, does anyone know Chinese teams are good with LD and Chen? If no, man they are screwed | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 22:24 brinepumps wrote: Tbf, its really hard drafting against Alliance, you have to ban LD, NP, Chen, Wisp, and probably Bat. Congrats to them, well deserved, top notch performance. On a side note, does anyone know Chinese teams are good with LD and Chen? If no, man they are screwed I mean, LD used to be traditional Chinese carry, so i think they will remember it quickly. Now, Chen is trickier part, but IIRC every Chinese team has Chen player, unlike EG. Though if Chinese teams will derp draft single carry against Alliance as well, they are fucked either way. | ||
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Asha
United Kingdom38255 Posts
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eonrulz
United Kingdom225 Posts
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40190 Posts
On January 17 2016 23:17 eonrulz wrote: Missed the finals - I gather Alliance won, but were the games any good? Should I go catch them on VOD? 2 derp drafts from PPD, would not recommend catching VODS unless you are a fan of Alliance. | ||
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SaltySam
65 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:53 FuzzyJAM wrote: Ah okay. I wasn't inferring that Sumail's hero pool was small. Sumail has a wider hero pool than S4, no question. I just wanted to show that S4 has more heroes that work in this meta than many people think.? How did I forget anything? I was going by this tournament, as I clearly stated, seeing as that was what was being discussed. S4 won the tournament despite playing half as many heroes as Sumail, so clearly Sumail's hero pool isn't too limited to win the tournament - that's total nonsense. | ||
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sunrazgriz
Vatican City State1573 Posts
On January 17 2016 23:21 lolfail9001 wrote: 2 derp drafts from PPD, would not recommend catching VODS unless you are a fan of Alliance. that luna pick was legit and s salt though | ||
stuchiu
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
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woojaekeem
United States524 Posts
two stomps | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
On January 17 2016 23:33 stuchiu wrote: were the finals worth watching? My guess is not from the reddit reaction. No it was disappointing. PPD getting out drafted twice is not something you see everyday. | ||
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Danzo
2820 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:42 bluzi wrote: Fuck all the cry babies about the patch , alliance got nerfed to the ground as a team after TI3 , so now we see holes in EG drafting ? good , it shouldn't be their patch all the time shouldn't it ? no chen or wisp player is hurting them like alliance having no Ember player is hurting them for ages now , just let us celebrate the win peacefully , jeez , OG/Vg/newbee didn't get half the flake Alliance get for running the same thing over and over until a major/TI was won/almost won .... whatever haters gonna hate , they outplayed EG and won fair and square , RTZ should be mad at his team losing mid lanes and picking him a god damn Luna..... Who's crying? I see EG hates more than anything. I can't go anywhere without NA Dota meme's and non stop praises for S4. | ||
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Sbrubbles
Brazil5776 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:51 Artisreal wrote: I have to say, Slacks did a pretty hype interview. Loda was flabbergasted for a second after his first question. Though due to his apparent character I never know if he's posing a serious question to, joking with or playing the interviewee. Yeah, he brought more energy than someone like kotlguy, though he overdid it a few times. | ||
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Ohforfsake
Norway204 Posts
Never win tournaments just before a major. WCA was fine because everyone called it fluke, but this isn't good. Now the bullseye will be on Alliance for the Shanghai Major. They better go and loose to some tier 2 EU teams now to take that eye away and place it back on EG where it should be! :D :D :D | ||
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shad2810
Malaysia2682 Posts
On January 18 2016 00:34 Ohforfsake wrote: Alliance won? Crap, they didn't get the memo... Never win tournaments just before a major. WCA was fine because everyone called it fluke, but this isn't good. Now the bullseye will be on Alliance for the Shanghai Major. They better go and loose to some tier 2 EU teams now to take that eye away and place it back on EG where it should be! :D :D :D Or why not do a ti3 repeat, where they win everyone including the big daddy? | ||
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Ohforfsake
Norway204 Posts
On January 18 2016 01:26 shad2810 wrote: Or why not do a ti3 repeat, where they win everyone including the big daddy? Noone has been able to do it since then. And going into TI3 people were questioning how good Alliance really was since they lost in the last tournament before the big one. But I guess there's only to hope for you're view to come true now. | ||
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mnck
Denmark1518 Posts
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Evander Berry Wall
United States1137 Posts
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blobrus
4297 Posts
Cool to see Alliance win though, the rise and fall and rise again is probably one of the coolest esports stories out there. | ||
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DwD
Sweden8621 Posts
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Zea!
9589 Posts
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Emnjay808
United States10655 Posts
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
On January 18 2016 02:27 Evander Berry Wall wrote: Validated the invite. The invite was valid all along. IDK how people thought 2 minor LAN wins on a previous patch outweighed a major LAN win on the current patch. Honestly most of the people who disagreed with the invite were either super salty Liquid fans or just flat out don't know to evaluate strong play. I wasn't one hundred percent convinced after WCA because it was only a single outing, but they certainly looked much more solid than Liquid at the time. | ||
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bluzi
4703 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:59 Shergal wrote: Nah I think the only real issue is Chen. All the other heroes can be countered and outplayed, it's just the performance level of the teams in this LAN was really low (IMO, including Alliance, but they're on an upwards spiral with all their heroes being viable again). WTF are you even saying.... man im going to be braindead by the end of this LR .....those were the top teams in the world , they dont just become all bad in a day nor god like in the other , the level was high as always in the tip top of the dota world , you cannot understand the game and level of play is not anyone fault by yourself mate.... | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On January 18 2016 03:45 SupLilSon wrote: The invite was valid all along. IDK how people thought 2 minor LAN wins on a previous patch outweighed a major LAN win on the current patch. Honestly most of the people who disagreed with the invite were either super salty Liquid fans or just flat out don't know to evaluate strong play. I wasn't one hundred percent convinced after WCA because it was only a single outing, but they certainly looked much more solid than Liquid at the time. Wasn't even 2 LAN wins. 1 Online tourney and 1 tiny LAN. | ||
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
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Taf the Ghost
United States11751 Posts
Thoughts: You need 3 things to Win a big tournament: 1) 3 strategies or 3 variations on the same strategy, allowing you to always get a good draft. 2) A draft advantage via Hero Pool compared to the Tournament Meta. 3) At least one player playing at a "next level" compared to everyone else. Alliance brought a 4th key that's going to need to be figured out. They've figured out how to farm more efficiently with the new map. In a low-kill EG game, they're almost always up 2-3k at 10 minutes, but they were consistently outfarmed in both games, regardless of how the lanes were going. That Dire off-lane needs to be really explored well. (Credit to Puppey for both calling how the series would play out and the score.) I do think the Veno was probably not the best choice in game 2 from ppd, but that's not why they lost. They lost because Alliance had figured out their farming pattern better and come up with some brutally hard to deal with rotations. Add on top of that their best heroes dominated the Meta at Starladder. But Alliance both knows how to play them and how to play against them. That game 2 was instructive. With Bat + Zeus, Alliance played the Vision + Nighttime game so well that it was a 2:1 kill score at 20 minutes. Alliance's warding was also really on point. (And it showed some of the problem EG had in game 2 against LGD: really good vision game prevents a lot of what EG wants to do.) s4 was definitely playing the best of Alliance, though everyone was on-point from Day 2 on. And since s4 is their playmaker, that really opened up the map for them. Add in the great vision game and they were able to both farm better and shut down the farm on EG. The last point I have is that I think EG hit on the actual Meta direction in Day 1 and didn't quite realize it. Alliance had both strong push and supports that can heal + do something else. (Juggernaut's Healing Ward was pretty critical in game 2 as well.) Call it the "hard sustain" method of support play we've been seeing for a while now, but it's only getting more important. Game 1 really turned on the sustain + position of Alliance at that Top Radiant Tier 1 fight. If Wisp gets picked off, they probably get wiped and the game looks very different. (Most EG games tend to be about those early rotations. If they snag the right one, they can carry the lead to a victory. That's why banning Spirit Breaker is what allowed them to move from 0-2 to win 3-2 against VP at The Summit 4.) | ||
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spudde123
4814 Posts
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GinNtoniC
Sweden2945 Posts
On January 17 2016 21:27 Gear 3rd wrote: This patch could develop into a nightmare for EG. I will stop my rant about A now. I still dont like them but when they won I thought "well at least theyre celebrating: humans confirmed!" Imo if some particular players sort out their issues (which they propably will) i think Secret TL could come out really strong this patch in the long run. And i am really curious how OG and VG will approach the patch at shanghai. Off to TI3 VODs to study. To be frank I've always considering to be one of the most robotic teams out there, but hey we're all biased I guess. | ||
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JoeHannes
Germany207 Posts
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HopLight
Sweden999 Posts
On January 18 2016 06:46 Taf the Ghost wrote: (Credit to Puppey for both calling how the series would play out and the score.) Just curious does anyone have a link to this interview/post? | ||
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SaltySam
65 Posts
On January 18 2016 19:13 JoeHannes wrote: s4 just like he was the drafter for Team Secret during their period of dominance.Who is drafting for Alliance? | ||
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Huruid
Sweden22 Posts
On January 18 2016 19:29 HopLight wrote: Just curious does anyone have a link to this interview/post? | ||
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