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While I understand that there's a need to discuss this matter, this thread has way too many trash posts in it. Please think carefully about what you want to say. Ad hominem attacks on Swedish people in general, calling you fellow Starcraft fans idiots etc etc will be dealt with with harsher punishment from here on out. Keep it civil people.
Page 230: Here's some more stuff that'll get you banned!
- Conspiracy theory mongering about MLG and GOM
- Comparing people to Hitler
- Posting useless one liners of arguments that have already been repeated ad nauseum. |
It took some balls on GOM's part to strip Naniwa of Code S, however harsh it may be. He definitely deserved some form of punishment and I'll stop short of saying that this punishment was too harsh.
What concerns me though is I feel that GOM need to be a lot more transparent in their choices of formats and seeds. I know it's a little difficult to coordinate with foreign players on when they're arriving, but Sen and Idra suddenly getting seeds without prior announcement or much clear explanation of how they got the seeds is somewhat a bit of a critical flaw for GSL IMO.
I feel if they announced the reason and did it more promptly (even if the reason is something like Demuslim placing 20th at an MLG), it would make things a lot more transparent and straight up.
Think about it. Up/Downs are next week and we're still not quite clear on who the 2 foreign seeds are.
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What if Nestea had 7pooled and Naniwa had won the game? What if Naniwa had said after the game that he thougth nestea would 6 or 7 pooled and decided that a probe rush could have countered it.
this rule is so stupied that its just patetic. How are they ever going to apply this for future situations?
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Poor MorroW must be sad about the lack of support he'll be getting from his country in January's Code A. <.<
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On December 14 2011 23:24 creepcolony wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 23:17 xbankx wrote:On December 14 2011 23:15 Xax wrote:On December 14 2011 23:12 Umpteen wrote:On December 14 2011 22:14 .Sic. wrote:
"During a match, a player shall not offend the opponent or audience with abusive behaviours"
Gom stepped over the boundaries by deciding that they have the right to determine what play is "offensive to opponents/audience" or not. + Show Spoiler +What exactly about the ensuing furore makes you think GOM got that call wrong?
I've read a good few of the 100+ pages of this thread and without exception those opposed to GOM's decision have focused on only a small part of the big picture.
Sure, the match didn't matter as far as Naniwa's chances in the competition were concerned. So if that's all you decide to care about, his decision was entirely reasonable.
But professional sport is not about pandering to one individual. In professional sport, everyone is in it together: players, spectators, organisers, officials - everyone. It only works if we all pull together.
Are victory ceremonies or in-game victory BM (to which this has been compared) against the spirit of the sport? No. Fans love that stuff; it foments rivalries, increase the spectacle. Obviously there is a point where they would become detrimental (literally pissing into your opponent's cubicle for instance), but right now, no.
Would Nestea going on tilt and 6-pooling in that same game be against the spirit of the sport? No. A 6-pool is a genuine, if desperate, attempt to win. It would at least show he cared.
What Naniwa did, on the other hand, was entirely selfish. He denied Nestea a chance to save face by earning a win, made his sponsors look stupid after they hyped the game, used the match as a platform to humiliate the organisers for their choice of format - a format he signed up for by choosing to take part, disappointed the fans who stayed up to watch - in short, he made it perfectly clear that the only thing he gave a damn about was himself.
If you think 'SC2-pro' is just a kind of unofficial league above GM, you're woefully mistaken. Doing anything professionally carries obligations over and above those attached to a recreational activity, because it's no longer just about you. It's about you and the people paying you. You can cook? Great! You want to be a chef? Better start adhering to health and safety and hygiene standards, and getting food out on time and on budget. You can take nice photos? Great! Want to be a wedding photographer? Then you'll be wanting insurance and a network of other pros in case you're ill on the day. You'll be multiply-RAIDing your hard drives, scouting venues, honing your interpersonal and organisational skills so that the wedding party have a great time and great pictures to take away and don't have to spend all day away from their guests.
You can play SC2 well? Great! You want to be a pro-gamer? You want a sponsor to pay you and ferry you around from tournament to tournament? You want fans who'll tune in and maybe buy the products you endorse? Then you act like you give a shit, 100% of the time. That's part of the job. Read this. Seriously such a good post. Well, no question, what naniwa did was wrong. Nothing to discuss here. But, revoking his code S spot is too much. Much too much. Ofc its GOM's baby, they can do whatever the fuck they like, but explaining naniwa that he wont get any more screen time in korea with a behaviour like this and letting him apologise to nestea, GOM and the fans would have been a much more respectable and wise descision. Mr. Chae's personal comment on naniwa is just ridiculous and shows that Mr. Chae clearly has not the skills it takes to do his job. Its more amateurish than everything naniwa did. By far.
I still can't believe people base their opinion on something that was translated by a 3rd party. Do you guys REALLY believe that Mr Chae chose those words? REALLY?
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On December 14 2011 23:26 manloveman wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 23:25 mordk wrote:On December 14 2011 23:24 manloveman wrote:On December 14 2011 23:22 top9696 wrote:On December 14 2011 23:08 Benjef wrote:On December 14 2011 23:08 top9696 wrote:
(Sorry for my terrible grammer)
In korea, people are cheering about this news. They think imnestea was ridiculed by naniwa.
Even nestea said that he was mad at that time. Before start playing, He thought for a while how to play, but the glorious probe rush came.
Also im korean. I agree about this. I think this is the culture crash. Guessed as much. Pretty big culture clash. Guess your right. Most Korean dont(cannot) understand why foreigners are standing by naniwa. Anyway, After the probe rush, naniwa got a huge korean anti-fan. So why didnt koreans go bonkers on nestea, when he threw his game vs mwp at blizzcon? Because you're purely speculating and he actually didn't? Haha go find the destiny quote on sotg about that exact game.
Destiny knows everything and only speaks the truth...
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i think the principle of GOM stepping in and deeming a certain tactic "unworthy" of their tournament is very troubling.
Once you cross that barrier, who knows what early plays will be banned. Soon the meta game of the GSL will have completely changed because certain early plays will no longer need to be considered...
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On December 14 2011 23:28 St00r wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 23:17 Skwid1g wrote:
They do know how to host a tournament, Naniwa just doesn't deserve to play in one. Nice joke bro. No tournament in the world would let people play a game without nothing on line. They clearly need to learn to host a better tournament. :-)
Du är ju korkad, aldrig hört talas om fotboll?
Almost all tournaments have meaningless games.
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On December 14 2011 23:28 purpose wrote:
What if Nestea had 7pooled and Naniwa had won the game? What if Naniwa had said after the game that he thougth nestea would 6 or 7 pooled and decided that a probe rush could have countered it.
this rule is so stupied that its just patetic. How are they ever going to apply this for future situations?
probe rush doesn't counter 6 pool :O
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On December 14 2011 23:25 SnowandLights wrote:
Well it was fun while it lasted GOM. I'm out!
Same. I can't support this decision.
Professionals in other sports get fined or reprimanded for unprofessional behavior.
They don't get suspended or revoked from their ability to play the game unless it's a multiple time offense.
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I totally understand the decision made by GOM and i will continue to support them. What Naniwa did may be small to foreigners but this is very very rude to do in Korea.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES51072 Posts
On December 14 2011 23:21 Boundz(DarKo) wrote:
How do I delete my account on gomtv.net?
don't be so over dramatic.
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On December 14 2011 23:28 Mattidute wrote:
Poor MorroW must be sad about the lack of support he'll be getting from his country in January's Code A. <.<
morrow said he doesn't want to participate so close to his arrival, has he said he will play in the next code a?
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On December 14 2011 23:27 Piy wrote:
It's GSL's fault for having a format that leads to possible pointless matches. You can't expect competitive players to play serious games when theres nothing on the line for either of them.
It's Naniwa's fault for not seeing past the trees. It's not just about himself, it's about the show, it's about the people trying to put on the show, and it's about the audience. He's a pro, he was paid just to show up, he represents his team, his sponsors, his fans, he has a responsibility AS A PRO to put all of his effort into his work.
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On December 14 2011 23:25 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 23:21 s1gmar wrote:
naniwa got what he derserved he's just an ill-manered abusive player I still don't understand how he's abusive because of this probe rush. How is attacking with probes being abusive? It's not abusing the game or a glitch or anything of that nature, and it's certainly not being verbally or physically abusive outside of the game. What definition of "abuse" is this?
He was previously banned from ESL for not doing things according to the rules.
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On December 14 2011 23:28 St00r wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 23:17 Skwid1g wrote:
They do know how to host a tournament, Naniwa just doesn't deserve to play in one. Nice joke bro. No tournament in the world would let people play a game without nothing on line. They clearly need to learn to host a better tournament. :-)
haha right.
They know how to host a tournament, thats why Kespa owns BW.
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On December 14 2011 23:15 Fus wrote:
Nanis behavious wasn't offensive, there was just no reason to play that game. There was: Determine 4th and 5th place, even if none of them will get into the playoffs.
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On December 14 2011 23:27 Piy wrote:
It's GSL's fault for having a format that leads to possible pointless matches. You can't expect competitive players to play serious games when theres nothing on the line for either of them.
Yeah damn GOM, expecting those players who get paid to play games to play out all their games even when they're getting paid for losing all of them!
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On December 14 2011 23:22 goswser wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2011 23:21 Boundz(DarKo) wrote:
How do I delete my account on gomtv.net? blind swedish fanboys are retards
I could not see where to delete my account, though I really, really want to.
I am not blind (otherwise I wouldn't be able to read what you just called me) and nor am I retarded, but gee thanks!
If you have to know, I don't have much respect Naniwa. He has always had his problems, more than little in the past.
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On December 14 2011 22:37 Incomplet wrote:Poll: Did GOM make the right decision with Naniwa?No (170) 51% Yes, justice must be served! (123) 37% He needs to be punished but they went too far (42) 13% 335 total votes Your vote: Did GOM make the right decision with Naniwa? (Vote): Yes, justice must be served!
(Vote): He needs to be punished but they went too far
(Vote): No
please keep this poll up, i think its important to know what most ppl think!
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The thing I find really funny is that they fire Naniwa for offensive behaviour, and put Idra in it. Really ironic, even absurd.
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EPT
