EPTthats pretty pathetic and childish from beyonder.
i agree with drone 100% 2
Chibi Explanation - Page 10
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mAKiTO
Colombia4171 Posts
thats pretty pathetic and childish from beyonder. i agree with drone 100% 2 | ||
KwarK
United States42963 Posts
On March 21 2007 08:58 Liquid`Drone wrote: haha kwark and honestly, chibi could have gotten permanently banned a long time ago and there would have been almost no objections. he has made a lot of drunken shit posts. but this time around, he was banned because beyonder took offense to a post that should not have been offensive, wrote a shitty flame post in retort (which then proceeded to escalate the discussion), and then banned chibi for posting about pedophelia and said he was going to leave the forums if chibi was unbanned. then, after all this, and hundred posts of discussion between the moderators, I guess the eventual result was that the other moderators did not want to go against beyonders ultimatum (although they also criticised it) and thus found a reason to ban chibi ; he had posted tons of shit topics in the past. (and this is a fact. ) but first temp banning someone, then warning that person never to do this again, and then banning the poster without him doing what he was warned about, (in fact the post that made chibi get banned was one of the better posts in the thread, beyonder was the one who "turned the topic gay" through his "witty and clever" flame) constitutes what I regard as shitty as fuck moderation. If this is true then Beyonder is shit admin. And before I get flamed over this then I'd like to make some valid points. Admittedly that didn't work for Chibi but whatever, I've never been warned so far. - A forum is not a popularity contest. That means that when Beyonder says "If you don't ban Chibi I'm leaving" you should not give in. Bans are for people who deserve them. And while Beyonder obviously felt Chibi deserved one Beyonder does not speak for tl.net. That he issued that ultimatum makes me lose all remaining respect for him. Way to act like a kid. "I don't like Chibi, I contribute to this website, I'll refuse to contribute if you don't get rid of Chibi." Does anyone think that is a decent way to act? Anyone at all? I'd have taken Beyonder up on it. Regardless of my views on Chibi simply because nothing gives him the right to act like that. He doesn't deserve admin powers. We know there is dispute among the mods. The majority of tl.netters seem to want him back, but Beyonders e-terrorism (ban him or I make this website a worse place) seems to have prevailed. I'd like this to go to vote. On the poll on the right hand side. He's a very old tl.netter, I think it'd be a justified use of it. | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28686 Posts
obviously this makes chibi getting banned permanently far more likely. | ||
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fig_newbie
749 Posts
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SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
Agreed? What you mean is it agrees with your own personal preference and not a logical view. And you know that in typing it. This post is bullshit, as are a large portion of every other baal post ever made. He knows it as he's typing them. The few people that mattered? Tell us, what makes Chibi matter? Being different? People being personally close to him? People who matter are people who contribute in a positive way. Pestering a forum and derailing threads multiple times is hardly contributing. His sense of humour was piss poor too. People who matter are people that make great contributions to the site. Not pester people repeatedly and annoy / anger them on a regular basis. Chibi was able to make well written and informed / valid discussion about his views. Despite previous bans he chose not to on multiple occasions. With such a subject it is best to use tact. Point is he broke his own rules that he agreed to. Admins felt they had to set these rules on him due to angering a lot of people / derailing a lot of threads / making a lot of inflammatory remarks / dropping a few that were perma-ban worthy but they were lenient. Remember you'd open a thread and like 4 pages in you'd be like, "wtf it turned into another pedo thread?" They did the correct thing under those circumstances because Chibi as you have seen over the years cannot stop talking about it. Even when asked. He feels it is necessary to bring up these points and challenge our society and try to convince others of his view. Until that is done he won't simply be quiet. The way he has done it in the past, multiple times, has been just wrong. He's said a lot of things that are just wrong. He doesn't get it. If he could make well informed posts always on the subject that requires so very much tact then he could exist fairly peacefully here even despite his views coinciding with others. It's done baal. Stop trying to reverse the ban, it won't happen. But if you're going to question it, question it by point and debase it. Saying, "why don't we clean up the other people" is one of the worst arguments i've ever heard. They are not near as persistent in their attempt to be annoying. Those that were for a short period of time - Strafe - for instance have been banned multiple times. And even he was able to keep many of his idiotic thoughts to himself. Sorry baal, this site isn't one big MSN chat window anymore where you can say whatever the fuck you please. It's a very active and awesome forum. You can say almost whatever the fuck you please, be thankful with it and stop bitching. You can pretty much ban Chibi for his most recent remarks anyway. | ||
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mAKiTO
Colombia4171 Posts
Thats pretty sad of beyonder acting that way Testei, you are such a hypocrite | ||
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28686 Posts
the fuck do you know we had a huge discussion about this in the men in red forum I've talked to chibi about how the process went I assume chibi talked to baal baal is correct, chibi was not banned for causing trouble, he was banned due to one moderator having a huge personal bias against him. beyonder instigated chibi far more than the other way around, beyonder actively went out of his way to taunt chibi, while chibi merely posted about stuff that interests him with no intention of offending anyone. in fact his post in the thread that got him banned was an eloquent post which was backed up by facts which supported a view he had about homosexuality. beyonder, despite this, flames the post, in addition incontrol asks chibi what the deal about him and pedophelia is, then chibi posts more about pedophelia (BY REQUEST), and beyonder bans him for it. the justification for the ban came after the ban, not before the ban. obviously a crappy ass way to moderate. | ||
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KwarK
United States42963 Posts
On March 21 2007 09:16 MYM.Testie wrote: Agreed? What you mean is it agrees with your own personal preference and not a logical view. I'm glad we have Testie here to be objective for us. Because with all these people voicing their own personal views it's good to have Testie who can see to the heart of any matter and can find the single objective truth. I now see my opinion was misguided, and crumbles in the face of Testie's unopinionated absolutely correct objectivity. In other news, Testie, you're an asstard. | ||
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mAKiTO
Colombia4171 Posts
http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=50531 | ||
Smurg
Australia3818 Posts
Kinda like 2pac being shot when he was so young. Eri, what do you mean by this?: "the justification for the ban came after the ban, not before the ban. obviously a crappy ass way to moderate." What happened after he was banned? Just 'general trouble making'? | ||
Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
He got a last chance from the staff and blew it. It's as simple as that. If this is a place where we harbour and condone this, where folks can post sexually tinted pictures of waaaaay underage girls in skimmy outfits hinting at what-not, then indeed I do not want to moderate such a place. I tend to take a responsibility serious and the bucket overflowed; he continued to adress a topic which he vouched not to adress. It was't as direct after the warning, but he provokingly continued what he was doing before it. You can agree or not agree on the decision he agreed upon - not posting about pedo - but he agreed upon it and didnt followup. Call me childish, but it is the way it works for me. I will not hold ANY KIND of responsibily on a delicate subject such as this. He posts this shit on the General Forum, and I feel - am - responsible for it. It is no joking matter and it should never be. If it becomes this, if he continues, if nothing is done, then yes I will take a stand and pack my bags if the majority of the staff sees different on this situation. That aint no biggy. Ethics is an important aspect of life. Some people posting here have no clue at all, (who the fuck is Kwark?). They only see that topic. I agree that on that topic alone he shouldnt be banned, but there is a lot of history to this subject that few know about. I like how Drone is trying to pull the 'OMG PERSONAL GRUDGE CARD'. My ass, Drone, my ass. Are you this blind, or am I this stupid? (Posted on my moms laptop, I cant see shit on this thing, but felt I had to respond nonetheless) | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
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SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
"this forum suddenly took an awful shift to thousands of nobodies while the few people that mattered have left..." | ||
ManaBlue
Canada10458 Posts
In general, Saro's post shows that Chibi should have been banned long ago due to the things he's posted on the forum. That, more than the act that actually resulted in the ban, should be what you're using to measure the legitimacy of the ban. | ||
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KwarK
United States42963 Posts
On March 21 2007 09:27 Beyonder wrote: Some people posting here have no clue at all, (who the fuck is Kwark?). They only see that topic. I agree that on that topic alone he shouldnt be banned, but there is a lot of history to this subject that few know about. Erm... - Before topic he wasn't banned. - After topic he was. - You believe that what he said in that topic wasn't banworthy. - You ban him. That makes very little sense to me. And I'm some guy who posts on this website. Who the fuck are you? | ||
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Smurg
Australia3818 Posts
But I don't get phased or annoyed by things. (Edit: That is 'content' of posts.) Spamming the same image over and over again, spamming tons of threads and flaming uncessarily. are the only annoyances I have. 'Physical' things like that annoy me. Not much else. | ||
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28686 Posts
On March 21 2007 09:27 Smurg wrote: Chibi being gone is sad. Kinda like 2pac being shot when he was so young. Eri, what do you mean by this?: "the justification for the ban came after the ban, not before the ban. obviously a crappy ass way to moderate." What happened after he was banned? Just 'general trouble making'? what happened was that first chibi was banned with very little reason, and beyonder saying he would leave the site if he was unbanned. then we had a big discussion about it, and the moderators mostly agreed (with a couple fence sitters and me and travis being opposed) that he should not be unbanned. then, saro started digging and found out that chibi had been banned 8 times in the past, but this happened while we were deciding how to explain the ban to the public ; not before he was banned. not to mention that temp bans are only supposed to lead to a permanent ban if they are followed by further fuckups, in this case we had a temp ban leading to a permanent ban due to one moderators strong feelings, and many moderators unwillingness to go against that moderator. chibi did not break any rules or posting guidelines after returning from his previous temp ban. (that temp ban could easily have been a permanent one though, and even I would not be objecting much then. ) however when we first temp ban someone, and that someone then cleans up his act, I don't understand how my fellow moderators can argue that permanently banning him afterwards is correct. | ||
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fig_newbie
749 Posts
On March 21 2007 09:16 MYM.Testie wrote: They did the correct thing under those circumstances because Chibi as you have seen over the years cannot stop talking about it. Even when asked. He feels it is necessary to bring up these points and challenge our society and try to convince others of his view. Until that is done he won't simply be quiet. Whats wrong with this? Many people active on tl.net are equally one-dimensional. It only becomes wrong when a moderator asks him to stop, but then that would lead to questioning behind the said moderator's intentions. Granted TL.mods have absolute power over the going-ons of this site, but as someone said earlier, this might be constricting not necessarily free speech (since there relaly isnt here) but the dynamics of the site. If he could make well informed posts always on the subject that requires so very much tact then he could exist fairly peacefully here even despite his views coinciding with others. from my viewing experiences, chibi IS articulate enough, even in the face of flames. The last thread w/ beyonder, for example. He's said a lot of things that are just wrong. He doesn't get it. Opinion? People ragging on Chibi really should take a look at themselves in the mirror first. | ||
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Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
On March 21 2007 09:34 Kwark wrote: Erm. Before topic he wasn't banned. After topic he was. You believe that what he said in that topic wasn't banworthy. You ban him. And I'm some guy who posts on this website. Who the fuck are you? The single act, no. The whole picture, yes for sure. Can't you read? Continuing to adress a topic he vouched not to adress. Continueing to hint and it on every possibility. He broke the rules set out for him after 7 bans. Not to forget that he should have been banned a LONG TIME AGO, but that doesnt count as much. | ||
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Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
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