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BadgerBadger8264
Netherlands409 Posts
Definitely bullshit, he should of told someone about the bullying like the cops. Carrying around a knife is illegal and they're both kids nobody should have gotten killed. Please, if you know absolutely nothing about bullying, do not comment, your comments are taking up precious space on this forum. Telling authorities only serves to make bullying worse. | ||
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ampson
United States2355 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:54 Zealotdriver wrote: This kid is a hero. He should be rewarded. Yeah, give the kid a fucking medal for killing a teenager with a whole life ahead of him, most likely destroying a family, and providing a bad example to bullied kids everywhere. | ||
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BadgerBadger8264
Netherlands409 Posts
Yeah, give the kid a fucking medal for killing a teenager with a whole life ahead of him, most likely destroying a family, and providing a bad example to bullied kids everywhere. Are you seriously shaming a kid for defending himself in a fight he tried his very best to avoid against a kid multiple times his size? | ||
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Cupine
Canada51 Posts
I think the kid did the right thing, most people who claim he murdered didn't read the whole article in detail, it wasn't like he pulled the knife out as soon as the fight started, and according to the source on naplesnews, he was obviously bullied to the extent where he couldn't take it anymore, I give him props for not pulling it on the guy earlier. This should send a message out to bullies everywhere, because I feel that often, bullies feel invincible, just because the people they bully are often the ones weaker than they are. This has led to many massacres in schools, and it's time that the bullies realize that they are in fact, human. Tbh, this kid should get a trophy for his actions, the message his actions send to other people, and I hope to see a wave of innocent kids fighting bullies all across the world, and maybe schools would be a safer place. My second point, the authorities, I mean, if I was in that situation I would've probably taken action myself too. I mean, what can authorities do exactly? Go through a legal system, a fine, curfew, juvenile detention?, what is that going to do exactly? Maybe it's just me, i've always lost hope in the legal system because honestly, if they hurt you that badly you should be the one taking action, because the legal system won't give you any peace, your nightmares will still haunt you, and this is why I think the kid's actions were justified, feel free to argue with my logic. | ||
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ampson
United States2355 Posts
On January 11 2012 11:02 BadgerBadger8264 wrote: Are you seriously shaming a kid for defending himself in a fight against people multiple times his size? I'm shaming a poster who wants to reward a kid for killing another. | ||
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nalgene
Canada2153 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:54 Zealotdriver wrote: This kid is a hero. He should be rewarded. For his gallantry and intrepidity? He stood his ground against all odds. The way the story sounds seems like he would've been beaten to death/gangbanged by his bully friends who surrounded him. But instead, it ended with a sharp conclusion with the bully falling. | ||
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BadgerBadger8264
Netherlands409 Posts
I'm shaming a poster who wants to reward a kid for killing another. That's still pulling a situation completely out of context. | ||
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DeepElemBlues
United States5079 Posts
I'm shaming a poster who wants to reward a kid for killing another. Kid shouldn't get a reward per se but he should get all the support and help he needs to recover from this, as I'm sure he's emotionally battered from the year of bullying prior to the incident and the incident itself. People need to read the details, he didn't pull the knife until he felt scared for his life thanks to the events of the fight (getting hit in the head repeatedly until he felt light-headed, aka concussion-like symptoms). Once you reach that point adrenaline takes over 100% and you don't even think, you just act until the rush is gone. I had someone try to rob my house and I almost popped his right eye out gouging at him and I didn't even realize what I was doing. When you're totally filled with terror/rage and you feel like your life is on the line, you don't think about "excessive force" or anything else but staying alive however possible. | ||
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fatfail
United States386 Posts
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jodenstone
Sweden45 Posts
Presuming the kid didn't go for the kill initially i agree this isn't murder, nor manslaughter. Still i think there has to be some kind of exemplary punishment to show people killing is never an ok solution when you are not in an immediate life-threatening situation. Maybe something like a probation, if he commits serious crime again, that is a strong sign excessive force was used. | ||
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DeepElemBlues
United States5079 Posts
when you are not in an immediate life-threatening situation. It was determined that he was facing a life-threatening situation, the authorities don't just take your word that you felt your life threatened so it was a justified self-defense killing. They examine the scene, interview witnesses, etc., basically do all the things they would do in a normal murder investigation, and make a decision. The decision in this case was that the fear of death was justified and as such so was the killing. Again, really people read up on the details before pontificating about this or that. | ||
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Golbat
United States499 Posts
On January 11 2012 10:58 Kangbao wrote: Nowhere did I say "the kid intended to kill the bully". If you interpret "using deadly force" as "intending to kill" you're simply ignorant of the law. Intending to kill and using deadly force are not the same thing under the law. Deadly force is an amount of force that is likely to cause either serious bodily injury or death to another person. A knife is deadly force. He may not have planned on killing anyone. Even if he intended to brandish the knife and have them back off, there was always the possibility that the guy didn't back off, and he planned on then using it. The bully was an idiot for picking on the kid in the first place, and even more so when he decided to continue fighting. That doesn't justify him being killed. The part i'm really hung up on is you saying "A knife is deadly force". A knife is not deadly force. A knife is not a force. Having a knife is not deadly force. Brandishing a knife is not deadly force. He did use deadly force however, by using the knife, which he is allowed to do within the constraints of Florida's stand your ground law. But simply a knife is not deadly force. And if you use deadly force, you must have the intention to make someone or something dead (aka kill them). On January 11 2012 11:14 fatfail wrote: The kid should be punished for having brought a knife around. That is all. I can't see a situation where the kid would be punished for having the knife. Let's say he was caught with the knife, he would be handed over to the School Resource Officer (SRO). The SRO would then have had the kid explain why he had the knife. Then the kid tells the SRO that he is being bullied and is scared for his life or whatever, and planned on using the knife to scare thee bully away by brandishing the knife. The kid would then be told to bring the bully to the SRO's attention next time, and be sent on his way, and the bully would then be punished. | ||
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jodenstone
Sweden45 Posts
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TotalBalanceSC2
Canada475 Posts
Thank you for enlightening me. | ||
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Golbat
United States499 Posts
On January 11 2012 11:30 TotalBalanceSC2 wrote: After reading through the posts of some of the Americans who live in the same world as this incident i have come to be convinced that perhaps the kid was justified especially if the death was accidental. That doesnt mean things shouldn't be improved so a situation like this is avoided in the future but the kid should not be charged for murder or manslaughter, but perhaps he should still get a minor charge as killing someone should never happen completely scot-free. Also the people saying he should be rewarded disgust me. Thank you for enlightening me. The kid deserves no punishment, because the death of his bully is simply an unfortunate consequence of the kid defending himself. Are you saying a woman who is about to be raped and bashes her attacker's skull in with a brick also deserves a punishment? Why are you so hell-bent on punishing someone for an unfortunate thing that happened that was mostly out of the kid's control? | ||
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vitruvia
Canada235 Posts
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DeepElemBlues
United States5079 Posts
Yes, i understand the situation was determined life-threatening, i have a hard time believing that was the case AFTER he produced the knife though. Still, arguing like this is kind of pointless without all the details. The law doesn't make distinctions like that; what methods you use to defend yourself don't suddenly change the equation as long as your attacker is still attacking you. Now, if the knife is pulled, and your attacker tries to run away, and you chase him and stab him, that's a different story. But if your attacker continues to attack, producing a weapon doesn't mean that since you now (presumably) have the advantage you must stop. | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10665 Posts
Im thinking somethin along the lines of "Well that was stupid of me, im an idiot" No way in hell was he even blaming the victim AT ALL. No way, no chance. Not at all. | ||
Myles
United States5162 Posts
On January 11 2012 11:27 Golbat wrote: The part i'm really hung up on is you saying "A knife is deadly force". A knife is not deadly force. A knife is not a force. Having a knife is not deadly force. Brandishing a knife is not deadly force. He did use deadly force however, by using the knife, which he is allowed to do within the constraints of Florida's stand your ground law. But simply a knife is not deadly force. And if you use deadly force, you must have the intention to make someone or something dead (aka kill them). I can't see a situation where the kid would be punished for having the knife. Let's say he was caught with the knife, he would be handed over to the School Resource Officer (SRO). The SRO would then have had the kid explain why he had the knife. Then the kid tells the SRO that he is being bullied and is scared for his life or whatever, and planned on using the knife to scare thee bully away by brandishing the knife. The kid would then be told to bring the bully to the SRO's attention next time, and be sent on his way, and the bully would then be punished. Well, there is Zero Tolerance. I'm pretty sure Collier County has it. They suspende both kids for getting in fight even if one curls up in a ball while the other kicks the crap out of them. | ||
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ChinaRestaurant
Austria324 Posts
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