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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 4089

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Toadesstern
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany16350 Posts
June 19 2016 15:16 GMT
#81761
On June 19 2016 14:14 Danglars wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 19 2016 13:23 Plansix wrote:
On June 19 2016 13:19 Danglars wrote:
On June 19 2016 12:58 Plansix wrote:
On June 19 2016 12:52 Danglars wrote:
On June 19 2016 09:59 oBlade wrote:
On June 19 2016 09:37 Danglars wrote:
Everybody I've talked to from NJ hates Trump for Atlantic City business. All these hopes are too far-out looking at things right now. I'm more looking at something like RCP's map and the fight of his life even in states Bush won easily.

It's definitely not the most likely state to be competitive for him, but he doesn't need it to win anyway. But RCP's map doesn't even follow their own polls. Graying Michigan and Georgia? It's not in the evidence so far that Clinton and Trump are in any danger there. AZ is a red staple and I don't see evidence yet that would reverse that, not sure why NH is marked toss-up either.

On June 19 2016 09:56 Toadesstern wrote:
On June 19 2016 09:44 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
On June 19 2016 09:31 zlefin wrote:
W Post isn't a joke last I checked; it has its biases, but it's still a credible and decent place of journalism.
Do you have a quote of the exact headline the Post used? Trump certainly implied Obama may have been involved iirc


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/06/13/donald-trump-suggests-president-obama-was-involved-with-orlando-shooting/

You decide if that's a fair interpretation of what Trump was saying.

I consider it a website of campaign attack-ads, not a legitimate source of journalism.

kind of hilarious comming from the right side considering all the shit about facebook and how censoring media is intolerable.
But the other way around is just fine. Ban them all if you don't like what they write~
On June 19 2016 09:21 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
[...] Good riddance getting their press pass revoked.


But nobody's taking their right to publish - in fact, they've promised to cover Trump even more.
I'd give Trump AZ just knowing Hillary will continue her present course and alienate AZ voters. 45 to 41 Georgia is enough to convince me contested, Michigan is +/- five latest I saw, so I can see it gray at the moment.

On June 19 2016 10:14 Toadesstern wrote:
it's also not just the WashingtonPost
Among the news organizations whose reporters have been blacklisted: Gawker, BuzzFeed, Foreign Policy, Politico, Fusion, Univision, Mother Jones, the New Hampshire Union Leader, the Des Moines Register, the Daily Beast and Huffington Post.
It sounds like they were listing every outlet who had at least one reporter banned, to gain strength to oppose the move. I'm simply looking at the exact paragraph from your un-linked source.

On June 19 2016 10:18 Plansix wrote:
On June 19 2016 10:15 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
On June 19 2016 10:14 Toadesstern wrote:
it's also not just the WashingtonPost
Among the news organizations whose reporters have been blacklisted: Gawker, BuzzFeed, Foreign Policy, Politico, Fusion, Univision, Mother Jones, the New Hampshire Union Leader, the Des Moines Register, the Daily Beast and Huffington Post.


LOL oh no not BuzzFeed

What a madman

That's it you've convinced me to vote Hillary

Buzz feed does pretty reasonable reporting. They straight up say that their click bait pays for the real reporting. They have said it in a ton of interviews about the site. The White House would give them a press pass.

And the fucking clown blacklisted Univision and Politico? What a fucking joke. Thin skinned baby who can't deal with the press. Can't even deal with Buzzfeed, but he expects us to send him to deal with other nations. What will he do if the British PM says something mean?
Univision still employs Salinas and Ramos. They're what you see when you look up political hacks in the dictionary. Politico is biased in the normal trend these days and I don't recall any specific problems lately. If he's going to prevent any reporters at all from covering his events, the DNC latino mouthpiece is an obvious choice. I'm pretty curious who from Politico was banned.


Or you could be a Presidential candidate and not ban reporters like a baby? I hear that is what all the cool candidates have been doing for decades. I don't care what they report or how they do it, its not President's job to decide who gets to report on them. We decide who we read, not the President or anyone running for that job.
Maybe his best move is to let even news outlets totally devoted to crushing his presidential ambitions have their seats in the press box and press conferences. I'm undecided on that one. Hell, maybe we can have Hillary campaign staff ask him questions and cut the middleman. Hell, even calling them "reporters" in these times is a misnomer.

Not the presidents job to censor the press the president doesn't like. It decides who gets to be called press. If he doesn't like the questions, don't apply for the job.
As already said in this thread, they can publish what they like. Censorship isn't even involved.

I would argue that getting information on the event you want to cover is somehow involved in publishing stuff about aforementioned event.
If you're banning half the media from entering the White House because they're on the left side of the spectrum you are effectively censoring... Granted we're not even close to that scenario but you're basicly arguing that banning media from doing their job is okay because you're not specifically banning their publications.
<Elem> >toad in charge of judging lewdness <Elem> how bad can it be <Elem> also wew, that is actually p lewd.
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
June 19 2016 15:18 GMT
#81762
Actually Trump has said he would enforced libel lawsuits thus he could effectively ban press by Bankrupting them in legal battles ala Gawker.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
SK.Testie
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada11084 Posts
June 19 2016 16:11 GMT
#81763
He'd be doing America a great service by bankrupting some of these organizations.
Social Justice is a fools errand. May all the adherents at its church be thwarted. Of all the religions I have come across, it is by far the most detestable.
Falling
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada11439 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-19 16:24:41
June 19 2016 16:24 GMT
#81764
On June 20 2016 01:11 SK.Testie wrote:
He'd be doing America a great service by bankrupting some of these organizations.

And I'm sure others would think it a great service if a Left politician bankrupted news organizations on the right. And I wouldn't mind if someone bankrupted Alex Jones and his ilk. But it doesn't mean a political nominee is the right person for the job. Hell, any powerful person, running for office, it should never be their job. If a news organization goes under because of the market, fair play. But if you get on the wrong side of a political nominee... I think the free press is still an important freedom, and I don't really think it makes a real difference if the person is in government or running for government. In fact, as corporations gain power equivalent to government, I would be just as concerned with powerful interests bankrupting the press in acts of vengeance.
Moderator"In Trump We Trust," says the Golden Goat of Mars Lago. Have faith and believe! Trump moves in mysterious ways. Like the wind he blows where he pleases...
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
June 19 2016 16:25 GMT
#81765
On June 20 2016 00:18 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Actually Trump has said he would enforced libel lawsuits thus he could effectively ban press by Bankrupting them in legal battles ala Gawker.

Nice, rich people trying to destroy media they don't like. This will end well.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-19 16:34:03
June 19 2016 16:33 GMT
#81766
If you're voting for Trump you're basically voting for the American Erdogan

Also apparently he has no staff like.. what?
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15742 Posts
June 19 2016 16:35 GMT
#81767
On June 20 2016 01:33 Nyxisto wrote:
If you're voting for Trump you're basically voting for the American Erdogan

Also apparently he has no staff like.. what?


Introvert just keeps shaking his head. He knew this would happen.
ShoCkeyy
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
7815 Posts
June 19 2016 16:38 GMT
#81768
On June 20 2016 01:33 Nyxisto wrote:
If you're voting for Trump you're basically voting for the American Erdogan

Also apparently he has no staff like.. what?


Why need staff when he can do it all?
Life?
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-19 16:53:22
June 19 2016 16:51 GMT
#81769
On June 20 2016 01:33 Nyxisto wrote:
If you're voting for Trump you're basically voting for the American Erdogan

Also apparently he has no staff like.. what?


I think anyone who was following the delegate hunting (however fruitless it ended up being for Cruz) should have realized Trump's campaign was not very good at organization or staffing.

The campaign's power lies in PR and media manipulation/baiting. Not much to speak of elsewhere, but their strength in that field is considerable.
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
June 19 2016 17:08 GMT
#81770
I mean, Trump shat on Cruz for his delegate hunting powers, so I'm not sure it would have been a net positive for him if he had more skillfully gone for those delegates in the first place.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
June 19 2016 17:10 GMT
#81771
Cruz had a freakishly good data and GOTV operation. It's how he managed to keep limping forward despite his anticipated evangelical base not going for him and being the most hated guy in the Senate.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
June 19 2016 17:33 GMT
#81772
I'll bet Trump isn't even worth $1 billion. He's not that impressive from a business standpoint. Why make Trump steaks and water bottles, to get some pocket change? Why ask supporters for $100,000 before the convention?
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
June 19 2016 17:41 GMT
#81773
I mean, Trump is pretty clearly a highly successful businessman. Everyone who tries to say otherwise purely by virtue of the fact that they don't like him makes the anti-Trump side look like complete morons.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22131 Posts
June 19 2016 17:42 GMT
#81774
On June 20 2016 02:33 Doodsmack wrote:
I'll bet Trump isn't even worth $1 billion. He's not that impressive from a business standpoint. Why make Trump steaks and water bottles, to get some pocket change? Why ask supporters for $100,000 before the convention?

Same answer as last time you asked about his steaks.

And why he asks for money is obvious. He doesn't want to spend his own money. His contribution to his own campaign was a loan so he can get it all back.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
June 19 2016 17:43 GMT
#81775
On June 20 2016 01:51 TheTenthDoc wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2016 01:33 Nyxisto wrote:
If you're voting for Trump you're basically voting for the American Erdogan

Also apparently he has no staff like.. what?


I think anyone who was following the delegate hunting (however fruitless it ended up being for Cruz) should have realized Trump's campaign was not very good at organization or staffing.

The campaign's power lies in PR and media manipulation/baiting. Not much to speak of elsewhere, but their strength in that field is considerable.


He's been losing pretty badly on that front ever since he had to address the general election audience. He can't just power through with his zealots, it's not going to work.
Gorsameth
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands22131 Posts
June 19 2016 17:44 GMT
#81776
On June 20 2016 02:41 LegalLord wrote:
I mean, Trump is pretty clearly a highly successful businessman. Everyone who tries to say otherwise purely by virtue of the fact that they don't like him makes the anti-Trump side look like complete morons.

Putting his daddies starting money into stock and sitting on his ass would have made him just as rich as he is today.

That is why people call him a mediocre businessman.
His 'success' is in not having lost it all like others have.
It ignores such insignificant forces as time, entropy, and death
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States5936 Posts
June 19 2016 17:46 GMT
#81777
On June 20 2016 02:33 Doodsmack wrote:
I'll bet Trump isn't even worth $1 billion. He's not that impressive from a business standpoint. Why make Trump steaks and water bottles, to get some pocket change? Why ask supporters for $100,000 before the convention?

Forbes says $4.5 billion, does that settle the bet?
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
June 19 2016 17:50 GMT
#81778
Forbes said 4.5 billion about Elizabeth Holmes a week ago, seems to be a cursed number
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18855 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-06-19 18:31:36
June 19 2016 18:26 GMT
#81779
The Forbes net worth metric is not exactly reliable on its own terms; for better or for worse, estimating the worth of high wealth individuals is itself a political game of indicator significance and timeframe choices. This, I might add, is yet another reason why lauding trump for his "wealth" is not exactly a good idea.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
LegalLord
Profile Blog Joined April 2013
United States13779 Posts
June 19 2016 18:27 GMT
#81780
On June 20 2016 02:44 Gorsameth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2016 02:41 LegalLord wrote:
I mean, Trump is pretty clearly a highly successful businessman. Everyone who tries to say otherwise purely by virtue of the fact that they don't like him makes the anti-Trump side look like complete morons.

Putting his daddies starting money into stock and sitting on his ass would have made him just as rich as he is today.

That is why people call him a mediocre businessman.
His 'success' is in not having lost it all like others have.

Yep, this line of argument. Safe to say that it's garbage.
https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2015-09-03/should-donald-trump-have-indexed-

Sure, he's not some sort of business genius, but you'd be better off attacking him on his policies rather than trying to prove he's a bad businessman, which he isn't. The latter makes you look like a petty loser.

On June 20 2016 02:46 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 20 2016 02:33 Doodsmack wrote:
I'll bet Trump isn't even worth $1 billion. He's not that impressive from a business standpoint. Why make Trump steaks and water bottles, to get some pocket change? Why ask supporters for $100,000 before the convention?

Forbes says $4.5 billion, does that settle the bet?

To be fair, no wealthy person can say with any strong degree of certainty exactly how wealthy they are. The more you have, the less clear it is exactly how much you have because the "fair market value" of all your earnings is always in motion. I'd say that Trump is somewhere in the "2 to 10 billion" range for net worth, and that we probably can't do better than that.
History will sooner or later sweep the European Union away without mercy.
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