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xiao8 was cute, going on cliff, popping his salve, getting shot by an angry rhinoceros because his teammates were kind enough to provide vision to the ancients >.>
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
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On September 03 2012 08:15 Hrrrrm wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2012 08:11 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 08:08 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 08:03 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:59 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 07:58 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:55 Salazarz wrote:
People just have to complain about everything. There's always hundreds of whine-posts in SC2 double-elim finals because one side having an advantage in grand finals before the actual grand finals even start is not very... grand. Now Valve does it this way and lo and behold, hundreds of whine posts again.
Personally, I like this way a lot more, especially if the grand finals are played on same day as other matches. There is absolutely no reason to think that coming from winner's bracket is NOT an advantage, so it's not like teams are going to throw games or whatever. You're going to be fresher, maybe have an extra special strat saved up, have an extra chance to observe your opponents' games... it is an advantage, however small you may want to claim it is - and the finals actually start off on even footing, which is nice. Just have single elim instead, then. Fairness is pretty important when a million dollars is on the line. Also those people who complain don't know the format. Don't give the team that wins all their sets a disadvantage in comparison to all the others. Does that make sense to you ? And with all that rant out of the way IG-LGD is starting, let's see what'll happen. Why not 16 teams league format for ultimate fairness then? They had the time to do it. Is this called a slippery slope argument? I'm not familiar with the English terms. If you do a double elimination format you don't do it up to the final stage and then remove it as if it never was there. Just do single elimination. Then just don't think of it as a double elim. This is not proper double elimination. It has been clear from the start that there is no 1-0 advantage for the wb winner. We can call it Valve 1.5 elimination. You were talking about fairness that is why i brought up the league format which would be the fairest format in determining the best team as everyone plays each other. So i was just wondering if you would prefer TI2 to be following that format from the start. It's double elimination to everyone but one single team. I don't understand how you're fine with everyone but a single team getting two lives. That'd be bullying at school, racism on the streets. Valve wanted to get the two best teams to the Grand Finals and then watch an even match between them. ALL teams knew this going into it and all agreed to the rules. What exactly is the problem again? If Na'Vi were in the Loser's Bracket they'd be glad as hell they didn't have to climb that Grand Finals mountain TWICE. They all knew the only advantage for staying in the Winner's Bracket would be lesser games and guaranteed second place if you won the Winner's Bracket. Just drop it please. I could understand if this was a "surprise" to the teams but it wasn't.
I'll post a detailed writeup after this tournament.
IG playing so well... Well, apart from the lone druid I guess but it doesn't really matter.
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On September 03 2012 08:11 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2012 08:08 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 08:03 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:59 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 07:58 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:55 Salazarz wrote:
People just have to complain about everything. There's always hundreds of whine-posts in SC2 double-elim finals because one side having an advantage in grand finals before the actual grand finals even start is not very... grand. Now Valve does it this way and lo and behold, hundreds of whine posts again.
Personally, I like this way a lot more, especially if the grand finals are played on same day as other matches. There is absolutely no reason to think that coming from winner's bracket is NOT an advantage, so it's not like teams are going to throw games or whatever. You're going to be fresher, maybe have an extra special strat saved up, have an extra chance to observe your opponents' games... it is an advantage, however small you may want to claim it is - and the finals actually start off on even footing, which is nice. Just have single elim instead, then. Fairness is pretty important when a million dollars is on the line. Also those people who complain don't know the format. Don't give the team that wins all their sets a disadvantage in comparison to all the others. Does that make sense to you ? And with all that rant out of the way IG-LGD is starting, let's see what'll happen. Why not 16 teams league format for ultimate fairness then? They had the time to do it. Is this called a slippery slope argument? I'm not familiar with the English terms. If you do a double elimination format you don't do it up to the final stage and then remove it as if it never was there. Just do single elimination. Then just don't think of it as a double elim. This is not proper double elimination. It has been clear from the start that there is no 1-0 advantage for the wb winner. We can call it Valve 1.5 elimination. You were talking about fairness that is why i brought up the league format which would be the fairest format in determining the best team as everyone plays each other. So i was just wondering if you would prefer TI2 to be following that format from the start. It's double elimination to everyone but one single team. I don't understand how you're fine with everyone but a single team getting two lives. That'd be bullying at school, racism on the streets. Brewmaster, haven't seen him in some time now, kind of funny o_O IG beating LGD in farm but behind in kills... But not anymore, IG looking really good thus far.
Tournament format does not have to be the same across the whole tournament.
In fact this TI2 went from Group Stage League Format - Elimination/Tournament format.
So think of it this way, the group stage is to pick top 4 and top 4 to put into the double elimination playoff brackets.
The double elimination are to pick the TOP 2 BEST TEAM.
Then the top 2 are playing bo5 single elimination.
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Those of you trying to stay up... get some sleep now and wake up for the finals. These games could take 2-3 hours and then there'll be an hour break.
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iG just mopping up LGD right now. Three kills mid even with things like Black Hole cancelled. Shadow Shaman doing serious work for iG
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On September 03 2012 08:18 dtz wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2012 08:11 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 08:08 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 08:03 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:59 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 07:58 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:55 Salazarz wrote:
People just have to complain about everything. There's always hundreds of whine-posts in SC2 double-elim finals because one side having an advantage in grand finals before the actual grand finals even start is not very... grand. Now Valve does it this way and lo and behold, hundreds of whine posts again.
Personally, I like this way a lot more, especially if the grand finals are played on same day as other matches. There is absolutely no reason to think that coming from winner's bracket is NOT an advantage, so it's not like teams are going to throw games or whatever. You're going to be fresher, maybe have an extra special strat saved up, have an extra chance to observe your opponents' games... it is an advantage, however small you may want to claim it is - and the finals actually start off on even footing, which is nice. Just have single elim instead, then. Fairness is pretty important when a million dollars is on the line. Also those people who complain don't know the format. Don't give the team that wins all their sets a disadvantage in comparison to all the others. Does that make sense to you ? And with all that rant out of the way IG-LGD is starting, let's see what'll happen. Why not 16 teams league format for ultimate fairness then? They had the time to do it. Is this called a slippery slope argument? I'm not familiar with the English terms. If you do a double elimination format you don't do it up to the final stage and then remove it as if it never was there. Just do single elimination. Then just don't think of it as a double elim. This is not proper double elimination. It has been clear from the start that there is no 1-0 advantage for the wb winner. We can call it Valve 1.5 elimination. You were talking about fairness that is why i brought up the league format which would be the fairest format in determining the best team as everyone plays each other. So i was just wondering if you would prefer TI2 to be following that format from the start. It's double elimination to everyone but one single team. I don't understand how you're fine with everyone but a single team getting two lives. That'd be bullying at school, racism on the streets. Brewmaster, haven't seen him in some time now, kind of funny o_O IG beating LGD in farm but behind in kills... But not anymore, IG looking really good thus far. Tournament format does not have to be the same across the whole tournament. In fact this TI2 went from Group Stage League Format - Elimination/Tournament format. So think of it this say, the group stage is to pick top 4 and top 4 to put into the double elimination playoff brackets. The double elimination are to pick the TOP 2 BEST TEAM. Then the top 2 are playing bo5 single elimination.
The top 2 teams are the ones that hadn't lost sets, wouldn't you say?
Those top 2 teams just played. Stop arguing with me when I'm trying my hardest to stop, will you?
Oh man that blank hole was such a fail. Seems like a big victory for LGD there, this is actually looking like a really good game
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Have iG and LGD faced each other before this match at TI2?
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I think it kinda sucks for LGD that they have to play another Bo3 right after while iG could watch the previous set and rest.
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On September 03 2012 08:19 bardtown wrote:
Those of you trying to stay up... get some sleep now and wake up for the finals. These games could take 2-3 hours and then there'll be an hour break.
Really there will be an hour break ? :< aw
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Lalalaland34504 Posts
On September 03 2012 08:13 Earll wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2012 08:08 Firebolt145 wrote:On September 03 2012 08:04 Manit0u wrote:
Could someone enlighten me as to why no one seems to be ever picking up Desolator or MKB? Aren't they great damage for money items in DotA? Desolator requires you to get it quite early to be effective, and the minus armor is easily gotten by getting a medallion instead. It also gives you ONLY damage with no survivability at all, whereas other damage items that are generally rushed like Manta give additional abilities. By the time you start looking for pure damage items, it is too late and desolator is outclassed by other damage items such as MKB or Daedalus. MKB is only a great damage item on heroes that inherently have relatively low base damage, such as Windrunner or QoP. On most other heroes Daedalus is a better damage item. Pretty sure I read somewhere that Desolater is almost always better than MKB\Daedalus unless you need to go through evasion, have an insane attack speed, or the enemy has a very large amount of armor. Getting medalion would just make Desolater even stronger, as long as you don't bring the target below 21 minus armor.
Hmm, don't think so to the first part. Can't remember the math though.
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LGD don't want to die. Nice fight there. Two for zero.
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On September 03 2012 08:18 dtz wrote:Show nested quote +On September 03 2012 08:11 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 08:08 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 08:03 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:59 dtz wrote:On September 03 2012 07:58 Shikyo wrote:On September 03 2012 07:55 Salazarz wrote:
People just have to complain about everything. There's always hundreds of whine-posts in SC2 double-elim finals because one side having an advantage in grand finals before the actual grand finals even start is not very... grand. Now Valve does it this way and lo and behold, hundreds of whine posts again.
Personally, I like this way a lot more, especially if the grand finals are played on same day as other matches. There is absolutely no reason to think that coming from winner's bracket is NOT an advantage, so it's not like teams are going to throw games or whatever. You're going to be fresher, maybe have an extra special strat saved up, have an extra chance to observe your opponents' games... it is an advantage, however small you may want to claim it is - and the finals actually start off on even footing, which is nice. Just have single elim instead, then. Fairness is pretty important when a million dollars is on the line. Also those people who complain don't know the format. Don't give the team that wins all their sets a disadvantage in comparison to all the others. Does that make sense to you ? And with all that rant out of the way IG-LGD is starting, let's see what'll happen. Why not 16 teams league format for ultimate fairness then? They had the time to do it. Is this called a slippery slope argument? I'm not familiar with the English terms. If you do a double elimination format you don't do it up to the final stage and then remove it as if it never was there. Just do single elimination. Then just don't think of it as a double elim. This is not proper double elimination. It has been clear from the start that there is no 1-0 advantage for the wb winner. We can call it Valve 1.5 elimination. You were talking about fairness that is why i brought up the league format which would be the fairest format in determining the best team as everyone plays each other. So i was just wondering if you would prefer TI2 to be following that format from the start. It's double elimination to everyone but one single team. I don't understand how you're fine with everyone but a single team getting two lives. That'd be bullying at school, racism on the streets. Brewmaster, haven't seen him in some time now, kind of funny o_O IG beating LGD in farm but behind in kills... But not anymore, IG looking really good thus far. Tournament format does not have to be the same across the whole tournament. In fact this TI2 went from Group Stage League Format - Elimination/Tournament format. So think of it this way, the group stage is to pick top 4 and top 4 to put into the double elimination playoff brackets. The double elimination are to pick the TOP 2 BEST TEAM. Then the top 2 are playing bo5 single elimination.
this argument should end the discussion imo..
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On September 03 2012 08:21 Implenia wrote:
Have iG and LGD faced each other before this match at TI2?
No.
But their record is pretty even with iG having the edge on match history.
These 2 teams were bootcamping together before TL2
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Oh kill on the Beastmaster!
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1h break???? right, I'm gg'ing out till finals.
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On September 03 2012 08:21 TR wrote:
Ferrari got epicenter?
He did but wasnt able to get it off
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EPT
