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On August 12 2013 13:32 NGrNecris wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:30 Shikyo wrote:On August 12 2013 13:27 HigoSeco wrote:On August 12 2013 13:23 Shikyo wrote:On August 12 2013 13:20 HigoSeco wrote:
I didn't root for any of the teams in the finals, but i really don't like this split push bullshit win in the final game. Anyways, Alliance deserved the win since the game allows for that kind of shit DotA, LoL or whatever you have... Splitpushing is always an effective strategy. In even SC2 you can do the same thing(Attack in multiple locations, dodge the main army) and there it's considered amazing play. What sort of games are you looking for, WoW 3v3 Arena? It juat feels that splitpushing with certain heroes is way too strong compared to other strats. Na'vi went from being ahead to losing the game just because their tps were cancelled. That kind of play shouldn't have such a big reward. Anyways Alliance deserved the win given the current state of the game. I just hope np gets nerfed and maybe wisp too. You don't think it was risky? What if Na'Vi kept going and killed the throne? Remember DotA2 is just secondarily PvP, the main goal is destroying buildings. how exactly would they have killed the throne when furion and ck wisp could just tp back instantly to defend
It is Navi's fault for letting them take wisp and furion. They are such a strong combo precisely because they can be anywhere on the map at any time. The downside is if you fight them 5 on 5 they are weak, because they have a skill which teleports them anywhere. That is the only reason Navi could take the mid rax. They would have won if they didn't clump up and have 3 tp's get cancelled by puck. But they panicked and didn't see it coming. That is the reason they lost, not because wisp or split-pushing is too strong. If they had taken 1 second to split up their tp's then they would have won. It was Navi's mistake.
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To the people complaining about how 1 ability won the game, isn't that what happens a lot of the time in teamfights anyways? 1 good ult, including Dream Coil, can often decide a teamfight and then the game through that. This was amazing DOTA, a beautiful clash of styles. Calm down, watch it again, and love DOTA.
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I'm amazed that people are complaining about split pushing when Alliance was literally forced to contest at Roshan when they were way behind, and somehow managed to win a fight that seemed basically impossible to win for them. So stfu if you seriously think Alliance 'won with split push.' They won by denying Roshan at a timing that Na'vi wanted, underfarmed, underleveled. If Na'vi wins here, they win the game.
Not to mention, S4 demonstrated that Alliance is fully capable of playing Na'vi style aggressive small skirmish style in game 4 with his Nightstalker, which was a very high risk and high reward hero. At first I was pretty skeptical that Alliance could play aggressive when necessary or when they were behind, but games 4 and 5 fully demonstrated that Alliance is not a one trick pony.
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On August 12 2013 13:34 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:33 r.Evo wrote:On August 12 2013 13:29 Mataza wrote:On August 12 2013 13:27 r.Evo wrote:On August 12 2013 13:24 Plansix wrote:On August 12 2013 13:23 Mellon wrote:
The meta in Dota 2 seems to be terrible atm. At least Navi did play outside of it and got 2nd place. Really cool! Puppy does not agree. He seemed did not mind the meta at all. Puppey understands that he outsmarted Alliance while they outplayed him. That's what makes him one of the best Dota captains in the world, he has all the reason to be happy. The current meta is crap. The really good teams play each other so few times that it's basically just the opinion of teams. OD deserves to fly straight out of the meta. Naga deserves to get right back in. And a host of other little things Dota is one of the greatest games in the world because people like your or me DON'T decide what makes it better. Sit back, enjoy the ride and try to get behind the mysteries. This TI4 we had 14/16 of the worlds beast teams not understanding how this version was meant to be played. The fact that only DK and Na'Vi were smart enough to do so makes Dota Dota. And the fact that Alliance was able to win despite that with superior execution also makes Dota Dota. In Icefrog we trust. And the meta will change in two months. AND WHEN HAVE WE SEEN A NIGHTSTALKER PICK????????????!?!?!??!?!
yeah damn, i dont think i saw one game of him played at all 
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On August 12 2013 13:35 Drazerk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:34 opterown wrote:
my closing thoughts:
1) Not missing a single game of TI3 in the Australian timezone is really damn draining.
2) Fountain hooks are bullshit. I'm still fuming from that game.
3) Poor kyxy
4) I hope Burning doesn't retire, he can still do great things yet.
5) That was one of the best final games of any tournament I've ever watched
6) juff is a fucking boss for live reporting all the games. seriously, what a hero
7) China disband... or at least massive reshuffle. i expect a very interesting chinese scene for the next few months
8) Amazing production from the team. There are a lot of things they can improve about TI in general, but overall great job.
9) Thank god azarkon was banned for the main event.
10) Long live Dota 2! Hey what about me!
who?
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opterown
Australia54784 Posts
On August 12 2013 13:35 Drazerk wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:34 opterown wrote:
my closing thoughts:
1) Not missing a single game of TI3 in the Australian timezone is really damn draining.
2) Fountain hooks are bullshit. I'm still fuming from that game.
3) Poor kyxy
4) I hope Burning doesn't retire, he can still do great things yet.
5) That was one of the best final games of any tournament I've ever watched
6) juff is a fucking boss for live reporting all the games. seriously, what a hero
7) China disband... or at least massive reshuffle. i expect a very interesting chinese scene for the next few months
8) Amazing production from the team. There are a lot of things they can improve about TI in general, but overall great job.
9) Thank god azarkon was banned for the main event.
10) Long live Dota 2! Hey what about me!
haha major props to you, r.evo and 739 for helping out too :D
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On August 12 2013 13:34 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:33 toemn wrote:On August 12 2013 13:31 EFermi wrote:On August 12 2013 13:20 BoZiffer wrote:
Man. I honestly feel like no other event can match this hype. The International has to be the gold standard of eSports. Huh? The final game was great but what was so special about the event itself? Definitely not the introduction nor winners cemeronies. The production was better than the last 20 cheaply produced SC2 events combined. Get over it, deal with it. A new era has begun. TB and Artosis switching is only the beginning.  TB and Artosis are switching to Dota what?
TB definitely.
Tasteless or Artosis tweeted smth. similar. You gotta read between the lines.
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What a great tournament, the best so far. I'm very happy what Valve has done, what they have built. Thanks to Na'Vi and [A] to make the Final one of the best Bo5. Yes there was errors from both teams, yes the style that some used are debatable for some, but you got to accept that it was an excellent finals and in the end, we, the community and DOTA2 also won.
Everyone should be happy, [A] enters in the hall of fame of winners, and Na'Vi enters in the hall of fame of being in the finals for three times (its painful but man, good DOTA was had).
Next year will be more awesome and DOTA2 thanks to it getting bigger, i can't wait to next year International.
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On August 12 2013 13:33 rabidch wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:29 DucK- wrote:
Navi should have won the 5th game. It was not exactly a throw. Clutch play by S4. If Navi could TP back, they would manage to easily defend both towers. They would be able to push the other towers easily, with Alchemist getting bigger and bigger. As good as a lineup Alliance have for rat doto, it is not enough with that advantage Navi has.
But after that, the game totally swung towards Alliance. Only way Navi can win is if TA and Alchemist get real big such that they can destroy towers. Bulldog went very smart with the Necrobook. It's sad that 1 Dream Coil turned the whole game.
As much as I'd wanted Navi to take this game, Alliance deserves it. Or at least S4 deserves this because he has countlessly single handily carried Alliance. By carry I mean doing ridiculous plays to put them in the game. Most of the time alone. it is not a throw since the game was still anybodys but it was a really cocky decision to even trade rax, let alone their tier3 towers! you really need those towers to buffer against split push. props to alliance for not breaking to defend under that kind of pressure but navi let them do that too easily. im not sure why they worried about an extended game so much
They didn't intend to trade the t3 towers at all, they could have actually made it back on time based on their tp timings if you check the vod again. They probably forgot the possibility of having their tp's cancelled by coil in the heat of the moment.
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On August 12 2013 13:34 sc14s wrote:
its funny that i see more anti na'vi fans complaining about the na'vi fans complaining than the actual na'vi fans complaining.
does this make any sense??
Better, you see more people complaining about people voting no and you dont actually see the people that voted no
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On August 12 2013 13:36 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:35 Drazerk wrote:On August 12 2013 13:34 opterown wrote:
my closing thoughts:
1) Not missing a single game of TI3 in the Australian timezone is really damn draining.
2) Fountain hooks are bullshit. I'm still fuming from that game.
3) Poor kyxy
4) I hope Burning doesn't retire, he can still do great things yet.
5) That was one of the best final games of any tournament I've ever watched
6) juff is a fucking boss for live reporting all the games. seriously, what a hero
7) China disband... or at least massive reshuffle. i expect a very interesting chinese scene for the next few months
8) Amazing production from the team. There are a lot of things they can improve about TI in general, but overall great job.
9) Thank god azarkon was banned for the main event.
10) Long live Dota 2! Hey what about me! Hey I remember you, you're the guy who likes Ravens.
I went to a cave and found a flock of ravens who I now live with 
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You see this kind of whining all the time. E.g. Peope hate Floyd Mayweather Jr. because he plays a very defensive and reactive style. Or in football, when a team beats a rival team and fans keep calling them cheaters or saying stuff like the ref being biased.
Dota is no exception.
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On August 12 2013 13:35 CorsairHero wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:33 Noxide wrote:
Ban bulldog prophet everytime!! Respect banning EGM's naga takes a lower priority. Did you watch the first alliance vs navi series?
Can't ban everything. I know its awesome but the prophet just goes so well with what they do.
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On August 12 2013 13:34 opterown wrote:
my closing thoughts:
1) Not missing a single game of TI3 in the Australian timezone is really damn draining.
2) Fountain hooks are bullshit. I'm still fuming from that game.
3) Poor kyxy
4) I hope Burning doesn't retire, he can still do great things yet.
5) That was one of the best final games of any tournament I've ever watched
6) juff is a fucking boss for live reporting all the games. seriously, what a hero
7) China disband... or at least massive reshuffle. i expect a very interesting chinese scene for the next few months
8) Amazing production from the team. There are a lot of things they can improve about TI in general, but overall great job.
9) Thank god azarkon was banned for the main event.
10) Long live Dota 2!
you should get a second star.
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Just glad that we had such a great finals. Hope to see even better play after this TI3.
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Bisutopia19339 Posts
On August 12 2013 13:34 opterown wrote:
my closing thoughts:
1) Not missing a single game of TI3 in the Australian timezone is really damn draining.
2) Fountain hooks are bullshit. I'm still fuming from that game.
3) Poor kyxy
4) I hope Burning doesn't retire, he can still do great things yet.
5) That was one of the best final games of any tournament I've ever watched
6) juff is a fucking boss for live reporting all the games. seriously, what a hero
7) China disband... or at least massive reshuffle. i expect a very interesting chinese scene for the next few months
8) Amazing production from the team. There are a lot of things they can improve about TI in general, but overall great job.
9) Thank god azarkon was banned for the main event.
10) Long live Dota 2!
Forgot to thank me for not spamming Bisu in this thread.
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Russian Federation615 Posts
guys, please stop fighting. Alliance is a fantastic team, the tourney was amazing, Teamliquid coverage was top notch, so much content, so much good interviews, insight. It was a hell of a week.
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Sure they will get one pickoff, they will get two pickoffs. Dota is not about kills, its not about gold. Its about killing the opponents throne.
- Loda
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On August 12 2013 13:34 opterown wrote:
my closing thoughts:
1) Not missing a single game of TI3 in the Australian timezone is really damn draining.
2) Fountain hooks are bullshit. I'm still fuming from that game.
3) Poor kyxy
4) I hope Burning doesn't retire, he can still do great things yet.
5) That was one of the best final games of any tournament I've ever watched
6) juff is a fucking boss for live reporting all the games. seriously, what a hero
7) China disband... or at least massive reshuffle. i expect a very interesting chinese scene for the next few months
8) Amazing production from the team. There are a lot of things they can improve about TI in general, but overall great job.
9) Thank god azarkon was banned for the main event.
10) Long live Dota 2!
opterown ti3 mvp
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On August 12 2013 13:34 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2013 13:33 toemn wrote:On August 12 2013 13:31 EFermi wrote:On August 12 2013 13:20 BoZiffer wrote:
Man. I honestly feel like no other event can match this hype. The International has to be the gold standard of eSports. Huh? The final game was great but what was so special about the event itself? Definitely not the introduction nor winners cemeronies. The production was better than the last 20 cheaply produced SC2 events combined. Get over it, deal with it. A new era has begun. TB and Artosis switching is only the beginning. TB and Artosis are switching to Dota what?
I can see day9 also jumping ship anyday now
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EPT
