EPTI won't get surprised if we have ZvZ in the final of ASL 14 like season 10.
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/Pmx3q94.png)
T E S A G I is real if StarCraft has no TvZ.
Who is the best Bonjwa?
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bovienchien
Vietnam1152 Posts
I won't get surprised if we have ZvZ in the final of ASL 14 like season 10. T E S A G I is real if StarCraft has no TvZ. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24255 Posts
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reborn8u2
16 Posts
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/34etVK3.jpg) Anyone but savior. | ||
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WGT-Baal
France3341 Posts
For the game itself, he was indeed (really) good, but I wouldnt put him above Flash and even JD/Bisu (MSL finals anyone?). I d consider jangbi/fantasy in the waning days of the kespa days to be also superior. 2009 Nada was far from his prime, you could argue the same for 2007 Boxer. Also it s a tiny amount of games. I would name Savior the worst bonjwa and worst thing that ever happened to pro-BW, and I say that as a big CJ fan, and I met savior in the 2008 WWI he was actually really nice in person, but that doesnt excuse anything he did. edit: spoiler: + Show Spoiler + What is sad is yet another competition with no option of a P win... | ||
BisuDagger
Bisutopia19195 Posts
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Mutaller
United States1049 Posts
I believe flash is. Savior dominated with his 3 hatch muta vs terran vs the aging terrans that were used to low econ imbalanced maps. I am not even sure savior changed the game, JulyZerg has a bigger legacy than him in that aspect. He also fell off once the 2008 era hit, with an exception of blizzcon, but he was literally a b-teamer. Meanwhile flash dominated in multiple eras of brood war including its peak competition. He managed to popularize the +1 5 rax that made Savior's 3hm muta build less dominate. As for the other terrans I would argue the same point I made before. They excelled on the low econ imbalanced maps of the era. By time FS, CB, Match Point and the new era of maps emerged these guys were on their way out. They couldn't keep up and their fancy styles didn't translate. If any of them actually played in the modern era and had success it would be a different story. | ||
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Optimate
244 Posts
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TMNT
2468 Posts
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outscar
2832 Posts
/close thread | ||
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Marl
United States692 Posts
On September 23 2022 00:59 WGT-Baal wrote: Savior almost single-handedly killed the scene and the team system, did untold financial and reputational damage (not to mention drag very young players into the mess) to the whole game and ended up fully banned, he is not worthy of that list. For the game itself, he was indeed (really) good, but I wouldnt put him above Flash and even JD/Bisu (MSL finals anyone?). I d consider jangbi/fantasy in the waning days of the kespa days to be also superior. 2009 Nada was far from his prime, you could argue the same for 2007 Boxer. Also it s a tiny amount of games. I would name Savior the worst bonjwa and worst thing that ever happened to pro-BW, and I say that as a big CJ fan, and I met savior in the 2008 WWI he was actually really nice in person, but that doesnt excuse anything he did. edit: spoiler: + Show Spoiler + What is sad is yet another competition with no option of a P win... It's such bullshit savior gets all the heat for matchmaking. Player conditions were complete garbage in 2008 compared to today so it's completely understandable to me why someone would get tempted to do it. Hey though it's very convenient for the system to transfer all its sins onto one individual. I still respect savior for what he did prior and would be excited if he was in ASL. | ||
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BonitiilloO
Dominican Republic611 Posts
On September 23 2022 01:16 BisuDagger wrote: Flash has dominated every era he has played in. I think it's more interesting to discuss who the best non-bonjwa players were (Fantasy, Stork, Reach, Yellow). Where do all these players rank? Who's the GOAT silver surfer? why Fantasy is not playing broodwar? | ||
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Mutaller
United States1049 Posts
On September 23 2022 03:32 BonitiilloO wrote: why Fantasy is not playing broodwar? I am thinking the same thing. He was on another level 2010 and after | ||
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WGT-Baal
France3341 Posts
On September 23 2022 02:53 Marl wrote: It's such bullshit savior gets all the heat for matchmaking. Player conditions were complete garbage in 2008 compared to today so it's completely understandable to me why someone would get tempted to do it. Hey though it's very convenient for the system to transfer all its sins onto one individual. I still respect savior for what he did prior and would be excited if he was in ASL. The system was and still is appalling. It is rotten in many ways for kids/young people in Korea in various fields including Kpop, actor agencies, go (baduk) and gaming. It s better for BW gamers now because they are not part of actual teams, LoL players still have the shitty system, barely upgraded from then. But savior didnt just take money to lose/fix games, he was the ring leader and actively participated in that while being very famous with good contracts and freedom, I am more lenient towards some of the other people caught (this is also reflected by the court decisions at the time). Two wrongs do not make a right. The fact the system sorta endured is a disgrace, but it does not make savior any less guilty. Also the culture is very different from the US. Savior playing in ASL would be a death blow. For Fantasy: he stated he preferred SC2, though i cant find a source for it. | ||
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Djabanete
United States2786 Posts
He practically won an ASL. Or Best. Practically won an OSL. Dunno about all these other guys. | ||
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outscar
2832 Posts
On September 23 2022 03:32 BonitiilloO wrote: why Fantasy is not playing broodwar? He said that he likes/prefers SC2 more to BW. Still a big shame he didn't even try to qualify. | ||
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LUCKY_NOOB
Bulgaria1389 Posts
^_._^ The fact that Tesagis are able to win WITHOUT Flash is a testament to the strength of the race. So far It's been TvT, PvP and ZvZ one for each... If a mirror happens it would be absolutely natural. Ofc that is not even a good metric... Dammit I've been pulled back in again... | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
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