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On January 12 2012 11:47 RoosterSamurai wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 11:45 Alryk wrote:On January 12 2012 11:43 RoosterSamurai wrote:On January 12 2012 11:41 Alryk wrote:On January 12 2012 11:34 Mohdoo wrote:On January 12 2012 11:27 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:On January 12 2012 11:24 FuzzyJAM wrote:On January 12 2012 11:19 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:
Sorry, guys, but "winning the hearts and minds" of the population is not the soldier's job. His job is to shoot where his CO tells him to shoot, kill who his CO tells him to kill, and be a nasty, crude, rude, and generally unpleasant mother-fucker.
People are making WAAAAAAAY too big a deal about this... If all a soldier's job is to kill people who he's been told to kill then it's an exceptionally dishonourable job. You can't have things both ways. I can and do have it both ways. A good soldier follows the lawful orders of his CO without question or hesitation. If his CO orders him to kill a target, he has a duty to kill that target as quickly and efficiently as possible. No job is honorable or dishonorable taken by itself. Only the one who is doing it can make it honorable or dishonorable. In this instance, what the soldiers did was gross, but hardly shocking or even all that disrespectful. I don't see how shooting someone is okay, but then peeing on them is "so horrible!" Desecration of a corpse is legally defined as war crime. On January 12 2012 11:25 Alryk wrote:On January 12 2012 11:24 Mohdoo wrote:On January 12 2012 11:22 Tegin wrote:
This incident doesn't represent every Marine, nor the USMC in general. Damn technology. Damn technology? Technology is the reason these pitiful people will be brought to justice. Technology is the reason people become aware of this disgraceful behavior. I think he's talking about how the media tends to just show the ridiculously awful side of things and never the good side, not that he's disagreeing with you  Also: did I answer your question well enough? If you have something else to ask please feel free. Yes, you did, thank you. Its shocking to hear that soldiers are allowed to serve more than the recommended amount. I can imagine that after a while, they're totally fucked up from all the shit that goes down. That is DEFINITELY something that needs to change... It's not so much being "allowed" as "necessitated," we have already dipped into our reserves to give the active duty soldiers as few tours as possible, it's just a mess in there. Despite how messed up a lot of the people may be though, they're driven (mostly) by a desire to uphold our country's values and what they believe is right, and to most of us, it means serving (and potentially dying). But I assure you, the military doesn't WANT us there. A tired soldier on his sixth tour is much closer to dead than a soldier on his second. They do their best to cycle it, but the military is pretty starved for recruits right now, at least that's what I believe. Maybe if we didn't insist on having hundreds of thousands of occupying forces in non-threatening countries like Germany and Japan, we wouldn't be so starved though? I'm not too familiar with Germany, but I am definitely ok with soldiers being in Japan and Korea. North Korea is a pretty damn big threat. One of my friends who was in Korea was speaking with korean soldiers who told them that if we weren't there and North Korea staged an "all out attack" on South Korea, they'd survive for about an hour, and North Korea would have Seoul within a day. Japan also needs protection from us there, although I'm pretty sure we also have a still standing treaty from WW2 that keeps soldiers there. Plus, if SK fell, what would happen to GSL? I don't disagree with you, but even with us being in Korea and Japan, if North Korea decides to go all out and attack South Korea, all of our initial forces would most likely still be wiped out, and we'd have to re-invade just to push the NK's back. And we have guaranteed Japan protection from other countries since WW2, but honestly, I could see the US breaking that treaty if it ends up leaving our land too unprotected. I'm very confident we would abandon Japan if China tried to invade it.
Nah, I believe we are more than equipped to defend off of North Korea by themselves. Don't forget how far behind us in technology they are, as well as the power of our navy in the area. We wouldn't be fighting with "just" soldiers.
If china invaded Japan... one, they would destroy the world's economy. 2) I find that hard to believe. What would the point of any political alliance ever be? China doesn't WANT to invade Japan, if they do, they crush their own economy.
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Can't we just look at the other "US soldiers did something bad" threads? Because this is not only getting old, it's getting to be the same annoying discussion over and over.
Why can't everyone just not jump on the first opportunity for bashing? Why can't we just keep this out of here?
This is the SAME GODDAMN argument EVERY other week, and it's getting freaking tiring by now watching TL devolve into a bunch of bashers and bash-nots.
Just stop talking about this. Please.
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On January 12 2012 11:35 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:
I didn't say that it wasn't disrespectful. My point is
Why are you expecting killers to be respectful to people they just killed?
Why do soldiers have to be "respectful"?
Where did you all get this idea that the military is happy fun time filled with a bunch of people who are deep thinkers who are constantly pontificating about their love and respect for their enemy? That is some pure hollywood BS right there.
"Persons taking no active part in hostilities, including military persons who have ceased to be active as a result of sickness, injury, or detention, should be treated humanely and that the following acts are prohibited:
violence to life and person, in particular murder of all kinds, mutilation, cruel treatment and torture;"
taken from the Geneva convention. pretty sure we can agree once you kill them they stop taking an active part in hostilities and then urinating on them counts as cruel treatment.
On January 12 2012 11:52 Praetorial wrote:
Can't we just look at the other "US soldiers did something bad" threads? Because this is not only getting old, it's getting to be the same annoying discussion over and over.
Why can't everyone just not jump on the first opportunity for bashing? Why can't we just keep this out of here?
This is the SAME GODDAMN argument EVERY other week, and it's getting freaking tiring by now watching TL devolve into a bunch of bashers and bash-nots.
Just stop talking about this. Please.
i dont think the word forum means what you think it means
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On January 12 2012 10:12 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 09:58 Mohdoo wrote:Source: http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/11/us/video-marines-urinating/index.html?hpt=hp_t3Washington (CNN) -- A number of websites including TMZ and YouTube posted a video Wednesday showing four men dressed in U.S. Marine Corps combat gear urinating on the apparently dead bodies of three men sprawled on the ground in front of them.
One of the men says, "Have a great day, buddy." A voice asks, "You got it on the video?" to which another voice responds, "Yeah." Another jokes, "Golden, like a shower." The US government has already commented on it and are currently investigating who did this. If I may, I would like to do more than post the story, but also give my personal experience with a group of marines. A friend of my girlfriend was getting married and my girlfriend was one of the bride's maids. As such, there was a get together the day before the wedding at their home for the brides maids and best men etc. As the boyfriend of a bride's maid, I had the pleasure of coming along as well. The man who she was marrying was a marine, and all of his best men were also marines who served together in Iraq or Afghanistan, I can't recall which. When I arrived, they were playing Resident Evil 4, I think. They would joke about how they pretended that the zombies were Muslims, and how they absolutely loved killing Muslims. One of them specifically mentioned how it made them feel amazing to kill Muslims, followed by the rest agreeing and talking about it. I was just kinda sitting on a chair in the living room, as they all sat on a couch. I was speechless and couldn't really wrap my mind around the fact that they meant what they were saying and really felt that way. They continued talking about how they hated Muslims and how much they miss killing them in the war. I could tell that they were being serious and saw nothing wrong with what they were saying. I know its hard to really describe, but I could tell they were being quite serious. The bride and groom were very religious, and the other marines seemed to be the same. I know that some, far from all, Christians see Muslim faith as a competitor of sorts. Nevertheless, the most disgusting behavior I've ever had the displeasure of of watching. I don't like how just about any physically capable person can become a marine. I don't like that there are such low psychological and mental requirements. If someone is given, they need to be an outstanding person. The people shown in this video and the group of marines I described are certainly far from DECENT people. They bring shame to my country and I wish that there was more being done to prevent such people from serving. Note: I do not feel these in the video or the ones I met in person represent Marines or the US military as a whole. However, these people were issued guns and were put in situations where they had the potential to harm civilians. This is beyond unacceptable. It shouldn't be so easy to be a marine. There have been similar incidents in the past as well. 1. What is wrong with pissing on bodies? I mean, it's unprofessional, and rude, but is there anything really morally wrong with it? It's a peace of dead meat. The person isn't inside that body any more. 2. Why include the ridiculous anecdotal story about some marines joking around while playing a game? I don't see how this connects with the article at all. Furthermore, I have heard a thousand variations of this same story a thousand times, and so that makes me wonder why you put it here even more. 3. You don't have to be nice to be a solider. On the contrary, the military would probably prefer having the nasty guy to the nice guy. The nice guy is good, but when it comes time to blow some people up and kill some people, you don't want someone who has a problem with killing. You want someone that wants to kill, likes to kill, and will kill. 4. It isn't easy being a soldier. We need soldiers though, and they don't need to be great people. They need to be killers. Killers, often, are not the greatest people. There aren't enough nice people who are also killers to fill the shoes that we need. Life sucks, move on.
Are you retarded? I know one of the commanders for jtf2 special forces in canada and they wont accept anyone into the military that like killing people. Pissing on dead people is disrespectful, humiliating and all around bad?..
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On January 12 2012 11:53 turdburgler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 11:35 MasterBlasterCaster wrote:
I didn't say that it wasn't disrespectful. My point is
Why are you expecting killers to be respectful to people they just killed?
Why do soldiers have to be "respectful"?
Where did you all get this idea that the military is happy fun time filled with a bunch of people who are deep thinkers who are constantly pontificating about their love and respect for their enemy? That is some pure hollywood BS right there. "Persons taking no active part in hostilities, including military persons who have ceased to be active as a result of sickness, injury, or detention, should be treated humanely and that the following acts are prohibited: violence to life and person, in particular murder of all kinds, mutilation, cruel treatment and torture;" taken from the Geneva convention. pretty sure we can agree once you kill them they stop taking an active part in hostilities and then urinating on them counts as cruel treatment. Show nested quote +On January 12 2012 11:52 Praetorial wrote:
Can't we just look at the other "US soldiers did something bad" threads? Because this is not only getting old, it's getting to be the same annoying discussion over and over.
Why can't everyone just not jump on the first opportunity for bashing? Why can't we just keep this out of here?
This is the SAME GODDAMN argument EVERY other week, and it's getting freaking tiring by now watching TL devolve into a bunch of bashers and bash-nots.
Just stop talking about this. Please. i dont think the word forum means what you think it means
Yeah, having an open forum is great, but when it ALWAYS gets to the point of "Israel is a puppet of the US(or vice versa)-or not" and "US is an empire that just wants to push everyone around-no it's not!", it promotes no discussion, and I get to see the worst brought out.
Seriously, this thread oughtn't to exist.
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It's really tiresome seeing these threads. They always get blown up into huge deals and people take them as an opportunity to comment on an entire group of people, which is over 200,000 (according to wiki). The generalizations being made are just as ridiculous to me as any made about any kind of race or ethnicity.
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Osaka27152 Posts
Im tired of these kinds of news threads.
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EPT
