EPTEvil Geniuses Discussion - Page 222
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ChickenDieAlive
699 Posts
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OtherwiseOcelot
33 Posts
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kun3
101 Posts
On August 23 2019 06:51 ChickenDieAlive wrote: If EG keeps up their level of play, they will be fine against any of the LB teams. I'm not worried. Anything less than the championship is a failure for this roster really. One year without winning any big tournament is a little bit much for them. If they don't win this TI, there will be some changes (Zai coming back lol?). But if they do, it might be a different story. Zai is in a better team and he left EG because he wanted to play in Europe. Doubt he is coming. But yeah some changes need to happen. If they ever want to win ppd needs to come back. | ||
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MonkeyLarry
United States60 Posts
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wims80
1892 Posts
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ChickenDieAlive
699 Posts
On August 23 2019 20:28 kun3 wrote: Zai is in a better team and he left EG because he wanted to play in Europe. Doubt he is coming. But yeah some changes need to happen. If they ever want to win ppd needs to come back. Zai is a close friend with Sumail and RTZ so never say never, unless Secret somehow win this TI. | ||
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lolnoty
United States7166 Posts
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Gaial
United States313 Posts
On August 24 2019 07:20 lolnoty wrote: I still think it's a great roster, and if there are changes, only 1 person will be changing. Eh I'm not so sure. There's obvious communication issues in game, and it was mentioned in an interview. Cr1t may want to move on. Not sure about rest of the team. As a fan watching, I feel that 1st place is out of reach with this composition of players. | ||
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mda
12 Posts
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ChickenDieAlive
699 Posts
On August 24 2019 09:59 Gaial wrote: Eh I'm not so sure. There's obvious communication issues in game, and it was mentioned in an interview. Cr1t may want to move on. Not sure about rest of the team. As a fan watching, I feel that 1st place is out of reach with this composition of players. I think Sumail and RTZ should split up. They have been trying to find a formula that works for both of them for years and it hasn't worked out. I love them both but to win TI and Majors, they should go their separate ways. Sumail is a position 1 mid, so he's better amplified by a sacrificial carry like Fear in the past. Matumbaman would be perfect for him. For RTZ, I don't know, maybe he should go back to the mid lane? On August 24 2019 11:01 mda wrote: To be fair, the caliber of the remaining teams don't make this 6th place finish so bad. Even if EG won, I'd have said the same about TL. It isn't bad at all. But for this roster, this is disappointing. They formed this roster to win, not to just be "not bad". It is even more disappointing if you include the fact that they haven't won anything for a year. | ||
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Sapaio
Denmark2037 Posts
And RtZ and Sumail have kind of proven they can't win together, and really don't understand why. Other teams have a farming carry and a Flashy mid. | ||
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saocyn
United States937 Posts
On August 24 2019 20:05 Sapaio wrote: For me EG players have the skill to win, but lacks the creativity to come up with solutions in game and in draft. So i really can't see keeping Bulba and a new captain could also be a solution. And RtZ and Sumail have kind of proven they can't win together, and really don't understand why. Other teams have a farming carry and a Flashy mid. I actually double down on this. I feel like they either need a new captain or a new drafter for them (Assuming Bulba's the only one doing the drafting) no one actually knows. But they very much lack creativity, adaptation and innovation within the drafting phase. This TI just proves that you can checkmate your opponents through drafts alone with 17-25 min games, so the drafts are very lacking. An example is EG just refused to or don't know how to, use IO. whereas the teams that did so in Birmingham had a huge advantage, including TI. they didn't opt for alch, when in previous times sumail has been dominant on alch. I know there's a possibility that they had prepared in advanced certain drafts, but the way they went out was extremely disappointing just proving that adaptation and innovation is key. Sumail has been a consistent factor on EG and when the captain deviates from getting sumail snowball heroes that can win early game, and then position into late game carry they suffer immensely. Sumail clearly has the talent to outdo the other mid player majority of the time which nets them an early game lead. I also feel RTZ makes many mistakes that are game losing for EG. I don't know if his decisions are often times team decisions but there are some instances where he just falls back into his old routine of getting caught out alone and its punishing. RTZ's map awareness is a shell of it's former self along with his mechanics. Sad Boys RTZ was this guy who could 1v3 your team through pure mechanical superiority but as time goes on we don't see any of that. | ||
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Gaial
United States313 Posts
I don't think drafting is as major of an issue as I see here. Drafting different heroes for the sake of being different doesn't make sense. | ||
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melkor3
Austria50 Posts
Or that Anti Mage last pick ... So yeah imo they need a drafter who faster adapts to the meta. I also didn’t understand why they avoided RTZ’s Arc Warden who can win the game by itself for them. They mostly picked Life Stealer for him who can’t do too many flashy plays. | ||
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Gaial
United States313 Posts
EG beat Enchantress game 1 against Secret. People say that EG isn't creative, yet last pick a hero that;s only been picked 6 times (incl. group stage) before they picked it with a 50% win rate (AM). It doesn't pan out; how can you predict a 20 minute battflefury in the draft? Many things can only be said because already know the outcome | ||
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Sapaio
Denmark2037 Posts
On August 25 2019 20:41 Gaial wrote: EG banned Alchemist all 3 games against Secret and OG. In game 1, Liquid banned it against EG. EG beat Enchantress game 1 against Secret. People say that EG isn't creative, yet last pick a hero that;s only been picked 6 times (incl. group stage) before they picked it with a 50% win rate (AM). It doesn't pan out; how can you predict a 20 minute battflefury in the draft? Many things can only be said because already know the outcome In what way did they make AM creative, did they invent new item build or new synergy with other heroes. Being creative isn't just pick new hero but having a new plan with it. | ||
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Qualitaetsgarant
124 Posts
Its hard to keep track without the shuffle-thread. | ||
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Coolsnow7
46 Posts
2) that style itself wasn’t just predictable - it was somewhat one-dimensional. The style was: draft good lanes for everyone, and then farm everyone until we have enough of a lead to go high ground with minimal risk. The problem was that if they ever came out behind in the mid-game, their drafts had nothing else to them: no coordinated power spike in the mid game, no ability to mow down towers, no late game comeback condition, no way to sneak Rosh. (I’m generalizing quite a bit here; obviously sometimes they’d pick TA and have a solar crest on S4 and be able to take Rosh relatively fast - but that was largely incidental to the fact that those heroes would, hopefully, win their lanes.) Oftentimes their heroes didn’t have any particularly strong synergies, or if they did, they didn’t play around them. 3) I actually think the biggest issue was S4’s hero pool and play. To make a team like this work, you need a player like Zai who can wind up on any hero and have impact from the role of “third support” to “I’m the carry now” offlaner. S4 had like 2 heroes he could play consistently well at this TI, and when they deviated from their 1-dimensional drafts even while keeping S4 on a comfort hero, he couldn’t deliver. This is all just some extremely general thoughts in the back of my mind after watching them play for the last year and a half, so very open to having my mind changed. But to me the issue wasn’t predictability so much as a singular focus on winning lanes without the flexibility from the offlane to make that work. | ||
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Chewbacca.
United States3634 Posts
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Sabu113
United States11075 Posts
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