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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 6743

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
February 02 2017 11:40 GMT
#134841
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
mikedebo
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada4341 Posts
February 02 2017 11:43 GMT
#134842
On February 02 2017 19:48 Acrofales wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 19:39 Furikawari wrote:
Dis gonna be good.

Was it satirical? It sounds like it was; presumably with the implication that his left-wing professors were Stalinists or so? If so, who cares? Young kids does something silly with 0 real consequences. More news at 11.

In fact, the more I read about this guy, the more I like him. I disagree with him ideologically, but he sounds like an honest and intelligent man who is willing to fight for his principles. I'm increasingly surprised Trump nominated him.


It's annoying (and damaging, I think) to treat every piece of news like this with the same magnitude of noise and outrage. I doubt there's any solution to this, but I wish people would temper the frequency and strength of their messaging in proportion to the severity of the thing being spoken about. Something that someone did as a man-child is not deserving of the same sort of hue and cry as discoveries of more recent information, or actions with immediate consequences.
I NEED A PHOTOSYNTHESIS! ||| 'airtoss' is an anagram of 'artosis' ||| SANGHOOOOOO ||| "No Korea? No problem. I have internet." -- Stardust
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18821 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-02-02 11:50:56
February 02 2017 11:50 GMT
#134843
I'm wondering: does Trump or anyone who can persuade him know that judicial conservatives do their best to limit governmental liability for private acts? Further, do any of them know what Chevron deference actually does and what Gorsuch's opinion on its obsolescence means relative to the power of the courts? These are the real questions
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United Kingdom13775 Posts
February 02 2017 11:57 GMT
#134844
On February 02 2017 20:43 mikedebo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 19:48 Acrofales wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:39 Furikawari wrote:
Dis gonna be good.

Was it satirical? It sounds like it was; presumably with the implication that his left-wing professors were Stalinists or so? If so, who cares? Young kids does something silly with 0 real consequences. More news at 11.

In fact, the more I read about this guy, the more I like him. I disagree with him ideologically, but he sounds like an honest and intelligent man who is willing to fight for his principles. I'm increasingly surprised Trump nominated him.


It's annoying (and damaging, I think) to treat every piece of news like this with the same magnitude of noise and outrage. I doubt there's any solution to this, but I wish people would temper the frequency and strength of their messaging in proportion to the severity of the thing being spoken about. Something that someone did as a man-child is not deserving of the same sort of hue and cry as discoveries of more recent information, or actions with immediate consequences.

This message is far too late right now. In a way it's what xDaunt was talking about: the media cried wolf for far too long and now they lost credibility and won't be taken seriously when something is actually genuinely that bad.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
February 02 2017 12:01 GMT
#134845
lol

U.S. President Donald Trump labeled a refugee swap deal with Australia "dumb" on Thursday after a Washington Post report of an acrimonious telephone call with Australia's prime minister threatened a rare rift in ties between the two staunch allies.

The Post reported that Trump described the resettlement plan as "the worst deal ever" and accused Australia of trying to export the "next Boston bombers". It said the call had been scheduled to last an hour but Trump cut it short after 25 minutes when Australian Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull tried to turn to subjects such as Syria.

Turnbull told reporters the call with Trump at the weekend had been frank and candid but refused to give further details.

"I do stand up for Australia. My job is to defend Australian interests," Turnbull said in Melbourne.

Turnbull refused to confirm the Post report that Trump, who had earlier spoken to world leaders including Russian President Vladimir Putin and Mexican President Enrique Pena Nieto, had angrily told him that the call was "the worst so far".

[...]


source: www.reuters.com

not really a big thing either but fairly comical for me. I didn't expect anything else from the man
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
Biff The Understudy
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France7878 Posts
February 02 2017 12:15 GMT
#134846
On February 02 2017 19:37 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 19:25 Amui wrote:
On February 02 2017 18:38 LegalLord wrote:
On February 02 2017 16:14 Blisse wrote:
In the meantime I can't wait to see whether this turns out to be fake or not.


 Leaked Draft of Trump’s Religious Freedom Order Reveals Sweeping Plans to Legalize Discrimination

 A leaked copy of a draft executive order titled “Establishing a Government-Wide Initiative to Respect Religious Freedom,” obtained by The Investigative Fund and The Nation, reveals sweeping plans by the Trump administration to legalize discrimination.

This article was reported in partnership with the Investigative Fund at the Nation Institute.

The four-page draft order, a copy of which is currently circulating among federal staff and advocacy organizations, construes religious organizations so broadly that it covers “any organization, including closely held for-profit corporations,” and protects “religious freedom” in every walk of life: “when providing social services, education, or healthcare; earning a living, seeking a job, or employing others; receiving government grants or contracts; or otherwise participating in the marketplace, the public square, or interfacing with Federal, State or local governments.”

The draft order seeks to create wholesale exemptions for people and organizations who claim religious or moral objections to same-sex marriage, premarital sex, abortion, and trans identity, and it seeks to curtail women’s access to contraception and abortion through the Affordable Care Act. The White House did not respond to requests for comment, but when asked Monday about whether a religious freedom executive order was in the works, White House spokesman Sean Spicer told reporters, “I’m not getting ahead of the executive orders that we may or may not issue. There is a lot of executive orders, a lot of things that the president has talked about and will continue to fulfill, but we have nothing on that front now.”

 Language in the draft document specifically protects the tax-exempt status of any organization that “believes, speaks, or acts (or declines to act) in accordance with the belief that marriage is or should be recognized as the union of one man and one woman, sexual relations are properly reserved for such a marriage, male and female and their equivalents refer to an individual’s immutable biological sex as objectively determined by anatomy, physiology, or genetics at or before birth, and that human life begins at conception and merits protection at all stages of life.”

...

 In particular, said Lupu, the draft order “privileges” a certain set of beliefs about sexual orientation and gender identity—beliefs identified most closely with conservative Catholics and evangelical Christians—over others. That, he said, goes beyond “what RFRA might authorize” and may violate the Establishment Clause.

Lupu added that the language of the draft “might invite federal employees,” for example, at the Social Security Administration or Veterans Administration, “to refuse on religious grounds to process applications or respond to questions from those whose benefits depend on same sex marriages.” If other employees do not “fill the gap,” he said, it could “lead to a situation where marriage equality was being de facto undermined by federal employees, especially in religiously conservative communities,” contrary to Supreme Court rulings.


www.thenation.com/article/leaked-draft-of-trumps-religious-freedom-order-reveals-sweeping-plans-to-legalize-discrimination/

I wonder if the entirety of the next four years are going to be conducted through speculation and "leaks" that may or may not be genuine.

Sounds like fun, and chaos.

Well, the way it's going currently, there's going to be a lot of unhappy people willing anonymously leak stuff before it comes out, and I would hope that doesn't change.

Then again, I wouldn't be too surprised if Trump creates an echo chamber in a few months once he's cleaned the dissidents out. That'd be super dangerous to have though.

If I were a party interested in spreading chaos I would take to the Twitterverse and make thousands of "rogue" accounts and peddle conspiracy theories disguised as leaks. I couldn't possibly be the only one to have this idea.

You haven't been following.

That's called the alt right and that's basically how your current president has been elected.
The fellow who is out to burn things up is the counterpart of the fool who thinks he can save the world. The world needs neither to be burned up nor to be saved. The world is, we are. Transients, if we buck it; here to stay if we accept it. ~H.Miller
mikedebo
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada4341 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-02-02 12:18:01
February 02 2017 12:17 GMT
#134847
On February 02 2017 20:57 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 20:43 mikedebo wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:48 Acrofales wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:39 Furikawari wrote:
Dis gonna be good.

Was it satirical? It sounds like it was; presumably with the implication that his left-wing professors were Stalinists or so? If so, who cares? Young kids does something silly with 0 real consequences. More news at 11.

In fact, the more I read about this guy, the more I like him. I disagree with him ideologically, but he sounds like an honest and intelligent man who is willing to fight for his principles. I'm increasingly surprised Trump nominated him.


It's annoying (and damaging, I think) to treat every piece of news like this with the same magnitude of noise and outrage. I doubt there's any solution to this, but I wish people would temper the frequency and strength of their messaging in proportion to the severity of the thing being spoken about. Something that someone did as a man-child is not deserving of the same sort of hue and cry as discoveries of more recent information, or actions with immediate consequences.

This message is far too late right now. In a way it's what xDaunt was talking about: the media cried wolf for far too long and now they lost credibility and won't be taken seriously when something is actually genuinely that bad.


It's not the media I'm talking about. So many of us are constantly retweeting and posting on social media about this stuff about how 'outraged' we are, and just shouting into the ether. If this stuff bothers us, we could be doing something of substance instead -- there are so many actions that are more productive than just yelling into a textbox!
I NEED A PHOTOSYNTHESIS! ||| 'airtoss' is an anagram of 'artosis' ||| SANGHOOOOOO ||| "No Korea? No problem. I have internet." -- Stardust
mikedebo
Profile Joined December 2010
Canada4341 Posts
February 02 2017 12:27 GMT
#134848
Apologies if this was posted already -- I tried to find it in this thread, and didn't.

This article talks about how social media "big data" (lol) companies can be used to increase campaigning efficiency. The tone of the writing is doomsday for no reason (obviously this model could be replicated by pretty much any interested party if the research is in the public domain, and probably relatively simply even if it was kept "secret") but it's neat to think about how this kind of technology will contribute to campaigning in the future.
I NEED A PHOTOSYNTHESIS! ||| 'airtoss' is an anagram of 'artosis' ||| SANGHOOOOOO ||| "No Korea? No problem. I have internet." -- Stardust
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United Kingdom13775 Posts
February 02 2017 12:39 GMT
#134849
On February 02 2017 21:17 mikedebo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 20:57 LegalLord wrote:
On February 02 2017 20:43 mikedebo wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:48 Acrofales wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:39 Furikawari wrote:
Dis gonna be good.

Was it satirical? It sounds like it was; presumably with the implication that his left-wing professors were Stalinists or so? If so, who cares? Young kids does something silly with 0 real consequences. More news at 11.

In fact, the more I read about this guy, the more I like him. I disagree with him ideologically, but he sounds like an honest and intelligent man who is willing to fight for his principles. I'm increasingly surprised Trump nominated him.


It's annoying (and damaging, I think) to treat every piece of news like this with the same magnitude of noise and outrage. I doubt there's any solution to this, but I wish people would temper the frequency and strength of their messaging in proportion to the severity of the thing being spoken about. Something that someone did as a man-child is not deserving of the same sort of hue and cry as discoveries of more recent information, or actions with immediate consequences.

This message is far too late right now. In a way it's what xDaunt was talking about: the media cried wolf for far too long and now they lost credibility and won't be taken seriously when something is actually genuinely that bad.


It's not the media I'm talking about. So many of us are constantly retweeting and posting on social media about this stuff about how 'outraged' we are, and just shouting into the ether. If this stuff bothers us, we could be doing something of substance instead -- there are so many actions that are more productive than just yelling into a textbox!

A lot of people here, among other places, are often just echoing media sentiment. Hell, some talk about "opinion makers" who invent their opinion for them to spread to the far corners of the omniverse.

The opposition is quite fractured in that it has no semblance of unity. They don't want Trump but it's hard to get at what they do want.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Biff The Understudy
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France7878 Posts
February 02 2017 12:47 GMT
#134850
On February 02 2017 21:39 LegalLord wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 21:17 mikedebo wrote:
On February 02 2017 20:57 LegalLord wrote:
On February 02 2017 20:43 mikedebo wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:48 Acrofales wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:39 Furikawari wrote:
Dis gonna be good.

Was it satirical? It sounds like it was; presumably with the implication that his left-wing professors were Stalinists or so? If so, who cares? Young kids does something silly with 0 real consequences. More news at 11.

In fact, the more I read about this guy, the more I like him. I disagree with him ideologically, but he sounds like an honest and intelligent man who is willing to fight for his principles. I'm increasingly surprised Trump nominated him.


It's annoying (and damaging, I think) to treat every piece of news like this with the same magnitude of noise and outrage. I doubt there's any solution to this, but I wish people would temper the frequency and strength of their messaging in proportion to the severity of the thing being spoken about. Something that someone did as a man-child is not deserving of the same sort of hue and cry as discoveries of more recent information, or actions with immediate consequences.

This message is far too late right now. In a way it's what xDaunt was talking about: the media cried wolf for far too long and now they lost credibility and won't be taken seriously when something is actually genuinely that bad.


It's not the media I'm talking about. So many of us are constantly retweeting and posting on social media about this stuff about how 'outraged' we are, and just shouting into the ether. If this stuff bothers us, we could be doing something of substance instead -- there are so many actions that are more productive than just yelling into a textbox!

A lot of people here, among other places, are often just echoing media sentiment. Hell, some talk about "opinion makers" who invent their opinion for them to spread to the far corners of the omniverse.

The opposition is quite fractured in that it has no semblance of unity. They don't want Trump but it's hard to get at what they do want.

Decency and people with some sense of compassion in power are a good place to start. Being united against something as opposed to for something is half of what politics is about. It's not enough in itself, but it's half.

Transpose into more extreme circumstances and you see your criticism makes no sense. You can't say that the opposition in Poland in the 80's was vain because it was a huge coalition with very different views whose only common point and only common agenda was to oppose the communist system. And that's just one example.
The fellow who is out to burn things up is the counterpart of the fool who thinks he can save the world. The world needs neither to be burned up nor to be saved. The world is, we are. Transients, if we buck it; here to stay if we accept it. ~H.Miller
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United Kingdom13775 Posts
February 02 2017 13:14 GMT
#134851
On February 02 2017 21:47 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 21:39 LegalLord wrote:
On February 02 2017 21:17 mikedebo wrote:
On February 02 2017 20:57 LegalLord wrote:
On February 02 2017 20:43 mikedebo wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:48 Acrofales wrote:
On February 02 2017 19:39 Furikawari wrote:
Dis gonna be good.

Was it satirical? It sounds like it was; presumably with the implication that his left-wing professors were Stalinists or so? If so, who cares? Young kids does something silly with 0 real consequences. More news at 11.

In fact, the more I read about this guy, the more I like him. I disagree with him ideologically, but he sounds like an honest and intelligent man who is willing to fight for his principles. I'm increasingly surprised Trump nominated him.


It's annoying (and damaging, I think) to treat every piece of news like this with the same magnitude of noise and outrage. I doubt there's any solution to this, but I wish people would temper the frequency and strength of their messaging in proportion to the severity of the thing being spoken about. Something that someone did as a man-child is not deserving of the same sort of hue and cry as discoveries of more recent information, or actions with immediate consequences.

This message is far too late right now. In a way it's what xDaunt was talking about: the media cried wolf for far too long and now they lost credibility and won't be taken seriously when something is actually genuinely that bad.


It's not the media I'm talking about. So many of us are constantly retweeting and posting on social media about this stuff about how 'outraged' we are, and just shouting into the ether. If this stuff bothers us, we could be doing something of substance instead -- there are so many actions that are more productive than just yelling into a textbox!

A lot of people here, among other places, are often just echoing media sentiment. Hell, some talk about "opinion makers" who invent their opinion for them to spread to the far corners of the omniverse.

The opposition is quite fractured in that it has no semblance of unity. They don't want Trump but it's hard to get at what they do want.

Decency and people with some sense of compassion in power are a good place to start. Being united against something as opposed to for something is half of what politics is about. It's not enough in itself, but it's half.

Transpose into more extreme circumstances and you see your criticism makes no sense. You can't say that the opposition in Poland in the 80's was vain because it was a huge coalition with very different views whose only common point and only common agenda was to oppose the communist system. And that's just one example.

I could give you a dozen examples off the top of my head where an opposition failed because it had no plan for the future and enough internal strife that it wasn't going to work out. Hell, there are even a few such examples for Poland if that is your country of choice. But I suppose the most obvious one would be Syria, where Assad would not have been able to regain the upper hand if not for the fact that the dozens of splintered rebel factions hate each other just as much as they hated Assad.

And that is basically what the Trump opposition looks like right now.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-02-02 14:13:20
February 02 2017 14:12 GMT
#134852
On February 02 2017 20:40 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/827112633224544256

Bannon and Milo with the presidential bullhorn behind them. It will be a fun year!
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
SpiritoftheTunA
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States20903 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-02-02 14:24:45
February 02 2017 14:19 GMT
#134853
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4182852/Trump-s-SCOTUS-pick-founded-club-called-Fascism-Forever.html

what a boss tbh

meanwhie trumps been going hard on twitter

[image loading]
posting on liquid sites in current year
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
February 02 2017 14:23 GMT
#134854
All nations leaders threaten invasion to lighten the mood...

"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
biology]major
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2253 Posts
February 02 2017 14:30 GMT
#134855
On February 02 2017 23:23 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
All nations leaders threaten invasion to lighten the mood...

https://twitter.com/AP/status/827150802766675968


It's been 2 years of trump saying bombastic things to test the waters and re negotiating from there. Why is every little out of the norm behavior still a surprise?
Question.?
LightSpectra
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States1238 Posts
February 02 2017 14:31 GMT
#134856
On February 02 2017 23:19 SpiritoftheTunA wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4182852/Trump-s-SCOTUS-pick-founded-club-called-Fascism-Forever.html

what a boss tbh


Shocking if true, but isn't the Daily Mail some sensationalist tabloid?
2006 Shinhan Bank OSL Season 3 was the greatest tournament of all time
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
Netherlands30548 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-02-02 14:48:02
February 02 2017 14:34 GMT
#134857
On February 02 2017 23:30 biology]major wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 23:23 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
All nations leaders threaten invasion to lighten the mood...

https://twitter.com/AP/status/827150802766675968


It's been 2 years of trump saying bombastic things to test the waters and re negotiating from there. Why is every little out of the norm behavior still a surprise?

Because threatening military action is not a game

You can't be serious that stuff like this is a good negotiation tactic in any way. He literally screwed the relationship with Mexico in two weeks and for what exactly?
Neosteel Enthusiast
SpiritoftheTunA
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States20903 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-02-02 14:36:07
February 02 2017 14:35 GMT
#134858
On February 02 2017 23:31 LightSpectra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 23:19 SpiritoftheTunA wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4182852/Trump-s-SCOTUS-pick-founded-club-called-Fascism-Forever.html

what a boss tbh


Shocking if true, but isn't the Daily Mail some sensationalist tabloid?

i disagree with both your logic (of applying what is essentially ad hominem to sources w.r.t individual articles) and with your statement of "shocking if true"

i literally had a roommate in college who was a good guy who wouldn't have surprised me if he told me he made a tongue-in-cheek "fascism forever" club in his old-boys prep school
posting on liquid sites in current year
LightSpectra
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States1238 Posts
February 02 2017 14:36 GMT
#134859
On February 02 2017 23:35 SpiritoftheTunA wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 02 2017 23:31 LightSpectra wrote:
On February 02 2017 23:19 SpiritoftheTunA wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4182852/Trump-s-SCOTUS-pick-founded-club-called-Fascism-Forever.html

what a boss tbh


Shocking if true, but isn't the Daily Mail some sensationalist tabloid?

i disagree with both your logic (of applying what is essentially ad hominem to sources w.r.t individual articles) and with your statement of "shocking if true"

i literally had a roommate in college who was a good guy who wouldn't have surprised me if he told me he made a tongue-in-cheek "fascism forever" in his old-boys prep school


I mean it would be shocking if a guy that was a widely-respected federal judge turned out to be a fascist.

Unless I'm confusing the Daily Mail with something else though, I think I'm gonna go ahead and be skeptical of it until a more respectable source confirms it.
2006 Shinhan Bank OSL Season 3 was the greatest tournament of all time
SpiritoftheTunA
Profile Blog Joined August 2006
United States20903 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-02-02 14:39:19
February 02 2017 14:38 GMT
#134860
the article itself calls the club tongue in cheek

its not claiming he's a full-stop fascist

did you not read it

i don't think it's misleading at all, especially if you have cultural context for these kinds of things

i don't think it's particularly damning either, outside of people (like you apparently) who think the label fascist means the same thing in all contexts
posting on liquid sites in current year
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