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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne
There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 |
the issue is that infestors in general don't require much positioning or control to use.
That's not even remotely true, have you ever tried using an Infestor-centric play style before? If you're playing against any decent player if you mismicro your Infestors at all you instantly lose the game in your first battle. Infestors are highly micro intensive just like the Sentry is. What happens if you mismicro your Sentry or spam a bunch of Forcefields badly? You run out of energy and lose the game.
Also one other things, your statement that Hydras counter Stalkers is a huge misconception. No, no they don't and Hydras are one of the worst units in the game second only to Reapers.
I can also speak from experience that 1-1 Hydras and SpeedLings vs unupgraded Stalkers and Void Ray the Protoss actually wins, that's how amazingly bad Hydralisks are.
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On September 12 2011 02:50 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 01:56 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:40 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:33 Big J wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... Well, I have seen MC win 2 GSL titles with Sentry play, while neither NesTea nor Losira (nor Fruitdealer) are playing this hardcore Infestorstyle in ZvP and ZvT (don't get me wrong, they use Infestors, but not in the way people talk about in this thread... Only Destiny really goes Massinfestor all the time, and he still hasn't won anything big - not even come close!) Those game are pretty bad examples to make a point and there is good reason no one sees that playstyle any more.. Zergs have sine received fungal buffs and realize just how damn good hive tech is.... The closest you get to seeing it anymore is Huk moving out with 8-9 sentries and a zlot to poke (not outright win the game). If you lose the sentries its game....... The only reason destiny is even GM if because of infestors. After this patch he will go back to master where he belongs...... Well then in that regards, can you show a game where Z won because of mass NP? Just watch Destiny's stream, he abuses it all the time...
Does destiny own MC with his infestor play? I dont think so
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On September 12 2011 03:11 ReignFayth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 02:54 Assirra wrote:On September 12 2011 02:50 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:56 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:40 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:33 Big J wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... Well, I have seen MC win 2 GSL titles with Sentry play, while neither NesTea nor Losira (nor Fruitdealer) are playing this hardcore Infestorstyle in ZvP and ZvT (don't get me wrong, they use Infestors, but not in the way people talk about in this thread... Only Destiny really goes Massinfestor all the time, and he still hasn't won anything big - not even come close!) Those game are pretty bad examples to make a point and there is good reason no one sees that playstyle any more.. Zergs have sine received fungal buffs and realize just how damn good hive tech is.... The closest you get to seeing it anymore is Huk moving out with 8-9 sentries and a zlot to poke (not outright win the game). If you lose the sentries its game....... The only reason destiny is even GM if because of infestors. After this patch he will go back to master where he belongs...... Well then in that regards, can you show a game where Z won because of mass NP? Just watch Destiny's stream, he abuses it all the time... Stop using Destiny all the time ppl. He is the ONLY one that actually does it. Show an example in a professional tournament before you claim something is OP. Stephano He just won IPL Qualifier #3 by beating Kiwikaki, Puzzle, mma, revival and someone else I cant recall
pure ling infestor in nearly ALL games.....
He beat marinekingprime FFS!!!
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On September 12 2011 02:49 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 01:47 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... I'll give you my Neural parasite in all it's glory for your FF. Trade? Neural parasite if broken in its current state and doesn't belong in the game. Horrible rebuttal on your part....
LOL if you think the NP is broken atm, you obviously did not play in beta. Btw, I didn't mention sentries in the post you quoted. I said FF. I can show you tons and tons of example where FF has single handedly won the game dating all the way back to beta.
Can you show me a game where Mass NP was the biggest factor in the game? Hell, look through all those games that NP was used on Massive and think what would have happened if the patch had went through then.
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On September 12 2011 03:11 ReignFayth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 02:54 Assirra wrote:On September 12 2011 02:50 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:56 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:40 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:33 Big J wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... Well, I have seen MC win 2 GSL titles with Sentry play, while neither NesTea nor Losira (nor Fruitdealer) are playing this hardcore Infestorstyle in ZvP and ZvT (don't get me wrong, they use Infestors, but not in the way people talk about in this thread... Only Destiny really goes Massinfestor all the time, and he still hasn't won anything big - not even come close!) Those game are pretty bad examples to make a point and there is good reason no one sees that playstyle any more.. Zergs have sine received fungal buffs and realize just how damn good hive tech is.... The closest you get to seeing it anymore is Huk moving out with 8-9 sentries and a zlot to poke (not outright win the game). If you lose the sentries its game....... The only reason destiny is even GM if because of infestors. After this patch he will go back to master where he belongs...... Well then in that regards, can you show a game where Z won because of mass NP? Just watch Destiny's stream, he abuses it all the time... Stop using Destiny all the time ppl. He is the ONLY one that actually does it. Show an example in a professional tournament before you claim something is OP. Stephano He just won IPL Qualifier #3 by beating Kiwikaki, Puzzle, mma, revival and someone else I cant recall
Let's continue with the absurdity and require it to be a LAN tournament.. LAN!! you can't right?.. ergo infestors don't need a nerf.
PD. Congrats to stephano.. he needs to go to Korea.
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Hydralisks are extremely efficient against any gate core composition IF they can force a confrontation or IF you are primarily using them defensively. There ARE also a couple of ways a zerg can make these niches work, like using a nydus just outside of the protoss base on tal darim, or in base nydus if you can find a spot to put it, or doom drop. They're situational, but can be game ending.
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On September 12 2011 03:30 me_viet wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 02:49 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:47 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... I'll give you my Neural parasite in all it's glory for your FF. Trade? Neural parasite if broken in its current state and doesn't belong in the game. Horrible rebuttal on your part.... LOL if you think the NP is broken atm, you obviously did not play in beta. Btw, I didn't mention sentries in the post you quoted. I said FF. I can show you tons and tons of example where FF has single handedly won the game dating all the way back to beta. Can you show me a game where Mass NP was the biggest factor in the game? Hell, look through all those games that NP was used on Massive and think what would have happened if the patch had went through then.
NP makes carriers, motherships, BC, obsolete.
Why should one ability make it so those units can never be fielded in a high level game against zerg?
As I have already stated, its a spell that 99% of the time will end up with the unit neuraled being killed at the end of battle. There is only one other spell that comes close to doing that (250mm strike cannon).
It immobilizes/stuns the target and kills it. NP end result is not only a dead unit but during its control it is doing damage back to the opponents army....
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On September 12 2011 02:02 _-NoMaN-_ wrote:
you said it.
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On September 12 2011 03:30 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 03:11 ReignFayth wrote:On September 12 2011 02:54 Assirra wrote:On September 12 2011 02:50 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:56 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:40 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:33 Big J wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... Well, I have seen MC win 2 GSL titles with Sentry play, while neither NesTea nor Losira (nor Fruitdealer) are playing this hardcore Infestorstyle in ZvP and ZvT (don't get me wrong, they use Infestors, but not in the way people talk about in this thread... Only Destiny really goes Massinfestor all the time, and he still hasn't won anything big - not even come close!) Those game are pretty bad examples to make a point and there is good reason no one sees that playstyle any more.. Zergs have sine received fungal buffs and realize just how damn good hive tech is.... The closest you get to seeing it anymore is Huk moving out with 8-9 sentries and a zlot to poke (not outright win the game). If you lose the sentries its game....... The only reason destiny is even GM if because of infestors. After this patch he will go back to master where he belongs...... Well then in that regards, can you show a game where Z won because of mass NP? Just watch Destiny's stream, he abuses it all the time... Stop using Destiny all the time ppl. He is the ONLY one that actually does it. Show an example in a professional tournament before you claim something is OP. Stephano He just won IPL Qualifier #3 by beating Kiwikaki, Puzzle, mma, revival and someone else I cant recall pure ling infestor in nearly ALL games..... He beat marinekingprime FFS!!!
Didn't MC win a lot of his games by heavily abusing the Sentry FF ability? I'm so glad Blizzard nerfed that cuz FF op as hell.
Oh wait...no..people just learned to deal with it better...umm...
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On September 12 2011 03:36 BeeNu wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 03:30 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 03:11 ReignFayth wrote:On September 12 2011 02:54 Assirra wrote:On September 12 2011 02:50 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:56 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:40 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:33 Big J wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:
[quote]
Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... Well, I have seen MC win 2 GSL titles with Sentry play, while neither NesTea nor Losira (nor Fruitdealer) are playing this hardcore Infestorstyle in ZvP and ZvT (don't get me wrong, they use Infestors, but not in the way people talk about in this thread... Only Destiny really goes Massinfestor all the time, and he still hasn't won anything big - not even come close!) Those game are pretty bad examples to make a point and there is good reason no one sees that playstyle any more.. Zergs have sine received fungal buffs and realize just how damn good hive tech is.... The closest you get to seeing it anymore is Huk moving out with 8-9 sentries and a zlot to poke (not outright win the game). If you lose the sentries its game....... The only reason destiny is even GM if because of infestors. After this patch he will go back to master where he belongs...... Well then in that regards, can you show a game where Z won because of mass NP? Just watch Destiny's stream, he abuses it all the time... Stop using Destiny all the time ppl. He is the ONLY one that actually does it. Show an example in a professional tournament before you claim something is OP. Stephano He just won IPL Qualifier #3 by beating Kiwikaki, Puzzle, mma, revival and someone else I cant recall pure ling infestor in nearly ALL games..... He beat marinekingprime FFS!!! Didn't MC win a lot of his games by heavily abusing the Sentry FF ability? I'm so glad Blizzard nerfed that cuz FF op as hell. Oh wait...no..people just learned to deal with it better...umm...
Quit going off track and comparing it to FF. Its fucking stupid how you are side stepping the discussion about NP and infestors by bringing up sentries...
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On September 11 2011 21:11 CatNzHat wrote:
At the low level, there are a lot of terrans, in masters, terran is the least played race.
bad troll. everyone know that people choose terran when they first start out on ladder because its easiest to handle (trust me, I started Zerg for SC2 immediately after 10 years of playing brood war and know).
The graph actually goes like this
Low league = many terran, average protoss, low zerg.
Mid league (plat, dia) = few terran, average protoss, high zerg.
High League = many terran, average protoss, low zerg.
At least, thats what the SC2 stats graph shows us.
You can see terran peaks at low and high end, proving its easy for terran to get out of mid leagues. Zerg peaks at mid league, proving its hard to get out of them, and protoss is average across the board, proving that protoss is competent to smash P or Z, given that TvP is so hard for P.
Something to think about.
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On September 12 2011 03:36 BeeNu wrote:
Didn't MC win a lot of his games by heavily abusing the Sentry FF ability? I'm so glad Blizzard nerfed that cuz FF op as hell.
Oh wait...no..people just learned to deal with it better...umm...
There's something different to losing to a 7 minute sentry timing compared to losing a 40 minute macro game to a single unit composition. Don't get me wrong, there are still way too many "7 minute UnitX" rushes in SC2, but it's not the same thing.
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On September 12 2011 03:35 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 03:30 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 02:49 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:47 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... I'll give you my Neural parasite in all it's glory for your FF. Trade? Neural parasite if broken in its current state and doesn't belong in the game. Horrible rebuttal on your part.... LOL if you think the NP is broken atm, you obviously did not play in beta. Btw, I didn't mention sentries in the post you quoted. I said FF. I can show you tons and tons of example where FF has single handedly won the game dating all the way back to beta. Can you show me a game where Mass NP was the biggest factor in the game? Hell, look through all those games that NP was used on Massive and think what would have happened if the patch had went through then. NP makes carriers, motherships, BC, obsolete. Why should one ability make it so those units can never be fielded in a high level game against zerg? As I have already stated, its a spell that 99% of the time will end up with the unit neuraled being killed at the end of battle. There is only one other spell that comes close to doing that (250mm strike cannon). It immobilizes/stuns the target and kills it. NP end result is not only a dead unit but during its control it is doing damage back to the opponents army....
Lol if you think Mothership/Carrier/BC's aren't used solely cause of Infestors then yea... not sure if I should explain why they aren't used lol.
1. Mothership is a BM unit and has never been considered meant for competitive play after their nerfs from alpha.
2. Why aren't Carriers used in PvP or PvT? no infestors there.
3. Why aren't BC's used in TvP? No infestors there either.
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On September 12 2011 03:20 Shiori wrote:+ Show Spoiler +this is a fundamental problem with all protoss units: there's a very obvious hard counter to all of them, and the counter is so powerful that you might as well not even have any units at all. for example, a marauder ball makes a stalker ball absolutely useless, even with blink and great micro. similarly, blink stalkers are made essentially useless by a decent number of infestors. colossi? vikings. deathball? baneling drops to kill sentries then go surround.
Zerg has no real hard counter to colossus or HT's. HT's hard counter mutalisks, zerglings, hydralisks, and Infestors. I don't think you understand how few options zerg ever really has. We have only about 9 attacking units, and you're shutting down 4 of them. Infestors you can argue can't just barely fungal outside of their range, but in terms of comparing the two units one-against-one, the HT has a clear advantage in being able to kill or nearly kill infestors instantly for modest amounts of energy.
Colossi similarly shut down Zerglings and Hydralisks.
+ Show Spoiler +
i know i'm going to take a lot of flak for this, but the hydralisk is actually one of the better designed units in this game. you know why? cause it has a very specific purpose and does it well. it beats air and it counters stalkers. no shit it gets raped by mass colossi, as should it, because it's tier 2, but i fail to see why every race thinks they need some sort of 2-unit composition to beat everything. we protoss players have been meshing 4 or 5 different units per composition since beta, and yet terran and zerg qq if one unit doesn't do well in every situation. how do you think we feel when queens somehow beat t2 voidrays cost-for-cost? you know why they do? because pissy zergs were mad they couldn't hatch first and they didn't want to invest what they perceived to be dead resources into hydras/spore crawlers. but how's that fair? if you open greedily and another person punishes it, then you SHOULD have to deviate from your build to deal with it. you shouldn't be able to get by with your macro mechanic. imagine if i could just open nexus first against 6pool and survive because of chronoboost. it's ridiculous.
Hydralisks do not beat stalkers with blink, at all. Hydralisks lose to mass air after a certain point. Hydralisks have no role in any matchup except the oddest of situations that don't properly reflect its intended roles anyway. Hydralisks are a bad unit, and a bad zerg unit is devastating becaese we have so few units in the first place.
A one-base zerg against a one-base protoss is a loss after the 4-gate timing. Zerg gets not only resources from the hatcheries, but also production. We NEED multiple bases. It is not greedy to do so, it is a burden placed upon us by the design of the game. The best response to a 2rax is 15 hatch, 'nuff said.
+ Show Spoiler +
so yes, the infestor is imbalanced, and the reason is that it's not situational at all. it's good in every single circumstance except against mass HTs (but then lol that composition sucks anyway) and never represents a risky investment. in a game that's fundamentally about out-smarting your opponent, there should not be any mid-game "safe bets." that's the problem here. there's too many strategies midgame for terran/zerg which are virtually unpunishable. they don't have a conceivable non-allin weakness. and that's a big problem, because when i SEE a dt shrine being built, i can prepare for it, but when i see a ghost academy going down, or an infestation pit, there isn't really anything i can do to make the corresponding units a non-factor.
anyone who denies any of this is honestly deluded and doesn't understand what balance is.
Safe bets? A protoss can sit on two-base until all the minerals are mined out of it and the zerg can never, ever attack in a non-all-in manner. Two-base also significantly weakens harass and scouting due to the low travel distances across your bases.That is the definition of a safe bet.
You complain about hard counters, but at the same time you complain about lacking a hard counter despite offering one at the beginning of this quote. You're ignorant, upset, and irrational. Don't waste people's time without using some of your own to figure out what exactly your issue with zerg is.
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On September 12 2011 03:30 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 03:11 ReignFayth wrote:On September 12 2011 02:54 Assirra wrote:On September 12 2011 02:50 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:56 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:40 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:33 Big J wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... Well, I have seen MC win 2 GSL titles with Sentry play, while neither NesTea nor Losira (nor Fruitdealer) are playing this hardcore Infestorstyle in ZvP and ZvT (don't get me wrong, they use Infestors, but not in the way people talk about in this thread... Only Destiny really goes Massinfestor all the time, and he still hasn't won anything big - not even come close!) Those game are pretty bad examples to make a point and there is good reason no one sees that playstyle any more.. Zergs have sine received fungal buffs and realize just how damn good hive tech is.... The closest you get to seeing it anymore is Huk moving out with 8-9 sentries and a zlot to poke (not outright win the game). If you lose the sentries its game....... The only reason destiny is even GM if because of infestors. After this patch he will go back to master where he belongs...... Well then in that regards, can you show a game where Z won because of mass NP? Just watch Destiny's stream, he abuses it all the time... Stop using Destiny all the time ppl. He is the ONLY one that actually does it. Show an example in a professional tournament before you claim something is OP. Stephano He just won IPL Qualifier #3 by beating Kiwikaki, Puzzle, mma, revival and someone else I cant recall pure ling infestor in nearly ALL games..... He beat marinekingprime FFS!!!
Did you even watch those games. MKP played like shit. Utter shit. The zerg had the BEST possible spawn positions on Tal Darim, MKP blindly 2 rax's with 1 proxy'd in the middle of the map. Horrible timing on it, yet it STILL managed to kill the hatch.
The only reason MKP lost that is because he didnt even make a wall to gaurd against the counter attack. Not to mention the multiple time's he just blindly walked unseiged tanks out in the middle of the map. It's not really surprising to look at those games and know why terran lost.
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On September 12 2011 03:20 Shiori wrote:
i know i'm going to take a lot of flak for this, but the hydralisk is actually one of the better designed units in this game. you know why? cause it has a very specific purpose and does it well. it beats air and it counters stalkers.
Actually, mass blink stalkers will beat hydras off creep very easily, and will also stand a more than decent chance even when on creep.
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On September 12 2011 03:35 Rorschach wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 03:30 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 02:49 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 01:47 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 01:19 Rorschach wrote:On September 12 2011 00:49 me_viet wrote:On September 12 2011 00:44 Rorschach wrote:
Neural parasite would be more balanced if it just destroyed the unit for 100 energy cause that is what it does in a nutshell. So be honest and ask yourselves if spell like that should exist? Just like how FF is an i-win button right? I mean basically, you cast FF and then destroy stuff with no retaliation while the opponent can't do anything... You don't see people blindly MASSING sentries in every MU and winning games with them. FF is one ability whereas the infestor has three really good abilities. It is simply too versatile of a caster that works for any composition.... I'll give you my Neural parasite in all it's glory for your FF. Trade? Neural parasite if broken in its current state and doesn't belong in the game. Horrible rebuttal on your part.... LOL if you think the NP is broken atm, you obviously did not play in beta. Btw, I didn't mention sentries in the post you quoted. I said FF. I can show you tons and tons of example where FF has single handedly won the game dating all the way back to beta. Can you show me a game where Mass NP was the biggest factor in the game? Hell, look through all those games that NP was used on Massive and think what would have happened if the patch had went through then. NP makes carriers, motherships, BC, obsolete. Why should one ability make it so those units can never be fielded in a high level game against zerg?
Do you have any idea how inefficient it is to try to kill BCs and the like with Neural? Go watch Dimaga vs MVP in the GSL WC Korea vs The World showmatch. Dimaga is going Infestor Ultra for ages, and MVP breaks out some BCs, and they give Dimaga a hell of a time. Even a single BC needs TWO FULL NEURALS along with about 5 Infested Terrans. That's about 325 energy for a single unit. Dimaga could've invested in Hydras or Spire tech, but that would've cut severely into his Ultras and Infestors. Conversely, with Spire tech out, he wouldn't even need Neural to take out the BCs, since Corruptors counter them so hard by design.
Corruptors do much more to obsolete capital ships than Neural does.
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The NP change is nice, Colossus are useful against Infestors again.
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pure ling infestor in nearly ALL games.....
He beat marinekingprime FFS!!!
Some terran (Such as MKP) go Marine/tank/medivac all game, some protoss go colossus/stalker all game, and they deal with it, i dont see the problem with a Zerg doing the same
Plus, Stephano is pretty fucking good
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I would still insist instead of removing their ability to NP massive-type units, they should lower or keep the cast cost 100 energy, and it channel 6 energy every second it is active. So an EMP or feedback will cancel it.
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EPT
