EPTPatch 1.4 PTR Notes (updated 9/8) - Page 337
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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 | ||
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Lomak
United States311 Posts
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Cyrak
Canada536 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:48 -Archangel- wrote: Maybe you should read you edit in that post and rethink you position. If you still feel your way, I guess nobody can help you. I don't 'feel' any way and I didn't take any position at all other than suggesting people take the advice of people whose financial success depends on the strength of Zerg with a grain of salt. I don't believe I mentioned anything about balance or made any personal attacks on anyone in that video. I'm still trying to decipher your post. Posting in this thread feels like trying to teach calculus to a dog. | ||
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Kabocha
United States39 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:32 skatbone wrote: "Fixed an issue where Broodlords on the high ground would not be revealed when attacking enemy units on the low ground." I haven't read all the pages since the patch updates were released. Has this been discussed? While small, I have had problems with this, on Shakuras, for instance. Another slight buff for toss and terran (albeit a small one). Late game ZvP and ZvT usually involve some sort of unit(s) with their army that can already see on the high ground anyways (terran tend to have medivacs, protoss tend to have observers, collawlsus, and/or void rays), so I don't think the impact will be tremendous. This would just make things a little bit more convenient for the toss or terran. I don't know what to say about ZvZ. Maybe if they have brolords on highground, and we bring hydras right next to the bottom of the cliff, we can do something to brolords without constant rain of death... | ||
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Cain0
United Kingdom608 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:50 Treble557 wrote: I like this idea actually. It'd still suck not being able to use NP in zvp, but.. atleast it won't make thor/broflame hellion combos unstoppable. Everyone seems to like this idea to be honest. Its definately the way forward. | ||
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Watercrystal
58 Posts
This means 2 things to me: a) as Blizz is adding a new Infestor nerf, the other Zerg (maybe Toss and Terran, too) nerf(s) are confirmed and will go live as-is. b) Since I am playing Protoss, heavily struggeling vs Infestors sometimes, it's time to partey hard! TBH this is a perfect patch for Toss (even if my Idea of adding a AA attack on colossi didn't happen :D) and I am really excited to play some games on it as I don't have the chance to play the PTR. Atleast you can NP Stalkers and Zealots, isn't that great? Cheers  Watercrystal | ||
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dogabutila
United States1438 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:48 EmilA wrote: Because anyone can come up with a reason why something shouldn't be nerfed. Every terran could rightfully argue that blue flame hellions against workers can be solved by careful sim city - it'd be correct, but it wouldn't change the glaringly obvious fact that BF hellions are broken. Likewise, infestors can theoretically be handled by feedback, but in reality it just doesn't happen. Infestors are in a state where they're freaking ridiculous against pretty much everything but their intended counter units (that happen to be branched out specialist units) and even then, they're not being dominated by said units at all. If banelings did 45 damage, it would be still be possible for terran to trade cost effectively by splitting each marine individually, but banelings would still just be too good. Destiny just points out that there is a unit that can do alright against the infestor, which he thinks justifies the infestor being rather imbalanced against everything else. The funny thing is that everybody acts like NP is the reason infestors are so so OP but nobody ever complained about it before. It was just fungal, infested terran, chain fungals. People are so emotionally invested into hating infestors that they cheer for a nerf that breaks the game without examining why they really think infestors are OP and adjusting those issues. | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:55 dogabutila wrote: The funny thing is that everybody acts like NP is the reason infestors are so so OP but nobody ever complained about it before. It was just fungal, infested terran, chain fungals. People are so emotionally invested into hating infestors that they cheer for a nerf that breaks the game without examining why they really think infestors are OP and adjusting those issues. I'll trade you, nerf infested terrans to shit and you can keep Neural Parasite as is. | ||
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KimJongChill
United States6429 Posts
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Lomak
United States311 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:56 Whitewing wrote: I'll trade you, nerf infested terrans to shit and you can keep Neural Parasite as is. As long as the changes are self serving who cares if they are actually bad for the game right? | ||
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ilimor
Sweden47 Posts
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Begtse
France135 Posts
Atleast you can NP Stalkers and Zealots, isn't that great? Cheers Watercrystal Yup while clossi will rape infestors hard!And all the rest of Z army as well :p NPing thors was nice.... Nice job blizz... Z gonna get raped again and again! | ||
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Velocirapture
United States983 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:55 dogabutila wrote: The funny thing is that everybody acts like NP is the reason infestors are so so OP but nobody ever complained about it before. It was just fungal, infested terran, chain fungals. People are so emotionally invested into hating infestors that they cheer for a nerf that breaks the game without examining why they really think infestors are OP and adjusting those issues. I think the excitement about the nerf is that it opens up a lot of strategies. The reason NP was rarely the deciding factor before is because people purposefully avoided strategies that were wrecked by it. Basically, its the new strategies that could be developed that are exciting while the old builds are unaffected. | ||
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raDon
Germany34 Posts
I needed months to deal with Protoss in fights and now im back in platinum. Thanks Blizzard, you can destroy a race but are unable to fix closepositions. | ||
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Lomak
United States311 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:59 Velocirapture wrote: I think the excitement about the nerf is that it opens up a lot of strategies. The reason NP was rarely the deciding factor before is because people purposefully avoided strategies that were wrecked by it. Basically, its the new strategies that could be developed that are exciting while the old builds are unaffected. You have it backwards. We WERE seeing new strategies being developed in order to help deal with the infestor and NOW everything will revert back into its stagnant 'collossus death ball vs. roach corrupter'. For instance, your never going to see warp prism / HT play used to snipe infestors because WTF is the point?! Just build more collusus, Why would any protoss ever make a HT in PvZ anymore?! | ||
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Treemonkeys
United States2082 Posts
I don't even like that idea but it's better than not making it work on massive units. Ghost and high templar have the tools needed to deal with infestors, if the tools aren't good enough, buff the tools instead of nerfing the infestor. All this is going to do is cut some micro out of the game, further simplifying it. | ||
Theeakoz
United States1114 Posts
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Treble557
United States221 Posts
- Snipe now does 1/4th it's actual damage to massive units. - Ghosts can no longer cast snipe or EMP while cloaked - Psy Storm Now does 20 dmg +60 to light. Perfectly fair changes imo. | ||
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sitromit
7051 Posts
Am I missing something here? | ||
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RyLai
United States477 Posts
I'm really not liking the second one... It's nice for Terran since we don't have to worry about our Thors (or somehow Battlecruisers?) to be Neural Parasited if we go for a mech army (which was about the only way to deal with it aside from MASSSSSSSSSS magic box Mutas)... I don't see it affecting very high level ZvT at all... But for ZvP... Man is that a giant bummer... No longer does Protoss have to worry about 5 Colossi getting Neural Parasited and demolishing their own army if they don't micro... Before, you split up so Fungal Growth doesn't lock down all your Stalkers, then you Blink in and snipe off Infestors using Neural Parasite on your Colossi and use whatever units you have left in range (other Colossi) to snipe the rest. But... If you take that away, you only take over Void Rays and Immortals... And if they don't make either, well you're kind of in luck and kind of screwed... If they made Immortals, your Roaches get demolished (as if 5 Colossi don't do that anyway), if they made Void Rays, you need Corruptors (fuck Hydras cause of Colossi) to deal with them. So if they go for either you Neural Parasite those instead and use them to focus down the Colossi... But if they don't, then you just don't get Neural Parasite unless you have extra money or want to be ready for a sudden tech switch... For Terran, it was kind of hard for us since we can't stim forward to snipe the Infestors... They Fungal Growth us, and the Marines basically die. But... We should be using our Tanks to focus fire the Infestors anyway. So again, this doesn't make any difference in ZvT. I still don't like the nerfs to Z and T (except the much needed change to the Pre-Igniter upgrade to encourage biomech play again). I feel like Banshees should get a hard nerf... That would somewhat help the 1-1-1 issue (nerf the damage, starting energy, and maybe even HP, maybe buff speed). I mean, Banshees can single-handedly end the game if you're not ready for them... And even then, they can end the game if you're not ready for MASS Banshees. I really don't think a Queen should lose to a Banshee 1:1... Maybe 1:2... But not 1:1... The only buff I think Protoss should get (aside from the nerfs that buff everything defending against a 4 Gate and encourages Protoss macro play) is the Mothership buff... It's been nerfs SO MANY TIMES and has never gotten anything back for it... It's about time it gets SOMETHING to help make it a more useful unit... But I also feel that the warp in mechanic, Colossi, Void Rays, and Marines should all get nerfed at the same time (otherwise there becomes massive balance issues since with nerfed Marines, how do you defend 3 Gate VR?; and how in the hell are you going to deal with Robo/Stargate/Templar plays late game?). That way, the 1-1-1 is further nerfed, the 2 Rax is nerfed, the 4 Rax is nerfed, the 5, 6, 7 and bullshit 3 Rax are nerfed. But oh my God... Mutas will be Godly in ZvT... But yeah... It's very hard to balance the game... We'll just take it 1 step at a time and the races that get the short end of the stick will cry until they learn to deal with it or a patch comes to fix it. I'd say Terran will cry the most after this patch, but from what I've seen, Terrans seem to be the most adaptive and experimental group of players... But maybe that's because most do dumb shit and get away with it because Terran has some unbelievably dumb shit that's difficult to defend without really good scouting and experience, so they keep winning with non-mainstream strategies anyway... Yay for relying on the metagame! -.- | ||
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hugman
Sweden4644 Posts
On September 10 2011 03:09 MrCon wrote: Haha, they're having the exact same speech that people were having about zerg when they where decimated by the deathball before getting buffed. "But they could do so much shit, like 2 base mothership or 3 nexus openings §§§" == "make nydus lol" This is so funny (and ironic) About the colossi, we don't see them anymore in both matchups (or only in a tech switch). They were boring 8 months ago, but I don't feel they're boring anymore, because they're rarer. And guess what, ZvP has evolved soo much over the last few months, I'm not even that worried about nerfing NP even though I think it's silly. Even if you changed the Infestor back to how it was pre-patch (8 sec duration etc.) I still think Zergs would have the upper hand in the metagame. Fungal getting buffed was not the sole reason the ZvP winrates changed, it was Zergs playing better. | ||
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