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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On August 31 2012 06:17 qyk05328 wrote: I'm not very familiar with the Chinese number system, but does having a lower number mean that in addition to getting one's farm you also get to fuck his gf? Puts a new spin on what people mean when they say "Hao isn't a safe 1st position". | ||
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qyk05328
Germany635 Posts
On August 31 2012 06:22 Chiharu Harukaze wrote: Yes. 1st position means you have first priority over the farm (generally the hard carry). 5th position is lowest priority for the farm (like a CM or something). Of course this is flexible within the game so while an Earthshaker support may start as 4th or 5th position, they're still going to let him find farm at some point to get a Blink Dagger and the like. The finer granularity seems really nice as opposed to simply saying someone is support and be finished with that. Most likely top western teams in reality are implicitly prioritizing one support/utility hero over the other, but this explicit priority assignment is much more rigorous and could be helpful for less experienced teams. EDIT: Yeah, I was joking but thanks for the info nevertheless. I'm really interested to know more about their system. | ||
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Kupon3ss
時の回廊10066 Posts
On August 31 2012 06:19 BurningSera wrote: Eh guys recommend me some good naga games. Have an urge to watch the no tits bitch from china man player. TongFu vs Navi Game 2 has some superb naga usage | ||
Firebolt145
Lalalaland34504 Posts
On August 31 2012 06:35 Kupon3ss wrote: TongFu vs Navi Game 2 has some superb naga usage Yes definitely, that naga ult -> vacuum -> blackhole was amazing. Too bad the vacuum and blackhole was from the opposite team. | ||
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cecek
Czech Republic18921 Posts
On August 31 2012 06:17 qyk05328 wrote: I'm not very familiar with the Chinese number system, but does having a lower number mean that in addition to getting one's farm you also get to fuck his gf? Of course... The carry gets to fuck the support's girlfriend. Being a support is all about sacrificing yourself for the good of the team, haven't you played DotA before? jeez... | ||
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myopia
United States2928 Posts
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kdgns
United States2427 Posts
On August 31 2012 06:33 qyk05328 wrote: The finer granularity seems really nice as opposed to simply saying someone is support and be finished with that. Most likely top western teams in reality are implicitly prioritizing one support/utility hero over the other, but this explicit priority assignment is much more rigorous and could be helpful for less experienced teams. EDIT: Yeah, I was joking but thanks for the info nevertheless. I'm really interested to know more about their system. My understanding of the positions: 1= hard carry, if it was possible to pool all the gold into this position's bank, most teams would want to do so, prime examples include anti-mage, morphling, spectre. These heros will win you the game if you get enough farm on them 2= Ganking carry/midgame carry, farming is still important, they still need items, but the way they get it is through participating in teamfights and ganking. Examples of 2 position heroes are queen of pain and invoker. They need items, but they have a strong enough midgame to leave lanes to gank and and teamfight 3= Offlane solo (usually). They get an entire lane to farm! all for themselves!....except its usually in the suicide lane, basically these heros have good long range damage skills that allows them to get whatever last hits they can get without feeding horribly. They usually need levels but not as much as 1 or 2, in teamfights they are not the main dps, but they are still critical to teamfights with a high level in at least one of their skills. Examples include windrunner, beastmaster, and dark seer. They change fights not by huge dps, but by having high levels in one of their big skills. and they have long range/safe ways to stay in lane. 4= Support (teamfight ult). Now to the poor supports, 4th position means that you are rushing one item (usually blink dagger), a good team will let you have a few waves when you're close, the rest of the money comes from assists. Examples include support earthshaker, support tide. These guys are completely different beasts with and without a blink dagger, they only really need to be level 6 to be gamechanging, and have a decent level 1 skill such that its ok for them to be behind a bit. 4th positions are basically running on boots+branches until they get blink. 5= Support (ward b*tch). The pillar that supports the team, your job is to not die so many times that you are unable to afford wards throughout the game, you have an awesome level 1 skill, and great level 2, your ult is quite useful, but is a luxury rather than an necessity to the teams strategy. Common strategies include staying out of exp range on the 1 position's lane just so he farms safer, acting as a human ward (remember wards don't get money/exp, so you dont either). Your levels comes from the assists, you let the 1 position get the last hits on towers/kills. Etc. Many team captains choose to play the 5th position because of the amount of time they can devote to the overall game, since they take care of wards they pay attention to them, since they die the easiest they are most aware of danger. Examples include crystal maiden, vengeful spirit. In an ideal game, you would give the 1st position about 50% of the farm (jungle plus a lane plus ancients plus last hit on towers), 2nd position 30% (one lane) 3rd position would get about 15% (one lane, but you miss a lot of creeps), and 4th position gets enough for blink, giving rest to 1st position and 5th gets the salary. | ||
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Ghighita
Romania28 Posts
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MyMia
18 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
On August 31 2012 05:46 Yoshi- wrote: Isn't the tongfu drama about Hao having sexual intercourse with the gf of mu? say wat now | ||
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kdgns
United States2427 Posts
On August 31 2012 07:58 Kipsate wrote: Chinese number system can best be explained by the amount of resources one allocates to a certain hero, where 5th takes the least resources(hard support) and the 1st position takes the most resources(hardcarry). say wat now As far as I know, the only drama in Tongfu is due to the differing attitudes of the members, mu and awoke (I think) are in a troublesome financial situation, they have to work day and nigh shifts (as xiao8 mentioned) and winning a fifth of 1 million american dollars is basically a godsend, they treat this tournament as an answer to their financial worries. I think Hao isn't in such a situation, and because of his personality, he appears more relaxed, and due to his unsafe 1st position play, he can be seen as a weak link in Tongfu, the one bringing it down. Of course everyone wants to win, but how much winning changes your life will be quite different. Thus, you have tension, Hao's playstyle is threatening mu and awoke's only chance to change their financial situation. | ||
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
Going into TI 2, I thought that the level showed by TF was around the level every Chinese team was going to be at. In this I did not think that iG and LGD were secretly bootcamping for months. TF follows the normal trajectory for a team that's practicing both Dota 1 and Dota 2, and which still lacks understanding of the latter. iG and LGD are not normal in how well they understand the game after 2-3 months of playing both Dota 1 and Dota 2. | ||
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BurningSera
Ireland19621 Posts
On August 31 2012 06:35 Kupon3ss wrote: TongFu vs Navi Game 2 has some superb naga usage rofl at 2009 commentary on navi tf g2. bahahahahaa 'if sylar played this he would have gotten a bfly and finish the game by now' - on naga's 2nd go at navi bot melee rax after hao got a heart. and his conclusion for the whole game is just the chinese idiom of 'ridiculous' lol And he even saw that coming when naga ulti at the first rosh fight. I think i am going to use his commentary for the next three days^^ | ||
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luc14n0
Brazil211 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:28 luc14n0 wrote: Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand Azarkon is spilling crap on other forums ! Nice. Heh, I think you're going to find TL.net a lot less amenable to your trolling. FYI, though, I've been a regular on TL for years. I was into SC before I got into Dota. | ||
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FinestHour
United States18466 Posts
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kdgns
United States2427 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:25 BurningSera wrote: rofl at 2009 commentary on navi tf g2. bahahahahaa 'if sylar played this he would have gotten a bfly and finish the game by now' - on naga's 2nd go at navi bot melee rax after hao got a heart. and his conclude for the whole game is just the chinese idiom of 'ridiculous' lol And he even saw that coming when naga ulti at the first rosh fight. I think i am going to use his commentary for the next three days^^ I went back and watched some of 2009's commentary, his knowledge of the game is quite good, but I feel his vods are better than his live casts. But I guess thats because he only picks the best games for his vods. Its also the case of "knowing the best option" vs "knowing what teams will do" for chinese teams it usually works, but for foreign teams he gets caught offguard | ||
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luc14n0
Brazil211 Posts
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Azarkon
United States21060 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:30 luc14n0 wrote: What trolling ? You are saying iG and LGD "secretly" bootcamped, and you have 0 evidence to back that up. As i have said to you many times before, chinese teams are on another level of dota 1/2 right now. In Chuan's interview, he said that iG and LGD were bootcamping for 3+ months. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On August 31 2012 08:24 Azarkon wrote: TF's problem isn't one player being bad it's the team not having great picks / bans and overall game strategy / vision. That's on the captain, who is Hao, so Hao gets the blame. It's exacerbated also by the awkwardness in picking 3/4/5 due to how Sansheng/Kabu/Awoke rotate the roles and nobody knows one of those roles inside-out, which leads to some awkward drafts trying to fit heroes for all 3 players. Awoke mentioned this on an interview with DC. Contrast this with, say, iG's near-perfect role assignment. Everyone knows their position inside-and-out, and can play every hero they would need to play to equal capacity. On August 31 2012 08:31 Azarkon wrote: In Chuan's interview, he said that iG and LGD were bootcamping for 3+ months. iG's also said at other points that the vast majority of games played during that time were against foreign teams. Not necessarily just secret bootcamping with LGD. | ||
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