• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:53
CEST 07:53
KST 14:53
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall10HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy6
Community News
Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles3[BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China9Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL66Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form?14FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event22
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form? Program: SC2 / XSplit / OBS Scene Switcher
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays Korean Starcraft League Week 77
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL20 Preliminary Maps [ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall SC uni coach streams logging into betting site Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL
Tourneys
[BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China [BSL20] Grand Finals - Sunday 20:00 CET CSL Xiamen International Invitational The Casual Games of the Week Thread
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Summer Games Done Quick 2025! US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative Summer Games Done Quick 2024!
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
Culture Clash in Video Games…
TrAiDoS
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 635 users

[GSL] Kellymilkies to cast Code A - Page 27

Forum Index > Community News and Headlines
1148 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 25 26 27 28 29 58 Next
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
February 18 2011 17:15 GMT
#521
On February 19 2011 02:06 Lepope wrote:
“If you are really effective at what you do, 95% of the things said about you will be negative.”


You have to be able to do it first.
cydereal
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States193 Posts
February 18 2011 17:16 GMT
#522
On February 19 2011 01:56 On_Slaught wrote:
I just had a terrible premonition...

the LR thread for the first night of games she casts is going to be a wasteland. Many-a-fools will be downed by ban hammers.


And they'll mostly deserve it.

Frankly, Kelly's probably one of the few people who has any actual tournament casting experience who could also stand moving to Korea on relatively short notice. She's not the best in the world, but she's probably the best available on short notice.

Give her a chance for this season, even if right now you're massively upset over this. Let's see if she gets better in an environment where she can live and breathe SC2 for a while. If after a full GSL she's still not learning the subtleties of the game, then argue on those grounds for her replacement.
mierin
Profile Joined August 2010
United States4943 Posts
February 18 2011 17:16 GMT
#523
On February 19 2011 02:06 Lepope wrote:
“If you are really effective at what you do, 95% of the things said about you will be negative.”

I strongly confirm it.

And here is another quote I like:

If you want to make a lot of people hate you, all you need to do is
make a lot of money doing something you love. —Hugh MacLeod

you can replace "lof of money" with "being successfull", "do what you love" etc...


...How many people hate Tasteosis again?
JD, Stork, Calm, Hyuk Fighting!
Lepope
Profile Joined December 2010
France17 Posts
February 18 2011 17:27 GMT
#524
do you remember Tastosis saying things about the little nerds back at home getting angry at everything during casts?

and making fun of it? They say it quite a lot I think

anyway those are quotes and not to be taken ONLY for this situation but to be remembered if you try to be successful in life and do things on your own. They might help
Poocs
Profile Joined February 2011
94 Posts
February 18 2011 17:32 GMT
#525
On February 19 2011 02:16 cydereal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2011 01:56 On_Slaught wrote:
I just had a terrible premonition...

the LR thread for the first night of games she casts is going to be a wasteland. Many-a-fools will be downed by ban hammers.


And they'll mostly deserve it.

Frankly, Kelly's probably one of the few people who has any actual tournament casting experience who could also stand moving to Korea on relatively short notice. She's not the best in the world, but she's probably the best available on short notice.

Give her a chance for this season, even if right now you're massively upset over this. Let's see if she gets better in an environment where she can live and breathe SC2 for a while. If after a full GSL she's still not learning the subtleties of the game, then argue on those grounds for her replacement.


If her problem was knowledge, she would be given a chance but it's not.
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
February 18 2011 17:33 GMT
#526
Lepope you will never please everyone. No caster is any position to do that.

There is a reason why you see a select few make it on network/cable TV. However, they all have something in common. Something you seem to keep missing.
andrewwiggin
Profile Joined September 2010
Australia435 Posts
February 18 2011 17:34 GMT
#527
On February 19 2011 02:06 Lepope wrote:
“If you are really effective at what you do, 95% of the things said about you will be negative.”

I strongly confirm it.


lol wut. That first quote doesn't even make sense. If you're effective at what you do, why would that many people complain about it? O_O

Is this some french thing I'm not getting....
HoldenR
Profile Joined February 2011
Netherlands256 Posts
February 18 2011 17:39 GMT
#528
On February 18 2011 23:25 Teddyman wrote:


Have this playing in the background for your next hour of browsing to prepare your ears. She's not that bad as long as she doesn't get over-excited. TotalBiscuit and Eleine can clearly tell what she's saying in the dual casts... you can't explain that!

Wow. This is awful.

I don't even know where to begin. This video, I suppose, is a good start. Besides the ones already posted today and yesterday, this video is absolute proof of why people aren't happy with Kelly. I'm only 10 minutes in and, quite honestly, it's already getting to the point of where you're upset for her for several reasons. Want an example? Skip to 8:30. She talks over her co-caster, for no reason, says something in a cutesy voice about units being... cute or something? I honestly can't understand. Her co-caster has NO idea what she's talking about and what's going on, and just quickly tries to get back on track. I have the feeling that if he did this alone, he would have delivered a much better performance than with her in tow.

There are plenty of reasons to be dissatisfied with her being chosen for this position, and they have nothing do with either sexism or racism or being "haters"(Please stop using this word. Please. You look like a moron, that goes to Kelly and her fans.), it has to do with her poor performance, poor attitude, and awful sounding voice.

Where to start? Oh, how about her poor attitude. Her inability to accept any criticism, showing an almost narcissist state of mind in which "I am the best ever at what I do, and anyone who dislikes my performace is a HATER!!". Is that professional? No, it's immature at best, and arrogant at worst. She could discuss why she disagrees, or why she feels this critique doesn't apply to her. She could post about how she knows there's room to improve, or the best choice, she could have shut up. She SHOULD have shut up. She should never have tweeted that she got to cast Code A a day before it happened(this alone is some of the most unprofessional behavior I've ever seen, and considering Artosis and Tasteless get called "unprofessional" more than a few times on here, this really paints them off as taking their job far more serious than she does), but she appears to care more about her personal success in the scene than anything else. Kelly, I might not like your attitude, but I say this for your best interest, you need to take criticism seriously. Especially if it's coming from such a large audience. This is not just "haters". When 80% of your target group doesn't like you, it's not personal, it's because of your performance. Accept that.

Second, her performance. Talking over co-casters, ignoring things going on in the games she's casting so she can talk about how "cute" something looks(Yes, you're a girl, but that doesn't make you an airhead, and your audience isn't interested in one.), her accent clearly not being understandable to a lot of people, often having entire sentences that a good majority of her viewers can't understand.

Thirdly, yes, we can criticize her. Just because she hasn't casted code-A yet, she has casted a lot of things, and there are very few people who are positive about her previous work. The fact of the matter is, she has performed poorly in the eyes of most people and has given us no reason to believe that that will change if we look at her growth over time. It's near non-existent. And while yes, it's too late to change it now and she is going to be caster, we have been lead to believe by her previous performance that she will not live up to expectations. It is not being mean or sexist to judge someone on their previous performance; it is standard, logical and most of all, it's required to make a judgement on someone.

Finally, and this is not to her, but to those defending her: No, her being a girl is NOT a "pro". It is not something we "need" in e-sports. Her gender is completely irrelevant, and as soon as you bring it up in her defense, you make it look as if though her actual casting qualities really are worse than her male-counterparts, because apparently, if she weren't a girl, she'd be worse than them. Her gender is IRRELEVANT. Get it through your heads, both people who like and dislike her. Whenever you mention it, it has the opposite effect of whatever point you're trying to prove.
Lepope
Profile Joined December 2010
France17 Posts
February 18 2011 17:52 GMT
#529
@StarStruck: and what do I miss? I am curious, you seem to know me very well based on my 9 (now 10) posts. Feel free to educate me please.

@andrewwiggin: lot of things, one of the main: jealousy. Also I am half italian and I have some american family and I have some belgium blood. So feel free to go ahead and not stopping at "that french thing".

What I really like is I did not even say yet if I like her or not. But bring it on, I need some hate too.
psychopat
Profile Joined October 2009
Canada417 Posts
February 18 2011 17:53 GMT
#530
I'm a bit confused... I watched some of the kellymilkies/eleine (?) video on page 24 at first and figured she was the second girl based on how much complaining there is...

Then I watched some of the phoenix + kellymilkies video on the same page and realized that she's the first girl from the first video. I totally don't get what the big deal is about the accent. She's perfectly understandable. There's a few too many "uhh"s and "umm"s but that gets better with experience.

I'm not worried at all and wish her the best.
mustapusta
Profile Joined January 2011
Singapore9 Posts
February 18 2011 17:55 GMT
#531
as far as i remember, most(keyword) of the post in the thread she called the trolling thread was just "kelly bashing" yes there are some good constructive criticisms , but mostly were "kelly sucks" or "no her plz".
and for those that says she has bad game knowledge, i'm not sure how someone with bad game knowledge can win a tournament. http://www.esl.eu/eu/female/sc2/cups/sc2goesfemale4/rankings/

We do know she has some problems with the tempo of speech, and the potential to talk over co-casters, but i'm sure these are things that can be worked on.
And to the people who are saying "I CAN'T UNDERSTAND HER AT ALL", explain to me how not only i can understand her, but the co-casters could reply to her as well.
these are my honest opinions, and yes i'm defending her from the constant bashing.
derp
mikesaysno
Profile Joined July 2010
United States85 Posts
February 18 2011 18:03 GMT
#532
I wish her the best of luck, but one of the things I value most in a caster is actually being able to understand what they are saying. From the things I've heard her cast, she has a very long way to go in this area.

This hire has greatly diminished my excitement for Code A, and that is unfortunate due to the amount of solid players (Liquid fighting!!) participating in it.
HoldenR
Profile Joined February 2011
Netherlands256 Posts
February 18 2011 18:06 GMT
#533
On February 19 2011 02:55 mustapusta wrote:
as far as i remember, most(keyword) of the post in the thread she called the trolling thread was just "kelly bashing" yes there are some good constructive criticisms , but mostly were "kelly sucks" or "no her plz".
and for those that says she has bad game knowledge, i'm not sure how someone with bad game knowledge can win a tournament. http://www.esl.eu/eu/female/sc2/cups/sc2goesfemale4/rankings/

We do know she has some problems with the tempo of speech, and the potential to talk over co-casters, but i'm sure these are things that can be worked on.
And to the people who are saying "I CAN'T UNDERSTAND HER AT ALL", explain to me how not only i can understand her, but the co-casters could reply to her as well.
these are my honest opinions, and yes i'm defending her from the constant bashing.

Please stop bringing up a female-only tournament as if it's an indication of anything. This is not a physical sports, and women are not at a physical disadvantage of height, weight, muscle, build or anything like that.

How many female players do you see in your average SC2 tournament? How many do you see in the top SC2 tournaments? How many of them compete at a top level? The answer, to all of these, is zero or near zero. Is that being sexist? No, it's a fact that fewer women play videogames, and even less(relatively) have an interest in competitive gaming.

However, those that do have an interest in it do not get to be excused from equal footing just because they're women. This tournament says absolutely nothing because, by definition, a female only tournament is basically admitting "Well girls, you could NEVER be as good as us, so go play amongst yourselves!".

Stop treating them like children. In an e-sports environment, they are equal, and we are allowed to demand equal qualities to their male counterparts if we want to call them the same level, be it in gaming performance or in casting qualities.
DominicxD
Profile Joined December 2010
20 Posts
February 18 2011 18:09 GMT
#534
Total Biscuit told her to go for it on Twitter. What the fuck man.

"Oh yeah, haters gonna hate, you go for it girl, despite the fact that there is absolutely no fucking support for you and that all this is going to do is piss off the community. Oh no, nevermind that there might be other casters out there who actually fucking deserve to do the job, just you go for it girl!"

Yeah, way to go TB. Fucking idiot.

User was warned for this post
Gaxton
Profile Joined April 2010
Sweden2328 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-18 18:11:42
February 18 2011 18:11 GMT
#535
On February 19 2011 03:09 DominicxD wrote:
Total Biscuit told her to go for it on Twitter. What the fuck man.

"Oh yeah, haters gonna hate, you go for it girl, despite the fact that there is absolutely no fucking support for you and that all this is going to do is piss off the community. Oh no, nevermind that there might be other casters out there who actually fucking deserve to do the job, just you go for it girl!"

Yeah, way to go TB. Fucking idiot.


Oh my.
TB will never let it go.
Acting like the whole SC2 community is out to get him!
SecondSandwich
Profile Joined July 2008
United States319 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-18 18:14:20
February 18 2011 18:11 GMT
#536
On February 18 2011 14:18 On_Slaught wrote:


Kelly+Tasteless might be better. Tasteless is more experienced with women so it might be more entertaining, maybe.




LoL
"Whatever [flash] says is the best, is the best" -Artosis i!i!i!i!i!Find Match!i!i!i!i!!i
mustapusta
Profile Joined January 2011
Singapore9 Posts
February 18 2011 18:12 GMT
#537
On February 19 2011 03:06 HoldenR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2011 02:55 mustapusta wrote:
as far as i remember, most(keyword) of the post in the thread she called the trolling thread was just "kelly bashing" yes there are some good constructive criticisms , but mostly were "kelly sucks" or "no her plz".
and for those that says she has bad game knowledge, i'm not sure how someone with bad game knowledge can win a tournament. http://www.esl.eu/eu/female/sc2/cups/sc2goesfemale4/rankings/

We do know she has some problems with the tempo of speech, and the potential to talk over co-casters, but i'm sure these are things that can be worked on.
And to the people who are saying "I CAN'T UNDERSTAND HER AT ALL", explain to me how not only i can understand her, but the co-casters could reply to her as well.
these are my honest opinions, and yes i'm defending her from the constant bashing.

Please stop bringing up a female-only tournament as if it's an indication of anything. This is not a physical sports, and women are not at a physical disadvantage of height, weight, muscle, build or anything like that.

How many female players do you see in your average SC2 tournament? How many do you see in the top SC2 tournaments? How many of them compete at a top level? The answer, to all of these, is zero or near zero. Is that being sexist? No, it's a fact that fewer women play videogames, and even less(relatively) have an interest in competitive gaming.

However, those that do have an interest in it do not get to be excused from equal footing just because they're women. This tournament says absolutely nothing because, by definition, a female only tournament is basically admitting "Well girls, you could NEVER be as good as us, so go play amongst yourselves!".

Stop treating them like children. In an e-sports environment, they are equal, and we are allowed to demand equal qualities to their male counterparts if we want to call them the same level, be it in gaming performance or in casting qualities.


so i take it that in your own words, girls are bad at video games and can never be as good as guys? and i'm also taking it that all the girls at participated in that tournament are terrible players, because it's "not a good indication since it's a woman's only tournament"
a tournament is a tournament, regardless of gender. this just proves she's one of the better female players that could participate during that tournament. learn to interpret words before insinuating something.
derp
andrewwiggin
Profile Joined September 2010
Australia435 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-18 18:18:44
February 18 2011 18:13 GMT
#538
On February 19 2011 02:55 mustapusta wrote:
as far as i remember, most(keyword) of the post in the thread she called the trolling thread was just "kelly bashing" yes there are some good constructive criticisms , but mostly were "kelly sucks" or "no her plz".
and for those that says she has bad game knowledge, i'm not sure how someone with bad game knowledge can win a tournament. http://www.esl.eu/eu/female/sc2/cups/sc2goesfemale4/rankings/

We do know she has some problems with the tempo of speech, and the potential to talk over co-casters, but i'm sure these are things that can be worked on.
And to the people who are saying "I CAN'T UNDERSTAND HER AT ALL", explain to me how not only i can understand her, but the co-casters could reply to her as well.
these are my honest opinions, and yes i'm defending her from the constant bashing.


You accept that she needs improvement, yes? I don't think anyone in this entire thread is against her improving! =/

But some people might prefer that she has practice that doesn't take place at the same time as the most prestigious well known SC2 tournament in the world!

You do not consider at least how this may be a little unfair to us spectators, yes? =(
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
February 18 2011 18:13 GMT
#539
Rather not considering, I have made at least 20 posts with regards to this. My position is succinct. If you miss it, then that's your problem not mine.

I've been trying to avoid speaking about game knowledge and how little relevance it has but mustapusta I hope you realize that is a very bad example of showcasing one's knowledge. The tournament in question had 11 participants.

The reason you can understand it is because you share dialects. If you have a ton of experience with it, then you will be fine. As another guy pointed out in the other thread, its somewhere between 20-30% of the Singaporean population that speak English on a regular basis. Statistically, it has to do with the region more than anything else.
andrewwiggin
Profile Joined September 2010
Australia435 Posts
February 18 2011 18:16 GMT
#540
On February 19 2011 03:09 DominicxD wrote:
Total Biscuit told her to go for it on Twitter. What the fuck man.

"Oh yeah, haters gonna hate, you go for it girl, despite the fact that there is absolutely no fucking support for you and that all this is going to do is piss off the community. Oh no, nevermind that there might be other casters out there who actually fucking deserve to do the job, just you go for it girl!"

Yeah, way to go TB. Fucking idiot.


I had to see for myself if he actually wrote this....

Haters gonna hate? wow. Just lost all respect for him.
Prev 1 25 26 27 28 29 58 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 7m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 1093
Leta 797
PianO 391
Snow 145
Dewaltoss 55
yabsab 40
Bale 12
Free 10
Sacsri 8
Movie 3
Dota 2
ODPixel138
League of Legends
JimRising 756
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K1231
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King129
Other Games
summit1g9608
WinterStarcraft427
monkeys_forever322
Tasteless124
SortOf99
NeuroSwarm57
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick38149
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH330
• practicex 47
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• sooper7s
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• ZZZeroYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1231
• Lourlo1195
• masondota2436
• HappyZerGling105
Other Games
• Scarra4302
• Shiphtur352
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4h 7m
WardiTV European League
10h 7m
MaNa vs sebesdes
Mixu vs Fjant
ByuN vs HeRoMaRinE
ShoWTimE vs goblin
Gerald vs Babymarine
Krystianer vs YoungYakov
PiGosaur Monday
18h 7m
The PondCast
1d 4h
WardiTV European League
1d 6h
Jumy vs NightPhoenix
Percival vs Nicoract
ArT vs HiGhDrA
MaxPax vs Harstem
Scarlett vs Shameless
SKillous vs uThermal
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 10h
Replay Cast
1d 18h
RSL Revival
2 days
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs Reynor
Replay Cast
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Classic vs Cure
[ Show More ]
FEL
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
FEL
4 days
FEL
4 days
CSO Cup
4 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
Bonyth vs QiaoGege
Dewalt vs Fengzi
Hawk vs Zhanhun
Sziky vs Mihu
Mihu vs QiaoGege
Zhanhun vs Sziky
Fengzi vs Hawk
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
FEL
5 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
5 days
Bonyth vs Dewalt
QiaoGege vs Dewalt
Hawk vs Bonyth
Sziky vs Fengzi
Mihu vs Zhanhun
QiaoGege vs Zhanhun
Fengzi vs Mihu
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Season 20
HSC XXVII
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025

Upcoming

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSL Xiamen Invitational
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.