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Keep this civil, guys |
On May 06 2012 06:12 Tyrant0 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 06:10 RevRich wrote:On May 06 2012 06:06 Tyrant0 wrote:On May 06 2012 06:03 RevRich wrote:On May 06 2012 05:57 Tyrant0 wrote:On May 06 2012 05:55 RevRich wrote:On May 06 2012 05:44 Tyrant0 wrote:On May 06 2012 05:42 Silvertine wrote:On May 06 2012 05:35 Tyrant0 wrote:On May 06 2012 05:08 Silvertine wrote:
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What does it matter that it was said in a game? I guess any racial slurs uttered in sports are justified applying that stupid logic. Pretty sure he's referring to computer games, not sports, where you're actually interacting with real people face to face. So being racist towards someone is OK as long as it's not in person? What difference could that possibly make? I don't think you'd expect Destiny or Orb to ever walk up to an actual black or asian man/woman in a gaming venue and say that to them in anger
Of course not, that would require courage. He's not being racist towards them, just a dick. And it wouldn't require courage, it'd require a severe lack of social aptitude, or an acute sense of racism -- or both. Very distinct differences that have gone over your head time and time again. I'm not even saying what he did was right. Feel free to judge him and think all sorts of bad things of him. He shouldn't have his sponsors spammed with e-mails for it. Hi, I'm reality. Have you visited me lately? Maybe you're just too busy being an apologist for a guy who obviously fucked up. Hey reality, have you caught up with the internet recently? Maybe you don't understand there are two sets of rules on the internet. Rules that apply to the random person (you and I) and those that apply to those who are in the public eye supported by teams/sponsors/public entities. I like how you describe this as "trivial bullshit". To who? You? Yep. I really don't care when I choose my keyboard that one brand happens to sponsor a team, who employed a player who said a racist word 3 months ago. No one else does either, they just go out of their way to be offended. Oh, I didn't realize you spoke for the entirety of the human race. God knows if you aren't offended by something, nobody is offended. Listen, I'm not a big fan of the overly PC society we've morphed into over the last however many years. I think there is a lot of fake outrage out there when people want to hurt someone in the public eye. That being said, this is the way the world works now. You can't just ignore it and hope nobody calls you out. It wasn't just calling out. Rather than simply not support him, or agree vocally hes a douche bag for what he says, or any of that, they did what community members found to be the most effective way to get what they want and barrage sponsors with fake threats of boycotting their brand. No one associates Razor with having said that word, they associate it with Destiny, and you don't have to watch him or like him. There ARE people who enjoy him, despite how much you disagree.
He ignored what is considered acceptable behavior in society for a public figure and opened himself up to any and all repercussions. Its really cut and dry - don't say "x" and you don't give the people a reason to be outraged.
You can't know for sure if the victim or people who rallied behind him were truly offended or not. If they say they are, then society deems to be true. You'll never know what truly lies in someone's heart. Razer can't say "oh, well he JUST said "gook" that's not really so bad - are you sure you're offended?".
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On May 06 2012 06:06 Tyrant0 wrote:
You conveniently unquoted the follow up to its the internet that clarifies how little of an impact it has on anyone except the people acting offended.
I think that's the fourth time you've been unable to explain how the fact it occurred on the internet makes it completely different from if it happened in person. At this point I can only take it as a concession that you have no argument.
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It almost makes you think how very few of the people will actually act on their "boycott." How few of them actually intend to buy a new gaming accessory within the next 1-2 years; how many of them ever bought anything from that brand in the past; how likely they were to ever buy it at all over a cheaper alternative; how many people will ACTUALLY impact razor's sales and ultimately bank, and Razor caves into a small barrage of threats. It almost makes me want to start sending them e-mails about how as a potential investor I'm worried by how much their sales would presumably be affected by a few thousand empty threats.
On May 06 2012 06:28 Silvertine wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 06:06 Tyrant0 wrote:
You conveniently unquoted the follow up to its the internet that clarifies how little of an impact it has on anyone except the people acting offended. I think that's the fourth time you've been unable to explain how the fact it occurred on the internet makes it completely different from if it happened in person. At this point I can only take it as a concession that you have no argument.
I literally just did, and you've both ignored it and excluded it in quotes. But I guess I'm wrong because you've now declared I don't have an argument. Well, YOU'RE wrong because YOU dont have an argument. There. What is your response? Cause it wont be an argument either, and you'll be wrong again. Infact, if you don't say anything that appeals to me, it's not an argument and is wrong.
But please, do continue to pick apart quotes and selectively ignore arguments.
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This thread should be closed. It is obvious that all intelligent people have stopped posting and now we only have bad arguments from both sides arguing over things that aren't the issue to see who has the bigger eDick.
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On May 06 2012 06:36 ZackAttack wrote:
This thread should be closed. It is obvious that all intelligent people have stopped posting and now we only have bad arguments from both sides arguing over things that aren't the issue to see who has the bigger eDick.
Unfortunately, we probably reached that point on the first page.
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Show nested quote +This thread should be closed. It is obvious that all intelligent people have stopped posting and now we only have bad arguments from both sides arguing over things that aren't the issue to see who has the bigger eDick. Unfortunately, we probably reached that point on the first page.
Yeah, the first two comments are actually the only things that have been repeated in this thread over and over.
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On May 06 2012 05:44 MountainDewJunkie wrote:
These issues are each bits of evidence as to why Esporsts will never been accepted in the mainstream. There are two many subcultures and internal conflicts. You have those that just want to make money (casters, irrelevant players who are known for personality and not accomplishments), corporate interests (sponsors, tournaments), TL's need for growth and preservation, we have casual gamers, recreational gamers, obsessed gamers, and pro gamers. The biggest issue is that we have the dark side of the gamer crowd: the emotionally unstable homophobes and racists, the ignorant, and the uneducated. We will always have these people. You can't get away from it, and you can't ban them all.
That's a stupid argument. People set cars on fire and start riots because of football games, yet that's one of the most mainstream sports in the US. So yeah, having a couple of people who use "offensive" language on the internet isn't that much of a concern I would think.
"Real" sports have as many subcultures as eSports, there are casual fans who will watch a game with friends from time to time while having a beer, then there are the guys who go to the stadium every week without a shirt and paint themselves green and finally there are the hooligans who specifically go to sports events to have brawls with fans of the opposing team. So don't tell me eSports is somehow alone in having assholes in its community. Everything with any semblance of success has idiotic followers to some degree.
Destiny is btw neither an "unstable homophobe" nor a racist, but nice try sneaking that in there. I'm pretty new to this community, but I'm already astonished at how full of themselves, hypocritical or just plain stupid a lot of people here seem to be. This whole "some guy said something offensive on his stream, let's get him fired in the name of eSports" thing is so incredibly shortsighted and hurts just the thing you are claiming to protect. Not to mention what kind of precedent this is setting. Do you really want to live in a world where every player/caster/streamer has to filter himself 24/7 because some dude somewhere might get offended by something and start emailing sponsors about it because it's fun to feel important and powerful?
Another thing that rubs me the wrong way is that this feels more like a campaign against Destiny by people that simply don't like him than anything principled. By the standards some people here seem to apply players like IdrA and Stephano should be burned at the stake too, but funnily enough that hasn't happened yet. Maybe we just need to give it time, who knows.
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One of the more respected moves made by Destiny in a long time. Honestly, I still don't know why he still has this much viewers. He has showed that he didn't care about his viewers and just view them as revenue. "If you don't like this, then leave."
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You guys already got him fired, you don't have to keep posting in this topic. Congratulations, ESPORTS has never been at it's finest.
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On May 06 2012 06:45 birdkicker wrote:
One of the more respected moves made by Destiny in a long time. Honestly, I still don't know why he still has this much viewers. He has showed that he didn't care about his viewers and just view them as revenue. "If you don't like this, then leave."
What do you want him to do? He has viewers that enjoy his personality. Why should he change for others that don't even watch? If he appealed to everyone's interests he'd either be completely uninteresting, or way more famous, with the guarantee that he'd be nothing like his former self.
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esports could do with less eracism. but if you read any news sites you'll see that there are alot of racists behind those monitors and keyboards.
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OMFG WHY DOES EVERYONE SEEM TO CARE SO MUCH!?!?! WHY IS THIS THREAD STILL ALIVE?
User was warned for this post
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On May 06 2012 06:53 quistador wrote:
OMFG WHY DOES EVERYONE SEEM TO CARE SO MUCH!?!?! WHY IS THIS THREAD STILL ALIVE?
Because we have to lynch a guy on a stream when there is so much racism and inequality in probably the whole third world, developing world and at least half the developed ALRIGHT?
We need to TACKLE RACISM RIGHT NOW!
Once Destiny gets fired then we can move on to our next target: The racist Indian caste problem that affects hundreds of millions!
Oh no wait... Maybe not...Nothing to do with ESPORTS so who cares. Right?
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Just to make it fair I contacted the Evil Genius's sponsors to let them know about Idra, Incontrol and Huk's behaviors. Idra routinely calls people retards during showmatches and regular play. On stream he called Ensnare and July faggots. For Incontrol he ridiculed a porn star about her profession making her come to tears on the most viewed Starcraft 2 podcast. And for Huk he tweeted Nigga. All these things are completely unacceptable. Something should be done because that is no way for a professional to act.
Just saying.
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On May 06 2012 07:06 Lunit wrote:
Just to make it fair I contacted the Evil Genius's sponsors to let them know about Idra, Incontrol and Huk's behaviors. Idra routinely calls people retards during showmatches and regular play. On stream he called Ensnare and July faggots. For Incontrol he ridiculed a porn star about her profession making her come to tears on the most viewed Starcraft 2 podcast. And for Huk he tweeted Nigga. All these things are completely unacceptable. Something should be done because that is know way for a professional to act.
Just saying.
Can I just ask: Did you actually contact them? (Sarcasm is hard to detect on the internet.)
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On May 06 2012 07:06 Lunit wrote:
Just to make it fair I contacted the Evil Genius's sponsors to let them know about Idra, Incontrol and Huk's behaviors. Idra routinely calls people retards during showmatches and regular play. On stream he called Ensnare and July faggots. For Incontrol he ridiculed a porn star about her profession making her come to tears on the most viewed Starcraft 2 podcast. And for Huk he tweeted Nigga. All these things are completely unacceptable. Something should be done because that is no way for a professional to act.
Just saying.
Although you're consistent, WHY didn't you contact EG? Why did you run straight to the sponsors?
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On May 06 2012 04:12 Leth0 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 04:08 Chocobo wrote:
It's just like the recent news story where the "Million Moms" group demanded that JCPenney stop using Ellen DeGeneres in their ads, because they don't like her and find her actions (such as existing as a gay woman) reprehensible. Even Bill O'Reilly was against that- you don't go demanding that someone get fired just because you don't approve of them. It's actually nothing at all like that situation. Correct me if I'm wrong but Ellen wasn't caught acting racist because someone beat her in a game of starcraft.
It is quite remarkable that so many people are unable to comprehend the concepts of analogies and comparisons.
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On May 06 2012 07:07 Psychobabas wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 07:06 Lunit wrote:
Just to make it fair I contacted the Evil Genius's sponsors to let them know about Idra, Incontrol and Huk's behaviors. Idra routinely calls people retards during showmatches and regular play. On stream he called Ensnare and July faggots. For Incontrol he ridiculed a porn star about her profession making her come to tears on the most viewed Starcraft 2 podcast. And for Huk he tweeted Nigga. All these things are completely unacceptable. Something should be done because that is know way for a professional to act.
Just saying.
Can I just ask: Did you actually contact them? (Sarcasm is hard to detect on the internet.)
Yes of course. Only did so because there seems to be player bias. This way everyone is held accountable for.
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On May 06 2012 07:08 ShamTao wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 07:06 Lunit wrote:
Just to make it fair I contacted the Evil Genius's sponsors to let them know about Idra, Incontrol and Huk's behaviors. Idra routinely calls people retards during showmatches and regular play. On stream he called Ensnare and July faggots. For Incontrol he ridiculed a porn star about her profession making her come to tears on the most viewed Starcraft 2 podcast. And for Huk he tweeted Nigga. All these things are completely unacceptable. Something should be done because that is no way for a professional to act.
Just saying.
Although you're consistent, WHY didn't you contact EG? Why did you run straight to the sponsors?
EG knows there players. Whats telling them information they already know going to do? I thought it was fair to contact the sponsors such as others have done. Fairness is fairness. If a few are to be punished. All should be punished.
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On May 06 2012 07:09 Lunit wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2012 07:07 Psychobabas wrote:On May 06 2012 07:06 Lunit wrote:
Just to make it fair I contacted the Evil Genius's sponsors to let them know about Idra, Incontrol and Huk's behaviors. Idra routinely calls people retards during showmatches and regular play. On stream he called Ensnare and July faggots. For Incontrol he ridiculed a porn star about her profession making her come to tears on the most viewed Starcraft 2 podcast. And for Huk he tweeted Nigga. All these things are completely unacceptable. Something should be done because that is know way for a professional to act.
Just saying.
Can I just ask: Did you actually contact them? (Sarcasm is hard to detect on the internet.) Yes of course. Only did so because there seems to be player bias. This way everyone is held accountable for.
You are doing virtually nothing to combat unprofessional speech, but are making huge progress towards the elimination of sponsorships for pro gaming teams.
Do you really think this is a good thing? Or have you just not thought it through?
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EPT
